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Theglassman12

VS Battles
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Tier

So I just finished playing Bayonetta 1, and I went through the lore and text to see about the justifications for the 5-B tier. Well long story short, it's iffy at best.

So, the main reason for all the Bayonetta characters to have the 5-B tier is because of one of the first sphere angels, who's stated in the description to be able to destroy the world with a small fraction of their power. Now you may be thinking "what's wrong with the description?" Well nothing really, except for the fact that this contradicts other feats from stronger beings.

The feats that I've found is Fortitudo, who with his power is able to scorch a town with his magma.

Another is Temperantia, who with his full power is able to destroy an entire country.

When the true power of the virtue of Temperance is laid upon our world, it is said to come as a tornado, capable of swallowing an entire country. Humans are helpless to guess at the impetus behind Divine Will, whether it be anger or happiness, and are left only with prayers and promises of personal temperance if only the heavens should make the storm subside."

Yet another would have to be Sapientia, whos power can create tsunamis and whirlpools.

It is also thought that Sapientia is responsible for the rise and fall of the tides, and natural phenomena such as tsunamis. The grand idea that the living seas could be nothing other than the Divine Will at work is actually evidence of Sapientia's narcissism, even amongst the other Cardinal Virtues.

There's another one with one of Bayonetta's summons, who's stated in the infernal demons section that they have enough power to pulverize mountains.

A giant endowed with six fearsome arms capable of pulverizing mountains, those unfortunate enough to fall underfoot of the demon are subject to days-long violent earthquakes.

The thing that all of these feats have in common is that none of them are consistent with the planet level statement from the Gracious and Glorious angels. This is the same case as the Irenic feat, where it's contradicted by the feat that was shown by someone more powerful than it.

For the normal angels, there's another feat that's sort of overlooked. Though it's unclear if this can be calced or not, and this feat would have to be the numerous lightning strikes being caused by Fearless.

Almost all of the naturally occurring lightning in the world is a result of the actions of these angels. It is said that divine wrath against gluttons is released in the lightning's flash, as the thunder signals heaven's roar.

Bayonetta
So a couple of things, such as her fear resistance, soul resistance, and poison manipulation should be moved to her Bayonetta 2 key instead of her Bayonetta 1 key since she hasn't shown these abilities until the sequal. The curse resistance can stay in both tiers considering it scales from Jeanne, who's an Umbran witch like her. Though the Madness resistance I'm unsure on what to do with that considering Rosa doesn't have the same thing, and she's an umbran witch like the two of them.

The 4 Cardinals of Virtue
Now this has been bugging me for quite some time. Where in the hell did they ever shown to be Non-Corporeal in the first place? Literally every time they show up they have a physical form. Unless I'm missing something, nothing about any of their encounters shows that they have a disembodied form to begin with.

Father Balder
Now this one is a bit more minor, but still noteworthy nonetheless. So I found a line in his profile addressing him as a she, and unless I'm missing a canon fanfiction, I'm 88% sure that he's a guy. OvO
 
Again with this.

Really.

This is now the fourth thread questioning them being 5-B.

I need to make a rule to ban this.
 
@Weekly if there's any feats in Bayo 1 that I'm missing, please show them to me. Cause I was only able to find one statement out of the 5 other statements that I found.
 
You missed the one about Rodin stopping the planet from being destroyed as well as fodder angels in Bayonetta 2 having High 6-A feats
 
@Weekly I've only played Bayo 1, so I haven't found any descriptions on Rodin saving the planet. High 6-A =/= 5-B
 
@Kepe there's no 5-B calc, it's based on a statement from a first sphere angel.
 
Supposedly gifted with incredible god-like powers, there are no records of Gracious or Glorious appearing on the battlefield of evil; however, it is said this is because a mere taste of their power is enough to destroy the world, devastating all its path - both the record and the record-keeper."
 
