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Battle of the DBS' Buff Bois - Broly vs Toppo

The_2nd_Existential_Seed

The_2nd_Existential_Seed

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Whelp... Time to have Broly fight all the Low 2-C's of DBS' ToP... And nothing says I can't do it with the bufest Bois in DBS History:

Dcvd4ur-9d56f6d0-1395-48bc-9568-02e6b2bb4e3e
GoD Toppo


SSJ / FP SSJ Broly : 1 (Zamasu Chan,Dragomer)

GoD Toppo: 3 (DragonEmperor23,Warren Valion,Hst Master)

(Would place pictures but Fandom isn't letting me)

Two of the buffest bois in DBS fight each other to the death. Both are Low 2-C for this fight.Speed Equalized.

Who wins ? Will Hakai rip through Broly, or will Toppo be ripped apart ?
 
Broly stomps, he's superior to Ssb Vegeta in Ikari stage 3 and only gets 50 times stronger as a ssj.

Basically blue Vegeta < Toppo < ssbe Vegeta < ssj Broly.
 
Broly one shot Toppo, he litteraly toyed with a stronger SSJB Vegeta on screen and was trading blow with Gogeta after he forced both Goku and Vegeta to run away, Toppo was overcame by a weaker Vegeta had been fighting for a while and was tired as all hell and even after that happened, Vegeta still had the strenght to go fight Jiren.
 
Dragomer said:
Broly one shot Toppo, he litteraly toyed with a stronger SSJB Vegeta on screen and was trading blow with Gogeta after he forced both Goku and Vegeta to run away, Toppo was overcame by a weaker Vegeta had been fighting for a while and was tired as all hell and even after that happened, Vegeta still had the strenght to go fight Jiren.
Click to expand...
Vegeta had the resistance to EE. Broly does not.

He dies to Hakai aura.
 
Warren Valion said:
Dragomer said:
Broly one shot Toppo, he litteraly toyed with a stronger SSJB Vegeta on screen and was trading blow with Gogeta after he forced both Goku and Vegeta to run away, Toppo was overcame by a weaker Vegeta had been fighting for a while and was tired as all hell and even after that happened, Vegeta still had the strenght to go fight Jiren.
Click to expand...
Vegeta had the resistance to EE. Broly does not.
He dies to Hakai aura.
Click to expand...
And what did Vegeta use to resist EE ? oh yeah, brute force and ki, what does Broly has in excess compared to Vegeta ? brute force and ki.

He no sell the hakai aura.
 
Dragomer said:
And what did Vegeta use to resist EE ? oh yeah, brute force and ki, what does Broly has in excess compared to Vegeta ? brute force and ki.

He no sell the hakai aura.
Click to expand...
No, he has resistence to EE, and over powered the Ki blast.

You can't just over power Hakai, you need a resistence to it, which Broly doesn't have.


If Vegeta just overpowered it, then it wouldn't be a resistence, but a weakness for the ability, which isn't how we view Hakai here on the wiki.
 
It couldn't kill Freezer, how is it going to kill Broly ?

Toppo wasn't allowed to kill him due to tournament rules. There are no rules here and Broly has no resistance to EE unlike Frieza
 
Warren Valion said:
Dragomer said:
And what did Vegeta use to resist EE ? oh yeah, brute force and ki, what does Broly has in excess compared to Vegeta ? brute force and ki.

He no sell the hakai aura.
Click to expand...
No, he has resistence to EE, and over powered the Ki blast.
You can't just over power Hakai, you need a resistence to it, which Broly doesn't have.


If Vegeta just overpowered it, then it wouldn't be a resistence, but a weakness for the ability, which isn't how we view Hakai here on the wiki.
Click to expand...
And where does the resistence come from ? his ki and raw power and there was no ki to over power, it was destruction energy. And once again, what give you the resistence ? ki, what does Broly have ? ki.

You can overpower it, that's what Vegeta does on screen.

