- 22,038
- 18,114
Sorry for the weird differences in format throughout the thread.
Since this covers the entire universe, feel free to bring up anything once the main points are addressed.
Secondly, he didn't survive an explosion that destroyed a mountain. He survived the initial blast wave of an energon chain reaction that threw him clear of a mountain-top destroying explosion.
Rattrap destroyed the flying mountain with demolition charges that Terorrsaur explicitly noted to be capable of "tear[ing it] to pieces" (something that Jasonsith calculated as Multi-City Block level) and opted to flee. Even then, the explosion itself only appeared to detonate the energon crystals within the mountain and create a chain reaction that destroyed it. Rattrap and Optimus Primal both imply they'd be destroyed by the explosion shortly after and fled like Terrorsaur.
A variant of these charges blew Tarantulus to pieces (though he was put back together), making the feat even less credible.
easily defeated Blackrachnia which survived crashing an island
Dinobot's page words this in a way that makes it seem like A) Blackarachina survived an island crashing into her, or B) this feat is even slightly impressive. The island itself was tiny compared to mountains, and she was in the central tower that was untouched by the fall.
has defeated Inferno which no sold a mountain exploding head on
Unlike the other feats in the Beast Wars pages, this one has merit to it. However, the explosion didn't destroy the whole mountain (only blasting a hole through the middle and top), and part of the feat was done by chain reaction. This isn't far below Mountain level, but not very close either.
Inferno himself also didn't tank the explosion. The comes back two episodes later with holes in his armour and partially crippled.
It's worth noting that Waspinator could survive one of these blasts at point-blank range.
I can't remember exactly when Megatron survived a bomb capable of destroying Detroit, but I have a very vague recollection of it. Even if he did, destroying Detroit is only a City level feat. Starscream also planned to destroy both the Autobot and Decepticon forces on Earth—blowing up half the city in the process—by fitting two of his clones with the same bomb that crippled Megatron in the past. Megatron and the rest of the Decepticons likely only survived the explosion due to their proximity.
Survived an explosion that was going to destroy 100 miles worth of terrain
The claim that the Starscream Supreme's self-destruction would destroy everything in 100 miles—more specifically a 100 mile radius—is accurate (this is around 12 gigatons, according to Stardestroyer.net). However, Megatron was nowhere near point-blank range when he took the explosion (for scale, the Starscream Supremes are as large as Omega Supreme, who Bumblebee claimed was roughly the size of Sumdac Tower in TransWarped) and was completely crippled.
Like the previous feat, this explosive was a shatter bomb, only enhanced to completely destroy Megatron. This lends credence to the idea that Megatron only survived due to his limited surface area and proximity to the epicentre, possibly some AllSpark energy as well.
There's no indication that Starscream surpasses Blitzwing in Lifting Strength. It's actually the opposite, because Blitzwing overpowered Optimus Prime with extreme ease and Starscream could only match him. Starscream has also never been noted as someone with high physical strength, only considerable firepower.
Survived an explosion that crippled Megatron
Starscream only survived the same bomb that crippled Megatron because his fragment of the AllSpark kept resurrecting him and healed the damages (he does heal, since his head was trisected and it's in one piece later). Throughout this same episode, Megatron had been killing Starscream effortlessly, proving that his strength and durability are leagues above Starscream.
I was actually surprised at how faithful Transformers: Prime is to the Full Moon game series. However, there's still considerable contradictions even before the writers decided the idea of an Aligned continuity family had failed. Here's a list of contradictions:
This was agreed on in the past, just never applied.
Firstly, Omega Supreme has no feats of tearing down Cybertronian buildings (which aren't even confirmed to be miles high in this continuity, but that wouldn't exactly surprise me). The closest he ever came to such a feat in the game was when he severely damaged the side of a building while trying to attack a group of Decepticons, and causing the High Council Tower to collapse because he woke up within its foundations and flew off.
Second, Omega Supreme's size chart apparently puts him at 420 feet (128 metres). However, this is inconsistent with Megatron's size in game (30 feet according to the same chart), as he only appears to be under 10x his size through scaling to these images. I put more faith into Megatron's size, since the the Transformers are almost always depicted as being similar in size to Earth vehicles. The scaling gets even worse in Retribution, where he's stated to be 1/2 mile in length.
Lastly, Omega survived falling from so high up that the atmosphere had thinned to the point where it wouldn't tear off his wings in Exodus. If Cybertron's atmosphere is similar to Earth, this means Omega Supreme potentially survived falling from kilometres. The resulting crater was smaller than Omega Supreme himself, but large enough for him to hide in, and he did take damage.
