The Monitors

[Antvasima]

We only know what was shown in that scan so far.

 

[LukaSolosYourVerse]

I swear y'all are just weird with regen sometimes.


>"High-Godly: The ability to regenerate even after the totality of your existence is erased, alongside the reality that you are present within that exists up to your own dimensional level."

>"True-Godly: The ability to regenerate from being erased on a level beyond the confines and concept of dimensions."

>Regens from getting erased by a high 1-A

>Mid godly

 

[Quantu]

We don't know if he was erased though.

He should have Likely High Godly regen anyway for being likely 1-A

 

[Antvasima]

Let's wait for more information in upcoming stories.

 

[LukaSolosYourVerse]

We don't know if he was erased though.

It was explicitly stated that he was but sure

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

No. It was stated that Mandrakk was "falling, until the very idea of him was gone". The word "erased" is nowhere in the scan of his fall.

 

[LukaSolosYourVerse]

And what could the "very idea of him" being gone mean, in any possible context, aside from being erased? Nothing at all, because it means exactly and precisely that. This is honestly like invalidating Cthulhu's star level feat because it doesn't clearly-as-water involve the word "destroyed".

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

Except that the comic, and the subsequent issue where he reappears, reference the event as him "falling to the bottom" of the Overvoid, not "being erased" by it. The statement of "the very idea of him" being gone is just a flowery way of saying he fell an impossible distance and length of time until TR could no longer hear him.

 

[Elizhaa]

Except that the comic, and the subsequent issue where he reappears, reference the event as him "falling to the bottom" of the Overvoid, not "being erased" by it. The statement of "the very idea of him" being gone is just a flowery way of saying he fell an impossible distance and length of time until TR could no longer hear him.

I pretty sure that Mandrakk the Dark Monitor true form is an Abstract Existence (Type 1) and should have the ability; Erasure would be the only key to kill him so it could be literal.

Abstract Existence's Proofs similar to The Thought Robot

• Exists in the Monitor-Sphere, an archetypal realm and fundamental world where everything is more profound and absolute, as a body of pure thought in a realm of nothingness, a "Self-Assembling Hyper Story" beyond the Story of DC Comics. The Monitor-Sphere was said to be an archetypal realm that exists beyond the story of DC and its multiverse which has bee repeatedly writte as an Infinite-Dimensional structure

 

[Antvasima]

I agree with MrKingOfNegativity.

 

[LukaSolosYourVerse]

Except that the comic, and the subsequent issue where he reappears, reference the event as him "falling to the bottom" of the Overvoid, not "being erased" by it. The statement of "the very idea of him" being gone is just a flowery way of saying he fell an impossible distance and length of time until TR could no longer hear him.

Again, that's exactly like invalidating a feat because it's phrased indirectly. "The very idea of him being lost" and "the mind of monitor engulfs him" both being used to describe the exact same event in the same panel alludes more to erasure than anything else.

And no, the unexpected is the only comic which actually says anything close to "falling to the bottom of the overvoid" when talking about the event. Even then, "damaged from the fall" can easily be interpreted in different ways once we remember that it wouldn't even make sense for the overvoid to even have a bottom.

 

[Sandman31]

I do think that Mandrakk was erased when he fell Into the Overvoid in Final Crisis.

He simply didnt fall, he was also engulfed by the Monitor Mind, which is the same thing that happened to the other Monitor who were erased from existence by being engulfed by the Overvoid. Which means that they returned to the mind that birthed them

But then he reappeared again in the Unexpected so I'm not sure anymore

 

[Antvasima]

Sandman31 is our main DC Comics expert, so I trust his judgement, but this may be a case of retroactive continuity.

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

dc's cosmology is so inconsistent. at times it doesn't make sense. I believe TR should be straight 1-A

 

[Antvasima]

Do you agree Sandman31?

 

[The_Tetromino_King]

i hope he does. By making TR and Mandrakk plain 1-A (possibly the source too)

 

[Alonik]

I do think that Mandrakk was erased when he fell Into the Overvoid in Final Crisis.
He simply didnt fall, he was also engulfed by the Monitor Mind, which is the same thing that happened to the other Monitor who were erased from existence by being engulfed by the Overvoid. Which means that they returned to the mind that birthed them.

