Very Small Upgrade to Tensura(WN)

[Catpija]

Been wondering about this ages ago and now i decided to make a thread about it, this is a pretty small upgrade that probably(or not) scales to the Top Tier of the Verse(hopefully), but we can discuss how the scaling works in the thread while now i will explain the new rating.

Low 2-C
3-A

As you can guess from the tag our main candidate is Guy Crimson and Yuuki, In Chapter 237 when Velzard rant about how unfair Guy is, she mentioned that he can actually destroy the world, and is the only one who can do it other than Veldanava(at that time supposedly, this note will be important later), thus the reason she become his partner to observes him.

「What is with you! Guy, you never listen to my opinion. It’s always, always me who had to be patient! As the Tuner, I had the role to guide this world that my older brother left behind. That’s why I always observed you so that you wouldn’t go on a rampage. Even though I really hated it…… Even Velgrind went freely to the place of the man she loved and Veldora was so carefree and rampaged as he pleased. As for me, I endured it all the time, you know!? Everything was because you were acknowledged by my older brother! It was because you were the only being except for my older brother who could destroy this world. I couldn’t afford to leave your side, you know…… I’m the only one who needed to have patience…… And yet, you’re going to leave me behind. I will never forgive you for that. Why do you have to support that suspicious slime now!? It would have been fine if you lived quietly in this northern land! You oppose my older brother even though there’s no way for you to win. Rather than letting you be killed by my older brother, I would rather be the one who will kill you with my own hands!」

Guy’s words sparked a fire inside Velzard’s frozen heart.

As she raged, Velzard threw out all of her displeasure she felt until now.

With all of her feelings, she lashed out at Guy with her fierce will.

There are multiple reason why this statement is quite true and can be used, first off Velzard is letting out all complain/displeasure she contained for as long as she have been Guy partner's, so lying is off the chart, it cant be a hyperbole too since there is a suprisingly lot of feat that can support it, for example Velda was cautious to Guy because of his strength, although he himself can do a Low 2-C feat.

「I knew it, it’s you! Those words force an absolute control over those with angel series’ ability, don’t they?」

「Hah, as expected of you, Guy Crimson. The only person Velda-sama was cautious of. However, it’s already too late even if you know about it. What you can do now is only await your death obediently.」

「Shut up! An insect like you shouldn’t speak so arrogantly!」

Originally, the plan was to kill Guy for sure.

And also include Chloe’s disposal.

Against Guy who wouldn’t let his guard down, Velzard and Chloe would be at a disadvantage even if they were together.

Not to mention, in the worst case that Guy won, he would get stronger.

To prevent an outcome like that, Lucia sought a certain victory.

He was going 'Tch' in his head, while he prepared himself for the worst.

And, the was the very moment, when Guy confirms that he was going to totally kill Velda.

It was also the moment, where he confirms that Velda ≠ Veldanava.

(That guy, he wouldn't stoop to paltry moves as low as this.

If he was really serious, something like destroying the world, he can do it all by himself.)

His strongest moves combined with other character who are comparable to him can causes an attack with an energy strong enough to destroy the world.

As for the other people―

「Guess we’ve no other choice but to do it. He looks like an unbelievable beast, but it would be quite fun to go out seriously if this is our last after all

「Hehe, it’s really been a while, Guy. I won’t leave your side until the end

「Whew. Even though I especially got revived and wanted to see what the world was like now. Well, it can’t be helped as things turned out this way. Velgrind, if we survived, will you show me the world then

「Rudra, you idiot. Searching for your reincarnation is more important than the world. And also…… I think you should realize that you didn’t get revived, you know

「Kufufufufu. It’s impossible for Rimuru-sama to be defeated, but let’s hold the fort in his absence

「Yeah, Sensei might have some ulterior motive, but it won’t be useless if we defeat him

Each of them said their respective thoughts and altogether faced Yuuk

Then, they unleashed their deadly attacks filled with their entire beings toward Yuuk

――Everything was as Yuuki expecte

Right now, Yuuki could use all skills because of Origin Skill『Information Ruler Akashic Record

In other words, he could even devour energy completely using Gluttonous Lord Beelzebut

Yuuki sprouted a dark smile as the mass of energy enough to destroy the world was approaching in front of him

Moving on to Yuuki, if you see the above quote carefully, you can see that Guy admit that Yuuki is a beast, indicate that he stronger than him. Yuuki also possess half of Veldanava's power, same dude who can destroy the world if he serious. its even stated that because of that, he too can obliterate the world. He also had his hand on Veldanava sword that have half of Veldanava maximum energy. who can create several parrarel universes.