Similar to Omega Supreme, Metroplex has problems in size. According to this, he's 600 feet long, but then it's more like 1,500 feet (457.2 metres) in this scene, and around a thousand (304.8 metres) here. However, there's no source or comparisons I can find that put Metroplex at 2 miles (3.2 kilometres) in height.
Also, Metroplex couldn't withstand hits from the warp cannons, he was completely disabled for a while. The Ark itself was about to be destroyed by the warp cannons after its shields had dropped, but even then it seems the ship could take at least a few shots.
Much like Metroplex and Omega Supreme, his height is inconsistent, but seems to be around the same size as the Ark. Transformers: Exodus states he's 5 times the size of Devastator, who's already many times larger than Megatron, and stated to be the largest bipedal Transformer Optimus Prime has ever seen up to that point.
Unlike Metroplex, however, I could actually see Trypticon and the Nemesis being City level. For one, Trypticon's station form destroyed nearly 10% of Iacon City—the buildings there being comparable in size to Metroplex—in a matter of minutes, despite being slowed down by its defences. His robot mode also survived falling from orbit with little to no damage after Jetfire disabled his jetpack. According to the novelization, the impact even devastated a destroyed city, produced a shockwave that propagated around Cybertron's surface (this isn't actually that impressive, as nukes actually do the same) and created a fireball large enough to reach the limits of the planet's atmosphere.
Substantiating this point, it's specifically stated in Spotlight: Doubledealer that Nova's control over the Darkness, a facet of D-Void—the being that embodies the Dead Universe—is what allows him to bend the DU to his will.
He never absorbed the Dead Universe, and I highly doubt this actually scales to his physical strength since the ores grant him a variety of different powers depending on which he uses. The fact that he had to make preparations to do this actually proves he can't perform this kind of feat normally. The feat also be Low 2-C regardless, because he was only drawing power one universe (the DU) and planned to destroy another (LU) separately.
However according to Nova Prime, the plan would combine all universes. I'm not sure if he just means the LU and DU, or all universes, but either way it's 2-C or higher. But the plan is almost exclusively portrayed as being on the scale of the Living Universe in every other instance.
Note that none of this context was brought up in the original thread.
Attack Potency: Multi-Continent level (Comparable to Optimus Prime. By 2005, he could one-shot the likes of Iron Hide and Hound, who were previously capable of surviving blasts from his Fusion Cannon) | Multi-Continent level (One-shot Starscream, who survived shots from the Orbit disruptor cannon, and became even more powerful after dipping in Thrull's plasma baths. Destroyed the planetoids Thrull and Goop in his cannon mode)
Durability: Multi-Continent level (Survived an explosion that was capable of moving the planet Cybertron out of the Solar System, tanked a shot from his own Fusion Cannon, has taken blows from Optimus Prime. More durable than the likes Soundwave and Starscream, who have survived blasts from a cannon capable of disrupting the moon's orbit)
Optimus Prime:
Attack Potency: Multi-Continent level (Has wounded and defeated the likes of Megatron and Soundwave. Fought Rodimus Prime, who is comparable to Galvatron, and even defeated Galvatron in Dark Awakening)
Durability: Multi-Continent level (Can tank blasts from Megatron's Fusion Cannon. Superior to the likes of Soundwave and Starscream, who survived shots from the Orbit disruptor cannon)
Rampage:
Attack Potency: Town level (Destroyed the top of a mountain with one blast)
Durability: Town level (Has survived the backfire of his own cannon on multiple occasions. More durable than Waspinator and Inferno, the latter of whom survived an explosion that devastated a mountain)
Waspinator:
Attack Potency: Town level (His mines can cause massive avalanches. Fought the likes of Optimus Primal and Cheetor on multiple occasions, though he is inferior to the former)
Durability: Town level (Survived an explosion that blew up part of a mountain and a point-blank shot from Rampage's cannon)
Megatron:
Attack Potency: Town level (Can fight on par with Optimus Primal, who can harm him) | Town level (Scaling off other Transmetal characters) | At least Town level (Stated his power to be greater then ever, fought against Optimal Optimus twice and had the upper-hand initially both times)
Durability: Town level (Far more durable than Waspinator. Superior to Inferno, who survived an explosion that devastated a mountain) | Town level (Survived an explosion that destroyed part of a mountain) | At least Town level (Took hits from Optimal Optimus)
Dinobot:
Attack Potency: Town level (Comparable to Optimus Primal and Megatron)