After this thread im making a rule to stop the attempts of downgrading Bayo's 5-B form because this is getting tiresome
 
@Kepe there's more tier 7 and tier 6 feats in Bayo 1 than there is for 5-B.

@Weekly that doesn't mean he saved a planet from exploding. Crisis can mean he stopped some upbringing that would wipe all life away.
 
@Kep Gracious and Glorious can destroy the world with a fraction of their power and world in this case is taken as planet due to fodder angels having high 6-A feats and mid-tier angels being able to destroy civilizations (which is usually what we take 'destroy the world' as) with casual attacks
 
@Glass Once again, read through those two threads. There is not a single thing here that hasnt already been brougght up and declined
 
@Weekly and stronger angels are stated to have weaker feats than Gracious and Glorious.
 
Please do get him in here. I want to ask what is the reasoning behind 5-B again.

To me, it's the exact same thing as rating Obito as 5-B because he said he could destroy the world after performing a High 6-A feat that BM Naruto tanked
 
the second thread barely addressed anything.

the first thread is just you bringing up the gracious and glorious feat, and you ignored the line that says, "devastating all in its path."
 
I agree w/ the OP, I wrote a giant piece on this a while ago.

Basically the justifications for 5-B via Rodin are from Bayonetta 2 lore (which is a high 6-A feat if you trace the lore), and the High 6-A feat from Gracious/Glorious being assumed as planet busting, even though they're much weaker than the strongest cardinal virtue(s), that top out at 6-C. Balder moon busting is him being amped via one of the eyes of the world.
 
It being an outlier is a little much.

I think Bayo can get "At least High 6-A, likely far higher" from this if Balder doesn't scale to her.
 
Kepekley23 said:
@KinkiestSins

Calculations trump authors.
Honestly, you can probably easier explain this where I beamed into another reality and now this wiki uses different lettering and tiering system lul.

But in response to the OP, 5-A calc somewhere. Think Bayo is fine where it is. Although I am open to listening to the above.
 
@Kinky the 5-A calc is from the main leader of the angels being amped with the right eye. It shouldn't scale to the angels.
 
"True to its name, which means 'wild bull', this enormous hammer houses a charm by the raging bull god Gozu. Some time ago, Rodin used this hammer during a fight to save a certain planet in crisis. Despite Rodin's fine work, Bayonetta turned down the weapon, not finding the name to her liking. Rodin felt he had no choice but to join the battle himself and put on a personal display of its power. Rodin has since made it more powerful for Jeanne, traveling to Japan to find and affix a new charm."

Cool. Doesn't mean it's necessarily 5-B.
 
Saving a planet from Crisis can also mean saving all life on the planet from dying. It doesn't automatically equate to preventing the planet from blowing up.
 
The context behind that is him saving a planet from a guy threatening its stability. Has literally nothing to do with Attack Potency.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
High 6-A is fine. Balder has a 5-A feat in destroying the moon, no? So it wouldn't even affect Bayo that much.
That was with the right eye active.
 
Tier 4 feats

Balder isn't 5-A for destroying the moon. He's Low 4-C via doing it while amped with an eye of the world.

Bayo with the other eye of the world

High 6-A feats

Gracious and Glorious supposed lore

Rodin shaking the planet and splitting the clouds with a hammer in Bayo 2 (can probably be redone as an earthquake calc tbh)

6-C feats

Cardinal virtue Temperantia creating a country wide storm via lore (Calc'd at 6-C)

Madama Butterfly stalemating a weaker clone of Temperantia in Bayo 2

Temperantia being weakened by Bayo and being killed off by a summon of Bayo detailed as a mountain buster in the lore (Calc'd at 6-C)
 
You are completely ignoring even worse angels being responsible for world-wide natural phenomena like causing all tsunami and thunderstorms in the planet. Also the angel who creates a barrier over the whole extent of the ocean which is much larger than the ocean we humans can see as the true one is hidden by the angels.
 
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