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Speed Equalized
Hopefully this isn't a stomp
Who wins and why?
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Shalltear vs Esdeath
- Thread starter SuperKamiNappa
- Start date
- Status
Speed Equalized
Hopefully this isn't a stomp
Who wins and why?
ApiesDeathbyLazors
He/Him- 7,236
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Alright, what does Shalltear start with and can she hurt Esdeath?
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Shaltear usually sizes up her opponent then goes into mid/close range and either use spells in mid-range or pippete lance for close range. Shaltear is able to revive herself at least once so being 1-shot while sizing up Esdeath isn't a problem, Greater Teleportation is going to be a pain in the ass for Esdeath due to speed equal. Her intangibility is going to be an awesome counter to Esdeath as she can't bypass it.
Shalltear's Implosion is likely going to be a gamechanger and kill Esdeath in one go. Now, many would argue that internal damages can be bypassed by sheer dura and AP. I still want a citation and evidence of this. Again, if I find a whale 1v1 and I'm on the outside of it, I'd get my face slapped into paste. If I start inside the whale, I can easily kill it by attacking it's organs. Your organs do not have the same durability as you do outside.
Force Sanctuary would give Shalltear some breathing room if she were to be hurt too much like say, Esdeath slices off her arm or something.
To add to this, Esdeath's weakness is that she's sadistic as hell. Her main advantages are AP and durability, but Shalltear absolutely destroys her in sheer versatility. Specifically, the combo of Going in and attacking, using teleportation to get back and either rewind to regain her HP or use Greater Lethal to recover. Unless you'd argue that Shalltear is just as green as she was against Ainz (Hah. No.) then she's definitely go for the war of attrition the moment she sees Esdeath's HP pool.
Shalltear's Implosion is likely going to be a gamechanger and kill Esdeath in one go. Now, many would argue that internal damages can be bypassed by sheer dura and AP. I still want a citation and evidence of this. Again, if I find a whale 1v1 and I'm on the outside of it, I'd get my face slapped into paste. If I start inside the whale, I can easily kill it by attacking it's organs. Your organs do not have the same durability as you do outside.
Force Sanctuary would give Shalltear some breathing room if she were to be hurt too much like say, Esdeath slices off her arm or something.
To add to this, Esdeath's weakness is that she's sadistic as hell. Her main advantages are AP and durability, but Shalltear absolutely destroys her in sheer versatility. Specifically, the combo of Going in and attacking, using teleportation to get back and either rewind to regain her HP or use Greater Lethal to recover. Unless you'd argue that Shalltear is just as green as she was against Ainz (Hah. No.) then she's definitely go for the war of attrition the moment she sees Esdeath's HP pool.
ApiesDeathbyLazors
He/Him- 7,236
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Don't forget about Time Stop. In an emergency Esdeath can pull out Time Stop and, so long as Shalltear isn't mist and has used up her revive, she's dead.Akreious said:
ApiesDeathbyLazors
He/Him- 7,236
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Also, to be fair, Esdeath's use of her ice is pretty versitile. Ice armor, ice constructs, ice walls. Encasement and projectiles. In hand to hand she absolutly overwhelms Shalltear. Esdeath's control over the battlefield is also absolute, though Shalltear's flight should counter that. We also can't forget, Esdeath isn't some brute that spams attacks reacklessly. She's the empire's best general for a reason. Her starting move will depend on the starting distance, which seem to be 4 kilometers here via SBA. So she'll probably start the fight by range spaming ice projectiles and ice encasement.
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"Don't forget about Time Stop. In an emergency Esdeath can pull out Time Stop and, so long as Shalltear isn't mist and has used up her revive, she's dead."
You do know that Shalltear resists Time Stop right? It's literally required to resist time-stop and instant death to be a competent PvPer in Overlord. Plus, the phrase Time manipulation appears twice on her profile and one is followed prior by a "Resistance to", so I'm fairly sure Shalltear resists.
"In hand to hand she absolutly overwhelms Shalltear."
Not really, no. The only reason Ainz overwhelmed shalltear was because he switched weapons so quickly that you cannot predict what he'd do next so her defense was all over the place, so she was forced into the offensive where Ainz wore her out.
"We also can't forget, Esdeath isn't some brute that spams attacks reacklessly. "
Yes, but she IS a Sadistic General that wants to watch you suffer as your life is slowly drained away into her unfeeling cold eyes
"She's the empire's best general for a reason."
.... Okay? Shalltear is one of the strongest NPCs of Nazarick for a reason too, as well as one of the best 1v1 Combatants. So...
Also an immortal vampire that god knows is how old in the New World
"Her starting move will depend on the starting distance, which seem to be 4 kilometers here via SBA. So she'll probably start the fight by range spaming ice projectiles and ice encasement."