Durability: Town level (Tanked one of Scorponok's missiles, a barrage of which destroyed a large portion of a mountain. Survived a massive beatdown from almost all the Predacons before finally dying of his wounds and finishing the fight)
Optimus Prime:
Attack Potency: At most Small City level, possibly far higher (Has fought against Starscream) | At least Small City level, possibly far higher (Able to contend with Megatron. Briefly disabled two Lugnut Supremes)
Durability: Small City level, possibly far higher (Survived attacks from Megatron, Starscream and the Omega Supreme clones)
Megatron:
Attack Potency: Small City level, possibly far higher (Can fight characters capable of harming him)
Durability: Small City level (Survived the explosion of a shatter bomb, two of which would have destroyed half of Detroit, and the near-point blank detonation of an explosive capable of destroying everything within a 100-mile radius, although he was heavily crippled in both instances), possibly far higher (Barely survived being near the epicentre of an explosion capable of destroying everything within a 100-mile radius, though he theorises it was only due to partial shielding from AllSpark energy)
Omega Supreme
Attack Potency: At least Small City level, possibly far higher (Megatron was afraid of taking him on, one-shot Blitzwing, Lugnut and mulitple Starscream clones)
Durability: At least Small City level, possibly far higher (Far superior to Megatron. According to Ratchet, it would take a nuclear bomb to dent his armour)
There's also some other feats that might be worth calculating. For example, one of Lugnut's explosives created an enormous crater in Three's a Crowd, devastated a forest (making another crater as well), pulverized concrete and reduced rock to dust. Multiple Starscream-level Decepticons also withstood an explosion larger than Omega Supreme.
As for lifting strength, Optimus and Warpath turned over a statue head larger than themselves, and Cliffjumper briefly suspended a large pipe.
Attack Potency: Continent level (He can harm those who can harm him) | Continent level (Routinely fights Megatron. Fought on par with Sixshot. Should be comparable to Grimlock and slightly superior to Tarn) | Continent level (Upon getting his confidence back, he easily defeated Nova Prime. Far superior to Galvatron, who can damage him)
Durability: Continent level (Survived the Toraxxis Mega-Refinery explosion) | Continent level (Repeatedly takes beatings from the likes of Megatron. Was able to barely survive an encounter with Megatron’s Stealth Bomber state) | Continent level (Tanked a point-blank shot from Regenesis Shockwave)
Shockwave:
Attack Potency: Continent level (Defeated all of the Dinobots by shutting down his higher brain functions. Fought and defeated the more powerful Scorponok, who tanked the Toraxxis Mega-Refinery explosion at point-blank range, with both confirming a shot from his cannon would penetrate the latter's armour) | Continent level level (Physically superior to Post-War Optimus Prime). Universe level+ with Preparation (Drew enormous amounts of energy from the Dead Universe since its creation, resulting in the dimension's lifeless state. Has complete control over space and time. Planned to revert all of history to a singularity where concepts, such as physics, time and space, would have never existed), possibly at least Low Multiverse level (According to Nova Prime, Shockwave's plan would have combined all universes into one)
Since this covers the entire universe, feel free to bring up anything once the main points are addressed.
G1 Cartoon (Completed)
Planetary Explosion
Firstly, assuming Cybertron's mass is comparable to Earth takes some heafty assumptions. While the planet is shown to have comparable gravity to Earth in Desertion of the Dinobots, it's depicted as being far smaller than Earth in The Ultimate Doom, Part 2/3 and The Transformers: The Movie (from left to right: Unicron, Lithone, Moonbase One & Two, Cybertron, Junkion, Quintessa and Earth). The explanation is simple; Cybertron is a factory made by the Quintessons, even containing a control room at its core.- AUTOBOT LEADER: Rodimus Prime, you have embarked on a journey into Cybertron's distant past. Prepare to look into the face of your creator! Aeons ago, Cybertron was a factory, built by the Quintessons to manufacture robots.
- In Fire on the Mountain, Megatron creates a weapon capable of creating massive explosions that can be seen from orbit and vaporizing mountain tops (doing a calculation gets 100 kilotons to 30 megatons, while the orbital explosion gets Country level results). Iron Hide could actually survive a shot, but he's briefly injured (notably less so than when hit with Megatron's Fusion Cannon).
- In The Core, Megatron plans to tap into the geothermal power of Earth's core, describing it as "richer than any [power source] in the galaxy." Starscream states that the Earth could shatter and eradicate everything on it, including the Transformers. Megatron only planned to survive by making a space bridge that connected to Cybertron.
