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Universal (Wiki Wide) Jormungandr/World Serpent CRT

KingTempest

KingTempest

He/Him
VS Battles
Thread Moderator
21,468
30,790
Hello everybody.

This is really simple.

Every verse with a statement of the World Serpent existing should be scaleable to a unified lowballed value (not accepted yet) (accepted).

Jormungandr is a serpent that circles the entire planet. Because of that, it has a ridiculously large yield that people can't really measure, just like the Riordan Jormungandr who was given a vague Moon level for his feat.

Many verses have random Jormungandr type creatures, usually tied to their verses' version of Thor.
Riordanverse, Brawlhalla, Records of Ragnarok, and many more.

My solution is to give a basic calculation for those verses, and for Jormungandrs that haven't been shown in actual pictures to where their dimensions or speeds can have different reasoning for their feats or measurements.

Idc if it's my calc, but most world serpents should flat out just scale to the yield from there.
 
Last edited:
KLOL506 said:
You almost gave me a heart attack with that name King, never do that shit again you goober
Click to expand...
ggsuperfodd

I remade the calc using GPE. It got moon level. Is there another way to calculate it's yield for something more scaleable to others, aka not just "energy due to existing?"

this is mainly made for creatures with no visible showings of speed and such, a basic calc for jormungandrs, but I can't really find a speed to use nor find anything for a speed above superhuman
 
Alright so the calc is accepted

I just need staff to accept using this calc for world serpents through fiction that fit the requirements of being a genuine world serpent
 
I also managed to find a method for its KE that isn't upscaling another snake's speed, need it evaluated though
 
New version evaluated. Waiting for a second opinion via the words of KLOL but the Large Planet level KE for Jormungandr has been accepted
 
Got accepted, thanks

Other verses will get their usages of the feats checked out. For now though, this should be good

Waiting for more thread evaluations though, only Griffin accepted it
 
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KE end is a definite no for a default, cause speed upscaling. Correspondingly so is the force one.

GPE is... an option. (Technically a snake can't fall over, but let's ignore that, I suppose)
I think 1000km above the ground is probably a height where you need to use the generalized GPE formula, though.

I also have the impression that the thickness / length ration of those ultra long snakes in fiction is frequently much lower than that of real life snakes, but that's subjective, I suppose.
 
Why is the height of the snake for the GPE Formula 1,000 kilometers? A 30 cm wide snake is only gonna have it's center of mass at most 15 cm above the ground, ignoring how snakes are usually flatter than they are wide. Not to mention as DontTalk said, they can't fall over so GBE's also unusable. Also you used six instead of 2Pi for the radius/height formula like some engineer which is an insult to the purity of geometry

EDIT: Wait that's not a radius formula- what exactly are you doing here that gets the "height" of the snake?
h (center of snake): ((40,007,863/6) * 0.3)/2 = 1000196.57 m
Click to expand...
 
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Arc7Kuroi said:
Mmmm isn’t speed upscaling fine if there’s good reason to assume the creature is capable of moving at those speeds? Iirc that’s what our standards say.
Click to expand...
No, our standards are
Should that not be possible, but it is known that the character moves relative to its size as fast or faster than its normal-sized counterpart, upscaled speed can be used. To confirm that they are that fast, it must be clear that they, for instance, take steps within the same timeframe or less than a normal human would.
Click to expand...
I.e. you would need confirmation that their speed/size ratio is the same as for a regular snake. Usually, if you have that much information, you can instead just figure out the speed without upscaling and use that instead (which is preferred).
 
DontTalkDT said:
I.e. you would need confirmation that their speed/size ratio is the same as for a regular snake. Usually, if you have that much information, you can instead just figure out the speed without upscaling and use that instead (which is preferred).
Click to expand...
Gotcha gotcha so I have a question. Say we upscale speed a giant bear to be Mach 1, and said bear can fight characters who are confirmed to be able to move at Mach 1 or faster speeds, is that sufficient to argue the upscale speed is ok?
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Gotcha gotcha so I have a question. Say we upscale speed a giant bear to be Mach 1, and said bear can fight characters who are confirmed to be able to move at Mach 1 or faster speeds, is that sufficient to argue the upscale speed is ok?
Click to expand...
No, that's calc stacking, since what you're actually doing is just scaling from the other characters.
 
DontTalkDT said:
No, that's calc stacking, since what you're actually doing is just scaling from the other characters.
Click to expand...
Why would it be calc stacking? I wouldn’t be using the speeds from scaling, I would use the upscale speed from the ratio of the giant bear to a regular bear. I wouldn’t be getting the bear speed from other characters at all, I’d be using the speeds of other characters to support the upscale speed calculated from the bear size ratio.
 
...I changed the calc to where it would stop using upscaled speed

The upscaled speed is only the first part of the calc which I crossed out.
 
ElajRuengies said:
Why is the height of the snake for the GPE Formula 1,000 kilometers? A 30 cm wide snake is only gonna have it's center of mass at most 15 cm above the ground, ignoring how snakes are usually flatter than they are wide. Not to mention as DontTalk said, they can't fall over so GBE's also unusable. Also you used six instead of 2Pi for the radius/height formula like some engineer which is an insult to the purity of geometry

EDIT: Wait that's not a radius formula- what exactly are you doing here that gets the "height" of the snake?
Click to expand...
Upscale the width of the old snake with the measurements of the length from jormungandr, then divide by 2 to find the middle point
DontTalkDT said:
I also have the impression that the thickness / length ration of those ultra long snakes in fiction is frequently much lower than that of real life snakes, but that's subjective, I suppose.
Click to expand...
The calc isn't for the snakes we can see that are like 20 meters in diameter and 3 planets in length, it's for snakes that get no visuals but have statements of circling the world
 
Last edited:
KingTempest said:
Upscale the width of the old snake with the measurements of the length from jormungandr, then divide by 2 to find the middle point
Click to expand...
Ooooh I see- although assuming that every world-circling snake will have the same proportions as a regular snake is iffy if the calc is supposed to be a lowball applicable to any Verse.
 
ElajRuengies said:
Ooooh I see- although assuming that every world-circling snake will have the same proportions as a regular snake is iffy if the calc is supposed to be a lowball applicable to any Verse.
Click to expand...
It’s supposed to be for those who have no visuals, not a lowball got every shown snake
 
KingTempest said:
...I changed the calc to where it would stop using upscaled speed

The upscaled speed is only the first part of the calc which I crossed out.
Click to expand...
The Math 3 section is also nothing but upscaled speed. It uses the ratio of size to velocity of a real snake and applies it to a giant version. That's exactly what we do when we upscale.
KingTempest said:
The calc isn't for the snakes we can see that are like 20 meters in diameter and 3 planets in length, it's for snakes that get no visuals but have statements of circling the world
Click to expand...
Does having no information make it better?

Anyway, let me just mention the use of the generalized GBE formula again, so that it's not forgotten.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Why would it be calc stacking? I wouldn’t be using the speeds from scaling, I would use the upscale speed from the ratio of the giant bear to a regular bear. I wouldn’t be getting the bear speed from other characters at all, I’d be using the speeds of other characters to support the upscale speed calculated from the bear size ratio.
Click to expand...
DT ^ 👁️ 👄 👁️
 
generalised GPE needs to be used since 1000km above Earth is enough to change the gravitational field strength by an appreciable amount.

((G * 5.972e24 * 4.4025953e22)/7371196.57) - ((G * 5.972e24 * 4.4025953e22)/6371000) = 3.73e29 Joules, 89.26 Exatons, Moon level.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Why would it be calc stacking? I wouldn’t be using the speeds from scaling, I would use the upscale speed from the ratio of the giant bear to a regular bear. I wouldn’t be getting the bear speed from other characters at all, I’d be using the speeds of other characters to support the upscale speed calculated from the bear size ratio.
Click to expand...
Because the speed value you wish to use for the KE is only solid if you use scaling to a calced value. Without that the upscaling would not be considered. You are combining two values, of which neither can be used.

SeijiSetto said:
generalised GPE needs to be used since 1000km above Earth is enough to change the gravitational field strength by an appreciable amount.

((G * 5.972e24 * 4.4025953e22)/7371196.57) - ((G * 5.972e24 * 4.4025953e22)/6371000) = 3.73e29 Joules, 89.26 Exatons, Moon level.
Click to expand...
That looks ok to use.
 
DontTalkDT said:
Because the speed value you wish to use for the KE is only solid if you use scaling to a calced value. Without that the upscaling would not be considered. You are combining two values, of which neither can be used.
Click to expand...
So essentially using scaling to support a value is a no no, aight. Ummmm I’d disagree still that it’s calc stacking, but I can see where your issue is rooted in. So basically the upscale speed needs to be self determinant? Which leaves us with 1) direct statements of speed or 2) seeing the creature move its body length in a quick time/whatever it says on the wiki page?
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
So essentially using scaling to support a value is a no no, aight. Ummmm I’d disagree still that it’s calc stacking, but I can see where your issue is rooted in. So basically the upscale speed needs to be self determinant? Which leaves us with 1) direct statements of speed or 2) seeing the creature move its body length in a quick time/whatever it says on the wiki page?
Click to expand...
Unfortunately so.
 
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