Sort of null due to Shalltear's Mist form and Teleportation. Also, Implosion bypasses like... all of that? Unless she can make ice inside her or something o_o
You do know that Shalltear resists Time Stop right? It's literally required to resist time-stop and instant death to be a competent PvPer in Overlord. Plus, the phrase Time manipulation appears twice on her profile and one is followed prior by a "Resistance to", so I'm fairly sure Shalltear resists.
"In hand to hand she absolutly overwhelms Shalltear."
Not really, no. The only reason Ainz overwhelmed shalltear was because he switched weapons so quickly that you cannot predict what he'd do next so her defense was all over the place, so she was forced into the offensive where Ainz wore her out.
"We also can't forget, Esdeath isn't some brute that spams attacks reacklessly. "
Yes, but she IS a Sadistic General that wants to watch you suffer as your life is slowly drained away into her unfeeling cold eyes
"She's the empire's best general for a reason."
.... Okay? Shalltear is one of the strongest NPCs of Nazarick for a reason too, as well as one of the best 1v1 Combatants. So...
"Her starting move will depend on the starting distance, which seem to be 4 kilometers here via SBA. So she'll probably start the fight by range spaming ice projectiles and ice encasement."
Sort of null due to Shalltear's Mist form and Teleportation. Also, Implosion bypasses like... all of that? Unless she can make ice inside her or something o_o
ApiesDeathbyLazors
He/Him- 7,236
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I have to go to bed now so this is the last thing I'll say tonight.
Will Shalltear's mist form allow her to escape when completely encased in ice? I guess teleportation would.
>Unless she can make ice inside her or something
That would literally be what freezing her solid would be yes. And Esdeath does that to fodder all the time. I didn't notice Shalltear resisted time stop. I'll be honest, I am kinda leaning towards Shalltear. Just trying to find excuses to help the ice waifu.
Will Shalltear's mist form allow her to escape when completely encased in ice? I guess teleportation would.
>Unless she can make ice inside her or something
That would literally be what freezing her solid would be yes. And Esdeath does that to fodder all the time. I didn't notice Shalltear resisted time stop. I'll be honest, I am kinda leaning towards Shalltear. Just trying to find excuses to help the ice waifu.
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"Will Shalltear's mist form allow her to escape when completely encased in ice? I guess teleportation would. "
Mist form is actually a misnomer. Mist Form makes Shalltear basically go into another dimension, so anything physical on the normal realm would do absolutely nothing to Shalltear, so being completely encased in ice wouldn't really do anything.
"That would literally be what freezing her solid would be yes. And Esdeath does that to fodder all the time. I didn't notice Shalltear resisted time stop. I'll be honest, I am kinda leaning towards Shalltear. Just trying to find excuses to help the ice waifu."
I was referring to using Ice Manipulation on the inside of Herself (Esdeath) to defend against Implosion. Although where she'd get the info and when to use it in response to Shalltear using implosion is beyond me
Mist form is actually a misnomer. Mist Form makes Shalltear basically go into another dimension, so anything physical on the normal realm would do absolutely nothing to Shalltear, so being completely encased in ice wouldn't really do anything.
"That would literally be what freezing her solid would be yes. And Esdeath does that to fodder all the time. I didn't notice Shalltear resisted time stop. I'll be honest, I am kinda leaning towards Shalltear. Just trying to find excuses to help the ice waifu."
I was referring to using Ice Manipulation on the inside of Herself (Esdeath) to defend against Implosion. Although where she'd get the info and when to use it in response to Shalltear using implosion is beyond me
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Doesn't Shalltear die from Passive Ice Death due to that gap?
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Undead in Overlord have an extremely high resistance to ice that normally makes them functionally immune to it. Esdeath's AP might overpower it a little, but it's definitely not going to be that effective. I think that Shalltear takes this mid-high difficulty due to versatility, hax, and mobility due to teleportation.
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https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1962778#4
Organ destruction isn't considered to ignore Durability to such an extent you can damage someone that much stronger
This is a stomp for Esdeath
BTW saying that being immune to 6C Ive means you can survive Ice that hits you at over 1000x higher then your Durability is. No offense. Laughable
Organ destruction isn't considered to ignore Durability to such an extent you can damage someone that much stronger
This is a stomp for Esdeath
BTW saying that being immune to 6C Ive means you can survive Ice that hits you at over 1000x higher then your Durability is. No offense. Laughable
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Shalltear can wear Esdeath down over time by chipping at her and teleporting away. Her lance will heal her over time, and time accelerator, mist form and teleportation help her escape. Greater lethal and time rewind can heal her, and her blood pool skill will replenish her MP whenever Esdeath bleeds. She can outlast Esdeath that way. Even if she dies, she can resurrect once.