But then he reappeared again in the Unexpected so I'm not sure anymore

Look, mandrakk was not literally sent out of Multiverse. The Thought Robot sent him only low dimensions, and he ended up in limbo. And in final of the crisis Mandrakk was killed by the green lanterns.

On the part of him falling into the soul of Overvoid, I believe it is because the Multiverse is not perfect. I think it's a matter of mentioning that the Multiverse has natural gateways leading out of it, into the soul of Overvoid. But in the HQ itself, probably he do not falling there out of the multiverse, he just goes through those white spaces that have on the map of the multiverse and comeback to limbo.

 

[LukaSolosYourVerse]

That's Rox Ogama in the scans you linked, not Dax Novu.

 

[Alonik]

You're right about the first ones, I confused. OvO.

But in the last two we see Mandrakk being killed by the heroes, including Nix Uotan that this was his father, Dax Novu.

 

[Driger-God]

About Monitor, they can live in the Sphere per your tecnology, but, they are 5-Dimension or 4-Dimension, the structure in Monitor Realm interact with object of 5D-4D, and they himself exist in equal tier than Bleedspace(Exist in 5┬░ dimension) per your tecnology. Monitor are 5D, scaling with Bleed-space, not above it, is inconsistent 1-A.

In the event, not exist feats for beyond 4D or 5D. The vision of Monitor is 4D, your tecnology, and they himself exist with Bleed (5D)

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

Oh, yeah, Monitors are totally consistently Bleedspace level despite the God Sphere transcending it entirely and then the Monitor Sphere being way above it. Uh-huh. There are Monitors that have affected all of existence as the Anti-Monitor has been described as doing, and Monitors like Nix Uotan that fight threats typically that threaten all creation. Even regular Monitors are hyper-stories beyond the story of DC, the book of infinite pages written by a dying Writer in Limbo containing all of existence. Monitor ships also run on the fundamental music that makes up everything in creation and can traverse the Overvoid. Regular Monitors, themselves can traverse it, actually. Them going down into the regular universe obviously down-sizes them, similar to true forms of New Gods coming down from the God Sphere in Boomtubes.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

you are double posting Hadou

 

[Driger-God]

But, they are BlendSpace level, they exist with bleed, and the Monitor are unique in all creation that manipulate the Bleed Space, in Final Crisis, Bleed Space exist above the GodSphere. "Bleed cannot be held or bottled, except here, by us"

Monitor Sphere is only place in all creation that Bleed(5D) can being manipulated, and the Monitor only in all creation can manipulate the bleed.
Anti-Monitor threatened the universes(planetary), in Pos Crise fase Nekron is above the Anti-Monitor.
The Book of Limbo contain all books in the existence, not all existence. "This contain every book possible"
I believe that you talking of this.

Define "Hyper Story", because it not make sense, you can afirmate that the story is Hyper Story by have written in 4D? The viewers forged from Throught Robot is 4D. But it not 1-A.
Nothing here sustent 1-A. Ignoring that Monitor exist with the Bleed(5D), and the Earths(4D), and Thought Robot originated the 4D Vision, you can scale they by 1-B.

 

[LukaSolosYourVerse]

"Every book possible" likely refers to every story that the over-monitor has observed, which would more or less mean something similar to all of existence.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

No, there is a statement from Mandrakk at the end of Final Crisis that says "all of existence contained within a single book". You need to learn the tiering system if you think 5D/4D stuff is considered 1-B, also.

 

[Driger-God]

5-D is high 2-A. I talked 1-B considering the system of dimensions, but, not exist prove for the level.
2-A is best scaling considering all.

"The Book" is only a book that contain the multiverse story, not existence. Ultraman can support the weight of Book alone. And Ultraman was literally read the book. You believe that Ultraman can support the all existence in their hand?

