Yami Vs Zenon

[Epsilon_R]

Both at their strongest keys

Yami:

Zenon:

Incon:

 

[Theendzero13]

yami cannot handle spacial domination+danmaku

 

[Epsilon_R]

yami cannot handle spacial domination+danmaku

He has Black Moon to deal with that also they are 4km away from each other according to SBA, Spatial Domination cannot reach this far

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Pretty sure Zenon has the higher AP, and speed.

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Zenon stomps, Yami cannot cut his heart.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Zenon stomps, Yami cannot cut his heart.

Yami can, he's arcane

 

[Epsilon_R]

Pretty sure Zenon has the higher AP, and speed.

Yami has several speed amps to close the gap (the speed gap isn't even that big honestly)

As for AP, Yami is at least 6.88 Teratons while Zenon is significantly higher than 8.6 Teratons, possibly 17.2 but ehh

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Yami can, he's arcane

He cannot bypass the AP gap. Spirit of boreas yuno (17 teratons) hit the heart and the heart tanked it, yami can't do shit.

 

[Epsilon_R]

He cannot bypass the AP gap. Spirit of boreas yuno (17 teratons) hit the heart and the heart tanked it, yami can't do shit.

1. Yuno at that time wasn't Saint Stage, he only became Saint when he landed the final blow

2. Dimension Slash ignores Durability

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

1. Yuno at that time wasn't Saint Stage, he only became Saint when he landed the final blow

2. Dimension Slash ignores Durability

1. I know, Yuno still couldn't kill the devil heart with an AP that was way higher than what yami has, even if yami can kill a devil, he doesn't have the AP to cut his heart.
2. Devil heart ignores ignoring durability.

 

[Epsilon_R]

1. I know, Yuno still couldn't kill the devil heart with an AP that was way higher than what yami has, even if yami can kill a devil, he doesn't have the AP to cut his heart.
2. Devil heart ignores ignoring durability.

You're misinterpreting how the heart works

The heart is unaffected by anything non Arcane or Saint Stage, but that doesn't mean the heart scale to the AP of non-Arcane/Saint Stage spells.

If the heart can tank an Arcane Stage spell (Like Zagred tanked Licht's attack), it scales to the attack's AP. Otherwise it doesn't.

2. It was unaffected by Durability Negation because said Dura Neg wasn't Arcane Stage. Devil Hearts cannot ignore Durability from Arcane attacks until proven otherwise

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

You're misinterpreting how the heart works

The heart is unaffected by anything non Arcane or Saint Stage, but that doesn't mean the heart scale to the AP of non-Arcane/Saint Stage spells.

If the heart can tank an Arcane Stage spell (Like Zagred tanked Licht's attack), it scales to the attack's AP. Otherwise it doesn't.

2. It was unaffected by Durability Negation because said Dura Neg wasn't Arcane Stage

Pretty sure that doesn't matter as yuno can still fight against and kill devils with the spirit of zephyr (like he should vs zagred), so the heart tanking his attack would mean it scaled above yuno's attack potency. Yami's durability negation attack didn't harm zagreds heart.

 

[SuperStar]

I vote Zenon for Durability Negation, Immortality, Regeneration, and Limited Invulnerability

 

[Epsilon_R]

Pretty sure that doesn't matter as yuno can still fight against and kill devils with the spirit of zephyr (like he should vs zagred), so the heart tanking his attack would mean it scaled above yuno's attack potency. Yami's durability negation attack didn't harm zagreds heart.

Nope. First off all, the heart tanked Yuno's Star whip and later Spirits of Boreas, but not Spirit of Zephyr.

Not only we don't know if Spirit of Zephyr could have cut Zagred's heart (If it was the case, the Author wouldn't have made him learn Saint Stage), but that's also the specificity of Spirit of Zephyr (Using the magic of others), meaning we can assume that he could do that with Boreas or Euros, much less with the Star Magic whip which is a totally different attribute.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Demon Zenon >= 100% Zenon = 100% Dante >> 80% Dante >>>>>>> Yami

Isn't that the current scale?

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Nope. First off all, the heart tanked Yuno's Star whip and later Spirits of Boreas, but not Spirit of Zephyr.

Not only we don't know if Spirit of Zephyr could have cut Zagred's heart (If it was the case, the Author wouldn't have made him learn Saint Stage), but that's also the specificity of Spirit of Zephyr (Using the magic of others), meaning we can assume that he could do that with Boreas or Euros, much less with the Star Magic whip which is a totally different attribute.

Spirit of boreas is achieved through the same means as spirit of zephr by using mana in the surrounding. The reason yuno learned saint stage is because he wasn't strong enough to cut zenons heart with his regular boreas.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Spirit of boreas is achieved through the same means as spirit of zephr by using mana in the surrounding. The reason yuno learned saint stage is because he wasn't strong enough to cut zenons heart with his regular boreas.

Spirit of Zephyr could work on Zagred's spells because he absorbed the magic of Licht and Lumiere who are arcane. Here, nobody around Yuno is arcane. As such Boreas, Zephyr and Euros cannot be considered arcane, hence why Zenon's heart tanked the attack.

Even if we assume they are, they cannot bypass Durability like Dimension Slash

 

[Epsilon_R]

Demon Zenon >= 100% Zenon = 100% Dante >> 80% Dante >>>>>>> Yami

Isn't that the current scale?

Devil Zenon > 100% Dante (?) Death Thrust > Yami condensing Mana Zone > 80%+Body Magic > 80% Dante > Yami

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Spirit of Zephyr could work on Zagred's spells because he absorbed the magic of Licht and Lumiere who are arcane. Here, nobody around Yuno is arcane. As such Boreas, Zephyr and Euros cannot be considered arcane, hence why Zenon's heart tanked the attack.

Even if we assume they are, they cannot bypass Durability like Dimension Slash

If that is true then yuno shouldn't be able to use the spirit of zephyr but he clearly can.
Also yami's dimension slash gets negated by zenons spatial magic.

 

[Epsilon_R]

If that is true then yuno shouldn't be able to use the spirit of zephyr but he clearly can.

Yuno doesn't need the magic of arcane stage mages to use Spirit of Zephyr. He can still absorb the remnants of magic of Langris and Finral.

Also yami's dimension slash gets negated by zenons spatial magic.

Dimension Slash would need to be inside Zenon's magic in the first place. Even then, Dimension Slash should still cut through it.

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Yuno doesn't need the magic of arcane stage mages to use Spirit of Zephyr. He can still absorb the remnants of magic of Langris and Finral.

Dimension Slash would need to be inside Zenon's magic in the first place. Even then, Dimension Slash should still cut through it.

So you're saying the spirit of zephyr that yuno used against zagred is different from every other spirit of zephyr? Can you prove that? Also Yuno was still able to fight against zenons magic which should have the same properties as zagreds, and yuno couldn't do anything against zagreds magic without the spirit of zephyr, but this might be flawed since 1 yuno could still fight and harm zenon without spirit of zephyr using star magic (though that may be arcane stage magic), and 2 zenon didn't use exactly the same magic as zagred, the one that goes something along the lines of AILFNALIFNASILFNASLIFNALINFA.
Zenons magic domain negates all magic except from those loved by mana or those with spatial magic who can use mana zone, which yami is neither.

 

[Epsilon_R]

So you're saying the spirit of zephyr that yuno used against zagred is different from every other spirit of zephyr? Can you prove that?

Well, he only was able to slice through Zagred's spell because he absorbed the magic of the Arcane Stage mages that were near him (Lumiere, Licht, Yami, Nero etc). Otherwise, Yuno isn't close to Arcane

It's up to you to prove he did the same thing during his fight against Zenon. Except you won't be able to since the only 2 characters near Yuno (Finral and Langris) are not arcane.

Also Yuno was still able to fight against zenons magic which should have the same properties as zagreds,

Headcanon. Even going by that logic, Nozel was able to fight against Megicula's magic but couldn't affect her heart, same thing for gaja.

and yuno couldn't do anything against zagreds magic without the spirit of zephyr,

Again, that's because he took the remnants of magic of Arcane Mages. That wasn't the case during his fight with Zenon

Zenons magic domain negates all magic except from those loved by mana or those with spatial magic who can use mana zone, which yami is neither.