No, it wouldn't be a weakness for the ability, it would be a property of ki and a capacity for the characters, also on this wiki we consider the hax as hax and resisting it as resistence, not a weakness of the hax, that was discussed multiple time.
 
Hst master said:
It couldn't kill Freezer, how is it going to kill Broly ?
Click to expand...
Toppo wasn't allowed to kill him due to tournament rules. There are no rules here and Broly has no resistance to EE unlike Frieza
And ? being allowed to kill or not doesn't change that Freezer wasn't erased by it.

And where does Freezer's resistence come from ? his ki and raw power, what does Broly has over Freezer ? ki and raw power.
 
Vegeta's inherit being is what has resistance to EE, not his Ki. Same with everyone else in the series who has shown resistance.

And if you don't like that, then you should make a CRT.
 
That's nonsense, that mean Saiyan Saga Vegeta would resist Toppo's hakai just as easily, that make no sense.

Why would i make a CRT when the general consensus is already on my side when it come to that ? 'a weaker character did it with raw power' is the whole reasoning behind all the 'portal creation' you can see on the DB profiles, you're the one who should make a CRT if you believe that Vegeta, Goku and Freezer just have EE erasure for absolutly no reason; good luck explaining why Freezer had to turn Golden to fully resist the destruction energy if the resistance come from 'his inherent being'
 
Dragomer said:
That's nonsense, that mean Saiyan Saga Vegeta would resist Toppo's hakai just as easily, that make no sense.
Why would i make a CRT when the general consensus is already on my side when it come to that ? 'a weaker character did it with raw power' is the whole reasoning behind all the 'portal creation' you can see on the DB profiles, you're the one who should make a CRT if you believe that Vegeta, Goku and Freezer just have EE erasure for absolutly no reason; good luck explaining why Freezer had to turn Golden to fully resist the destruction energy if the resistance come from 'his inherent being'
Click to expand...
Saiyan Saga Vegeta would be destroyed, not because of the EE properties, but from the level of strength that Toppo's Ki blasts are.

That is not the general consensus at all, thus why this thread was made.

And what? The Portal Creation feat was done with raw strength and was stated as such in the series, Hakai is not.

And Frieza needed to go golden to use his Ki to fully contain the energy, not resist it.
 
The way this wiki treats the Energy of Destruction and Hakai is completely inaccurate to what the series has shown. Only beings who were vastly weaker than the user were actually erased. Every other time, it's been shown that a person can actually hold out and not be instantly erased. Case in point, Sidra gives an Assassin a tiny amount of his Energy of Destruction, so Golden Frieza was able to control it and base Goku of all people was able to resist it. The same Golden Frieza is overpowered by a stronger version delivered by Toppo. Toppo himself even points out he could easily erase Frieza, but he's holding back since the tournament didn't allow killing. What happened when Vegeta became more powerful than Toppo? He swatted away Toppo's Energy of Destruction like it was a fly. Vegeta then proceeds to overpower Toppo at his max with a ki attack even Toppo's Energy of Destruction can nullify energy. All the hints point towards it being based on raw power. Broly is vastly above Toppo in terms of raw power. He was able to contend with SSB Goku when SSJ Goku is stronger than the current SSG Vegeta. He then becomes 50x stronger than that as a Super Saiyan. There's no way Toppo will be able to claim victory here.
 
Toppo get absolutely dusted. Ikari Broly is superior to SSB Vegeta and he gets 50x times power boost on the top of that while Toppo lost to SSBE Vegeta who id only 20x strong at best.

Toppo will run back to Jiren.
 
I've never seen Toppo using God's true Hakai. It might have been the rules of the tournament

Beerus erasing zamasu
beerus erases zamasu

Sidra Hakai
 
Let's see the dude who got his ass whooped by a ToP SSBE Vegeta vs the guy who required a post-ToP SSB Gogeta to defeat.