- In Fire on the Mountain, two shots from Megatron's Fusion Cannon (something that Megatron himself and Hound survive attacks from in this episode) reduces a mountain top to rubble so thoroughly that it created an avalance of rock. The Autobots reduce the rubble to tiny fragments with repeat fire. As I mentioned before, Iron Hide also withstands being hit with a cannon capable of vaporizing mountain tops and creating massive explosions from orbit.
- [Potentially] In The Secret of Omega Supreme, Optimus orders Omega Supreme to blow up an asteroid, only to rescind these orders. Later, he accidentally splits it in half. Throughout the episode, the asteroid is usually only few times larger than the Constructicons and Omega Supreme, who is 18 metres in height, to extending over the horizon.
- In B.O.T, Starscream, Soundwave and many other Decepticons withstand blasts from a cannon designed to knock the moon out of orbit (this could actually be consistent with knocking Cybertron out of orbit), which is a Multi-Continent level feat. They survive, but are clearly damaged by the shots.
- In Five Faces of Darkness Part 2, Galvatron destroys Thrull. This is impressive, but the planet's odd shape and the fact that the plasma baths could be seen from orbit indicate that Thrull is very small.
- In Five Faces of Darkness Part 3, Galvatron uses his cannon to shoot a storm on Jupiter, causing it to begin imploding. The resulting blast then detonates a "storm cone" (meaning one section of the storm itself), but leaves pretty much the entire storm intact. For reference, the largest storm on Jupiter is less than twice the width of Earth (the second is 8,000 km), so the feat is nowhere near Planet level.
- In Five Faces of Darkness Part 4, Galvatron blows up Goop, a junk planetoid.
- In Carnage in C-Minor, Ultra Magnus suggests that he, Broadside, Perceptor and Superion (those are the Autobots shown firing at the comet, but there's actually a lot more that weren't included due to animation errors) deflect a comet fitted with a thruster that Galvatron created to destroy Metroplex. The comet itself was usually portrayed as being hundreds, if not thousands of times larger than the Transformers, and Ultra Magnus showed some concern at the comet striking a small inhabited planet.
Power Curve
By the time of 2005 (The Transformers Season 1 is based in 1985), it appears Matrix wielders have vastly grown in strength. For example, Optimus is seen one-shotting multiple opponents that gave him far more trouble earlier in the series and overpowering Megatron, even to the point of crippling him with one blow, while Rodimus casually overpowers Galvatron. It's only in subsequent episodes that Galvatron, having increased his power by bathing in a plasma bath, can match the likes of Rodimus Prime and Ultra Magnus.- GALVATRON: These baths have made me more powerful than ever, but where am I to find the mighty legions who will follow me?
Beast Wars (Completed)
Rhinox's Explosion
While the shockwave could be seen from space, the damages to the cavern (made of natural rock) itself were nowhere near Mountain level, only blowing a hole in one. Megatron and the other Predacons also stood a significant distance away from the explosion (for reference, the Beast Wars characters are larger than humans, but not significantly).Megatron
Season 1
Firstly, Megatron did not blow up part of that mountain on his own, in fact he likely had no part in it. It was a few stray missiles from the Predacon crew firing at the Maximals. Scorponok, who's frequently portrayed as the muscle of the group, and Terrorsaur were the only ones firing missiles in that scene, so could have only been them.Secondly, he didn't survive an explosion that destroyed a mountain. He survived the initial blast wave of an energon chain reaction that threw him clear of a mountain-top destroying explosion.
Transmetal 2
Optimus Primal threw one of his jet blades at the tractor beam, damaging it enough halt the grinders that slice rock to pieces. This is kind of a durability feat, but doesn't prove he's Mountain level.Rattrap/Blackarachnia/Inferno
His mines blew up a flying a mountainRattrap destroyed the flying mountain with demolition charges that Terorrsaur explicitly noted to be capable of "tear[ing it] to pieces" (something that Jasonsith calculated as Multi-City Block level) and opted to flee. Even then, the explosion itself only appeared to detonate the energon crystals within the mountain and create a chain reaction that destroyed it. Rattrap and Optimus Primal both imply they'd be destroyed by the explosion shortly after and fled like Terrorsaur.