Thus, the result was as Yuuki had expected……

Yuuki was a genius, but he didn’t obtain all of Veldanava’s powers.

As such, being able to control all of Veldanava’s powers was a lie.

However, there was nothing that worried him.

Because it was true that he could use almost all of Veldanava’s abilities.

Yuuki already had enough power to destroy this world.

He could control the output like Guy, but then he wouldn’t be able to surpass them.

Yuuki thought as such, so he came up with the idea of recreating the abilities and put them inside Veldanava Sword.

Veldanava Sword was a crystallization of Veldanava’s powers. It was the condensed form of half of Veldanava’s maximum energy.

And then it all goes back to Guy, who stated could take on Yuuki and wouldnt lose

“I don’t plan on fighting with you. I am the type who doesn’t take fights they can’t win.”

Was what he said at that time.

I don’t know if that is his true feelings or not but I don’t want to fight with Guy either, so that’s fine with me.

At the very least, I felt like Guy as he is now could have fought Yuuki on an even field.

Well, I won’t lose to him as I am now but I don’t fancy getting hurt due to being prideful like that.

There’s no reason nor meaning in fighting him, so it’s best if we can get along.

Although I do say that, Guy and I fought a few times after that but I shall talk about that at a later opportunity.

Even if all the feat above not enough, Veldora in a weakened form that massively below Post-Timeskip Guy and Tenma War Yuuki can suppress a L2C Absorbtion merely with his aura.

(Note: I wont try to upgrade Veldora too since actually in another thread i have upgraded him and just waiting for more input, so this is just for supporting feat)

Diablo and other 3 character(Benimaru, Zegion, Dino) who comparable to him can create an attack greater than the creation of the universe/big-bang, they scales below Guy and Yuuki.

「Gotcha. Let’s go with full power!」

Dino yelled, sharpened his spirit and focused his mind in order to unleash his strongest attack.

His six pairs of white and black wings shone, as he gathered the surroundings’ magic essence and spirits into his twin swords ――

「Fallen Crusade[4]!!」

And so, he fired a white light slash and black shadow slash.

Both of the slashes intersected spectacularly at the center of the tetrahedron.

Colorless aurora filled the inside of『Absolute Barrier』.

However, the attacks on the “Berserk Evil Dragon” Zero weren’t over yet.

The moment both slashes intersected――

「End of World!!」

「Dimension Storm!!」

「Prominence Acceleration!!」

Several super special moves were unleashed.

With exquisite timing, it all reached the center of the tetrahedron as to cover Dino’s technique.

It caused a catastrophic, destructive power which was the greatest ever seen since the beginning of the universe.

TL;DR

There are atleast 5 of 3-A feat which the character that doing so is either comparable if not equal

Post-Timeskip Guy >= Yuuki/Velda(3 feat of 3A) = Tenma War Rimuru >= Full Power Milim > Tenma War Guy (3A) = Prime Rudra >> Chloe = True Dragons = Judgement Bullet >= Dagruel >= Shion = Kumara(possibly) > Diablo >= Zegion >= Benimaru(3-A) >= Dino >= Prime Ramiris > Guy 2000 years ago(3A)

 

[LoganKroos]

as already discussed in the Slime forum where I already gave my opinion I approve

 

[rainheart]

agree

 

[Peak]

I agree

 

[Lesser_Goddess_Alexia]

I agree

 

[Catpija]

Post-Timeskip Guy >= Yuuki/Velda(3 feat of L2C) = Tenma War Rimuru>>> Tenma War Guy (L2C) = Milim = Prime Rudra >> Chloe = True Dragons including Afterstories Veldora(L2C) > Diablo, Zegion, Benimaru >= Prime Ramiris > Pre-Veldanava Death Guy(L2C)

updated the scaling chain, what do you guys think about this?

 

[Ikhvagracia]

i think seems fine, and i agree

 

[Tempestdragon6]

agree only need admin approval for this to be applied

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

I agree.

 

[YueNoMoral]

agree

 

[Zegion]

Agreed

 

[Elizhaa]

Yuuki's current highest key rating did feel weird to me.

It did seem to be Low 2-C going on the significantly affecting space-time:
Characters who are capable of significantly affecting[1], creating and/or destroying an area of space that is qualitatively larger than an infinitely-sized 3-dimensional space. Common fictional examples of spaces representing such sizes are space-time continuums (the entire past, present and future of 3-dimensional space) of a universal scale.

Rimuru was comparable to him physically in the last fight before his last key; I don't think this Rimuru's key was ever updated. This Rimuru was superior to Guy, also.
There are a bunch of characters who powerscaled to them like Velzard.

I could see the ratings make sense. I think it would be good to have Celestial Pegasus's inputs; what are your thoughts @Celestial_Pegasus ?

 

[Tempestdragon6]

Yuuki's current highest key rating did feel weird to me.

It did seem to be Low 2-C going on the significantly affecting space-time:
Characters who are capable of significantly affecting[1], creating and/or destroying an area of space that is qualitatively larger than an infinitely-sized 3-dimensional space. Common fictional examples of spaces representing such sizes are space-time continuums (the entire past, present and future of 3-dimensional space) of a universal scale.

Rimuru was comparable to him physically in the last fight before his last key; I don't think this Rimuru's key was ever updated. This Rimuru was superior to Guy, also.
There are a bunch of characters who powerscaled to them like Velzard.

I could see the ratings make sense. I think it would be good to have Celestial Pegasus's inputs; what are your thoughts @Celestial_Pegasus ?

so rimuru key will be updated also

 

[Elizhaa]

so rimuru key will be updated also

If accepted yes especially since he scaled to Velda, Guy, and True Dragons in the key before his last key.

 

[Tempestdragon6]

If accepted yes especially since he scaled to Velda, Guy, and True Dragons in the key before his last key.

so what will be rimuru key then

 

[Catpija]

so what will be rimuru key then

Rimuru Pseudo True Dragon Key will get Universal+ AP

 

[091Franky]

Agreed

 

[Lesser_Goddess_Alexia]

Post-Timeskip Guy >= Yuuki/Velda(3 feat of L2C) = Tenma War Rimuru >= Full Power Milim > Tenma War Guy (L2C) = Prime Rudra >> Chloe = True Dragons including Afterstories Veldora(L2C) >= Diablo, Zegion, Benimaru >= Prime Ramiris > Guy 2000 years ago(L2C)

So, this will affect all characters who have H4C Tier/Top Tier in Tensura WN?

 

[LoganKroos]

So, this will affect all characters who have H4C Tier/Top Tier in Tensura WN?

All octagram, all true dragons, Rudra, Diablo, Zegion and Benimaru must have low 2c keys

 

[Catpija]

All octagram, all true dragons, Rudra, Diablo, Zegion and Benimaru must have low 2c keys

nah not all Octagram

 

[LoganKroos]

nah not all Octagram

Ramiris, Milim, Dagruel and Guy go, Dino too, Rimuru too, Leon with demi god too and Ruminas climbs to Dagruel, all are low2c

 

[Zegion]

would ruminas climb to dagruel also why Leon& dino?

 

[LoganKroos]

would ruminas climb to dagruel also why Leon& dino?

Leon's final evolution he became a demigod comparable to true dragons and Dino is comparable to Guy before evolving and scales to Rimuru's top 3, possibly the other primordials would also be low2c

 

[LoganKroos]

Shion and possibly Hinata would also be low2c, and even Rudra's minions would also be as it took Diablo and Veldora to face them

 

[LoganKroos]

although the light novel is stronger, the web novel version is far from weak

 

[091Franky]

There is no such thing as primordial in wn, Demi god leon doesn't scales to td if you have scan post it. Ruminas doesn't scales to Dagruel as well, most of that fight was Dagruel vs Veldora and some contribution of Shion with her hax

Shion and possibly Hinata would also be low2c, and even Rudra's minions would also be as it took Diablo and Veldora to face them

Have you even read wn? Hinata is fodder af, Kondou doesn't scales physically, he scales with judgment bullet. Most of them are already High 4-C here and if this gets accepted only those will be affected.

 

[Zegion]

Leon's final evolution he became a demigod comparable to true dragons and Dino is comparable to Guy before evolving and scales to Rimuru's top 3, possibly the other primordials would also be low2c

When was Leon compared to true dragon and dino being compared to guy I don't even remember that?

 

[LoganKroos]

There is no such thing as primordial in wn, Demi god leon doesn't scales to td if you have scan post it. Ruminas doesn't scales to Dagruel as well, most of that fight was Dagruel vs Veldora and some contribution of Shion with her hax

Have you even read wn? Hinata is fodder af, Kondou will scale with judgment bullet. Most of them are already High 4-C here and if this gets accepted only those will scale to it

you may be right, first you have to wait for Guy to be updated, then see the other characters, I just gave my opinion on the question about character tiers

 

[LoganKroos]

When was Leon compared to true dragon and dino being compared to guy I don't even remember that?

in the web novel the final evolution to demigod is said to be the last level that a hero can reach and is comparable even with true dragons like Cloe and Rudra are also, Dino scales to the top 3 of Rimuru who is possibly stronger than Guy 2000 years ago, while unsure about Dino, Leon is sure comparable to Cloe and Rudra

 

[Catpija]

Ruminas climbs to Dagruel, all are low2c

NO

 

[Catpija]

i will leave the fandom the day Ruminas become Universal+ , that weak fodder shouldnt even be on the Octagram

 

[Antvasima]

@Celestial_Pegasus @CrimsonStarFallen

Would you be willing to help out here please?

 

[Catpija]

Alright, im thinking back about who should scales, if there are any character left please tell me

Kondo, Carerra with Judgement Bullet
Zero(as a True Dragon)
Leon(evolved into Demi-God, Guy assumed Chloe is atleast Demi-God)
Dagruel(Comparable to Veldora)
Shion(Comparable to Dagruel, physically stronger than Diablo after the main story, can split Rimurun body apart)
Shuna(can split Rimurun body apart, comparable if not equal to Shion physically)
Dino(Comparable to Zegion)
Kumara(Can possibly beat Diablo)

 

[091Franky]

Alright, im thinking back about who should scales, if there are any character left please tell me

Kondo, Carerra with Judgement Bullet
Zero(as a True Dragon)
Leon(evolved into Demi-God, Guy assumed Chloe is atleast Demi-God)
Dagruel(Comparable to Veldora)
Shion(Comparable to Dagruel, physically stronger than Diablo after the main story, can split Rimurun body apart)
Shuna(can split Rimurun body apart, comparable if not equal to Shion physically)
Dino(Comparable to Zegion)
Kumara(Can possibly beat Diablo)

Why would shuna scales to it? Iirc Rimurun was from afterstories and we don't know anything about that body and shuna doesn't have any evidence to scale her physical to shion. Same with leon being demi god means nothing because power level varies within the same classification like most of the awakened monster under rimuru is 6-A, at best leon would get possibly higher

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Are we sure this is Low 2-C and not just 3-A? Yuuki failed to destroy the space-time continuum despite all these statements, and when talking about Veldanava's maximum power, is that referring to before or after Velda created the world? Cause as we all know he lost the ability to use Turn Null after doing so, so yea at max power Velda is 2-C sure, but afterwards his max is weaker.

Honestly thinking the latter makes the most sense, cause Yuuki failing to completely destroy the universe is big issue with him being Low 2-C.

 

[Catpija]

Why would shuna scales to it? Iirc Rimurun was from afterstories and we don't know anything about that body and shuna doesn't have any evidence to scale her physical to shion.

Shion and Shuna was grabbing each end of Rimuru body and it get splitted into two, Rimuru commented that Shuna resisted Shion strength, her physical should be comparable.

After returning to Tempest.

My body, Rimurun, was cruelly split into two.

Well, as it was a slime, it had just split into two smaller slimes… Still, it was not a good feeling when you thought of it as your own body.

“Th-this is…um…”

“No! It was because Shuna wouldn’t let go!”

It was surprising enough that Shuna would resist Shion’s great strength.

But more than that, I was shocked that my incredibly resilient body had been split into two.

These two should not ever be angered.

I promised to myself once again.

By the way, I was able to return to normal by absorbing the two Rimurun bodies.

Shuna and Shion looked a little sad, so I thought that I would give them a doll next time.

Rimurun body is his real body with the same large amount of Magicule, Rimuru just transferred his conciousness and escaped

There was no mistaking that the slime before him was Rimuru.

But, from that very person’s mouth the name Rimuru-n came out.



Even if someone could deceive Shion, there’s no imposter out there who could fool Shuna’s ‘Unique Skill Analyst: Appraisal’ so there’s no doubt that that’s the actual person.

(Even with my senses, I am able feel endlessly large amounts of magicules. Which means that, that slime is undoubtedly Rimuru-sama himself? No, but still――)*

That slime just let the two do as they pleased, looking embarrassed.

He looked innocent no matter how one looked at him and didn’t feel like the usual, brazen Rimuru.

However, one still can’t overturn the conclusion that this is the actual person……

Shuna and Shion delightfully started to look after the slime――Rimuru-n.

(Perhaps, this is one of Rimuru-sama’s evil schemes. Well then, what will he do this time?)

Diablo reached such a conclusion.

He probably left his real body behind and transferred his consciousness to a clone to take action somewhere.

Same with leon being demi god means nothing because power level varies within the same classification like most of the awakened monster under rimuru is 6-A, at best leon would get possibly higher

alright

 

[091Franky]

Shion and Shuna was grabbing each end of Rimuru body and it get splitted into two, Rimuru commented that Shuna resisted Shion strength, her physical should be comparable.

This is more like moment made for gag because shuna with unique skill can match the strength of shion pretty much break the whole power system from the beginning and also if shuna scales then most of subordinates under rimuru will scales to it, they were superior throughout the whole series which will not make sense and shuna is arguably weakest subordinates physically, she is more of magic type that uses her skill most efficiently.

 

[Gumball_Ushiromiya]

Agree with the upgrade

Are we sure this is Low 2-C and not just 3-A? Yuuki failed to destroy the space-time continuum despite all these statements, and when talking about Veldanava's maximum power, is that referring to before or after Velda created the world? Cause as we all know he lost the ability to use Turn Null after doing so, so yea at max power Velda is 2-C sure, but afterwards his max is weaker.

Honestly thinking the latter makes the most sense, cause Yuuki failing to completely destroy the universe is big issue with him being Low 2-C.

But then there's this which is making me question whether it should be Low 2-C or 3-A


I'll just follow the thread till an argument is made against this(because i haven't finished reading the webnovel ;-; )

 

[Catpija]

Are we sure this is Low 2-C and not just 3-A? Yuuki failed to destroy the space-time continuum despite all these statements, and when talking about Veldanava's maximum power, is that referring to before or after Velda created the world? Cause as we all know he lost the ability to use Turn Null after doing so, so yea at max power Velda is 2-C sure, but afterwards his max is weaker.

Honestly thinking the latter makes the most sense, cause Yuuki failing to completely destroy the universe is big issue with him being Low 2-C.

Veldora, who is below Yuuki can suppress mobius system absorbtion that gonna destroy the entirety of space-time continuum with his own aura, this should proves that its L2C and not 3A. i think the maximum of Veldanava energy refer to the after he lost Turn Null, because Yuuki cant replicate the skill.

Personally i don't trust Ciel statement in Chapter 248. It was stated multiple times that Yuuki Chrono Stasis should teleport Rimuru to the end of time and space , yet when he arrived, Ciel had enough time to wander/drift around and witness the end of the universe, shouldnt the end of time and space happened after that?

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Veldora's feat happens after a time skip though, unless there is something that states Veldora is on the same level as other characters from years before, i don't see why we should scale characters from the main story to him.

So because he wasn't sent exactly to end of space-time, we should discredit everything Ciel says? Ok we can't trust that Rimuru has enough Turn Null to recreate thousands of universes, this is not a good line of reasoning.

Also even if you ignore the statement, where and what exactly happened to Yuuki? Why wasn't he around if he was strong enough to nuke the timeline? I think the conclusion here is obvious.