Also Vegeta doesn't have some magical property which makes him and his ki immune to Hakai that no one else does. He was just too strong for Toppo's attacks to work, just like most hax in DB gets cancelled out by overwhelmingly higher power. Just like Base Goku and Golden Frieza resisted Hakai blasts due to the strength difference. Hakai won't protect Toppo from getting one shot by Broly.
 
Yeah, no. I just said in another thread that Frieza curbstomps Toppo. There is no way in hell that Toppo is standing the slightest hint of a chance of winning.

What part of Frieza saying 'no one in existence' can stop Broly is hard to understand? This isn't even an argument when Frieza personally fought Toppo and can unquestionably compare them.
 
If it were limit breaker Jiren or MUI Goku I'd have voted against Broly, but pretty much everyone else in the TOP gets godstomped by Broly.
 
Warren Valion said:
Dragomer said:
That's nonsense, that mean Saiyan Saga Vegeta would resist Toppo's hakai just as easily, that make no sense.
Why would i make a CRT when the general consensus is already on my side when it come to that ? 'a weaker character did it with raw power' is the whole reasoning behind all the 'portal creation' you can see on the DB profiles, you're the one who should make a CRT if you believe that Vegeta, Goku and Freezer just have EE erasure for absolutly no reason; good luck explaining why Freezer had to turn Golden to fully resist the destruction energy if the resistance come from 'his inherent being'
Click to expand...
Saiyan Saga Vegeta would be destroyed, not because of the EE properties, but from the level of strength that Toppo's Ki blasts are.
That is not the general consensus at all, thus why this thread was made.

And what? The Portal Creation feat was done with raw strength and was stated as such in the series, Hakai is not.

And Frieza needed to go golden to use his Ki to fully contain the energy, not resist it.
Click to expand...
There is no ki involved, it's pure destruction energy, so once again, you're spewing nonsense.

Except that fight threads aren't related to the general consensus, only if Toppo wins does it goes against the consensus.

And that mean that 'a weaker character did it with raw strenght' is a valid argument here and you should make a CRT if you ain't happy about it and Hakai was directly shown to be resisted by multiple characters who were around the same level, all using the same energy.

Why would he need to contain it if he is magicaly inherently resistent to EE and would have resisted it even if he had just been a powerless baby ? maybe because your argument is nonsense; especialy since you recognise Ki countering destruction energy right here.
 
You are confused. The Energy of Destruction and Hakai aren't the same thing, they have the same properties but in different forms.

Energy of Destruction are Ki blasts with EE elements within them because they are fueled with God of Destruction Ki.

They aren't the same as Hakai, which just deletes a target that they are pointing their hand at.

Energy of Destruction is an energy blast that erases someone when touched.

So Vegeta punching through one was because he overpowered the level of Ki being thrown at him, not that he overpowered being erased from existence through pure strength alone. It was because of his resistance to it that he wasn't erased.

The reason Frieza needed to transform? Because to control, manipulate, and condense such a large amount of energy, he needed more power. But to survive the EE effects of the attack? That's because he has the resistance for it.

The myth that Dragon Ball hax is ineffective if you have greater strength is wrong, and has been debunked with countless examples in the series.


Also, please take debate with a kinder inflection in your words. Belittling someone or their argument silences debate and stops communication which isn't the goal of this wiki - much the opposite really.
 
Warren Valion said:
You are confused. The Energy of Destruction and Hakai aren't the same thing, they have the same properties but in different forms.
Energy of Destruction are Ki blasts with EE elements within them because they are fueled with God of Destruction Ki.

They aren't the same as Hakai, which just deletes a target that they are pointing their hand at.

Energy of Destruction is an energy blast that erases someone when touched.

So Vegeta punching through one was because he overpowered the level of Ki being thrown at him, not that he overpowered being erased from existence through pure strength alone. It was because of his resistance to it that he wasn't erased.