A variant of these charges blew Tarantulus to pieces (though he was put back together), making the feat even less credible.
easily defeated Blackrachnia which survived crashing an island
Dinobot's page words this in a way that makes it seem like A) Blackarachina survived an island crashing into her, or B) this feat is even slightly impressive. The island itself was tiny compared to mountains, and she was in the central tower that was untouched by the fall.
has defeated Inferno which no sold a mountain exploding head on
Unlike the other feats in the Beast Wars pages, this one has merit to it. However, the explosion didn't destroy the whole mountain (only blasting a hole through the middle and top), and part of the feat was done by chain reaction. This isn't far below Mountain level, but not very close either.
Inferno himself also didn't tank the explosion. The comes back two episodes later with holes in his armour and partially crippled.
Rampage
Although, an extremely impressive feat regardless, Ramage didn't one-shot a mountain, only the top of one. For reference, fragmenting an entire mountain with a height and base width of 3,682.55 metres is baseline Mountain level, while the one here was. Doing a quick calculation gets Small Town level to Town level+ (fragmentation and violent fragmentation) for destroying the mountain top.It's worth noting that Waspinator could survive one of these blasts at point-blank range.
Transformers: Animated (Completed)
Bumblebee Explosion
Bumblebee was far enough away that the explosive itself couldn't be seen, so he didn't take this from anywhere near point-blank range. Applying a distance of one kilometre, the energy becomes so fractional that it actually drops to the kiloton range. Said explosion also left him charred and unable to stand, but relatively uninjured, so this is a high-end feat.Megatron
Survived a bomb that could destroy the entire city of Detroit with easeI can't remember exactly when Megatron survived a bomb capable of destroying Detroit, but I have a very vague recollection of it. Even if he did, destroying Detroit is only a City level feat. Starscream also planned to destroy both the Autobot and Decepticon forces on Earth—blowing up half the city in the process—by fitting two of his clones with the same bomb that crippled Megatron in the past. Megatron and the rest of the Decepticons likely only survived the explosion due to their proximity.
Survived an explosion that was going to destroy 100 miles worth of terrain
The claim that the Starscream Supreme's self-destruction would destroy everything in 100 miles—more specifically a 100 mile radius—is accurate (this is around 12 gigatons, according to Stardestroyer.net). However, Megatron was nowhere near point-blank range when he took the explosion (for scale, the Starscream Supremes are as large as Omega Supreme, who Bumblebee claimed was roughly the size of Sumdac Tower in TransWarped) and was completely crippled.
Like the previous feat, this explosive was a shatter bomb, only enhanced to completely destroy Megatron. This lends credence to the idea that Megatron only survived due to his limited surface area and proximity to the epicentre, possibly some AllSpark energy as well.
Starscream
Should be comparable if not superior to Blitzwing & As one of the strongest Decepticons, he shouldn't be much weaker than Strika who matched BrawnThere's no indication that Starscream surpasses Blitzwing in Lifting Strength. It's actually the opposite, because Blitzwing overpowered Optimus Prime with extreme ease and Starscream could only match him. Starscream has also never been noted as someone with high physical strength, only considerable firepower.
Survived an explosion that crippled Megatron
Starscream only survived the same bomb that crippled Megatron because his fragment of the AllSpark kept resurrecting him and healed the damages (he does heal, since his head was trisected and it's in one piece later). Throughout this same episode, Megatron had been killing Starscream effortlessly, proving that his strength and durability are leagues above Starscream.
War For Cybertron/Transformers: Prime (Deleted Profiles)
Contradictions Between Prime and WFC/FoC
In Prime, Orion Pax attained the Matrix from Primus after an attempt to save Cybertron from being poisoned (it's implied this is from Dark Energon), leading him to be reformatted as Optimus Prime well into the war. Conversely, Optimus is already a Prime in War For Cybertron (having become one when Zeta died) and just takes the Matrix under similar circumstances without being reformatted, although he actually prevented the poisoning and was assisted by other Autobots.Starscream was attacked by Grimlock in Fall of Cybertron and doesn't appear on the Nemesis. He's just with the Decepticons in Transformers: Prime, and Exodusgives no explanation.Yet Megatron himself rode skyward, in single-minded pursuit of the Ark, his vessel the reconfigured Trypticon. With him were Starscream, Lugnut, Soundwave—the elite of the Decepticons.
Tons of characters mentioned in the novels and games simply cease to exist. Lugnut (see the quote above), for example, isn't on the Nemesis and is never mentioned again.
