Zen-Oh downgrade (DBS CRT)

[Nullflowerblush]

The current speed justifications for Zen-Oh are invalid. His profile assumes that Future Zen-Oh erased Trunks' timeline with a energy blast that encompassed the Multiverse in a matter of seconds, but there was no blast involved in the destruction. He simply targeted the world and then removed it from existence -- range.

His rating should instead be Unknown, with a note in parentheses noting that, "While he has no feats to back up any concrete rating, it is strongly believed in-verse that defeating Zen-Oh would be impossible, no matter the means".

me, being an idiot, forgot to upload the scan to imgur prior to heading away from my home computer, so it is not on me at the moment
however, the statement of zen-oh being unbeatable comes from shin when goku brought up the zen-oh button to him in ep. 67

 

[LeSupremeKing1]

Disagree, zeno isn't given his speed rating not only because of that feat

 

[Orange]

Well besides erasing the future multiverse with a squish, he also erased all the universes that participated in T.O.P baring U7, he also ersed the previous 6 universes, and stated to be capeable of destroying everything in a blink of an eye.

In Future trunks etc, we see his blast actually getting bigger before everything gets erased.

In 2:28 to be exact.

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

I agree with this, for the same reasons I disagreed with Zeno getting EE resistance, Zeno simply targeted the universe and erased it like every other time he's on screen the expansion is only light.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

I agree.

 

[Braking]

so just a zeno change into unknown? i guess i could agree

 

[Orange]

Well besides erasing the future multiverse with a squish, he also erased all the universes that participated in T.O.P baring U7, he also ersed the previous 6 universes, and stated to be capeable of destroying everything in a blink of an eye.

In Future trunks etc, we see his blast actually getting bigger before everything gets erased.

In 2:28 to be exact.

My dumb ass though this about Ap

Ignore my comment -

 

[Rikimarox2]

I agree as well.

 

[CheatHydra]

Agreed

 

[Teezar]

I agree

 

[sanicspood]

yea i agree with this

 

[Valiant_Abyss]

If I had a dollar for every time there was a DBS CRT in the last 8 months...

 

[Tarang123]

Disagree with the logic here, but I agree that he should have an unknown rating.

zeno’s unknown rating would be due to not having any implication of scaling to his own blast’s speed. He himself is no fighter and has more anti-feats than feats.

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Disagree with the logic here, but I agree that he should have an unknown rating.

zeno’s unknown rating would be due to not having any implication of scaling to his own blast’s speed. He himself is no fighter and has more anti-feats than feats.

He scales to his own blasts speed by default, too bad it never actually moved.

 

[Tarang123]

He scales to his own blasts speed by default, too bad it never actually moved.

Nah, he doesn’t. There’s no reason for him of all people who to scale to that speed. The blast did expand and was just hilariously fast. It wasn’t the same way that he destroyed the universes in the tournament

 

[LeSupremeKing1]

Nah, he doesn’t. There’s no reason for him of all people who to scale to that speed. The blast did expand and was just hilariously fast. It wasn’t the same way that he destroyed the universes in the tournament

people in dragon ball consistently scale to the speed of their own ki attacks

 

[Tarang123]

people in dragon ball consistently scale to the speed of their own ki attacks

Zeno is an exception with his fighting speed being literal canon fodder in comparison. That argument still doesn’t work

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

people in dragon ball consistently scale to the speed of their own ki attacks

If “stronger = faster” applied to Zeno then shouldn’t he have been able to easily perceive Dyspo?

 

[ZillertheBucko]

I agree with this, for the same reasons I disagreed with Zeno getting EE resistance

stares angrily

 

[ZillertheBucko]

also I'd agree with zeno's attack potency being removed, but being able to watch the tournament of power go down is still evidence of reaction speed

 

[Tarang123]

also I'd agree with zeno's attack potency being removed, but being able to watch the tournament of power go down is still evidence of reaction speed

Why would his attack potency need to be removed? He’s still 2C

 

[Ganasto]

Shouldn't we scale him to the fastest fight he could see as an at least or no

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Why would his attack potency need to be removed? He’s still 2C

because his only attack has been erasure hax with a low 2-C range

 

[ZillertheBucko]

and now I'm confused
is this thread exclusively a speed downgrade or AP too?

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

and now I'm confused
is this thread exclusively a speed downgrade or AP too?

Speed.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

ok, then I just disagree

 

[Lightning_XXI]

I agree with the OP's reasons to remove the blast "speed" from his speed rating, however that's not the only reason for his MFTL+ speed from what I see, since he's capable of keeping up with Goku and Hit, apparently

So Unknown isn't necessary if the other feat stays

 

[Tarang123]

because his only attack has been erasure hax with a low 2-C range

Nah, there are other statements that he could easily destroy the entire DB multiverse. And the attack was a ki blast

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Nah, there are other statements that he could easily destroy the entire DB multiverse. And the attack was a ki blast

how was the attack a ki blast? he visibly erases zamasu
also destroy often refers to EE, especially with the gods, and especially with zeno who has never used anything except for erasing attacks

 

[Ganasto]

how was the attack a ki blast? he visibly erases zamasu
also destroy often refers to EE, especially with the gods, and especially with zeno who has never used anything except for erasing attacks

It was like balls of ki from his hands, when he erases universes he always just closes his fist iirc

 

[ZillertheBucko]

It was like balls of ki from his hands, when he erases universes he always just closes his fist iirc

it visibly was the exact same affect as when he erases every other universe
the reason it was dramatized is because he was erasing a low 2-C zamasu instead of just a universe
there's really nothing that suggests it was a blast

 

[Ganasto]

it visibly was the exact same affect as when he erases every other universe
the reason it was dramatized is because he was erasing a low 2-C zamasu instead of just a universe
there's really nothing that suggests it was a blast

That right there suggests it. Also the fact that we see it expanding in his hand and throughout what we can see of the universe like a ball of ki instead of everything being erased without contact seemingly instantaneously.

 

[Vizer04]

Following

 

[ZillertheBucko]

That right there suggests it. Also the fact that we see it expanding in his hand and throughout what we can see of the universe like a ball of ki instead of everything being erased without contact seemingly instantaneously.

I have read this 23 times now and I still have no idea what your argument is at all

 

[Ganasto]

I have read this 23 times now and I still have no idea what your argument is at all

Lol I'm just saying if you rewatch the erasing Zamasu clip, 2 ki balls expand in his hand and we see it in the background expanding to destroy the entire universe. When zeno uses blatant existence erasure like in ToP he does it instantaneously without contact. I don't think it being dramatized just for the sake of erasing Zamasu is enough evidence when it could just very well be a ki blast. It behaves just like one too

 

[Tarang123]

it visibly was the exact same affect as when he erases every other universe
the reason it was dramatized is because he was erasing a low 2-C zamasu instead of just a universe
there's really nothing that suggests it was a blast

Again, the expansion was completely different. With the other universes, they just disappeared. With Zamasu, it literally went and encompassed the entire timeline.

 

[Tarang123]

I have read this 23 times now and I still have no idea what your argument is at all

He's saying that the expansion implies that it's a ki blast, not like his usual AP. Even then, it wouldn't affect his AP due to him scaling comfortably above the angels who are already 2C

 

[ZillertheBucko]

He's saying that the expansion implies that it's a ki blast, not like his usual AP. Even then, it wouldn't affect his AP due to him scaling comfortably above the angels who are already 2C

all of his statements for scaling most likely refer to his ability to erase anything, we literally don't even have any hard evidence that zeno is capable of beating yamcha without it

 

[Tarang123]

all of his statements for scaling most likely refer to his ability to erase anything, we literally don't even have any hard evidence that zeno is capable of beating yamcha without it

Bruh what? Zeno is consistently considered the most powerful character in the entirety of DBS. You'd need actual evidence that the angels have more raw power than Zeno, which is never once confirmed or even implied lmao.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Bruh what? Zeno is consistently considered the most powerful character in the entirety of DBS. You'd need actual evidence that the angels have more raw power than Zeno, which is never once confirmed or even implied lmao.

the implication is probably that he's a b a b y
but I guess I see your point