Yami can literally use a spatial manipulation spell via Mana Zone. Not to mention Spatial Domination doesn't have the range of catch Yami inside of it.

Lastly, Dark Magic interferes with spells from the underworld, which would include Zenon's Spatial Magic

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

Well, he only was able to slice through Zagred's spell because he absorbed the magic of the Arcane Stage mages that were near him (Lumiere, Licht, Yami, Nero etc). Otherwise, Yuno isn't close to Arcane

It's up to you to prove he did the same thing during his fight against Zenon. Except you won't be able to since the only 2 characters near Yuno (Finral and Langris) are not arcane.

Headcanon. Even going by that logic, Nozel was able to fight against Megicula's magic but couldn't affect her heart, same thing for gaja.

Again, that's because he took the remnants of magic of Arcane Mages. That wasn't the case during his fight with Zenon

Yami can literally use a spatial manipulation spell via Mana Zone. Not to mention Spatial Domination doesn't have the range of catch Yami inside of it.

Lastly, Dark Magic interferes with spells from the underworld, which would include Zenon's Spatial Magic

Yuno created the spirit of zephyr when he used their mana to create it, but he's shown using it later, there is nothing that states it got weaker or that it changes based on where he creates it so if he is able to use it then it should be the same as the one vs zagred.
Yeah that's probably not a good argument because zagreds magic was special as only a few people could actually fight it.
His magic type is dark magic though it is spatial hax, I don't know if that applies but I would think it doesn't because his mana zone is not spatial magic only his attack which isn't enough. You know, zenon could just cancel out the dimension slash with a stronger spatial magic.
I don't know what interfere means here.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Yuno created the spirit of zephyr when he used their mana to create it, but he's shown using it later, there is nothing that states it got weaker or that it changes based on where he creates it so if he is able to use it then it should be the same as the one vs zagred.

So, you're telling me Yuno can absorb the magic of arcane stage mages despite not having a single arcane mage near him??

The first wizard king literally said he took is magic to make a sword that could work on Zagred's spells. As such, you need to prove that it would have still worked if Yuno didn't take the Wizard King's magic, who's arcane.

His magic type is dark magic though it is spatial hax, I don't know if that applies but I would think it doesn't because his mana zone is not spatial magic only his attack which isn't enough. You know, zenon could just cancel out the dimension slash with a stronger spatial magic.

Dimension Slash is spatial manip, and he can combine it with Mana Zone to cut through an infinite sized world.

Also Zenon can't reach Yami with Spatial Domination from kilometers away

I don't know what interfere means here.

Basically, Yami's Dark Magic attack was unaffected by Zagred's word soul magic

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

So, you're telling me Yuno can absorb the magic of arcane stage mages despite not having a single arcane mage near him??

The first wizard king literally said he took is magic to make a sword that could work on Zagred's spells. As such, you need to prove that it would have still worked if Yuno didn't take the Wizard King's magic, who's arcane.

Dimension Slash is spatial manip, and he can combine it with Mana Zone to cut through an infinite sized world.

Also Zenon can't reach Yami with Spatial Domination from kilometers away

Basically, Yami's Dark Magic attack was unaffected by Zagred's word soul magic

Yes, because after he used it to create the spirit of zephyr, he could still use the same spell without the wizard king being near him all the time, so unless the sword is recreated brand new every single time and has different properties to the first one then what you say is true, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case as the spirit of zephyr is clearly the same spell.
Okay I know that, but zenons magic is much more powerful than yami's, so the attack would be nerfed badly just like how langris was barely able to use his spell inside zenons domain. Zenon can cancel out the dimension slash with spatial magic.
Okay but zenons magic doesn't have that weakness.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Since this hasn’t been closed I choose Yami. He should be faster to the point of blitzing with his new spell, Deep Black Blade. Which he used on Lucifero

 

[speedster352]

I vote yami

 

[Quantu]

Yami obvs stomps him now with his Heart

Because I'm lazy and at work, what was the last chapter before this thread?