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wtf zeno has been declared capable of destroying 12 universe destroyed 6 has declared the maximum on the dragon scale. ball being the alpha cosmology I do not think you should show that it scales ridiculously by power twelve universe
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Cause on tier 2, it's all about literally destroying the universebut like
why? that makes no sense at all and I've never seen such a standard that exists
I have no idea how this makes EE scale to APCause on tier 2, it's all about literally destroying the universe
regular EE just isn't enough when it's on such a scale unless there's actual evidence. Basically, Zeno already scales to tier 2 level characters, or 4D characters. Unless you could prove that his hax scales infinitely higher than he does, his Tier 2 rating isn't changingI have no idea how this makes EE scale to AP
there is so much wrong with this but I can't get into a fraction of it without derailing the threadSome hax can give you tier, like EE or Creation.
dyspo thing is an outlier, we have seen zeno capable of percieving and reacting to faster people within the tournament of power.If “stronger = faster” applied to Zeno then shouldn’t he have been able to easily perceive Dyspo?
why do you think his fighting speed is fodder when higher power=higher speed within dragon ball, and zeno is blatantly above all within the verseZeno is an exception with his fighting speed being literal canon fodder in comparison. That argument still doesn’t work
Cause he has literally no fighting capabilities whatsoever. That, and he literally needed the god pad thing. These things aren’t just outlierswhy do you think his fighting speed is fodder when higher power=higher speed within dragon ball, and zeno is blatantly above all within the verse
Not being considered a "fighter" is fine for zeno, but again even with 0 experience in martial arts or any type of fighting he remains at the pinnacle of the verse, so clearly having no experience in fighting doesn't really matter to him. And the dyspo thing is 100% is an outlier, especially since we see zeno easily percieving literally every other fight in the tournament of power, and even fighters that should scale far above dyspo in the t.o.p.Cause he has literally no fighting capabilities whatsoever. That, and he literally needed the god pad thing. These things aren’t just outliers
Zeno feat when erase Zamasu is treated as Existence Erasure hax, not ki blast anymoreDisagree. We clearly see his energy start at his hands and then move outward in an omni-directional path way. This can clearly be calced for an attack speed.
It's erasure hax and still very much calcable to get an attack speed.Zeno feat when erase Zamasu is treated as Existence Erasure hax, not ki blast anymore
You don't calc hax and scale it to general speed rating, or everyone have passive hax or timestop hax will get infinite speedIt's erasure hax and still very much calcable to get an attack speed.
You don't calc hax and scale it to general speed rating, or everyone have passive hax or timestop hax will get infinite speed
Oh, and in Tounarment of Power he just raise his hand and 1 universes erased instantly, so we have infinite speed for him and everyone else in the verse then. No, we don't calc speed of a hax, even if it is depicted in similar way to an energy blastIf a time stop is done via an omni directional blast that starts at the user, then you can calc the attack speed of a time stop. Zeno's hax was depicted in such a way that it can be calced. Hax can be calced for speed depending on how its done.
Oh, and in Tounarment of Power he just raise his hand and 1 universes erased instantly, so we have infinite speed for him and everyone else in the verse then. No, we don't calc speed of a hax, even if it is depicted in similar way to an energy blast
ToP feat he cross the distance from himself to the universe instantly with his EE hax, and no projectile or something like spreading omnidirection blast was involved, that is enough for a likely infinite speed rating. So using visual choice here to calc a suppose EE blast is kinda a bad choice here
If you think that giving tiers (AP) to EE is wrong, make a CRT.there is so much wrong with this but I can't get into a fraction of it without derailing the thread
Meh, it was always in relation to power tbh. I doubt they call him that for speed or anything like thatBeing above all can be interpreted in many ways, not just about power
A very generic and overall statementMeh, it was always in relation to power tbh. I doubt they call him that for speed or anything like that
but it was pretty clear that it was referring to raw power in the hierarchy that's set out in DBA very generic and overall statement
I think saying that he doesn’t even know how to use ki is a little bit of a stretch, seeing as he’s alive and is clearly fairly intelligent to a degree as the tournament implied.And, he actually above everyone with his EE, physically, no. we don't even know if he actually know how to use Ki, no feat for it at all, so while should we rate him like what on his profile right now?????
