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Plot Manipulation

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Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)

Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)

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Okay, so it has come to my attention that there are two types of Plot Manipulation. There is the type where the character manipulates/changes the storyline, and then there is the type where the character manipulates what the story is made out of. Anti-Pops and any character who like manipulates panels in manga/comics are an example of this second type. I think that there should be a separation of these two types of Plot Manipulation, because the first type is much more useful than the second type, and the uses of them are much different, too. I don't know what I should be called, though. Suggestions?
 
I suggest that the first type of Plot Manipulation in which a character manipulates/changes the story line be called "True Plot Manipulation or Advanced Plot Manipluation". Secondly when a character manipulates panels in manga/comics I think it should be called "Story Panel Plot Manipulation", although these name would probably need to be shortened for covenience.
 
I don't think the name of the first type needs to change. And it isn't just with panels. Manipulating pages the characters are on, the game the character is in, stuff like that. Manipulating what the story is made out of, the canvas, persay. A suggestion would be to divide it into Type 1 and Type 2, but I'm open to the idea of renaming the second type altogether in a second ability page.
 
If you're referring to the Hero ability, we discussed in the Media Box thread that the page for Plot-Induced Stupidity can work for that type 3 you're proposing. It's also extremely uncommon as an actual ability, so there probably doesn't need to be a whole page for it.

Are we going to call them Type 1 and Type 2, though, or should a different name be used for the second type?
 
Fair point, it is so rare It probably isn't worth it. I agree

Type 1 can be like 'story manipulation' or something

Type 2 can be like 'medium manipulation' since they are manipulating the medium on which the story is taking place in/on
 
This seems like it would likely be too much of a bother to change, but I am open for input from other staff members.
 
Considering Plot Manipulation isn't just the most used ability in fiction, if "Plot users" is a category, it wouldn't be that hard to go through and just add types to the characters that have it, if Type 1 and Type 2 would be our method of differentiate it. As I said, they have vastly different applications, so it would make sense to separate them.
 
It is probably not important enough. Sorry.
 
Wouldn't it be better to just explain how their Plot Manipulation works on the profile pages rather than trying to shoehorn things into categories?
 
Because the second type is extremely different. I just see manipulating the storyline and manipulating what the story is made out of as different enough to be divided into types, as they have way different methods of performing, different applications, and people who resist one type shouldn't automatically resist the other.
 
If you guys are hellbent on this, then I don't think it would be harmful to do this since there are only a couple hundred profiles with this power.

But you'll also need to find scans to prove each and every example.
 
Reppuzan said:
If you guys are hellbent on this, then I don't think it would be harmful to do this since there are only a couple hundred profiles with this power.

But you'll also need to find scans to prove each and every example.
Click to expand...
We can just go through the reasonings most characters are given Plot Manipulation. Like, I would hope most characters who have it have justification. Admittedly, Bowser has no justification, but he has the first type.

And I'm fine with the second type getting a page called Media/Medium Manipulation if that's what everyone agrees with over dividing it into Type 1 and Type 2.
 
Well, I also think that it would be hard to know which type that is intended for each and every profile.
 
They will often not be available. I think that this seems to likely be unnecessary.
 
But if you don't what if someone gets confused between them and just assumes it's the first one that most people think of?

If this wiki is a index first then if the profile doesn't explain it and someone just looked up the page they would just assume it's the more common one which is also much more powerful.
 
I suppose that you have a point. If Reppuzan is willing to help organise this, it could be an idea.
 
The thing about turning this into Type 1 and Type 2 is that Type 1 is literally no different from Reality Warping.

I'd still much rather just explain the reasonings and extent of one's ability to use Plot Manipulation.
 
Rewriting the story is different from just reality warping, though. While the applications may be similar, the method of doing so is different. And Type 2 is very different from Type 1, and the applications and methods of performing Type 1 and Type 2 aren't similar at all. They are just abilities that are similar in nature, as Type 1 changes the storyline and Type 2 changes what the story is made out of. I think the there should be a distinction on any profile that has it to show which profile has which, because they're really different.
 
If you're referring to Reality Warping and Type 1 Plot Manipulation, yes. It's similar to Concept Manipulation and Reality Warping. Concept Manipulation has similar applications, but is better. Type 1 Plot Manipulation is the same way.
 
The proposal Reppu is making(my interpretation of it, at least) is similar to saying we should get rid of Type 1 Plot Manipulation(manipulating the storyline/rewriting the story) and leave only Type 2(which is far more uncommon), replacing any instance of rewriting the story with Reality Warping instead. This, I don't agree with.
 
I do not agree with that either, but do not think that he suggested it.
 
@Hadou

That's not what I said at all.

What I said was that there's no point in making the categories the way you described them as since Type 1 is literally just high-end Reality Warping.

Just have explanations on each and every profile with Plot Manipulation to explain what each character can do and be done with it.

There's no need to make this overly complicated.
 
I think that makes sense.
 
Type 1 is just high-end Reality Warping, yes. But Type 2 is still necessary, in my opinion, to be differentiated from the first Type. And going on every profile and adding descriptions for them to differentiate them is just similar to adding a Type 2 to the Plot Manipulation page and differentiating them using Type 1 and Type 2 on the profiles.
 
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