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Chipping at a High 6B with 6C attacks is a no no
And she dies by literally any attack from Esdeath
And she dies by literally any attack from Esdeath
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Oh lol, it happens
ApiesDeathbyLazors
He/Him- 7,236
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We should focus on getting a consensus on the organ thing before calling this a stomp. We apperently already have a guideline on the site considering fiction organs the same as real organs.
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My wall
Now
Now
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Uh Gargoyle did you ignore the very thread you linked? ONE person said that the organ durability isn't tiers lower, everybody else said that attacking organs IS Durability Negation. A Whale is 9-B, their heart's durability in that very thread is around car level. So yes, the whale's durability is an entire tier under.Gargoyle One said:
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2 said it didn't, Ant and Genki, 3 if you count me.
More if you count this https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1305778?useskin=oasis
<In that thread is around car level
Steel framings for cars are 9B.
Also, an entire tier beneath High 6B is 6B which is still>>>>>>>>>>>6C Shalltear
And that's one move out of many that Shalltear can use as everything else is useless.
More if you count this https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1305778?useskin=oasis
<In that thread is around car level
Steel framings for cars are 9B.
Also, an entire tier beneath High 6B is 6B which is still>>>>>>>>>>>6C Shalltear
And that's one move out of many that Shalltear can use as everything else is useless.
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Wait, the ice is only in environmental destruction? As in, it was never shown to be effective against people that's 6-B themselves and were still harmed by the ice?
"More if you count this https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1305778?useskin=oasis"
Half of those guys either left the thread and never argued or simply abandoned ship once the Grace Period ended. And if you were to look, I was actively saying that Organs don't have the same durability as outside either :/
"<In that thread is around car level
Steel framings for cars are 9B.
Also, an entire tier beneath High 6B is 6B which is still>>>>>>>>>>>6C Shalltear"
Oh don't play semantics with me. You know what I meant. Still though, in that very thread above, you also failed to see another point. Implosion means a force would be tugging on your body from the inside; assuming we're going to use "Real Life Physics" of the body for fictional characters, this means not only massive stress on organs (As structural stress is separate from physical durability) but potentially, at minimum, causing a KO due to blood circulation being totally ****** up. The same effect where if you go under too intense of Gs, you pass out. Same line of logic but with an invisible magic spell on your insides rather than a really really fast jet.
"More if you count this https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1305778?useskin=oasis"
Half of those guys either left the thread and never argued or simply abandoned ship once the Grace Period ended. And if you were to look, I was actively saying that Organs don't have the same durability as outside either :/
"<In that thread is around car level
Steel framings for cars are 9B.
Also, an entire tier beneath High 6B is 6B which is still>>>>>>>>>>>6C Shalltear"
Oh don't play semantics with me. You know what I meant. Still though, in that very thread above, you also failed to see another point. Implosion means a force would be tugging on your body from the inside; assuming we're going to use "Real Life Physics" of the body for fictional characters, this means not only massive stress on organs (As structural stress is separate from physical durability) but potentially, at minimum, causing a KO due to blood circulation being totally ****** up. The same effect where if you go under too intense of Gs, you pass out. Same line of logic but with an invisible magic spell on your insides rather than a really really fast jet.
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No, Esdeath is High 6-B for one-shotting a High 6-B. Environmental destruction doesn't matter here.
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while saying that organs are weaker than your skin and such, there is a limit.
To say that something a thousend times weaker could crush your insides. Litiraly an ant could rip apart your hearth by that logic
To say that something a thousend times weaker could crush your insides. Litiraly an ant could rip apart your hearth by that logic
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????PaChi2 said:
Look at what Esdeath is scaled too.
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Anyway
<Assuming we're gonna be using real life physics
Don't
<Half of them either abandoned the thread
Both Cal and Monarch disagreed on the organs but agreed Shalltear had other ways to win. Which, in this case, she has literally zero ways to win
She can't Chip away at her AP, she resists her Mindhax, Shalltear gets stomped in pure range as she requires hundreds of meters to use any of her equipment that isn't Teleport.
<Assuming we're gonna be using real life physics
Don't
<Half of them either abandoned the thread
Both Cal and Monarch disagreed on the organs but agreed Shalltear had other ways to win. Which, in this case, she has literally zero ways to win
She can't Chip away at her AP, she resists her Mindhax, Shalltear gets stomped in pure range as she requires hundreds of meters to use any of her equipment that isn't Teleport.
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I think the OP thought Esdeath was still 6C at the time before making this to be fair.Xantospoc said:
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What? You thought Esdeath was 6C too?
It happens
It happens
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Then close this my dear sweet pachi
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