The reason Frieza needed to transform? Because to control, manipulate, and condense such a large amount of energy, he needed more power. But to survive the EE effects of the attack? That's because he has the resistance for it.

The myth that Dragon Ball hax is ineffective if you have greater strength is wrong, and has been debunked with countless examples in the series.


Also, please take debate with a kinder inflection in your words. Belittling someone or their argument silences debate and stops communication which isn't the goal of this wiki - much the opposite really.
Click to expand...
We treat Hakai as the same as destruction energy here, Toppo even say 'Hakai' while attacking Freezer, for someone who talk about CRT, you don't know much about the consensus here.

No, nothing like that is ever said or implied in the show, Sidra make clear that destruction energy is it's own thing.

once again, Toppo litteraly scream 'hakai' while throwing destruction energy and both are considered the same on that site, go make a CRT if you ain't happy.

You mean the ki that wasn't there ?

and once again, his resistance come from where ? Oh yeah, he just is, Baby Vegeta would no sell hakai, i forgot.

Why would he need to control, manipulate and condense an attack that can't ever hurt him because he was born unable to be erased from existence ? oh yeah, because your argument doesn't make sense.

It's not a myth, we litteraly see them doing it on screen, try again, Goku, Vegeta and Freezer being suddenly born unable to be erased from existence is more of a myth than anything said about hax in DB, by your logic, Kid Goku should have EE resistance.

first, you started it, 'go make a CRT if you ain't happy' is a taunt and has no 'kind inflection' so don't play the victim now, second, being kind or not has nothing to do with your argument being absolute nonsense, 'it's not nice' is not a valid reason for people to not call out your argument for being what it is.
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
points at Guldo
Click to expand...
Guldo used his ability against characters who were barely stronger than him and we know that time fuckery require god level of strenght to resist since we saw it with Hit, different hax required different level of power to resist.
 
" and once again, his resistance come from where ? Oh yeah, he just is, Baby Vegeta would no sell hakai, i forgot."

Just saying, you don't always need explanations for why you have resistances in order to have resistance. You just need a feat of resisting the thing.
 
Dragomer said:
DragonEmperor23 said:
points at Guldo
Click to expand...
Guldo used his ability against characters who were barely stronger than him and we know that time fuckery require god level of strenght to resist since we saw it with Hit, different hax required different level of power to resist.
Click to expand...
Vegeta was strong enough to oneshot Guldo and Krillin/Gohan were fast enough to almost blitz him before he held his breath. There was definitely a large gap between the people he time stopped and himself.
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
" and once again, his resistance come from where ? Oh yeah, he just is, Baby Vegeta would no sell hakai, i forgot."
Just saying, you don't always need explanations for why you have resistances in order to have resistance. You just need a feat of resisting the thing.
Click to expand...
You don't always need a 'why' but you always need a 'how', here we don't have 'why' ki resist EE once it reach this level but we have 'how' the characters resist EE and it's by using their power.
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
Dragomer said:
DragonEmperor23 said:
points at Guldo
Click to expand...
Guldo used his ability against characters who were barely stronger than him and we know that time fuckery require god level of strenght to resist since we saw it with Hit, different hax required different level of power to resist.
Click to expand...
Vegeta was strong enough to oneshot Guldo and Krillin/Gohan were fast enough to almost blitz him before he held his breath. There was definitely a large gap between the people he time stopped and himself.
Click to expand...
Their difference in power level was barely 20% and DB characters from similar level can blitz each other in short burst, same for one shotting, Vegeta could one shot Dodoria too and yet the actual power level difference wasn't that big.

And once again, the difficulty to resist come from the hax itself, not Guldo, time hax need god level to be resisted but it can be resisted, we saw it on screen, that's just what we are shown.
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
I thought powerlevels weren't accepted as being accurate here?
Click to expand...
If they aren't there is no way to judge the difference between them and we don't even have power levels for Guldo anyway IIRC, what i said about the one shotting and blitzing is valid independently from power level.
 
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