Omega Supreme
Omega Supreme’s assumption of his alt-form was nearly complete. It would have been long ago, thought Megatron, had he not been built into the foundation of the High Council Tower and the wall of Teletraan-1. Six thrusters, their exhaust nozzles wider than Megatron’s arm span, took form and locked into place.A rumble spread through the collapsing basements of the High Council Tower. Debris from upper floors rained down around them as the remains of the building fell away from Omega Supreme. And a second rumble, yet more menacing than the first, brought with it the first dim glow from within the thruster cones.“We retreat for now, then. But only for now.” Megatron yelled out a signal and his retinue began to fall back, zigzagging their way from pillar to pillar as the final collapse of the High Council Tower approached.
“Omega Supreme!” Springer yelled joyfully. “Where’s he signaling us from?” Jetfire asked. “Right here,” said Ultra Magnus. “What do you mean, ‘here’? Last time I checked, he was half a mile long, kind of tough to hide.”
The natural rotation of Cybertron would have carried Omega Supreme’s launch point away to the east as he rose straight up out of Cybertron’s gravity well, had he not detected the pursuit of Starscream and undertaken evasive action. Deploying wings since he had achieved enough altitude that the thickness of the atmosphere wouldn’t tear them apart, Omega Supreme arced away back to the west, remaining over Autobot-held territory while still trying to fulfill Teletraan-1’s imperative that he reach space and go on to the designated location for the Plasma Energy Chamber.Optimus Prime mobilized, taking alt-form with the rest of his squad and redlining toward the impact site, but he could not imagine how this mission might end in success. He would recover the Plasma Energy Chamber, perhaps, and perhaps could even sequester it somewhere again, but the loss of Omega Supreme was disastrous for the dwindling hopes of the Autobot cause. They arrived at the crater, skidding to a halt and reassuming proto-form as soon as their momentum wouldn’t pitch them into the smoking depths of the crater itself.And then, once again, everything changed as the gargantuan proto-form of Omega Supreme stood ponderously up out of the crater.
Metroplex
Also, Metroplex couldn't withstand hits from the warp cannons, he was completely disabled for a while. The Ark itself was about to be destroyed by the warp cannons after its shields had dropped, but even then it seems the ship could take at least a few shots.
Trypticon/Nemesis/Ark
Trypticon Station, in a bipedal form larger than any walking bot Optimus Prime had ever seen, was rising again. It rose five times the size of Devastator, an immense shape that loomed like a walking city over the exploded landscape around the station’s impact.
Trypticon Station’s impact, on the edge of the Mithric Sea, caused a visible shock wave that propagated across Cybertron’s surface like an earthquake. The ruins of Crystal City shattered into even smaller pieces. The Titanium Turnpike heaved and twisted into what looked like a roller coaster. Landslides occurred across the heaving spines of the Manganese Mountains, and the shock was felt as far away as Iacon and, in the other direction, Stanix and Kaon. The visible fireball rose blazing to the limits of Cybertron’s atmosphere before it dissipated into a layer of smoke that began to enclose the Northern Hemisphere of the planet, walling it off from orbital observation -Transformers: Exodus
Debunking 2-C/Low 2-C IDW (2005 Continuity)
If it's not clear, "DU" means "Dead Universe" and "LU" means "Living Universe". If I use the term "Universe" by itself, then that refers to the "Living Universe", which Optimus Prime and co. occupy.Outlier
Even if it's these feats are true, there's more than enough evidence to prove they're outliers.- The Worldburner ships in the Decepticon fleet are designed to destroy planets (it's later stated that any one of the ships in the fleet could destroy a dozen), something that wouldn't be neccesary or meaningful for Low 2-C characters.
- Megatron boasts (though I don't think he's exaggerating) that his railgun can destroy cities while uncharged. If he has 2-C power, then that'd be an extremely empty threat.
- Optimus is damaged by the shockwave of a nuclear bomb-level attack and believes Megatron would be killed (he's wrong since the latter was vastly upgraded). However, he does admit that it hurt.
- Galvatron is knocked out by blasts designed to pulverize comets, though he's conscious shortly a short time later.
- Overlord, a member of the Warrior's Elite (meaning an upgraded point-one percenter and Six-changer) is considered powerful enough to "shave an inch" off a planet. Though likely hyperbolic, that indicates he's weaker, if anything. For reference, Six-Shot (whose power is comparable to Overlord) is so powerful that Megatron installed an off-switch in him, something he did to all the Warrior's Elite as well. Overlord himself is Megatron's last resort.
- Bombs designed to destroy planets and moons are considered superweapons. One of these planet-destroying bombs (Geobomb) was used in an effort to kill Megatron, which only failed when another variant that teleports planets was activated.
- Pyro considers a 5-15 kiloton explosion to be capable of killing both himself and Optimus Prime.
