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Since the last revision thread is around 2 months old, is better to make a new thread with a more defined information to deliver. Anyway, today I want to bring up some stuff that was left out in previous discussions and some new stuff that I want to brought up.
I've been revicing the threads for the earthbound upgrades to see if I've missed something, and during that time, I realized something that was kinda left hanging, but now can have some kind of solution.
ArbitraryNumbers stated that the kids would not gain any kind of resistance during the battle with Giygas due to being a massive PIS at the time, since Ness was still 3-A. The resistance were against Space-Time Manipulation, since Giygas was able to create a dimension of Darkness were he fought the kids, and even during the process of creating it, the Kids were just fine, He's also stated to be able to disrupt the Time-Space of the normal universe, and Time Paradox Immunity, since despite fighting Gigyas in the past, were all his army and equipment was, and also were he started causing the distortion of the place due to the battle, the present timeline didn't suffer any change, and the kids were able to come back just fine. As stated, this were rejected due to being PIS, however, with the "no recent anymore" Ness upgrade to Low-2C, it was agreed that he was the one defending the party during the battle, and the main focus of the battle againt Giygas, thus, turning the battle into a normal confrontation, removing the PIS, thus, should the kids have the resistance now? At least Ness, since he was the one tanking almost all the damage?
Giygas is also stated to be the embodiment of evil in the NoA version, and the Japanse version states that he's "evil itself", so should this count as conceptual embodiment?
Also, every one who can use the Frankling badge should be resistance against Lighting Manipulation, due to the fact that the Frankling badge reflects all Lighting/Electricy attacks, and at least for the Earthbound co. against Light Manipulation too, since the Night Pendant is stated to be able to absorb the Light of Light attacks.
Other thing that I wanted to brought up, is that I think Void Manipulation should be a better wording to Giygas existance erasure abilitie, since it shows more often and as more proof. For example, during the entire of the events of Earthbound, it is refered that Giygas will bring eternal darkness to the entire Universe, As referenced before, Darkness refers more to the cease of existance instead of something like Darkness manipulation, since is refered as the complete destruction of the Universe, and there's never an abilitie to control something like shadows or similar in the entire franchise, so darkness in the sence of "cease to exist" is the best option. During the final battle with Giygas, as stated above, he creates a dimension that stated of being just "dark",
fitting for someone who's stated of being capable of putting everything into the darkness of nothing itself, and also, when Paula starts calling for help via her prayers, during the final one, is stated of "Paula's called was absorbed by the darkness",
showing once again, some power recemblace to Void Manipulation, since it was able to absorbed something as non-corporeal as a call for help. This seems more fitting then just simple existance erasure, and I think I can suggest that the Kids should have some resistance to it, since they were able to survive during this battle, even when Giygas already turn the surroundings into a dimension of darkness, and they also survive long enough for Giygas to not erase them right on there.
Other thing that was brought up during this thread, is that despite being supossely a dimension only in his mind, Ness was still able to brought up items from there to the real world, kinda like Maria's Magicant, so, this would give him creation, and also absorption, since he absorbed the entirety of Magicant.
And finally regarding EarthBound/MOTHER 2, I've noticed that some characters like Cirno have Soul Manipulation for being able to damage Spirits and Ghost with their base attacks, since characters in the Mother series are also capable of duing this, should they also gain Soul Manipulation?
There's one little thing about MOTHER 3 that I wanted to talk, and is about clarifying more the Dark Dragon's profile. The only abilitie stated there is his Awaken, but only 1 of the three options. Not only this takes some explination of his abilities, but also makes stuff like Conceptual Manipulation making no sense in being in his profile. Something that I think would be a better explanation would be something like this: "Once the Dark Dragon fully awakens, it will remake the World in the heart of his awakener, depending if its good or evil. Of it is good, it will completly remove all "evil" of existance, and make life shine brightly, or, if it is evil, he will destroy everything to satisfy the ambitions of his awakener. If the one who awakens him doesn't have a heart, it will destroy all life, incluiding itself." All the quote's explaining this comes from the Magypsie Ionia, so this is a realiable explanition.
This last one could easily be a minserpretation, but I think it can hold some veracity, so here I go. During the event of MOTHER 3, it is stated that the Dark Dragon is "the power of the Earth itself", as shown here.
During EarthBound/MOTHER 2, it is stated the next sentence.
So, acording to this, Ness uniting his power with that of the Earth itself could be related to him absorbing the power of the Dark Dragon.
While it seems unlikely, there's some point that can be brought up to sustent this. First, it is very clear that Ness's powers after uniting himself with the Earth are related in some way with the Dragon's powers. For example, both similar in the way that both are capable of performing universal+ energy, like the Dragon being able to end time, and Ness's becoming one with it. Other thing is that the Dark Dragon can be considered being alive during the event of EarthBound; It is stated in MOTHER 3 that the Dragon as been on the Island where MOTHER 3 takes place for a "long, long time", so he existing in the time of EarthBound is very likely, since there's sign of even old civilizations in the Island, and the Magypsis that sealed him, are stated of being there even in "ancient times". There's also the fact that MOTHER 3 can very likely take place in the same universe as EarthBound, just many years in the future, so it could be related. So basically, Ness's power comes from uniting his powers with the Dark Dragon, pretty much granting him his new powers. My idea with this is that Ness could get a "possibly 2-C" rating based on the fact that he uses the same power source as the Dark Dragon (The Dark Dragon itself), thus, should have his same power.