Well, i'm sorry if this sound rude to you, but you should tell that to AKM, he is the one who agree with the thread of treating Zeno erased IZ feat as EE feat, not ki blastAlso, I hope I don't have to say this, but Zeno nukes IZ, he doesn't use his Erase ability for that one.
Zeno's nuking is much different from him actually erasing people. For nuking, Zeno charges up his ki blasts. For erasing, he just waves his one hand upward and the dude/universe he targets just vanishes into non-existence.
And...what your point, Babidi also very intellectual person, but he also doesn't have Ki Manip on his profile cuz he never have feat of doing this, or should we make a CRT to have Babidi get Ki Manip because he is intelligence individual?????I think saying that he doesn’t even know how to use ki is a little bit of a stretch, seeing as he’s alive and is clearly fairly intelligent to a degree as the tournament implied.
Oh? I could've sworn he was part of the group that agreed to Zamasu's feat involving a ki blast instead of EE.Well, i'm sorry if this sound rude to you, but you should tell that to AKM, he is the one who agree with the thread of treating Zeno erased IZ feat as EE feat, not ki blast
1. Its verbatim stated he is the strongest, stronger than anyone else, so yes i believe it means in power.2. Being above all can be interpreted in many ways, not just about power
3. Can we stop using outlier as a way to counter an argument????, Dyspo consistently showing that his speed above many other but not his power. Or we considering Dyspo is a outlier character and treat him non-existence???
Instant just means a short period of time not literally 0 time. We also see it taking moments for zeno's erasure to take place, so its definitely not happening in 0 time. But even if it was, that would just scale his attack speed to infinite. Using the wiki's ratings to justify why things aren't the case isn't good logic imo.Oh, and in Tounarment of Power he just raise his hand and 1 universes erased instantly, so we have infinite speed for him and everyone else in the verse then. No, we don't calc speed of a hax, even if it is depicted in similar way to an energy blast
I don't think this was ever saidit's also stated that he can erase anything
1. Oh, it is your interpretation then, but well his EE hax did above everyone else1. Its verbatim stated he is the strongest, stronger than anyone else, so yes i believe it means in power.
2. Because it is 100% an outlier, or do you mean to tell me dyspo is literally faster than anyone else in the tournament of power? You mean to tell me he was fine percieving ui goku vs jiren, and ssb level fights no problem, but dyspo by himself debunks all of that?
No. It is more consistent, in the tournament of power, and even narratively speaking that zeno has the speed to react to those fighters.
Instant just means a short period of time not literally 0 time. We also see it taking moments for zeno's erasure to take place, so its definitely not happening in 0 time. But even if it was, that would just scale his attack speed to infinite. Using the wiki's ratings to justify why things aren't the case isn't good logic imo.
Was literally just about to make this.The current speed justifications for Zen-Oh are invalid. His profile assumes that Future Zen-Oh erased Trunks' timeline with a energy blast that encompassed the Multiverse in a matter of seconds, but there was no blast involved in the destruction. He simply targeted the world and then removed it from existence -- range.
His rating should instead be Unknown, with a note in parentheses noting that, "While he has no feats to back up any concrete rating, it is strongly believed in-verse that defeating Zen-Oh would be impossible, no matter the means".
me, being an idiot, forgot to upload the scan to imgur prior to heading away from my home computer, so it is not on me at the moment
however, the statement of zen-oh being unbeatable comes from shin when goku brought up the zen-oh button to him in ep. 67
What I meant is that it’s highly unlikely that Zeno was around for so long without learning about ki. He even seems to be able to notice and understand it in the top.And...what your point, Babidi also very intellectual person, but he also doesn't have Ki Manip on his profile cuz he never have feat of doing this, or should we make a CRT to have Babidi get Ki Manip because he is intelligence individual?????