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

Yeah, considering the Monitor ship also amps a person's size when they go to higher levels of existence, similarly to the way Boomtubes do. If you're wanting to downplay it all based on the fact Ultraman held it, that's like saying it can't even be 2-A by that same logic.

 

[Driger-God]

But the book is not high 2-A, he not exist in Monitor Sphere. Ultraman and Superman there not body in high dimensions, they need use the Thought Robot for access a high dimension.

 

[AndrewBennet]

According to Morrison himself Thoughtrobot and Mandrakk are threat to the entire DC fiction

Grant Morrison confirms Mandrakk is the Avatar of a DC Comics Editor, and that he can destroy DC fiction

http://www.cbr.com/grant-morrisons-superman-saga-pt-iii/

Superman has fought angles and dark gods before, but here he faces the end of existence. The end of his fictional realm at the hands of a cosmically-charged editor in the form of Mandrakk who would suck the life out of every character, every story.

 

[AndrewBennet]

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-LpBGWzIl...UT4xJUvD7sFz5tI6TzNSYQCHMYCw/s1600/RCO018.jpg

Mandrakk returned in recent issue

 

[Driger-God]

He can destroy Dc fiction, and he was defeated by fictional character, as Superman(Thought Robot, and other), inconsistent in a new level...

 

[Jared1111]

I mean, it's straight up stated that the only reason Superman won that fight was because his meta narrative, aka "How big Superman is in the real world" overcame Mandrakks influence. So it wasn't the fictional character that beat him, it was the real world spread of Superman popularity and impact that beat him. The "story" of Superman.

 

[Driger-God]

I disagree of you.
You can't mensure the characters in this line of thought.
In the story, Mandrakk showed himself as fictional character, he fight with Thought Robot, and he loser.
You ignore the story, and the level in this story, for your upgrade. The mention about Mandrakk being a representation of Editor is inconsistent with story.

Thought Robot is union of two opposites qualities (Superman and Ultraman). In this story, he become stronger than Mandrakk, during the combat, he surpass the Mandrakk many times, and it's impossible for a fictional character. As a character that i wrote surpass me? Ilogic...

 

[Antvasima]

@Driger

A representation of an editor (likely Dan Didio) is not the editor himself.

Anyway, the DC characters will most likely not be downgraded.

 

[Driger-God]

@Driger
A representation of an editor (likely Dan Didio) is not the editor himself.

Anyway, the DC characters will most likely not be downgraded.

I understand, but, not make sense, all representation in Hq/manga is not the author or editor himself. The representation in this case is inconsistent, the editor representation that theorically can destroye all Fiction in Dc Comics, was defeated for character fictional of multiverse, this i can't understand. You can understand me? He can destroy all, ok. But, why he not destroyed all at once? He fighted to lose?

 

[Antvasima]

It was just a story, and the author can't very well let the protagonists lose to the extent that their entire setting is permanently destroyed.

 

[Driger-God]

Undestand. But, i still think that Mandrakk should destroy all, as Pralaya. I read again.

"All Creation"/"Entire Multiverse" mentioned in the story is the Planetary of World.

That change something?

 

[Alonik]

Do not you think that Dax Novu being a writer is not a totally hyperbolic statement? He is the first monitor, next to its opposite, the anti monitor. And throughout his entire history and constant philosophy, he is just a character who tries to understand the multiverse with his technology. Even their technology serves for them to go through higher dimensions, which they really can not do without some kind of equipment.

And there's another point, the bleed is a 5D fluid, and it's said in Superman Beyond that the whole Creation/Multiverse was bottled up by it. Is the DC multiverse 5D or does it have a large inconsistency with the monitors sphere and the multiversity map.

 

[LukaSolosYourVerse]

The monitors and bleed being 5D is totally inconsistent with just about every other comic in DC that deals with problems on a scale like this, with "all planes of existence" usually being mentioned during most of them.

 

[Driger-God]

I never see the mention by Monitor with "All Planes of Existence". The Monitor are in their normal is representation relationed with Planetary of World(Multiverse), and the Bleed(5D).

And the 5D exist outside the multiverse in Countdown for Final Crisis.