I know that last one is pretty theori-zy, but at least I would like to hear some input.
That's all for this thread that I have to proposed. Thanks for reading.
I've been revicing the threads for the earthbound upgrades to see if I've missed something, and during that time, I realized something that was kinda left hanging, but now can have some kind of solution.
ArbitraryNumbers stated that the kids would not gain any kind of resistance during the battle with Giygas due to being a massive PIS at the time, since Ness was still 3-A. The resistance were against Space-Time Manipulation, since Giygas was able to create a dimension of Darkness were he fought the kids, and even during the process of creating it, the Kids were just fine, He's also stated to be able to disrupt the Time-Space of the normal universe, and Time Paradox Immunity, since despite fighting Gigyas in the past, were all his army and equipment was, and also were he started causing the distortion of the place due to the battle, the present timeline didn't suffer any change, and the kids were able to come back just fine. As stated, this were rejected due to being PIS, however, with the "no recent anymore" Ness upgrade to Low-2C, it was agreed that he was the one defending the party during the battle, and the main focus of the battle againt Giygas, thus, turning the battle into a normal confrontation, removing the PIS, thus, should the kids have the resistance now? At least Ness, since he was the one tanking almost all the damage?
Giygas is also stated to be the embodiment of evil in the NoA version, and the Japanse version states that he's "evil itself", so should this count as conceptual embodiment?
Also, every one who can use the Frankling badge should be resistance against Lighting Manipulation, due to the fact that the Frankling badge reflects all Lighting/Electricy attacks, and at least for the Earthbound co. against Light Manipulation too, since the Night Pendant is stated to be able to absorb the Light of Light attacks.
Other thing that I wanted to brought up, is that I think Void Manipulation should be a better wording to Giygas existance erasure abilitie, since it shows more often and as more proof. For example, during the entire of the events of Earthbound, it is refered that Giygas will bring eternal darkness to the entire Universe, As referenced before, Darkness refers more to the cease of existance instead of something like Darkness manipulation, since is refered as the complete destruction of the Universe, and there's never an abilitie to control something like shadows or similar in the entire franchise, so darkness in the sence of "cease to exist" is the best option. During the final battle with Giygas, as stated above, he creates a dimension that stated of being just "dark",
fitting for someone who's stated of being capable of putting everything into the darkness of nothing itself, and also, when Paula starts calling for help via her prayers, during the final one, is stated of "Paula's called was absorbed by the darkness",
showing once again, some power recemblace to Void Manipulation, since it was able to absorbed something as non-corporeal as a call for help. This seems more fitting then just simple existance erasure, and I think I can suggest that the Kids should have some resistance to it, since they were able to survive during this battle, even when Giygas already turn the surroundings into a dimension of darkness, and they also survive long enough for Giygas to not erase them right on there.
Other thing that was brought up during this thread, is that despite being supossely a dimension only in his mind, Ness was still able to brought up items from there to the real world, kinda like Maria's Magicant, so, this would give him creation, and also absorption, since he absorbed the entirety of Magicant.
And finally regarding EarthBound/MOTHER 2, I've noticed that some characters like Cirno have Soul Manipulation for being able to damage Spirits and Ghost with their base attacks, since characters in the Mother series are also capable of duing this, should they also gain Soul Manipulation?
There's one little thing about MOTHER 3 that I wanted to talk, and is about clarifying more the Dark Dragon's profile. The only abilitie stated there is his Awaken, but only 1 of the three options. Not only this takes some explination of his abilities, but also makes stuff like Conceptual Manipulation making no sense in being in his profile. Something that I think would be a better explanation would be something like this: "Once the Dark Dragon fully awakens, it will remake the World in the heart of his awakener, depending if its good or evil. Of it is good, it will completly remove all "evil" of existance, and make life shine brightly, or, if it is evil, he will destroy everything to satisfy the ambitions of his awakener. If the one who awakens him doesn't have a heart, it will destroy all life, incluiding itself." All the quote's explaining this comes from the Magypsie Ionia, so this is a realiable explanition.
This last one could easily be a minserpretation, but I think it can hold some veracity, so here I go. During the event of MOTHER 3, it is stated that the Dark Dragon is "the power of the Earth itself", as shown here.
During EarthBound/MOTHER 2, it is stated the next sentence.
So, acording to this, Ness uniting his power with that of the Earth itself could be related to him absorbing the power of the Dark Dragon.
While it seems unlikely, there's some point that can be brought up to sustent this. First, it is very clear that Ness's powers after uniting himself with the Earth are related in some way with the Dragon's powers. For example, both similar in the way that both are capable of performing universal+ energy, like the Dragon being able to end time, and Ness's becoming one with it. Other thing is that the Dark Dragon can be considered being alive during the event of EarthBound; It is stated in MOTHER 3 that the Dragon as been on the Island where MOTHER 3 takes place for a "long, long time", so he existing in the time of EarthBound is very likely, since there's sign of even old civilizations in the Island, and the Magypsis that sealed him, are stated of being there even in "ancient times". There's also the fact that MOTHER 3 can very likely take place in the same universe as EarthBound, just many years in the future, so it could be related. So basically, Ness's power comes from uniting his powers with the Dark Dragon, pretty much granting him his new powers. My idea with this is that Ness could get a "possibly 2-C" rating based on the fact that he uses the same power source as the Dark Dragon (The Dark Dragon itself), thus, should have his same power.
I know that last one is pretty theori-zy, but at least I would like to hear some input.
That's all for this thread that I have to proposed. Thanks for reading.
