Yuta & Maki vs 15f Sukuna

[Gokukid2005]

Honestly I don’t think she’d be able to set up a sneak attack. In her fight with Sukuna, the narrator said she wouldn’t have been able to set up a sneak attack under normal circumstances and I doubt he would just lose track of her in the middle of a fight. The reason she cut off his hand prior was because he was getting jumped by Yuji and the others and cause he literally didn’t think she would be able to get back up after the black flash

While that's true, the fact she was able to pull off the sneak attack back to back with Sukuna acknowledging both times that he shouldn't have fallen for it should lend some credence to the idea that she could do it again.

On top of that, she can’t really just leave either. If she goes too far, she leaves Yuta’s domain and by proxy leaves SSK inside the domain cause she wouldn’t be able to bring a cursed tool out with her since it’d get caught in the barrier.

Whether its in or out shouldn't really matter seeing as she can enter and leave as she pleases.

Actually, now that I think about it. How the hell does Maki interact with something like a shrunken domain. She inherently doesn’t interact with barriers and domains which is why she’s able to walk through the edges of them but if the barrier is shrunken wouldn’t that mean like half of her body is outside of it

She's able to consent to entering a domain expansion, she just cannot be "trapped" in one.
It does sound really funny for half her body to stick out tho

 

[AbaddonTheDisappointment]

While that's true, the fact she was able to pull off the sneak attack back to back with Sukuna acknowledging both times that he shouldn't have fallen for it should lend some credence to the idea that she could do it again.

Whether its in or out shouldn't really matter seeing as she can enter and leave as she pleases.

She's able to consent to entering a domain expansion, she just cannot be "trapped" in one.
It does sound really funny for half her body to stick out tho

Was mostly bringing up the leaving SSK in there part since Sukuna could just track the sword and if he notices it’s no longer where she dropped it he knows she’s somewhere and would probably be prepared for it

Also okay so at least that means Maki won’t be half in the shrunken domain and her ripped apart my malevolent shrine lol

 

[Giannysmag]

16F Megukuna blitzed and one shot Ryu with Cleave who was later compared in dura to EOS Yuta. I don't see why this Sukuna couldn't do the same if he locked in here, especially since he is probably gonna get interested in the whole "Jujutsu vs Body" thing.

Even if he doesn't instantly go for the kill and just toys with them for a bit, their only wincons are Maki cutting of his head with SSK or Yuta going 5 min mode and blasting him with JL, but the moment Sukuna actually feels threatened by these abilities he is just gonna kill them.

Popping a domain is probably the worst idea for Yuta in this match up since it's just gonna force Sukuna to put up his own domain. Worst case scenario Yuta's domain gets refinement diffed, best case scenario he can put up a clash for a few minutes with the basketball domain but will eventually be destroyed from the outside (that is of course assuming that Sukuna doesn't just kill them himself inside the domain first).

Shibuya Sukuna is still a monster that beats anyone and everyone not named Gojo unfortunately.

 

[Gokukid2005]

Cleave doesn’t leave bloodstains on his fingers. Look at his fingers. Also, he doesn’t always cut people when he touches them; sometimes he beats them up.

This feels like a reach.
He wants to kill Maki to prove superiority.
He mentions he needs to cleave their head to kill them.
His cleave is weakened and cannot one shot them even to the head.
So Maki survives it. Assuming that he randomly decided to dig his nails into her face rather than using his whole slicing gimmick is cope.

 

[Gokukid2005]

Was mostly bringing up the leaving SSK in there part since Sukuna could just track the sword and if he notices it’s no longer where she dropped it he knows she’s somewhere and would probably be prepared for it

Fair.
I do think if he gets pressed enough/interested enough in Yuta and Rika he could lose track of that, seeing as he's a very capricious man and that's exactly what happened the second time he got snuck.
He assumed Maki was down and got "distracted" by a bunch of nobodies he cared nothing for so much so he didn't sense her sword.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Yuji's punches do reduce Sukuna's output, but based on the feats, Sukuna recovering his output with Black Flash is greater than the nerf caused by Yuji's punches.

Additionally, Sukuna landed another Black Flash in the middle of the fight before that.

Awakened Yuji didn't get cut by Dismantle—he took Cleave to the face and survived.

My main point is that Sukuna's output was repeatedly getting nerfed by Yuji's punches but was backed up again and again by Black Flash. Therefore, it's not a solid reason to consider one feat alone to claim that Maki has better durability than others.