- Megatron plans to use antimatter to kill the Decepticon Justice Division, which would blow up half the planet he's on (it's actually hollow, but I'm unsure if the characters know that by this point) without Tailbreaker's forcefield. He only survived due to being teleported out of the blast seemingly at the moment of the antimatter explosion.
Nova/Nemesis Prime
There's no evidence Nova's ability to control the Dead Universe scales to his physical strength or even really AP. For example, he has entered the Living Universe on multiple occasions, yet has never shown that kind of control—it was only his plan (the expansion) that'd allow him to control both universes after they combined.Substantiating this point, it's specifically stated in Spotlight: Doubledealer that Nova's control over the Darkness, a facet of D-Void—the being that embodies the Dead Universe—is what allows him to bend the DU to his will.
Shockwave
Shockwave all the Energon variants ("ores") and used Galvatron's link with the Dead Universe to draw energy from it, gaining complete control over the main universe (Living Universe) through space-time manipulation. Since he was drawing away its power as fuel from the very beginning of its creation (this was through a time drive that he merged into himself with all the ores), he could enact a plan to collapse the Living Universe into a singularity with the ore's powers, and create a Cybetron that lives there without time, distance, physics, etc for all eternity. This is also what the "stated eight times to be a universal threat" panels directly refer to.He never absorbed the Dead Universe, and I highly doubt this actually scales to his physical strength since the ores grant him a variety of different powers depending on which he uses. The fact that he had to make preparations to do this actually proves he can't perform this kind of feat normally. The feat also be Low 2-C regardless, because he was only drawing power one universe (the DU) and planned to destroy another (LU) separately.
However according to Nova Prime, the plan would combine all universes. I'm not sure if he just means the LU and DU, or all universes, but either way it's 2-C or higher. But the plan is almost exclusively portrayed as being on the scale of the Living Universe in every other instance.
Note that none of this context was brought up in the original thread.
Profile Changes
G1
Megatron:Attack Potency: Multi-Continent level (Comparable to Optimus Prime. By 2005, he could one-shot the likes of Iron Hide and Hound, who were previously capable of surviving blasts from his Fusion Cannon) | Multi-Continent level (One-shot Starscream, who survived shots from the Orbit disruptor cannon, and became even more powerful after dipping in Thrull's plasma baths. Destroyed the planetoids Thrull and Goop in his cannon mode)
Durability: Multi-Continent level (Survived an explosion that was capable of moving the planet Cybertron out of the Solar System, tanked a shot from his own Fusion Cannon, has taken blows from Optimus Prime. More durable than the likes Soundwave and Starscream, who have survived blasts from a cannon capable of disrupting the moon's orbit)
Optimus Prime:
Attack Potency: Multi-Continent level (Has wounded and defeated the likes of Megatron and Soundwave. Fought Rodimus Prime, who is comparable to Galvatron, and even defeated Galvatron in Dark Awakening)
Durability: Multi-Continent level (Can tank blasts from Megatron's Fusion Cannon. Superior to the likes of Soundwave and Starscream, who survived shots from the Orbit disruptor cannon)
Beast Wars
Rampage:
Attack Potency: Town level (Destroyed the top of a mountain with one blast)
Durability: Town level (Has survived the backfire of his own cannon on multiple occasions. More durable than Waspinator and Inferno, the latter of whom survived an explosion that devastated a mountain)
Waspinator:
Attack Potency: Town level (His mines can cause massive avalanches. Fought the likes of Optimus Primal and Cheetor on multiple occasions, though he is inferior to the former)
Durability: Town level (Survived an explosion that blew up part of a mountain and a point-blank shot from Rampage's cannon)
Megatron:
Attack Potency: Town level (Can fight on par with Optimus Primal, who can harm him) | Town level (Scaling off other Transmetal characters) | At least Town level (Stated his power to be greater then ever, fought against Optimal Optimus twice and had the upper-hand initially both times)
Durability: Town level (Far more durable than Waspinator. Superior to Inferno, who survived an explosion that devastated a mountain) | Town level (Survived an explosion that destroyed part of a mountain) | At least Town level (Took hits from Optimal Optimus)
Dinobot:
Attack Potency: Town level (Comparable to Optimus Primal and Megatron)
Durability: Town level (Tanked one of Scorponok's missiles, a barrage of which destroyed a large portion of a mountain. Survived a massive beatdown from almost all the Predacons before finally dying of his wounds and finishing the fight)
Animated