At best or worst, you can say they are comparable to one another—nothing more.

Maki's dura~Awakened Yuji's dura>Shinjuku Yuji's dura~DE Yuta's dura

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

This feels like a reach.
He wants to kill Maki to prove superiority.
He mentions he needs to cleave their head to kill them.
His cleave is weakened and cannot one shot them even to the head.
So Maki survives it. Assuming that he randomly decided to dig his nails into her face rather than using his whole slicing gimmick is cope.

He physically pushed maki
Never shown any cleave markings on her face
When both got seperated Sukuna's fingers has blood
Maki face skin was ripped not slashed.
So not buying the headcanon of it being a Cleave.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Now that I think about it, isn't Light Speed JL a really good wincon?

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Maki's dura~Awakened Yuji's dura>Shinjuku Yuji's dura~DE Yuta's dura

Nothing proves this.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Now that I think about it, isn't Light Speed JL a really good wincon?

Its Attack speed sure but not activation speed and Yuta has no chance for that unless he incapacitates Sukuna.

 

[Giannysmag]

This feels like a reach.
He wants to kill Maki to prove superiority.
He mentions he needs to cleave their head to kill them.
His cleave is weakened and cannot one shot them even to the head.
So Maki survives it. Assuming that he randomly decided to dig his nails into her face rather than using his whole slicing gimmick is cope.

Funny part is earlier in the fight Suk does use cleave on Maki which she does tank so whether or not he used it when he pushed her out the wall doesn't really matter.

But that doesn't effect this match up since that was a Sukuna who had a one shot level drop in output from the after effects of the Gojo fight and then took like 10 Yuji soul punches and a Maximum Output doamin amped Jacobs Ladder, so his output was in the trash by this point

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Nothing proves this.

You steelmanned the first part and the rest is obvious

Its Attack speed sure but not activation speed and Yuta has no chance for that unless he incapacitates Sukuna.

? He literally just points and a LS beam blitzes Sukuna. I'm talking about with 5 minute mode btw, not DE

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

? He literally just points and a LS beam blitzes Sukuna. I'm talking about with 5 minute mode btw, not DE

Kashimo's EMW is also considered LS, yet Sukuna can easily dodge it. It's not hard to predict Yuta's fingers pointing at him, and JL outside the domain isn't strong enough to kill him. He can always dig into the ground and block the light, just like he did with Angel in the Shinjuku Showdown. There are multiple ways he can counter that. Also, DA could potentially reduce the damage (just saying).

Additionally, 5-minute Mode isn't going to restore Yuta's CT burnout.

 

[Giannysmag]

Now that I think about it, isn't Light Speed JL a really good wincon?

JL has a pretty long activation time, long enough for even a near death Suksuk to set up a counter so he could easily do the same here. And the moment he realises Yuta has a technique that can straight up extinguish him he is gonna kill him

 

[Gokukid2005]

Sukuna doesn't have information on Yuta in this scenario so he wouldn't be on guard for JL and would more than likely get hit by it
If he does, he's finished.
Yuta has no reason to release JL, Sukuna doesn't have a strong hold over Yuji's body unlike Megumi's and Maki can further help with damage from SSK.

 

[Giannysmag]

Sukuna doesn't have information on Yuta in this scenario so he wouldn't be on guard for JL and would more than likely get hit by it
If he does, he's finished.
Yuta has no reason to release JL, Sukuna doesn't have a strong hold over Yuji's body unlike Megumi's and Maki can further help with damage from SSK.

Fair enough, still going Sukuna tho since the couples wincons completely rest on Sukuna just not taking either of them seriously at all. Even then when he was toying with Jogo he was still ragdolling him around and cutting him up with Dismantle which would make it pretty difficult for Yuta to even set up the five minute mode and JL

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

Fair enough, still going Sukuna tho since the couples wincons completely rest on Sukuna just not taking either of them seriously at all. Even then when he was toying with Jogo he was still ragdolling him around and cutting him up with Dismantle which would make it pretty difficult for Yuta to even set up the five minute mode and JL

About that last part, setting up five minute mode is not an entire routine. He just puts the ring on and it works. Setting up JL is the tall order in question

Anyways, I think Sukuna's limited control of Yuji calls into question whether he can incarnate while being hosted by him. It doesn't seem likely given how they interact

So this ultimately just comes down to Yuta and Maki with imperative knowledge vs 15F Sukuna who, as far as he is concerned, is on a time limit and therefore will f*ck shit up (though given his battle with Mahoraga, wanting to test strong individuals is fairly routine for him)

Surprisingly, there's strong arguments on both sides here

 

[Giannysmag]

About that last part, setting up five minute mode is not an entire routine. He just puts the ring on and it works. JL is a taller order

Even doing that is harder than you'd think since Sukuna has a tendency for cutting off people's arms

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

Even doing that is harder than you'd think since Sukuna has a tendency for cutting off people's arms

It's not like Yuta isn't durable enough to handle slashes as is. We saw how he held up against a barrage of slashes from Sukuna maybe around the 16F threshold

 

[Giannysmag]

It's not like Yuta isn't durable enough to handle slashes as is. We saw how he held up against a barrage of slashes from Sukuna maybe around the 16F threshold

Saying the Sukuna Yuta fought inside the domain is 16F level is headcannon and even if he can handle dismantle Sukuna can just Cleave him

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

Saying the Sukuna Yuta fought inside the domain is 16F level is headcannon and even if he can handle dismantle Sukuna can just Cleave him

We don't have an explicit power comparison. It's just the only assumption rooted in words cuz Sukuna claims he should be able to do to Yuji and Yuta what he did to Ryu

And no one seems to have disputed this, so...

Btw, now that I think about it, JL as a starting option is fairly within question here. Like straight up. They have prior knowledge and a lot of incentive to not leave an avenue for the same issues to happen. F*ckin Hana caught Sukuna with JL the first time despite him having foreknowledge of Angel's presence

 

[Giannysmag]

We don't have an explicit power comparison. It's just the only assumption rooted in words cuz Sukuna claims he should be able to do to Yuji and Yuta what he did to Ryu

That's fair but even so the slashes Yuta and Yuji where taking inside the domain where considered fatal hits, 15F Sukuna could still easily cut of Yuta's arm with a close range Dismantle or Cleave if he wanted to

Also, now that I think about it, JL off rip is well within question here. They have prior knowledge and a lot of incentive to not leave an avenue for the same issues to happen. F*ckin Hana caught Sukuna with JL the first time despite him having foreknowledge of Angel's presence

That is again assuming Sukuna just stands there and does nothing which is not in character for him most of the time. Against the Finger Bearer he was slamming him around and cutting him up, same with Jogo, same with Mahoraga, same with Higuruma. Him playing around and toying with them doesn't mean he isn't gonna be constantly attacking and putting pressure on them.

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

That is again assuming Sukuna just stands there and does nothing which is not in character for him most of the time. Against the Finger Bearer he was slamming him around and cutting him up, same with Jogo, same with Mahoraga, same with Higuruma. Him playing around and toying with them doesn't mean he isn't gonna be constantly attacking and putting pressure on them.

I'm not assuming he stands there doing nothing, I'm assuming he doesn't do anything major that would interrupt the incentivized quick process of putting on the ring and outmaneuvering the terrorist sorcerer with the usage of the damn giant blitz laser from god that already did so to him once. SBA starting distance or whatever

 

[Giannysmag]

I'm not assuming he stands there doing nothing, I'm assuming he doesn't do anything major that would interrupt the incentivized quick process of putting on the ring and outmaneuvering the terrorist sorcerer with the damn giant blitz laser from god that could do so to him when fired by a human level vessel

But like he can do something to stop that, he can start ragdolling Yuta before he gets to put on the ring or fire JL, cut him up with dismantle/cleave, punch him through some skyscrapers, anything he was doing to Jogo or Maho would be enough to interrupt Yuta really

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

But like he can do something to stop that, he can start ragdolling Yuta before he gets to put on the ring or fire JL, cut him up with dismantle/cleave, punch him through some skyscrapers, anything he was doing to Jogo or Maho would be enough to interrupt Yuta really

SBA starting distance puts them tens of meters away. There's way too much leeway for Yuta to unleash the comically large sky laser

 

[Giannysmag]

SBA starting distance puts them tens of meters away. This gives a huge amount of leeway to unleash the comically large sky laser

I don't think you understand how fast Sukuna is compared to these two. Let's agree the Sukuna in Yuta's domain is 15/16F level, he then takes a bunch of soul punches and JL which weaken his output and control over his body (both of which would also affect his speed), has one of his arms cut off (which we know messes with your speed, see Naobito), gets stabbed through the heart and has to manually pump his blood with CE and even after all those nerfs he still perception blitzes Maki despite her super senses the moment he gets serious (with him being around 10 meters away at that time mind you).

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

I don't think you understand how fast Sukuna is compared to these two. Let's agree the Sukuna in Yuta's domain is 15/16F level, he then takes a bunch of soul punches and JL which weaken his output and control over his body (both of which would also affect his speed), has one of his arms cut off (which we know messes with your speed, see Naobito), gets stabbed through the heart and has to manually pump his blood with CE and even after all those nerfs he still perception blitzes Maki despite her super senses the moment he gets serious (with him being around 10 meters away at that time mind you).

I understand the stat difference. I'm just saying:

1. This didn't stop Hana of all people from tagging Sukuna with it
2. Prior knowledge of said stat difference is more incentive for Yuta to abuse the starting distance and let rip the heavenly god ray

TLDR Window to abuse the smite laser

Anyways, I've explained myself enough. I'm crashing

 

[Giannysmag]

I understand the stat difference. I'm just saying:

1. This didn't stop Hana of all people from tagging Sukuna with it

The first time can just be PIS or him just being caught off guard cause he thought Hana was knocked out, especially since the second time Hana tried to pull JL she got countered

2. Prior knowledge of said stat diff is more incentive for Yuta to abuse the starting distance and let rip the heavenly god ray

Prior knowledge and starting distance do nothing for them here when the stat gap is this massive. You could put them 100 meters apart and I'd still bet Sukuna could make his way to them before Yuta can put on that ring

 

[Sir_Marvulous]

They're in the same ballpark in speed, and especially combat speed. Yes, Sukuna is faster. No, Sukuna is not crossing 100 meters before Yuta puts on a f*cking ring lmao

Anyways, crashing. Gn

 

[Giannysmag]

They're in the same ballpark in speed, and especially combat speed. Yes, Sukuna is faster. No, Sukuna is not crossing 100 meters before Yuta puts on a f*cking ring lmao

Anyways, crashing. Gn

Goodnight

 

[Arkenis]

You could put them 100 meters apart and I'd still bet Sukuna could make his way to them before Yuta can put on that ring

SBA is 4km. wtf are you guys EVER on???

I don't think you understand how fast Sukuna is compared to these two. Let's agree the Sukuna in Yuta's domain is 15/16F level, he then takes a bunch of soul punches and JL which weaken his output and control over his body (both of which would also affect his speed), has one of his arms cut off (which we know messes with your speed, see Naobito), gets stabbed through the heart and has to manually pump his blood with CE and even after all those nerfs he still perception blitzes Maki despite her super senses the moment he gets serious (with him being around 10 meters away at that time mind you).

Sukuna isn't much faster than them, its hilarious how comparable they are in speed here, and Maki's got the edge in speed here if anything. Naobito's arm shit is for him and has never been said for the whole verse.

Also okay so at least that means Maki won’t be half in the shrunken domain and her ripped apart my malevolent shrine lol

MS wouldn't even be up since they'd be in a domain clash and have it nullified.

 

[AbaddonTheDisappointment]

SBA is 4km. wtf are you guys EVER on???


Sukuna isn't much faster than them, its hilarious how comparable they are in speed here, and Maki's got the edge in speed here if anything. Naobito's arm shit is for him and has never been said for the whole verse.


MS wouldn't even be up since they'd be in a domain clash and have it nullified.

I’m talking about if she’s like half in the domain then she’d be caught by MS right outside the barrier. Regardless it’s not how her HR works but that does make me realize she can’t actually leave the domain or else she gets cooked by the MS right outside

Also SBA assumes the distance is the highest range, in this case hundreds of meters not 4 km

 

[Giannysmag]

SBA is 4km. wtf are you guys EVER on???

That's the maximum, normally it's set at based on the range of the fighters so here it would be 200 meters because of MS

Sukuna isn't much faster than them, its hilarious how comparable they are in speed here, and Maki's got the edge in speed here if anything.

Really now?

Naobito's arm shit is for him and has never been said for the whole verse.

No reason why it would be exclusive to him, his arms don't play any significant role in his CT, I always assumed it was a balance thing. Also that's like the least significant of the nerfs I mentioned lol

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

It's funny how Toji's speed is compared to 3F Sukuna at best, who is equal to Maki. This has been consistent in the verse so far. Yet, Maki supporters are wanking her to 15F Sukuna's level, even though we saw her getting outsped by 16F Sukuna at most 10% of his power. This is consistent with the series.

No one other than Gojo should be able to catch up to a healthy 15F Sukuna. (Maybe Miguel could, based on his statements).

Also losing an arm does seems to reduce the output of CE. It's not just Naobita there is also Angel output dropping due to that.

 

[Arkenis]

Alright I'm gonna give my view of the match so I don't gotta keep typing.

Yuta and Maki have knowledge on Sukuna, it's their eos selves so they will already know how Shrine works, knows what works more and what doesn't. Yuta will start his five minutes at the start, they'll fight and Sukuna will get destroyed in the worst 3v1 we've ever seen with Yuta nullifying Shrine with Sky Manipulation or Dhruv's tech making Yuta and Maki who already scale somewhat to 15f, even more less likely to be harmed severely. Rika's in play so Sukuna's getting grabbed, pushed down and hit by three people all with power on Ryu's level. To make this worse on Sukuna, Yuta can EASILY yell "STOP" and now Maki's stabbed Sukuna through the heart or cut off his arms or legs or just cut his head off. Since Sukuna will realize he can't just beat these two regularly he'll use domain and this is when its over for him, he doesn't have four arms to do HWB so he can't negate the sure hits, if he uses SD then he can't use Shrine so he'll put himself at a disadvantage, meanwhile Yuta's got Rika to aid him. Personally I think they end up killing him or his control over Yuji runs out.

 

[Arkenis]

It's funny how Toji's speed is compared to 3F Sukuna at best, who is equal to Maki. This has been consistent in the verse so far. Yet, Maki supporters are wanking her to 15F Sukuna's level, even though we saw her getting outsped by 16F Sukuna at most 10% of his power. This is consistent with the series.

Already said this but Sukuna blitzing Maki is due to the circumstances, it isn't something standard and he'd have no reason to want to prove something here.

 

[Giannysmag]

Alright I'm gonna give my view of the match so I don't gotta keep typing.

Yuta and Maki have knowledge on Sukuna, it's their eos selves so they will already know how Shrine works, knows what works more and what doesn't. Yuta will start his five minutes at the start, they'll fight and Sukuna will get destroyed in the worst 3v1 we've ever seen with Yuta nullifying Shrine with Sky Manipulation or Dhruv's tech making Yuta and Maki who already scale somewhat to 15f, even more less likely to be harmed severely. Rika's in play so Sukuna's getting grabbed, pushed down and hit by three people all with power on Ryu's level. To make this worse on Sukuna, Yuta can EASILY yell "STOP" and now Maki's stabbed Sukuna through the heart or cut off his arms or legs or just cut his head off. Since Sukuna will realize he can't just beat these two regularly he'll use domain and this is when its over for him, he doesn't have four arms to do HWB so he can't negate the sure hits, if he uses SD then he can't use Shrine so he'll put himself at a disadvantage, meanwhile Yuta's got Rika to aid him. Personally I think they end up killing him or his control over Yuji runs out.

The moment Sukuna realises he might be in danger he does what he did to Ryu and the fight is over. Also if he domain clashes with Yuta he won't need HWB or DA you goober both of their sure hit will be nullified

 

[Giannysmag]

Already said this but Sukuna blitzing Maki is due to the circumstances, it isn't something standard and he'd have no reason to want to prove something here.

It's literally just him using his full speed and he's been consistently able to blitz characters at or near the level of heavy hitters like Ryu, Yuji and Choso

 

[Arkenis]

Also if he domain clashes with Yuta he won't need HWB or DA you goober both of their sure hit will be nullified

Reread the Gojo fight.

It's literally just him using his full speed and he's been consistently able to blitz characters at or near the level of heavy hitters like Ryu, Yuji and Choso

Already responded to this.

That excitement is only after he ran through everyone that was interesting so I don't think it'll happen here.

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Already said this but Sukuna blitzing Maki is due to the circumstances, it isn't something standard and he'd have no reason to want to prove something here.

What does proving have to do with this? Sukuna would naturally adjust to his opponent's speed. Are you suggesting he would intentionally let himself get blitzed by his opponents?

He literally blitzed Mahoraga at first, but later Mahoraga adapted to him and kicked him out of the curtains. Sukuna instantly got back up and reacted even faster than before.

He's not some idiot who would let himself get blitzed by random characters he encounters.

Even before Sukuna locked in on Maki, he was efficiently dodging her attacks. So what does the whole "proving" thing have to do with this?

If we consider the Mahoraga situation, Sukuna would initially spam slashes. Once Maki and Yuta survive them, he would, in character, shift to using Cleave.