Assuming Detroit is a square (it's actually closer to a rectangle, but it's unknown which side of Detroit the Starscream clones would've destroyed anyway), the Stardestroyer.net nuclear calculator gets about 6.731 megatons (3.3655, or barely Small City level+, per bomb) for destroying half the city. So the new ratings would go:Optimus Prime:
Attack Potency: At most Small City level, possibly far higher (Has fought against Starscream) | At least Small City level, possibly far higher (Able to contend with Megatron. Briefly disabled two Lugnut Supremes)
Durability: Small City level, possibly far higher (Survived attacks from Megatron, Starscream and the Omega Supreme clones)
Megatron:
Attack Potency: Small City level, possibly far higher (Can fight characters capable of harming him)
Durability: Small City level (Survived the explosion of a shatter bomb, two of which would have destroyed half of Detroit, and the near-point blank detonation of an explosive capable of destroying everything within a 100-mile radius, although he was heavily crippled in both instances), possibly far higher (Barely survived being near the epicentre of an explosion capable of destroying everything within a 100-mile radius, though he theorises it was only due to partial shielding from AllSpark energy)
Omega Supreme
Attack Potency: At least Small City level, possibly far higher (Megatron was afraid of taking him on, one-shot Blitzwing, Lugnut and mulitple Starscream clones)
Durability: At least Small City level, possibly far higher (Far superior to Megatron. According to Ratchet, it would take a nuclear bomb to dent his armour)
There's also some other feats that might be worth calculating. For example, one of Lugnut's explosives created an enormous crater in Three's a Crowd, devastated a forest (making another crater as well), pulverized concrete and reduced rock to dust. Multiple Starscream-level Decepticons also withstood an explosion larger than Omega Supreme.
WFC
I'm not exactly sure on this now. There's a few feats I've been able to find for regular characters.- Starscream jinked and swooped through the barrage and unleashed a volley of missiles at an ion-cannon battery set into a hillside on the outskirts of Crystal City. The hillside vanished in a fireball that quickly darkened into a column of smoke that gushed from the interior of the hill, where fires would bum through the remnants of the defensive batteries until there was nothing left to bum.
- The initial salvo knocked Barricade backward, but the ’Con hadn’t survived this long in the war by being vulnerable to anyone’s first shot; he rallied and blew Bumblebee off the road with a brace of missiles. Bumblebee crashed hard into the side of a hill and barely rolled away from the second volley that collapsed the hillside on top of him.
- Jetfire, taking terrible punishment from the Seekers all around him, drove Megatron back with a missile salvo that blasted a trench between the gladiator and the rest of the Decepticons. Megatron returned fire, forcing Jetfire back up toward the covering Seekers. Starscream was chasing around toward the edge of the Well, harrying the retreating Autobots. Cliffjumper fired up at him, but the Seeker was too far away for gas guns to have any effect. “Run, Autobots!” Megatron roared. Victory was at hand. The Autobots were pressed to the very edge of the Well, hunkered down with the bottomless canyon at their backs. Megatron raised his arms. “The AllSpark will be mine! Where are you now, Orion Pax? You have failed for the last time!”
As for lifting strength, Optimus and Warpath turned over a statue head larger than themselves, and Cliffjumper briefly suspended a large pipe.
IDW
Optimus Prime:Attack Potency: Continent level (He can harm those who can harm him) | Continent level (Routinely fights Megatron. Fought on par with Sixshot. Should be comparable to Grimlock and slightly superior to Tarn) | Continent level (Upon getting his confidence back, he easily defeated Nova Prime. Far superior to Galvatron, who can damage him)
Durability: Continent level (Survived the Toraxxis Mega-Refinery explosion) | Continent level (Repeatedly takes beatings from the likes of Megatron. Was able to barely survive an encounter with Megatron’s Stealth Bomber state) | Continent level (Tanked a point-blank shot from Regenesis Shockwave)
Shockwave:
Attack Potency: Continent level (Defeated all of the Dinobots by shutting down his higher brain functions. Fought and defeated the more powerful Scorponok, who tanked the Toraxxis Mega-Refinery explosion at point-blank range, with both confirming a shot from his cannon would penetrate the latter's armour) | Continent level level (Physically superior to Post-War Optimus Prime). Universe level+ with Preparation (Drew enormous amounts of energy from the Dead Universe since its creation, resulting in the dimension's lifeless state. Has complete control over space and time. Planned to revert all of history to a singularity where concepts, such as physics, time and space, would have never existed), possibly at least Low Multiverse level (According to Nova Prime, Shockwave's plan would have combined all universes into one)
Last edited:
