The Elder Scrolls: Metaphysical Studies and Discussions - Lesson Two

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

Or "The Elder Scrolls Discussion Thread II" if you are boring.

Dreamsleeve VB-WS: Channel granted.ECMB-MAS: mnemonic aedron-capacitance memospore classification xD15JMo0JfiXcogitocode: The Sin of Restriction is the defying of Anuic convergence

"fk00-54bQ15"

ZERO-SUM VENTURE... RETURN FALSE... VERIFICATION 1

"f000-50bQ15"

FEXFEINT ENABLED... RETURN TRUE... VERIFICATION 8

"f000-000015"

WATERWORD WARD... RETURN TRUE... VERIFICATION 0

"0000-000000"

ACCESS GRANTED RELEASING MEMOSPORE

Lygosomatic Memospore directed to the Elder Council of Ut-Cyrod, in Truth, in Mastery, and in accordance to the Word.

Forgive the abrupt and doubtless distressing telepathic sending, my most honored Lords, but we of Temple Zero feel that these newest discoveries ought to be communicated at once. I speak for the Order as a whole in saying that this is a matter of utmost relevance.

Our eldest sorcerer-scryers, in their act of projecting their echoing Animus across the hyperagonal, endless depths of the Mundus, have found truly bewildering revelations regarding the Mythic Song and its contents. Strange alignments of confused serpentine-stars, dragons devouring their own tail in amnesia, and the very Bones of the Earth reverberating at the turning of the very Wheels of Heavens.

We humbly request that the mnemonic-encrypto documents attached to this recording be downloaded into material form, and brought to the attention of his majesty the Emperor and the Moth Priesthood, who must preserve these texts within their Akashakalpic Libraries.

This is no laughing matter, my honored Lords. The knowledge shared herein may change the face of Tamriel Prime forevermore. May Xarxes guide you in studying these words with the attention they deserve.

Mathieu of Schwarzwelt, Archmage-Arbitrator of Temple Zero Society

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

gonna post all of the txt since it seems the thread was not saved after the moved

Spoiler: Part 1

Ultima Reality

• By secret glyph: dreamsleeve transmissionDreamsleeve: urgent, security protocols grantedSecurity protocols: Sphinxmoth ancestor wraithbone wards
  Lygosomatic Memospore in answer to the Archmages of Temple Zero, in Truth, in Royalty, and in accordance to the Covenant.
  Greetings, honored Mathieu. This one speaks for the Elder Council of Empire-Actual, and informs you on the recent matters. This one tells you that we have received the echo-mnemic files attached to your Dreamsleeve sending, and have found it most fascinating. Even now, as I compose this recording, the Moth Priests pour their minds onto its decrypted mysteries. There is much debate in White-Gold, and this one believes that it'll be a while until Imperial Libraries become silent again.
  Though not all reception has been positive. There are some who scoff and mock at the revelations of your texts, dismissing them as the collective lunacy of a degraded order; whilst others simply find them incomprehensible and worthless drivel. This one if not among them, rather, he find the ideas of your writings rather interesting... Even if confusing, and a times reminiscent of the ramblings of a cat high on Moon Sugar... Nevertheless, this one has taken the liberty to file a copy of your texts to the Mane in Elsweyr. No doubt he'll be very interested in them.
  Expect to hear further messages from the Elder Council in the following weeks.
  The Ja'Khajiit, Former Mananaut and beholder of the Cat's Eye
  
  06:09, October 1, 2018
  
  
• 6 Kudos
  Monarch Laciel
  >Everything being said
  _______________________________
  >My head
  
  06:13, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  reply to #3
  Monarch Laciel wrote:
  >Everything being said
  _______________________________
  >My head
  "I can hear him now: what of Auriel's breaking? What of my twinned antecedent? What is the meaning of the endeavor that Artaeum refuses to admit? What, indeed, said the Thief to the Master that mostly knew."
  "For my part, I know my own first question: What do you want to hear first?"
  (... Okay, but seriously, this is just me and Ultima roleplaying).
  
  06:15, October 1, 2018
  
  
• CrimsonStarFallen
  So, how much work do you guys have left before the revision starts?
  
  09:07, October 1, 2018
  
  
• 5 Kudos
  Dragonmasterxyz
  ..............................................................Me reading this in a nutshell
  Ok but why tho-1
  
  Edited by Dragonmasterxyz 14:46, October 1, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  TISSG7Redgrave
  reply to #3
  Monarch Laciel wrote: >Everything being said
  _______________________________
  >My head
  me in a nutshell
  
  14:45, October 1, 2018
  
  
• 6 Kudos
  Saikou The Lewd King
  @Crimson You fool, this is the revisions being in the process of being made. You are just too foolish to understand speech of this level of existence.
  
  14:47, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Y'all are so void-minded you can't even comprehend the simple linguistics of a Dwemeri Children's Rhyme.
  For shame.
  
  14:48, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  I mean...
  It's not that hard to understand.
  
  14:51, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  Inmeant the first comment, not Dwemeri. I'll read that later.
  
  14:52, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Don't bother, the Dwemer Song is literally incomprehensible
  
  14:53, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  Is that a challenge?
  
  Because I will probably lose it.
  
  Edited by Ricsi-viragosi 14:54, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Setsuna tenma
  what tier will the dwemmer civilization be once the revision is done?
  
  15:00, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Numidium has 1-A Erasure.
  
  15:01, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Setsuna tenma
  so they will be the first tier 1A civ in the wiki
  
  15:02, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Well, no. The Numidium is an exceptional thing, and the Dwemer are normal people physically.
  
  15:31, October 1, 2018
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  Just really good at everything they do. Except existing.
  EDIT: Also, I hope they give us more Yagrum Bagarn in future games.
  
  Edited by A Stoned Orc 18:45, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Honestly, I think Yagrum is overrated. The Dwemer seen in ESO is much cooler in design.
  
  22:19, October 1, 2018
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  There's a Dwemer we see in ESO that isn't Yagrum?
  
  23:23, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Ultima Reality
  Yeah, you meet a Dwemer corpse strapped to a life-supporting machine in ESO
  
  23:27, October 1, 2018
  
  
• The Mysterious Stranger - Delta-
  Considering how Yagrum was deformed and bloated by corpus, I’m not suprised that there were Dwemer with better physiques and designs.
  Can’t really see the appeal for any of the designs in ESO either, but that’s just me.
  
  23:29, October 1, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  What do you mean, you think the game as a whole is ugly?
  
  04:54, October 2, 2018
  
  
• Setsuna tenma
  How does one attain CHIM in elder scroll?
  
  05:13, October 2, 2018
  
  
• Monarch Laciel
  you can't it's fanon that doesn't exist Vivec is just a guy pretending he's a god
  
  05:14, October 2, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Ultima Reality
  reply to #24
  Setsuna tenma wrote:
  How does one attain CHIM in elder scroll?
  https://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Matthew_Schroeder/The_Elder_Scrolls:_Metaphysics_%26_Philosophy#CHIM:_The_Secret_Syllable_of_Royalty
  
  09:52, October 2, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Yeah, it's simple really (Irony).
  
  15:18, October 2, 2018
  
  
• Cain Fastus
  How far into the 1A area?
  
  16:01, October 3, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Let me sleevestroke my concept-organ so that I can ponder that question
  Actually I'm not exactly sure.
  
  19:40, October 3, 2018
  
  
• The Mysterious Stranger - Delta-
  Well, not entirely. I do find some of the environments and settlements to be visually pleasing.
  
  I personally can’t stand many of the enemy designs, character models, and armor designs. Especially the armor designs... I felt like throwing up after I saw the Ordinator armor.
  
  22:10, October 4, 2018
  
  
• Self Love
  ESO has done a lot for the series, so I don't care much for armor design.
  
  22:31, October 4, 2018
  
  
• The Mysterious Stranger - Delta-
  Well, I do and I’ve criticized this MMO enough to cut my play through short.
  Any contributions that it added for the lore is hardly enough to justify my mediocre experience with it unfortunately.
  
  23:40, October 4, 2018
  
  
• 4 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  ESO is like a godsent in terms of lore.
  
  02:06, October 5, 2018
  
  
• The Mysterious Stranger - Delta-
  It’s hardly did much to entice me. Vivec losing his power early was rather stupid in my opinion.
  So, as I’ve stated. Not enough of a justification. Lore is nice for expanding upon the world and the series in general, but it doesn’t save a game from mediocrity. I have always enjoyed reading in-game text, but I did so while also enjoying the game’s narrative and world. If I don’t enjoy the game, why should I bother playing? I could simply read these written documents on the UESP.
  It’s musical score was rather dull in my opinion as well. Compared to the likes of Jeremy Soule, or even the charm of Arena and Daggerfall, it falls flat on its face.
  
  19:28, October 5, 2018
  
  
• Keeweed
  I don’t know why, but I really want an Elder Scrolls fighting game, I feel like it has everything required to make one.
  
  22:55, October 5, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  This thread needs to revive.
  
  20:57, November 20, 2018
  
  
• Keeweed
  So if I got this right
  • dragonborn AP: High 8-C superior to giants that can send people into the horizon and fragment large chunks of rock or 8-B for vaporizing dwerven centurion (I got the calc evulated but I probably should get more people to look at it) | High 6-A shoke the world | low 2-C defeated Alduin, who had the power to consume time and restart the next kalpa (or however you spell it)
  • Beginning game | middle game | end game
  • Did I get that right
  • (dots are the only way on mobile, at least for me, to keep sentences separate)
  
  Edited by Keeweed 21:24, November 20, 2018
  
  
• Steve Rogers1
  There's a problem with the High 6-A calc. It assumes that Nirn is a planet equivalent in size to Earth when this is clearly inaccurate. Nirn is it's own plane of reality. Shaking this reality would be more along the lines of High 3-A or Low 2-C .
  
  22:06, November 20, 2018
  
  
• 5 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  Talos according to a casual Elder Scrolls fan: Oh, the big viking god the Nords worship, who conquered Tamriel before ascending to godhood. The Thalmor banned his worship because they are racist and hate humans.
  Talos according to an Elder Scrolls lorebeard: Tal(OS) is the Many-Headed Oversoul of three separate Shezarrines - mortal incarnations of Lorkhan - who merged into one through an Enantiomorph and the usage of the Brass God Numidium. Talos became a god when he realized that existence was an illusion and attained CHIM, and in the process mantled Lorkhan. The Thalmor have banned his worship as the first step in a multi-layered plan to erase the concept of men from the multiverse.
  
  01:39, November 21, 2018
  
  
• Keeweed
  one thing I’ve always found funny about the elder scrolls is how almost every race is racist yet people only hate when nords do it. Dark elves in Skyrim complain about racism but literally everyone in Morrowind instantly hated you on sight for being an outsider even if you were a dark elf
  Outlander!
  
  Edited by Keeweed 01:46, November 21, 2018
  
  
• 2 Kudos
  Self Love
  Talos deserves a nice profile
  
  02:18, November 21, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  Breaking the Time God-0
  Amazing.
  
  Edited by Matthew Schroeder 16:37, November 22, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  https://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/Lorkhan
  
  03:43, November 23, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  https://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/Pelinal
  
  04:51, November 25, 2018
  
  
• Setsuna tenma
  reply to #44
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  https://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/Pelinal
  shouldn`t Penial have a High 3A key for erasing days and screwing with months
  
  04:52, November 25, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  A Stoned Orc
  Would one of you guys be willing to put together like a list of links/recommended reading, preferably starting with some of the more basic stuff before moving on into the deeper, Imperial Library/Michael Kirkbride stuff?
  
  20:39, December 1, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  https://bethesda.net/community/topic/13875/how-to-become-a-lore-buff
  Someone already has.
  
  20:40, December 1, 2018
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  arigato. some friends of mine were thinking of doing an RP guild on ESO, and after I started mentioning some of the stuff you guys have said here, they were interested in reading more into it.
  
  20:42, December 1, 2018
  
  
• BleedingPeach
  So... Does Talos really spank Reinhard's butt? I'm not talking about battles in the wikia but the fact that maybe Reinhard likes BDSM.
  
  23:07, December 5, 2018
  
  
• AshenCrow777
  Sooo is there going to be an upgrade or no? If so how high low 2-c again or not by that much
  
  Edited by AshenCrow777 11:10, December 6, 2018
  
  
• Jockey-1337
  For Khorne!
  
  22:04, December 6, 2018
  
  
• ChosenOrDeath
  Out of curiosity, which of the Daedric Princes are cool and which are assholes?
  
  22:26, December 6, 2018
  
  
• 5 Kudos
  DivineTedrius
  reply to #52
  ChosenOrDeath wrote:
  Out of curiosity, which of the Daedric Princes are cool and which are assholes?
  All of them and all of them.
  
  22:41, December 6, 2018
  
  
• 5 Kudos
  Ultima Reality
  All Princes are capable of both Good and Evil.
  Except Molag Bal he is an asshole.
  
  01:23, December 7, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Monarch Laciel
  But he gave us vampires
  
  02:15, December 7, 2018
  
  
• Jockey-1337
  reply to #54
  Ultima Reality wrote:
  All Princes are capable of both Good and Evil.
  Except Molag Bal he is an asshole.
  Even Mehrunes Dagon?
  
  02:40, December 7, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Even Dagon. Dagon's not necessarily evil, he's philosophically akin to Shiva. He destroys the old to bring the new, cleanses the old world so the new world can rise.
  
  02:48, December 7, 2018
  
  
• ChosenOrDeath
  Another question. Which Prince, according to lore, is the best to worship?
  
  03:02, December 7, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  Depends on who you are and what you're seeking to get from the prince.
  Meridia is probably the "safest" Prince to worship as long as you are not in any way remotely close to undead.
  
  03:27, December 7, 2018
  
  
• Monarch Laciel
  And yet Meridia has no problem giving you Dawnbreaker if you're a vampire... probably because you're likely to kill yourself with it.
  
  03:33, December 7, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  That's a result of how the game works and having to allow every player to be able to experience everything.
  
  03:34, December 7, 2018
  
  
• Monarch Laciel
  That
  And the explosion from Dawnbreaker hurts you if you're a vampire so maybe she's just like "**** it, they'll kill themselves with it eventually"
  
  03:51, December 7, 2018
  
  
• CryoTheMayo
  reply to #54
  Ultima Reality wrote:
  All Princes are capable of both Good and Evil.
  Except Molag Bal he is an asshole.
  I think Elder Scrolls Online is a pretty cool guy, eh harvests souls and doesn't afraid of anything
  
  Edited by CryoTheMayo 10:48, December 7, 2018
  
  
• DivineTedrius
  reply to #54
  Ultima Reality wrote:
  All Princes are capable of both Good and Evil.
  Except Molag Bal he is an asshole.
  At least he saves your life in Oblivion tho.
  
  11:56, December 7, 2018
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  I mean, even Molag Bal supposedly had a secondary motive of protecting reality from "even greater threats" or something like that, when he invaded Tamriel in ESO.
  
  Edited by A Stoned Orc 01:49, December 8, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Joke: Making a profile for the Dovahkiin or Alduin
  Woke: Making profiles for these dragons you never heard of
  
  03:15, December 8, 2018
  
  
• ZacharyGrossman273
  Shouldn't those guys have causality manipulation?
  
  03:16, December 8, 2018
  
  
• Setsuna tenma
  time manipulation is not linked and there is not gender tag in the profile
  
  03:16, December 8, 2018
  
  
• ZacharyGrossman273
  reply to #58
  ChosenOrDeath wrote:
  Another question. Which Prince, according to lore, is the best to worship?
  Obviously Sheogorath
  
  03:17, December 8, 2018
  
  
• 2 Kudos
  Crabwhale
  Matt, remember our little chat about Ancano?
  I'm never going to Sovngarde for this.
  
  16:21, December 9, 2018
  
  
• ChosenOrDeath
  Ok.Thanks for answering my questions. What are the Thalmor actually after? And what are the pros and cons of worshiping each Daedric Prince?
  
  22:43, December 10, 2018
  
  
• Crabwhale
  The Thalmor want to deactivate the Towers across the Mundus so that it may be swallowed by Oblivion (as the Towers keep it at bay) and for all things to return to the formless and timeless state of the Dawn Era.
  As for your second question, Jesus, that'd be a long ass reply. And sort of subjective as well, given that everyone might view the Princes differently.
  
  22:46, December 10, 2018
  
  
• ChosenOrDeath
  Wait, what!? Why?
  
  22:49, December 10, 2018
  
  
• Crabwhale
  Because they've always seen being bound to a mortal form as a downgrade wrought upon them unjustly. Which is also why Lorkhan is usually portrayed unkindly in their religions.
  
  22:51, December 10, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Ultima Reality
  

  “

  To kill Man is to reach Heaven, from where we came before the Doom Drum's iniquity. When we accomplish this, we can escape the mockery and long shame of the Material Prison. To achieve this goal, we must: 1) Erase the Upstart Talos from the mythic. His presence fortifies the Wheel of the Convention, and binds our souls to this plane. 2) Remove Man not just from the world, but from the Pattern of Possibility, so that the very idea of them can be forgotten and thereby never again repeated. 3) With Talos and the Sons of Talos removed, the Dragon will become ours to unbind. The world of mortals will be over. The Dragon will uncoil his hold on the stagnancy of linear time and move as Free Serpent again, moving through the Aether without measure or burden, spilling time along the innumerable roads we once travelled. And with that we will regain the mantle of the imperishable spirit.

  „

  
  22:52, December 10, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  https://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/Dagoth_Ur
  
  01:10, December 13, 2018
  
  
• 2 Kudos
  Mefre
  CHIM is just the poor man's Console Commands.
  Literal gods < Me playing oblivion on my PC.
  
  08:11, December 13, 2018
  
  
• Self Love
  This should be the new verse wallpaper
  
  19:13, December 13, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  I mean it's good but it doesn't capture the Heart of the Verse.
  
  19:20, December 13, 2018
  
  
• Keeweed
  Hey is there any speed feats for average mortals or are they going to be stuck being subsonic (I mean it’s better than Peak Human Vivec but people like the Dragonborn and Eternal Champion being subsonic feels agonizingly slow)
  
  19:36, December 13, 2018
  
  
• Self Love
  Aesthetics >
  In Tamriel? 🗸
  Has Mundus and the two moons in the background? 🗸
  Random people 🗸 (Good to not show favoritism of specific characters)
  I'd say it's way better.
  
  19:40, December 13, 2018
  
  
• 2 Kudos
  Ultima Reality
  TES' crazy cosmology makes the Speed Feats vary a lot, really, either you are Subsonic to Massively Hypersonic or you are Immeasurable. There is no middle ground.
  
  19:47, December 13, 2018
  
  
• Mefre
  The speed feat of the gods are pretty good being immeasurable and all, but is it faster than a khajit on skooma?
  But yeah the speed feats in TES are either decent or the flash on steroids, We might eventualy be able to get other speeds feats as the verse is explored, but for now we don't have any real balance/ middle ground at all on it.
  
  Edited by Mefre 20:54, December 13, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  DivineTedrius
  Feels similarly weird with the tiers. You have High 6-A suddenly jumping to High 4-C and then Low 2-C.
  
  21:01, December 13, 2018
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  There are a few 4-As too.
  
  21:35, December 13, 2018
  
  
• DivineTedrius
  reply to #85
  Who? I don't think i've seen any 4-A profiles yet.
  
  22:54, December 13, 2018
  
  
• Crabwhale
  Another interesting parallel I found: the Dragonborn being a possible Shezarrine while simultaneously technically spawned from Akatosh (being that he has a dragon's soul and all).
  
  18:03, December 14, 2018
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  The only other time this happened was with Tiber Septim.
  
  18:41, December 14, 2018
  
  
• Self Love
  I feel Vivec should have Weapon Mastery added to his powers & abilities
  Hax aside, he has impressive fighting ability due to his relation with Fa-Nuit-Hen and the like, it'd be wrong to ignore that.
  Maybe explaining his connection to the Barons and the ansu, alongside the latter's capabilities?
  Some scans from his sword meeting with Cyrus could help
  
  18:28, January 25, 2019
  
  
• 2 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Thread:2735288#3
  I explained Mehrunes Dagon here.
  
  14:56, February 23, 2019
  
  
• Keeweed
  Hey Matt is there a blog or thread about what all the Daedric Artifacts do lore wise. I know what Mehrunes Razor does because of that thread I made earlier, and I mostly know the skeleton key and the Wabbajack, but is there something explaining all the other artifacts?
  
  Edited by Keeweed 15:04, February 23, 2019
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  reply to #75
  Ultima Reality wrote:
  

  “

  3) With Talos and the Sons of Talos removed, the Dragon will become ours to unbind. The world of mortals will be over. The Dragon will uncoil his hold on the stagnancy of linear time and move as Free Serpent again, moving through the Aether without measure or burden, spilling time along the innumerable roads we once travelled. And with that we will regain the mantle of the imperishable spirit.

  „

  So, if Alduin won...RIP the Thalmor/the Thalmor's plan, right?
  
  19:49, February 23, 2019
  
  
• 2 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  The death of Alduin and the end of the Kalpic Cycle has VERY long-lasting consequences.
  
  20:33, February 23, 2019
  
  
• BleedingPeach
  I'm sorry but Talos is love. Those imperials are a bunch of jerks
  
  14:26, February 24, 2019
  
  
• 2 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  Talos was an asshole
  
  14:40, February 24, 2019
  
  
• This reply has been removed
• 2 Kudos
  A Stoned Orc
  Talos was an asshole.
  Now he's basically Thor and Jesus all in one.
  
  18:25, February 24, 2019
  
  
• BleedingPeach
  reply to #95
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  Talos was an asshole
  How does Whitestrake get here? There are questions that should not be answered
  
  15:05, February 25, 2019
  
  
• 6 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  Talos is the guy who betrayed his own King, killing him and making it appear like he was innocent so he could take the Throne, and then later betrayed and manipulated his two closest allies so he could capture their souls and use them to further his war efforts.
  Talos is also the guy who after invading and conquering Hammerfell used violent authority to oppress all rebellion and force the Redguards to conform to his new rule. He also had a sexual relationship with a Dunmer Queen, and when he found she was pregnant with his child he forced her to have an abortion because he didn't want to marry a non-human.
  Talos is also the guy who unleashed a giant Reality-Erasing Robot on Alinor and throughly massacrated the Altmer forces so badly the Aldmeri Dominion surrendered after one hour of conflict. This is practically the equivalent of responding to a war effort by throwing a nuclear bomb at the opposing country's capital.
  Talos also made use of state-enforced propaganda to seed prejudice and racism between humans and elves so the people of his Empire would be against the Altmer, and he also used propaganda to hide his own past and make himself look perfect and heroic.
  Oh, and there was also the time where Talos got rid of a rebel pirate by decapitating him and then doing some ventriloquism with his disembowed head, a jest he found so funny he ended up laughing out loud in Thu'um which killed all the people witnessing the act.
  I didn't make any of this.
  
  15:17, February 25, 2019
  
  
• BleedingPeach
  Let's see: I DON'T LIKE Reinhard because he is a nazi. After reading all what you said about Talos... I think Reinhard would be like "woah woah woah woah, kumpel! ("buddy" in german) I think you are going a little bit far"
  
  15:40, February 25, 2019
  
  
• Ogbunabali
  Don't believe this damn elf lies. They spread heretical propaganda about the mighty Talos Stormcrown born of the north where his breath is long winter. He conquered Tamriel because he loves man..
  
  15:45, February 25, 2019
  
  
• Setsuna tenma
  wait talos is not a virgin.
  
  15:46, February 25, 2019
  
  
• 3 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/The_Hist
  Ey.
  
  16:02, February 25, 2019
  
  
• Mefre
  Who would win?
  The Hist
  Or 15 octillion composite trees?
  
  18:04, February 25, 2019
  
  
• Crabwhale
  Fool.
  Thinking even a single Composite Tree would need to use even a hint of it's true power...
  
  18:06, February 25, 2019
  
  
• Self Love
  Talos having a dark sense of humor? +1
  
  20:46, February 25, 2019
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  
  We have a new Loremaster.
  
  20:25, March 6, 2019
  
  
• Ogbunabali
  I'm not familiar with him, although he did write Clockwork City so we should be in decent hands.
  
  20:29, March 6, 2019
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  He wrote this:
  The Elder Scrolls Online Clockwork City - Final Sotha Sil Dialogue
  
  20:31, March 6, 2019
  
  
• Ogbunabali
  It definitively reminds of Sotha Sil's Last Words, that's a good thing, he was a little too talkative than I would've liked tho.
  
  20:36, March 6, 2019
  
  
• Self Love
  Thank god. I was hoping it would be him
  
  23:27, March 6, 2019
  
  
• KongKing23
  I am still dreaming MK will return or play a significant role someday.
  
  02:58, March 7, 2019
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Keeweed
  Hey is there someone that can explain to me some of the skill feats for the Elder Scrolls protagonist. Some of the feats I think are perfectly fine like defeating most of the ALMSIVI, however Alexandria completely lost her mind so I don’t know how much of a skill feat that would be. And the CoC defeating Umaril is a good skill feat. But then when have things like the Dragonborn “fighting” Tsun. I’m pretty sure he wasn’t really trying, he says he was testing your Might just to see if you could pass a bridge (if you try to pass that bridge Tsun or Shor can instantly one shot you with a random lightning bolt so it doesn’t make since for the Dovahkiin to be comparable to him when he can wipe you off the map with a thought).
  Many times the main characters are also physically powerful, which leads to things like the CoC and Dragonborn fighting Boethiah’s Champions, but the CoC was 4-C and the Dragonborn was 7-B so they just causally one shot everything and went on with there days. Like what skill feats does the Ebony Warrior have of he’s the strongest person the Dragonborn ever fights, shouldn’t he have one shot literally everything he ever ran across making all his adventures worthless (I mean a low 2-C vs 9 9-B bandits, I wonder why the low 2-C won). Now maybe these feats are better than I think they are, but ganging up on people and abusing their weaknesses seems to be an incredible common thing in Skyrim especially. Vs Alduin you gang up on him and spam dragonrend, vs Harkon the bow one shots a shield that’s vastly stronger than Harkon’s durability so I assume you one shot him with it aswell (he’s also high 6-A so he one shot anything he ever came across and thus has no skill feats). Vs Mercer you one shot by being 7-B and ganged up on him with a Daedric Prince also helping you out. Vs Miraak he had to power up repeatedly throughout the fight yet kept losing repeatedly meaning the Dragonborn was probably vastly above him from the beginning of that fight, he also had a Daedric Prince help him (and don’t say Mora didn’t help, he literally killed Miraak, if that doesn’t count as help I don’t know what does).
  Now once again maybe all these feats are a lot better than I think, but to me it seems there are many ways that don’t revolve around skill as ways to win the fights the heroes have been through. (Expect for the Nerevarine because Hircine pretty much said and shown you’re skilled, and ESO pretty much drools itself when talking about the Vestige “he’s so skilled that a nigh omniscient god remembered the greatest warriors of all time due to his skill” like Jesus ESO; ironically the Vestige’s best skill feats don’t make any sense, like Nocturnal had a 99% chance of wining so the Vestige couldn’t have won through skill and pretty much got carried by prisoner cosmology that whole time).
  Sorry for the long text, but skill feats in the Elder Scrolls have always felt lacking to me and I wish someone could explain them.
  
  Edited by Keeweed 10:57, March 23, 2019
  
  
• 8 Kudos
  Mefre
  Played Skyrim yesterday, but unfortunatly I was overcome with grief when I got a letter of inheritence from my best friend "Bandit Thug" who was decleared dead and left me 200 gold, I don't think I'll be able to play skyrim for a while now without crying.
  
  Edited by Mefre 12:25, March 23, 2019
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  Couldn't Vivec or Sotha Sil forcibly manifest themselves in the Fourth Era or beyond, despite being depowered/dead by that era?
  
  Edited by A Stoned Orc 03:27, April 1, 2019
  
  
• Self Love
  Greymoor
  
  22:26, January 16, 2020
  
  
• Ogbunabali
  >Vampire lore
  Though not a huge fan, maybe we'll finally get some regen feats for vampires in TES.
  
  22:31, January 16, 2020
  
  
• KongKing23
  Common vampires are as fast as Quicksilver. This new lore confirms that speedsters exist in TES.
  
  Edited by KongKing23 01:20, January 17, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  >As fast as Quicksilver
  Dafuq you're talking about, that was just some vague subsonic speed.
  
  03:35, January 17, 2020
  
  
• AshenCrow777
  I highly doubt common vamps are anywhere near QS speed.
  
  03:41, January 17, 2020
  
  
• Steve Rogers1
  Subsonic isn't bad, but it's nothing substantial.
  
  03:44, January 17, 2020
  
  
• AshenCrow777
  Anyways if I was as rich as Elon musk I would have funded an Elder scroll movie feels like every other gaming company have at least one movie base on their games or a serie, show ESO more love damn it.
  
  03:48, January 17, 2020
  
  
• Crabwhale
  Movie would suck or be mediocre, such is their curse.
  
  06:46, January 17, 2020
  
  
• KongKing23
  reply to #119
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  >As fast as Quicksilver
  Dafuq you're talking about, that was just some vague subsonic speed.
  MCU Quicksilver. Almost on such level
  
  Edited by KongKing23 07:11, January 17, 2020
  
  
• AshenCrow777
  reply to #123
  Crabwhale wrote: Movie would suck or be mediocre, such is their curse.
  I'm talking more specifically about zenimax doing the script and writing themselves and let studio Blur (the ones that animates all ESO cinematic trailers) to do the movies.
  Theres no reason why it wouldn't work they could literally retell the story of ESO with the play protagonists (thief, warrior nord and altmer mage) from their different perspective of the events.
  I mean all 3 of them seem to be doing their own epic thing.
  
  10:28, January 17, 2020
  
  
• Crabwhale
  I was joking.
  
  12:29, January 17, 2020
  
  
• AshenCrow777
  Okok
  
  19:54, January 17, 2020
  
  
• This reply has been removed
• Steve Rogers1
  Content does not exist
  
  16:14, January 18, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  Shouldn't Pelinal have Conceptual Manipulation *and* Time Manipulation for cutting apart the metaphysical concept of a particular elvish month?
  
  10:19, January 23, 2020
  
  
• Shmoopbo
  I wonder if we will ever get a page for Jubal or MEMORY, that would be pretty neat.
  
  09:11, January 24, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  This place are so silence , btw this thread has working like other discussion thread ?
  
  16:55, August 2, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  Thread revival
  
  10:15, August 3, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Wouldn't mind having an ongoing TES thread.
  
  02:05, August 4, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #134
  Matthew Schroeder wrote: Wouldn't mind having an ongoing TES thread.
  It would be quite nice tbh
  
  02:11, August 4, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  Yes, please. I have so many questions.
  
  03:05, August 4, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Like what.
  
  16:13, August 4, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  Kinda curious how high into 1-A+ are the CHIM users
  
  16:26, August 4, 2020
  
  
• Amelia Lonelyheart
  Off topic, but remember when we where gonna downgrade the Daedric Princes to Low 2-C?
  
  22:53, August 4, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #139
  Amelia Lonelyheart wrote: Off topic, but remember when we where gonna downgrade the Daedric Princes to Low 2-C?
  Damn thats crazy, was it using the old system?
  
  22:55, August 4, 2020
  
  
• Keeweed
  reply to #139
  Amelia Lonelyheart wrote: Off topic, but remember when we where gonna downgrade the Daedric Princes to Low 2-C?
  Akatosh used to be considered the weakest 2-A on the site. And he was going to get downgraded to unknown.
  
  23:03, August 4, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  Wernt they low 1-C at the start?
  
  23:05, August 4, 2020
  
  
• Keeweed
  reply to #142
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote: Wernt they low 1-C at the start?
  As far as I’m aware only Sithis was low 1-C
  
  23:07, August 4, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #143
  Keeweed wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote: Wernt they low 1-C at the start?
  As far as I’m aware only Sithis was low 1-C
  Damn it must have been a while before i joined then cus the fisrt time i came here they were low 1-C
  
  23:08, August 4, 2020
  
  
• Keeweed
  I just got home from work. After I take a shower I’ll find the thread that was going to downgrade all the gods to unknown (like some were original 2-B and they were thought to be vastly less than that).
  
  Edited by Keeweed 23:11, August 4, 2020
  
  
• Keeweed
  Also lets not forgot that Vivec used to be low 6-B and was peak human in speed.
  
  23:12, August 4, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  F.
  
  23:18, August 4, 2020
  
  
• 4 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  Me: I would love to have an ongoing TES discussion thread.
  Person: Yes please I have so many questions!
  Me: Shoot, like what?
  Person: How strong is this guy?
  Me:
  
  03:05, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Amelia Lonelyheart
  God the Swamp Thing emote is the best thing we've done in awhile.
  As for questions, what's with the computer thing in the OP? Are there actual computers with that kinda stuff in the world?
  Also as an amusing aside, I was listening to Yellow Submarine again and they have an ocean made of time, made me think of TES.
  
  03:09, August 5, 2020
  
  
• 3 Kudos
  Matthew Schroeder
  reply to #149
  Amelia Lonelyheart wrote:
  As for questions, what's with the computer thing in the OP? Are there actual computers with that kinda stuff in the world?
  Short Answer: Magic Internet Email System.
  Long Answer: ...
  So there's this thing called the "Dreamsleeve" that is one of the vaguest and most obscure pieces of lore in the Elder Scrolls, so much so that it's almost never really defined in-depth. At least not directly.
  From what we do understand, though, the Dreamsleeve is an infinite "plane" of pure information and thought, existing in the deepest level of the Amaranth's Dream, essentially being the Godhead's own mindscape, the pure data from which the universe is structured.
  The Dreamsleeve is ALSO referred as the place to which souls wander after deaths, where all the memories and experiences that composed their last life are decomposed and recycled into pure energy, reducing the soul to its essential core so that it may become fresh for reincarnation.
  AND FOR SOME REASON the Dreamsleeve is also referred as a mental plane that particularly capable and attuned mages can reach into through heightened awareness. While reaching into the Dreamsleeve these mages can them convert messages (Be them texts, images, audio or "video" recordings) into raw data "upload" them to the plane as little things called "Memospores". They then can send forth ecrypted versions of these Memospores through the Dreamsleevee so that other mages can receive them, decrypt them with something called a "Cogitocode" and download the Memospore to see what it contains. If the encryption and decryption process isn't correctly executed the message can not only become garbled gibberish, but viewing it can actually bring damage to the mind of the downloading mage.
  TL;DR: The Dreamsleeve is an deep, infinite plane of pure information and thought where everything, even souls, are reduced to raw, basest data. Powerful mages can reach into their mindscape to send encrypted magic-emails with attached mnemic-files to other mages, who can them receive these emails, decrypted them, and see the messages they contain.
  
  03:27, August 5, 2020
  
  
• BleedingPeach
  Actually... when we talk about AEs, do we talk about totalities made up by someone who can achive CHIM or those are just fragments of ANU's dream?
  
  03:36, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  I don't understand your question.
  
  03:37, August 5, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #148
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  Me: I would love to have an ongoing TES discussion thread.
  Person: Yes please I have so many questions!
  Me: Shoot, like what?
  Person: How strong is this guy?
  Me:
  Hey cant blame me for my curiousity (not mentioning vswiki)
  
  03:39, August 5, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  also do we ever get the revelation of what was the core of the mountain?
  
  03:46, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Keeweed
  I’m kinda wondering how prisoners work. What a prisoner does/is has been really getting muddled recently in TES threads.
  Also I’m super curious on the abilities all daedric artifacts have. For example in game Mehrunes Razor is just death hax, but in lore it can do a crap ton of stuff according to Mankar Camoran’s profile.
  
  03:47, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  What mountain?
  
  03:47, August 5, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #156
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  What mountain?
  throat of the world
  
  03:50, August 5, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Amelia Lonelyheart
  @Matt.
  Interesting, sounds like a weird metaphor for game development, or something. Apparently a lot of TES lore is metaphorical for game mechanics so I wouldn't be to surprised if it was.
  Also, what are the cosmology sources on the higher-D planets? Is it from the Sermons of Vivec? Also, where could I read more about the Dwemer? I find their history pretty fascinating.
  
  03:53, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  @Amelia
  I'm not so sure on it being a metaphor for game development, honestly don't see the connection. Interesting take.
  As for the assertion that a lot of TES Lore being allegorical for Game Mechanics, that mainly comes from a decade-old post called "The Metaphysics of Morrowind" that concludes that CHIM is Console Commands / Modding the Game" and show various points in the 36 Lessons of Vivec where cheeky references to game mechanics are made. The article is actually very interesting and a good read but it's not the only interpretation of CHIM and certainly not the one Michael Kirkbride was going for when he was developing all the Thelema-inspired Mythos.
  Second, the source from Higher-Dimensional Planets comes from a 1998 Text simply titled Cosmology:
  https://www.imperial-library.info/content/cosmology
  It's backed up by other sources, of course, but this is where the whole Infinity Lore started.
  As for reading about the Dwemer, **** mate, there's a lot of places to go. Lots of in-universe books. I'm sure some Lore Podcast with sources has stuff on them.
  Also there are levels of Dwemer Lore to learn. It's one thing to talk about their general culture and technology and it's another thing to talk about Creational Subgradience and Tonal Architecture.
  
  04:02, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  reply to #157
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  throat of the world
  We don't know what the Stone of Snow-Throat is. There are several really cool theories, such as the Kalpic Cycle itself being the Stone, or Paarthurnax being the Stone, etc. We do know that the Stone is "A Cave", specifically in reference to Plato's Cave, so maybe the Stone of Snow-Throat is the constant state of Mundus as an illusion.
  There is one Lorebook, "Ysmir the Forefather", which mentions a "stone" that can take a mortal man to Aetherius and some interpret this to be the Snow Throat Stone.
  
  04:22, August 5, 2020
  
  
• MagiSinbad
  so i have a question : Do we have any piece of lore tell the story of Lorkhan interact with the mortals ? Back to the time before the Aedras yeeted his heart to the sea of Nirn. I'm just curious how does this trickster god interact with the mortal world, which originally was his idea.
  Or any story that could tell us about his personality.
  
  Edited by MagiSinbad 04:26, August 5, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #160
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  throat of the world
  We don't know what the Stone of Snow-Throat is. There are several really cool theories, such as the Kalpic Cycle itself being the Stone, or Paarthurnax being the Stone, etc. We do know that the Stone is "A Cave", specifically in reference to Plato's Cave, so maybe the Stone of Snow-Throat is the constant state of Mundus as an illusion.
  There is one Lorebook, "Ysmir the Forefather", which mentions a "stone" that can take a mortal man to Aetherius and some interpret this to be the Snow Throat Stone.
  ineresting i was thinking that in C0DA it might had been revealed
  
  04:48, August 5, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  I also have a question--largely regarding Pelinal. Seeing as he was incarnated in the time of the Dragons and all that, shouldn't he have the power of the Voice, too? Like, what's all missing on his profile?
  
  05:50, August 5, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  pelinal is not a dragonborn and for all i have read he never studied the voice
  
  06:10, August 5, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  @Matt can i ask ur permision to bring back the profiles of these characters and give them an update?
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Almalexia
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Azura
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Clavicus_Vile
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Malacath
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Mehrunes_Dagon
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Mephala
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Molag_Bal
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Namira
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Peryite
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Sanguine
  
  10:55, August 5, 2020
  
  
• MagiSinbad
  reply to #163
  if Mehrune Dagon's profile get ressurected, a High 1-B match between him and Khorne would be lit (Unless one of them completely outclass the other...)
  
  Edited by MagiSinbad 11:19, August 5, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  TOAAPRESENCE1
  Yes. If possible I would like to have those profiles back and clean/update them
  
  11:46, August 5, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Lapsad
  If the hopeless section come true , the match agaisnt chaos gods would be start
  Khorne vs Dagon
  Tzeentch vs Mora
  Nurgel vs Peryite
  
  12:07, August 5, 2020
  
  
• MagiSinbad
  Shouldnt Nurgle fight Namira ?
  And i suppose Slaanesh could fight Molag Bal or Sanguine or Mephala
  
  Edited by MagiSinbad 12:21, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Btw , Dagon has fought against alduin in previous kalph , we should make a new key for him
  
  12:57, August 5, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #170
  Lapsad wrote: Btw , Dagon has fought against alduin in previous kalph , we should make a new key for him
  That was the leper king not dagon (yes i know are the same but at that time he was just a daedra and. Ot a prince)
  
  13:06, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Yes , so it would be nice thing , if we make that real
  
  13:44, August 5, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  reply to #164
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  pelinal is not a dragonborn and for all i have read he never studied the voice
  He's also heavily associated with Kyne, who gave the power of the Voice to humanity, and he existed during the Dragon War...
  
  15:04, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Zhepar
  stupid question, but why i think the bretons are a far weaker and uninteresting race compared to the others, like the argonians that have a connection with a hive mind tree and were capable of invading deadlands during oblivion crisis or the nords and redguard that can bend reality via voice or the way of the sword
  
  Edited by Zhepar 17:50, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  Not sure if only nords being able to use the voice was confirmed. Well, obviously non-nords could potentially learn to use the voice like the dwemer, but even without that I don't think it's unreasonably to say a Breton (or a red guard like the ebony warrior, for the matter) could learn it as well.
  
  
  Still, Bretons as a race are only the outcome of the elves being pillaged and such, so obviously they have less roots than the other races.
  
  17:52, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Zhepar
  i think a Breton could learn the voice, but i see your point about the roots, what i am saying is that we dont hear a lot about breton story and point of view about things, even the most powerfull breton i can remember i think its gabrielle benelle from ESO
  
  Edited by Zhepar 17:55, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  A question about Khajiit, are they related to the woodelves?
  The woodelves have their whole code (never hurt plants, eat all of your slain enemies, etc.) specifically to allow them to retain their humanoid shape, or else they would become constantly morphing from one animal form to another.
  Khajiit have one form that is explicitly a lookalike to woodelves (except they have face... tattoos, paintings? Can't remember.), and their other forms are various levels of cat.
  
  17:55, August 5, 2020
  
  
• Ogbunabali
  Khajiit aren't related to bosmer, biologically at least if that's the question. They aren't considered mer or men, they're beastfolk like the imga. Although there have been thories that say they're actually elves altmer are just shaved khajiit<\s> though not much more than that.
  Also anyone could learn the thu'um, but nords have an affinity to it and used to have a whole culture because of Kyne and all.
  
  22:53, August 5, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #173
  A Stoned Orc wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  pelinal is not a dragonborn and for all i have read he never studied the voice
  He's also heavily associated with Kyne, who gave the power of the Voice to humanity, and he existed during the Dragon War...
  If i remember my lore well the reason was cus lorkan and her were married
  
  00:29, August 6, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  How do you thing , if sought to ask a stupid question , we can have a new key for padomay ? , also it's look so wierd but did't both of them have a same metaphor in the book of annuad ? , even ANU are really exist but why padoamy were't too ?
  
  05:50, August 6, 2020
  
  
• KongKing23
  Profiles for the Daedric Princes need to be finished at the highest priority. Divayth Fyr needs to be High 1-B as well.
  
  Edited by KongKing23 07:16, August 7, 2020
  
  
• Antvasima
  Well, we cannot force Matthew and Ultima to get the time and energy to handle it.
  
  08:15, August 7, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #182
  Antvasima wrote: Well, we cannot force Matthew and Ultima to get the time and energy to handle it.
  I mean....thats why i am asking to do it....
  
  08:56, August 7, 2020
  
  
• Stillwinston
  Gotta say on a whim I reinstalled Skyrim yesterday, looking at this wiki and knowing how powerful the Dovah gets now I find I appreciate the story more knowing that punching Alduin is a tier 2 feat lol
  
  09:27, August 7, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  I personally find it a but silly and immersion breaking for the lore to go out of its way to go against any and all gameplay.
  If they lack the technology to make characters perform certain things, saying they can destroy entire universes and then forcing you to play like a 9-B gets annoying quick. I prefer stories to be told in a way you can, not in a way you would want to.
  
  Same with that one wizard you meet in the dragonborn DLC. He was alive since the Nerevarine and before that, and supposedly looks down on you even as the arch-mage, and yet he downright states that dwarven animunculi and hunting for Briarhearts is a dangerous thing that he prefers not to do. And him being awfully arrogant is fine, but he isn't, and I'm supposed to take the fact that he is one of the strongest mages in the world.
  
  11:00, August 7, 2020
  
  
• Keeweed
  Hey I’m kinda wondering is nocturnal or jyggalag the strongest daedric prince? I’ve remember in Oblivion Jyggalag is constantly stated to be the strongest Daedric Prince, but I also remember there was something Nocturnal did that actually makes her stronger. I’m just curious because I find it weird that Jyggalag is stated like 8 times to be the strongest but apparently Nocturnal is stronger.
  
  13:21, August 7, 2020
  
  
• MagiSinbad
  reply to #185
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote:
  I personally find it a but silly and immersion breaking for the lore to go out of its way to go against any and all gameplay.
  If they lack the technology to make characters perform certain things, saying they can destroy entire universes and then forcing you to play like a 9-B gets annoying quick. I prefer stories to be told in a way you can, not in a way you would want to.
  i find it's somewhat forgivable. Surely Bethesda aim to creates a good game that get the player immerse in the world of Skyrim, not flexing the divine powers of Aedra and Daedra. And the game is targetes the players who also have zero ideas about the lore, so they dont care about the powerful things like Alduin eat the timelines or stuffs like that.
  Beside, we have mods, if we want to go full godly then there are mods for that. There's alway a mod to fix Skyrim to however we like.
  
  Edited by MagiSinbad 13:57, August 7, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  Yeah, but I feel like story and game are two things that should be connected in an open world game. Its not like every prisoner has to one-up the last, they could have just embraced how big of a downgrade the Rend Dragon is for Alduin so that he becomes immensely weak, and say that dragons are not as strong as they would normally be because they just now rose from eons without a physical body.
  
  14:00, August 7, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #186
  Keeweed wrote: Hey I’m kinda wondering is nocturnal or jyggalag the strongest daedric prince? I’ve remember in Oblivion Jyggalag is constantly stated to be the strongest Daedric Prince, but I also remember there was something Nocturnal did that actually makes her stronger. I’m just curious because I find it weird that Jyggalag is stated like 8 times to be the strongest but apparently Nocturnal is stronger.
  I'm pretty sure Jyggalag at his peak should have been capable of defeating her just fine.
  Without a daedric plane that we know off and completely separate from Shaegorath though? IDK.
  
  14:01, August 7, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #186
  Keeweed wrote: Hey I’m kinda wondering is nocturnal or jyggalag the strongest daedric prince? I’ve remember in Oblivion Jyggalag is constantly stated to be the strongest Daedric Prince, but I also remember there was something Nocturnal did that actually makes her stronger. I’m just curious because I find it weird that Jyggalag is stated like 8 times to be the strongest but apparently Nocturnal is stronger.
  She is strong no doubts about that, however i believe jyggalag is stronger especially when one considers that all the other princes had to join to stop him from keep expanding his realm and taking more and more parts of oblivion
  
  15:10, August 7, 2020
  
  
• KongKing23
  reply to #185
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote:
  I personally find it a but silly and immersion breaking for the lore to go out of its way to go against any and all gameplay.
  If they lack the technology to make characters perform certain things, saying they can destroy entire universes and then forcing you to play like a 9-B gets annoying quick. I prefer stories to be told in a way you can, not in a way you would want to.
  
  Same with that one wizard you meet in the dragonborn DLC. He was alive since the Nerevarine and before that, and supposedly looks down on you even as the arch-mage, and yet he downright states that dwarven animunculi and hunting for Briarhearts is a dangerous thing that he prefers not to do. And him being awfully arrogant is fine, but he isn't, and I'm supposed to take the fact that he is one of the strongest mages in the world.
  Neloth resisted the effects of Bend Will, while the Dovahkiin didn't at first. That's the indication why Matthew gave him Low 2-C.
  
  01:14, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  reply to #191
  KongKing23 wrote:
  He didn't resist Bend Will. He resisted a spell that only has a feat of mindhaxing hundreds of people.
  
  01:40, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  reply to #190
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  Our profile clearly stated that Nocturnal is the strongest Daedric Prince, who can strong armed every other Daedric Princes to follow her command, while the only reason why the Daedric Princes ally themselves with one another to defeat Jyggalag is because Jyggalag was messing with their territories. It's like a single country that attacked fifteen other neighbouring countries. It's a natural reaction for the fifteen countries to create an alliance against the single country, but that doesn't necessarily mean that that single country is the strongest.
  
  Edited by Waria Kambang 03:20, August 9, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #193
  Waria Kambang wrote:
  Our profile clearly stated that Nocturnal is the strongest Daedric Prince, who can strong armed every other Daedric Princes to follow her command, while the only reason why the Daedric Princes ally themselves with one another to defeat Jyggalag is because Jyggalag was messing with their territories. It's like a single country that attack fifteen other neighbouring countries. It's a natural reaction for the fifteen countries to create an alliance against the single country, but that doesn't necessarily mean that that single country is the strongest.
  I am pretty sure that it specifically was a problem because he was the strongest, and that his abilities were quiet a contradiction to the chaotic nature of the other Oblivion Planes.
  Plus, as Shaegorath, he did pretty much outwit and "defeat" them in some fights they had, though they were not really straight up one on one.
  
  08:59, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #192
  Waria Kambang wrote:
  He didn't resist Bend Will. He resisted a spell that only has a feat of mindhaxing hundreds of people.
  I think that was still done through bend will.
  However, when does he resist it? I do not remember him directly interacting with it. He does talk about you if you are caught in it, but I don't see why he'd need to plain interact with the rocks and be affected.
  Plus, his reaction to the concept of village (or is it city?) wide mindhax was "imagine what one could do with such a power", which definitly didn't feel like "reality destroying being" either.
  
  09:02, August 8, 2020
  
  
• 3 Kudos
  Ogbunabali
  Neloth definitely resisted bend will, although he himself admitted he wasn't sure what he did to prevent it. Since he tried multiple methods to resist it.o
  
  10:12, August 8, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #196
  Ogbunabali wrote:
  Neloth definitely resisted bend will, although he himself admitted he wasn't sure what he did to prevent it. Since he tried multiple methods to resist it.o
  So he basically went yolo with the situation hoping one of the things he tried would save him....huh
  
  10:31, August 8, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #193
  Waria Kambang wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  Our profile clearly stated that Nocturnal is the strongest Daedric Prince, who can strong armed every other Daedric Princes to follow her command, while the only reason why the Daedric Princes ally themselves with one another to defeat Jyggalag is because Jyggalag was messing with their territories. It's like a single country that attack fifteen other neighbouring countries. It's a natural reaction for the fifteen countries to create an alliance against the single country, but that doesn't necessarily mean that that single country is the strongest.
  wow, i have never read her profile so thats interesting, it would be nice to have a list of who is stronger than who
  
  10:32, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #196
  Ogbunabali wrote:
  Neloth definitely resisted bend will, although he himself admitted he wasn't sure what he did to prevent it. Since he tried multiple methods to resist it.o
  I can't remember him actually talking about what happened, beyond not being able to stop the influence of the spell on others and that he wouldn't even if he could.
  Beyond that,I think he only either admired the ability ("Imagine the power of being able to command entire villages to do your bidding. Imagine what I could do with that power."), or admitted that Miraak would have been a nuicance to him (And now I'm not even mentioning the fact that now we'll never know what would have happened when Miraak returned. Although... from all indications he could have proved a serious nuisance. So, yes, I am grateful that you dealt with him.) - which means a lot with how arrogant he is.
  Plus, if you straight up use Bend Will on him he will be affected.
  
  10:42, August 8, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  so using the full shout or just one word to affect him?
  
  10:48, August 8, 2020

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

Spoiler: Part 2

• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #200
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  so using the full shout or just one word to affect him?
  I think you need two words, but all animals and human(oid)s need that many.
  
  10:53, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  reply to #194
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote:
  Personally, I think when they said power, they are more or less referring to the influences that he had through out Oblivion and what those influences represents.
  And I don't think the power that Miraak used on those stones was Bend Will shout. I mean, a single word of power from the Dovahkiin's Bend Will shout was able to completely shatter the influence Miraak had on the All-Maker Stones. At that point in time, Miraak's thu'um was still clearly more powerful than the Dovahkiin's, so it makes no sense for the Dovahkiin to be able to dispel said influence with a single word of power.
  And yeah, any notion of Neloth being able to resist Bend Will shout is completely shattered when in-game you can affect him with said shout.
  
  Edited by Waria Kambang 12:13, August 8, 2020
  
  
• KongKing23
  reply to #199
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote:
  Ogbunabali wrote:
  Neloth definitely resisted bend will, although he himself admitted he wasn't sure what he did to prevent it. Since he tried multiple methods to resist it.o
  I can't remember him actually talking about what happened, beyond not being able to stop the influence of the spell on others and that he wouldn't even if he could.
  Beyond that,I think he only either admired the ability ("Imagine the power of being able to command entire villages to do your bidding. Imagine what I could do with that power."), or admitted that Miraak would have been a nuicance to him (And now I'm not even mentioning the fact that now we'll never know what would have happened when Miraak returned. Although... from all indications he could have proved a serious nuisance. So, yes, I am grateful that you dealt with him.) - which means a lot with how arrogant he is.
  Plus, if you straight up use Bend Will on him he will be affected.
  The gameplay is sometimes unreliable. For example, you can use Dragonrend on every dragon, while Bend Will doesn't work on certain quest scripted dragons.
  Undead is also immune to Bend Will in the game, which it is contradictory to what it can do in lore. Pete Hines has said that it is depending on certain aspects of gameplay but the lore absolutely takes precedence over the gameplay.
  
  12:27, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #203
  KongKing23 wrote:
  The gameplay is sometimes unreliable. For example, you can use Dragonrend on every dragon, while Bend Will doesn't work on certain quest scripted dragons.
  Undead is also immune to Bend Will in the game, which it is contradictory to what it can do in lore. Pete Hines has said that it is depending on certain aspects of gameplay but the lore absolutely takes precedence over the gameplay.
  True to some extent, but I really can't remember when he mentionts resisting Bend Will, and the wiki with all his quotes doesn't seem to have anything about that either.
  The fact that the mind control that Miraak uses is inferior to a one word bend will also doesn't help.
  And Neloth really is disillusioned from how powerful he is when every times he mentions his power he either diminshes you (and he is nowhere near above The Last Dragonborn at their peak), dismisses other's powers (like Miraak), and is still unwilling to take pretty meh challanges (It's rather hard to believe the man that views traveling in Skyrim, fighting Briarhearts, attacks from the Ashen ones and Dwemer ruins as dangerous and needing a lackey to act as a meat shield is also someone that can destroy all of reality, defeat someone superior to Alduin, and be immune to a full Bend Will shout)
  But a few of the profiles do really confuse me like that. Like the giants, whose High 8-C calc assumes violent fragmantation for fragments the size of someone's head, or some people scaling to creating starry skied nights when stars don't even exist in Elder Scrolls.
  
  20:46, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Keeweed
  Stars do exist in the Elder Scrolls. Mankar has one in his dimension and Jagar Tharn also had one in his dimension. Even out of their dimensions we have seen regular stars in the Elder Scrolls, there are just holes in reality along with the regular stars.
  
  Edited by Keeweed 22:26, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #205
  Keeweed wrote:
  Stars do exist in the Elder Scrolls. Mankar has one in his dimension and Jagar Tharn also had one in his dimension. Even out of their dimensions we have seen regular stars in the Elder Scrolls, there are just holes in reality along with the regular stars.
  But, like, are they specified to be giant balls of burning gas and plasma? And when are normal stars in the sky proper mentioned?Those are legitimate questions btw, I am still pretty new at a lot of the lore.
  
  22:30, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Not specified but it can be easily assumed. The fact that galaxies exist on numerous Pocket Planes is proof that the stars in those realms and the stars on Mundus can't be the same.
  
  22:36, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Keeweed
  As far as I’m aware they aren’t mentioned but there are multiple official videos that go through space in the Elder Scrolls and they go past stars in the sky, Jagar Tharn’s is also shown to just be a regular star since I believe that part of the lore came before the holes in reality part.
  However I do agree with you when it comes to giant calc that it probably should use fragmentation, also I think the giant’s size is too large in the calc. It uses the giants lore size but the feat in question has the giant be only 2 or 2.5 times larger than the regular human in the shot instead of 4 times like the calc uses. However there are multiple statements of mages and daedra destroying large buildings/castles so I’m not sure if the giant getting downgraded would change too much.
  
  22:36, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #207
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  Not specified but it can be easily assumed. The fact that galaxies exist on numerous Pocket Planes is proof that the stars in those realms and the stars on Mundus can't be the same.
  Fair nuff.
  
  22:37, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ogbunabali
  reply to #204
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote: And Neloth really is disillusioned from how powerful he is when every times he mentions his power he either diminshes you (and he is nowhere near above The Last Dragonborn at their peak), dismisses other's powers (like Miraak), and is still unwilling to take pretty meh challanges (It's rather hard to believe the man that views traveling in Skyrim, fighting Briarhearts, attacks from the Ashen ones and Dwemer ruins as dangerous and needing a lackey to act as a meat shield is also someone that can destroy all of reality, defeat someone superior to Alduin, and be immune to a full Bend Will shout)
  When does he say any of this?
  The closest I can remember is him saying something along the lines of "long journeys across Skyrim can be dangerous". Which is very true even for someone like him. Especially a prominent member of house Telvanni, who knows how many other dunmer want his head.
  
  Edited by Ogbunabali 22:44, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #210
  Ogbunabali wrote:
  When does he say any of this?
  The closest I can remember is him saying something along the lines of "long journeys across Skyrim can be dangerous". Which is very true even for someone like him. Especially a prominent member of house Telvanni, who knows how many other dunmer want his head.
  He mentions needing you for journeying under in the dwemer ruin specifically to deal with the dangerous, dirty work as well.
  For him claiming to be superior to the last dragonborn, if you are an Arch-Mage and bring that up, he laughs at you and tells you he could become your master once his other apprentice finished his apprenticeship in a few decades. He also generally talks to you as an inferior person regardless, because arrogant demeanor and all that.
  For Miraak, he describes the man as a "potential nuisance" when he made it clear that he knew little of him beyond the fact that he worked for Mora and that his influence was spreading and controlling entire villages, where he mentions just how much he could do with such a power.
  He does mention how he has reached the apex of enchanting for being able to make staves all on his own. Not sure if him saying that he is better but doesn't want you to become as good as you is an excuse to keep acting superior once you hit 90 enchanting level or not.
  I mean, if he scales to some other sorcerer that'd be fine, but putting him above the Last Dragonborn, or even the first one, seems to just be taking his arrogance at face value.
  
  22:53, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ogbunabali
  By dangerous he likely means the environmental type, within the context in which it was said. Considering the biggest danger in the whole dungeon would be the drowning or it collapsing he would need a fodder to act like a guinea pig for traps and what not, the dwemer enemies weren't that note worthy.
  Ok? He's arrogant, but he's right. He's a much better wizard with hundreds of years of experience and research more than you.
  He said he "would've" become a nuisance iirc. As in, of he gets free and goes on a world conquest, he'd definitely interfere with his work. Which, again, is true.
  You're acting like Miraak mind controlling a whole island+ dragons isn't impressive.
  That's just because gameplay wise he can't teach you anymore for balance purpse. And interacting with anyone above their level cap will tell you "I can't teach yoi anymore" this is just his in character way of telling you that.
  He's extremely arrogant, that's pretty evident, but he's not lying.
  
  23:15, August 8, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  I kinda agree with Ricsi when it comes to neloth, I cant see him being above the Dovahkiin
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 23:20, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #212
  Ogbunabali wrote:
  Ok? He's arrogant, but he's right. He's a much better wizard with hundreds of years of experience and research more than you.
  You're acting like Miraak mind controlling a whole island+ dragons isn't impressive.
  He's extremely arrogant, that's pretty evident, but he's not lying.
  You are better than him at the warding part of spells at the very least, and that still doesn't mean he is superior in power to the dragonborn. There are a lot of sorcerers with hundreds of years worth of study after all, and The Last Dragonborn's knowledge of spells is pretty limited (they know nothing of mysticism, nor the Damage Attribute part of Destruction magic), but using that as reasoning for raw power is pretty meh.
  He did not know about the dragons when he said that, nor did he say Island. He controlled villages, which does not really sound all that impressive to me.
  I know he is arrogant and not directly lying, but it is pretty clear that he doesn't know how strong either Miraak or the Last Dragonborn is, so taking his claims of superiority to grant a tier still feels force to me.
  
  23:23, August 8, 2020
  
  
• Ogbunabali
  reply to #214
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote: Snip
  I think it's reasonable to assume synecdoche in this case. Especially since he mentions the "spreading madness/influence across the island" or similar lines a couple of times.
  Fair play.
  I see your point, though I wasn't particularly arguing about his tier, but I don't have a problem with his current tier of "possibly Low 2-C".
  
  00:21, August 9, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #215
  Ogbunabali wrote:
  I see your point, though I wasn't particularly arguing about his tier, but I don't have a problem with his current tier of "possibly Low 2-C".
  Sorry, I was refferring to that. Still though, he doesn't exactly have many feats, and his statements are done with him lacking knowledge overall.
  Are other "best wizard of the year" characters in Elder Scrolls Low 2-C, or is his tier just baseed around scaling to the two dragonborns? If the latter, I feel it's a bit of a strech to me.
  I get there are a lot of strong people around, but I doubt that there are that many Low 2-Cs that can drop in and kill him out of nowhere for him to really be that concerned with the idea. Though I guess the Thalmor have a few of those up their sleeves.
  
  00:33, August 9, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  Someone's trying to argue with me on another medium that the Last Dragonborn should be Outerversal because of archetypal platonic beings that exist on Nirn or something?
  
  04:01, August 9, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  Even if that were the case, not all Thu'um is equal and The Last Dragonborn hasn't affected any such being as far as I know.
  And that is a big "even if".
  
  04:03, August 9, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  I think he's trying to scale that to Alduin, and then to the Dragonborn via that, but yeah, I agree.
  
  04:06, August 9, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  I am pretty damn sure such things would just be indipendent from time and exist in all Kalpas. Though, did he give any sources or such for claiming that? The name of the beings, why they are on such a level, all that kind of basic things to give with such insane claims.
  
  04:10, August 9, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  @Ricsi: Here's a link to a pastebin log of the conversation:
  My name = Last Dragonborn, other person = Vier
  His main point is that Nirn/Mundus = made of Et'Ada, Et'Ada were Outerversal, therefore anything on/from Nirn = Outerverse tier. Even though they gave that part of themselves up to become Nirn/Mundus, which I try to get through to him several times, but, well, you can read his sword metaphor for yourself to see how far that gets me. He essentially believes that Nirn is "above infinity" because of a single lore book he read, and that makes it beyond our 3-dimensional reality at its baseline, when in reality, Mundus/Nirn is surrounded by infinity.
  
  And then he posted the link to a youtube video before he left for the night: Channel is called "Your Favorite Villain!"
  
  Edited by A Stoned Orc 06:19, August 9, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  So... he thinks that every single atom in Nirn is 1-A.
  Yeah no, I don't see how you can raelly use logic to dissuade him.
  
  06:25, August 9, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  He apparently thinks the same of Lord of the Rings for similar reasons.
  
  
  ...Not to mention, the whole Darkseid comparison may as well be off-topic. The mechanics of Darkseid and his death do not matter to the mechanics of the Elder Scrolls cosmology. :\
  But yeah, it's pretty stupid, if you ask me. He apparently thinks that Outerversal - Outerversal = Outerversal. >_> 1+1 may as well equal 1 to him.
  
  Edited by A Stoned Orc 06:39, August 9, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #223
  A Stoned Orc wrote:
  But yeah, it's pretty stupid, if you ask me. He apparently thinks that Outerversal - Outerversal = Outerversal. >_> 1+1 may as well equal 1 to him.
  How nice to see people misinterpret infinity.
  While a part of infinite can be infinite (all number - all whole number), that does not make all parts of infinity infinite (all numbers - 1).
  Same goes for outerversal. Assuming every atom in a reality is equal to the cosmology of said reality is like saying everything in the real world would be High 3-A or Low 2-C.
  
  06:51, August 9, 2020
  
  
• A Stoned Orc
  Tried my damnedest to get that through to him. Oh, well.
  
  06:59, August 9, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  Other than the insane wank what is the current subject?
  
  14:46, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #226
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  Other than the insane wank what is the current subject?
  Whether Nelos's belief of superiority over Miraak and The Last Dragonborn is actually well founded (He admits to not know much of Miraak, and he doesn't know The Last Dragonorn at all). He might know more of magic, but that doesn't mean he is stronger.
  
  Edited by Ricsi-viragosi 14:50, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  I agree he isn't stronger, he is super arrogant. But I think he is intended to be a better mage than The Dovahkiin can ever be.
  
  15:00, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #228
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  I agree he isn't stronger, he is super arrogant. But I think he is intended to be a better mage than The Dovahkiin can ever be.
  I think he is better in the sheer versability, but I kind of doubt him having more raw power.
  A lot of people from previous games would have far more knowledge and aviable spells than the Dova. Hell, even the previous Arch-Mage would likely know more with his decades of experience.
  Plus, once you become Mora's new "champion", you'll probably get access to more knowledge than him (but that's after the game, so I get what you mean).
  
  15:16, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  >The previous Arch-mage.
  Bullshit. Neloth is like, 500 years old.
  
  15:20, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #230
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  >The previous Arch-mage.
  Bullshit. Neloth is like, 500 years old.
  I meant more knowledgable than the Dovah, not Neloth. Neloth is absolutely better than the Arch-Mage.
  
  15:21, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  reply to #229
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote: A lot of people from previous games would have far more knowledge and aviable spells than the Dova. Hell, even the previous Arch-Mage would likely know more with his decades of experience.
  Considering that some spells from previous games are very common and the College of Winterhold supposedly being the only place in Skyrim where people can truly learn magic, I think it would make sense for them to have some spells from the previous games that are not available because of game limitations.
  
  15:22, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #232
  Waria Kambang wrote:
  Considering that some spells from previous games are very common and the College of Winterhold supposedly being the only place in Skyrim where people can truly learn magic, I think it would make sense for them to have some spells from the previous games that are not available because of game limitations.
  I mean, not really.
  Magic is seen as a tool for the weak from 90% of the Nords to the point that there is only one Nord student (two if Dragonborn is one), and the College itself nearly sank and was heavily damaged.
  
  15:23, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  reply to #233
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote:
  No. It has been repeatedly stated that the College was nearly untouched by the Great Collapse. That's the whole reason why the people accused the College of having parts in the Great Collapse. And while it's true that most nords sees magic as a tool for the weak, the existence of powerful individuals and masters in College of Winterhold proves that they have a lot of magical knowledge to share. I mean, Tolfdir was said to be one of the best Alteration master in Tamriel.
  
  Edited by Waria Kambang 15:29, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #234
  Waria Kambang wrote:
  No. It has been repeatedly stated that the College was nearly untouched by the Great Collapse. That's the whole reason why the people accused the College of having parts in the Great Collapse. And while it's true that most nords sees the magic as a tool for the weak, the existence of powerful individuals and masters in College of Winterhold proves that they have a lot of magical knowledge to share.
  The College itself, yeah, but it still left them in the bad side of pretty much everyone near them.
  And that isn't proof. That's literally lack of proof. There is no mention of such things, Nords don't even study there and the general magical knowledge is so low common folk don't even know that magic staffs are a thing...
  While the college might be lightyears ahead the rest of Skyrim, there is little proof for it being really advanced with magic at all.
  
  15:30, August 10, 2020
  
  
• MagiSinbad
  i have a question : how powerfull is Shalidor ? i guess he's nowhere around someone like Divath Fyr, but still curious since the guy managed to steal Glamoril from Akatosh himself which is kinda impressive
  
  15:36, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  Read my edit. The existence of powerful masters like Tolfdir, who is said to be one of the greatest Alteration master in Tamriel proves that their magical knowledge are very much equals to other provinces of Tamriel. Based on Urag gro-Shub's dialogues, the College has been collecting and preserving magical knowledge for hundreds of years, starting from the First Era, and their magical knowledges are still preserved. Not to mention that it was created by Shalidor, a mage who rivals Divath Fyr in magical knowledge.
  And how those the lack of magical knowledge of the common folks supposed to prove the College's lack of magical knowledge?
  
  Edited by Waria Kambang 16:21, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  Keep in mind that I'm not saying that the Dovahkiin should have every single spells that the previous protagonists have. I'm just saying that their magical knowledge are not limited to what we've seen in-game.
  
  Edited by Waria Kambang 18:20, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  reply to #237
  Waria Kambang wrote:
  Knowledge of magic does not equal ability to use it, and more importantly The Last Dragonborn isn't all-knowledgable in magic either.
  Majority of the other apprentices just up and die in their experiments, and the Last Dragonborn's proficency in a magical school does not reflect the spells they know in them.
  Which is why I said the previous Arch-Mage probably knew more than him or her.
  
  15:49, August 10, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  Is more of a game limitation/creators limiting spells as they have said
  I wish they keep the spells from all the games and just added new ones every game but the just seem to just wash down and try to make less than the previous games
  But thanks to that people make mods to put spell on the games
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 15:56, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  reply to #239
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote:
  Nor am I saying that, But assuming that the Dragonborn, who can supposedly surpass one of the best Alteration master in all of Tamriel and reach similar levels in other schools to have such a limited number of spells, which is clearly a game mechanic, is wrong. What I'm saying is that it is logical to assume that the Dragonborn have far more spells than what the game shows us, but we don't know what those spells are or how many they are.
  
  Edited by Waria Kambang 01:55, August 11, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  reply to #240
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  This is very much true. There's no reason for the College of Winterhold to have less spells than other institutions of magic when it's are created by one of the most knowledgeable magician in the whole history of Tamriel, had been preserving magical knowledges longer than Arcane University (and unlike Arcane University, didn't lose their magical knowledges to the Thalmor), and have powerful masters like Tolfdir to teach and pass their magical knowledges to their apprentices. The only explanation for this is game mechanic, because it makes zero sense in lore.
  
  Edited by Waria Kambang 16:27, August 10, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  We get lost something , being this thread said a lot , we need aka lorkhan , magnus put to 1-A + , but currently there was't change
  
  18:53, August 11, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #243
  Lapsad wrote: We get lost something , being this thread said a lot , we need aka lorkhan , magnus put to 1-A + , but currently there was't change
  Ye i said something like that a while ago
  
  10:16, August 13, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #230
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  >The previous Arch-mage.
  Bullshit. Neloth is like, 500 years old.
  i have a question Matthew Schroeder woulndt the CHIM users have plot hax for being able to manipulate the whole dream etc.?
  also are the true selves of CHIM users on the dreamsleave? as vivec is said to be there when he enters CHIM?
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 17:19, August 20, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  No , not whole dream , also that not a plot
  CHIMster can access dreamsleeve as they want
  
  00:16, August 21, 2020
  
  
• This reply has been removed
• Waria Kambang
  reply to #247
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  Narrative and plot exists in TES universe. The Adamantine Tower for example, define the stories for the Earth Bones.
  "The spike of Ada-Mantia, and its Zero Stone, dictated the structure of reality in its Aurbic vicinity, defining for the Earth Bones their story or nature within the unfolding of the Dragon's (timebound) Tale. The Aldmeri or Merethic Elves were singular of purpose only so long as it took them to realize that other Towers, with their own Stones, could tell different stories, each following rules inscribed by Variorum Architects. And so the Mer self-refracted, each to their own creation, the Chimer following Red-Heart, the Bosmer burgeoning Green-Sap, the Altmer erecting Crystal-Like-Law, et alia." - Aurbic Enigma 4: The Elden Tree
  
  Edited by Waria Kambang 23:51, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  reply to #248
  I was heard it , king anumaril can compose reality by the staff of tower
  Also more like each tower are working like plot , that make sense
  
  02:08, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  So they should indeed have plot manipulation
  
  02:19, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  reply to #250
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  So they should indeed have plot manipulation
  Probably , anybody who can control the influence of the tower , they could have
  
  02:25, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #251
  Lapsad wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  So they should indeed have plot manipulation
  Probably , anybody who can control the influence of the tower , they could have
  So yea, the CHIM users and Numidium is able to erase them too
  
  02:56, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  reply to #252
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  Lapsad wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  So they should indeed have plot manipulation
  Probably , anybody who can control the influence of the tower , they could have
  So yea, the CHIM users and Numidium is able to erase them too
  Sadly , thay narrative it working below concept of time , it's not strongly
  
  03:07, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  One of the towers is beyond/above time
  
  03:11, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  What one ?
  
  03:17, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #255
  Lapsad wrote: What one ?
  Think it was the adamantine tower were all the gods reunited to discuss about lorkans betrayal
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 03:24, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Adamantine was create after the time already spread , it still below
  
  03:27, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #257
  Lapsad wrote: Adamantine was create after the time already spread , it still below
  Not really.
  For the Convention to be made, Akatosh’s vessel struck the Earth and became fixed in it as a Tower. And through the Convention, it would define the Earthbones and structure their nature inside of Nirn’s narrative, effectively making it the first speck of solid and unassailable reality in the non-linearity of the Dawn Era, thus earning it the name of Ur-Tower, or Ada-Mantia.
  So the tower is what brought time and defined all of the nareative and structures, the tower is still beyond time
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 03:33, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Then , tower have a function to establishing the narrative , it still need the concept of time to stabilized that function , that why i said "below"
  
  03:42, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #259
  Lapsad wrote: Then , tower have a function to establishing the narrative , it still need the concept of time to stabilized that function , that why i said "below"
  Still does not change the fact that there is plot and narrative and those that can control,change and erase it exist
  
  03:58, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Yes narrative is still eixst , but that not i pointed , i said about narrative not a tower , the narrative is needed the time to congeal it
  
  04:15, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #261
  Lapsad wrote:
  Yes narrative is still eixst , but that not i pointed , i said about narrative not a tower , the narrative is needed the time to congeal it
  ? i srly dont understand what u are trying to say
  
  04:35, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  reply to #253
  Lapsad wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  Lapsad wrote:
  
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  So they should indeed have plot manipulation
  Probably , anybody who can control the influence of the tower , they could have
  So yea, the CHIM users and Numidium is able to erase them too
  Sadly , thay narrative it working below concept of time , it's not strongly
  I pointed this before the narrative are working beneath the time
  
  Edited by Lapsad 04:55, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #263
  Lapsad wrote:
  Lapsad wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  Lapsad wrote:
  
  
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  So they should indeed have plot manipulation
  Probably , anybody who can control the influence of the tower , they could have
  So yea, the CHIM users and Numidium is able to erase them too
  Sadly , thay narrative it working below concept of time , it's not strongly
  I pointed this before the narrative are working beneath the time
  the narrative/plot already existed what the adamintine tower is doing is just putting it in order on Nirn
  
  06:05, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Waria Kambang
  Theoretically, CHIM users are capable of creating a narrative and plot that are above time/at a 1-A scale, since they are capable of manipulating the dream in anyway.
  
  06:11, August 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  I whish i could make a CTR to get the Plot hax on thier profiles
  tho not sure if minor CTR were allowed
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 06:32, August 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Also , this Context can be used to proof some evedence to existence of narrative ? , those tell that y'ffre can give power to tell story and give power to create story
  
  01:06, August 24, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  forgot about that txt
  
  
  also has any of u seen skyblivion and skywind mods?
  
  15:11, August 24, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Probavly have a some important ?
  
  04:56, August 25, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  I got a question again , how does alduin have AE type 2 , what concept he was reliant ?
  
  17:13, August 25, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #270
  Lapsad wrote:
  I got a question again , how does alduin have AE type 2 , what concept he was reliant ?
  End of times
  
  17:44, August 25, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  It be that , then now alduin has already been defeated and truly die , the end of time is still be coming ?
  • edit
  
  Edited by Lapsad 18:18, August 25, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #272
  Lapsad wrote:
  It be that , then now alduin has already been defeated and truly die , the end of time is still be coming ?
  • edit
  thanks to the dragonrend shout as u can see on the dova profile
  "Power Nullification (Immortality (Types 1, 3, 4 and 5), Regeneration (At least Low-Godly) and Abstract Existence (Type 2) via Dragonrend)"
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 18:25, August 25, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  It forget type 8
  
  18:27, August 25, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #274
  Lapsad wrote:
  It forget type 8
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Thread:4166573
  
  18:33, August 25, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  I mean on dovah profile is not listed type 8 negation
  
  18:39, August 25, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #276
  Lapsad wrote:
  I mean on dovah profile is not listed type 8 negation
  i know, thats why i shared that thread were we were talking about the AE and the type 8 etc.
  
  18:40, August 25, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Ok , another , alduin conceptual manip is legit on type 2 , due to the song has exist before the world of matter ?
  
  18:52, August 25, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #278
  Lapsad wrote:
  Ok , another , alduin conceptual manip is legit on type 2 , due to the song has exist before the world of matter ?
  the song/tonal magic was the start of it all, all is music and dragons are very gifted and natural at it, of course not all Yes, dragons are on the same level the strongest being the dova and knowing all the thing from those dragons he killed and miraak for example the bendwill shout is able to bend the earth/earthbones
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 18:55, August 25, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Why vivec has a spot 2nd on Low-2C , what a smurf he have ?
  
  06:05, August 26, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #280
  Lapsad wrote: Why vivec has a spot 2nd on Low-2C , what a smurf he have ?
  Ye the characters above him are smurfs
  
  14:42, August 26, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Also vivec have it too ?
  
  15:33, August 26, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #282
  Lapsad wrote:
  Also vivec have it too ?
  u mean if vivec is a smurf in his low 2-C key?
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 15:47, August 26, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Yes
  
  15:48, August 26, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #284
  Lapsad wrote:
  Yes
  not really, the low 2-C key of vivec is when he was at his weakest
  
  15:50, August 26, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  If be that , D from vampire hunter have a very powerfull hax more than vivec
  
  15:55, August 26, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #286
  Lapsad wrote:
  If be that , D from vampire hunter have a very powerfull hax more than vivec
  vivec low 2-C key is when he is at his weakest but he aint that weak boi
  
  16:15, August 26, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Yes but it make me thoughtly wierd , fang mu have a h1b stuff , D from vampire hunter have a low-1c smurf
  
  Edited by Lapsad 16:23, August 26, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Being contracdic agian , aka profiel were said dreamsleeve are 1-A , but why vivec profile can siad it H1A ? , what somthing get it large differrent
  
  03:21, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #289
  Lapsad wrote: Being contracdic agian , aka profiel were said dreamsleeve are 1-A , but why vivec profile can siad it H1A ? , what somthing get it large differrent
  In the thread were the updates that were to be given u can see that it got derailed also i have asked ultima before and he has said that aka and lorkan are basically around the same level as CHIM users on their prime.
  So it basically boils down to "we dont have enought people interested in TES to start making the upgrades" is funny actually cus if I remember there are a lot of profiles that have not been updated and not been given abilities and resistances they have but are not on the profiles, the reason why the dova page has most of his haxes is cus I have been working and making CTR for it otherwise he would just have like 7 powers still
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 03:29, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  We must to fixed after the move , it's looks be confuse
  
  03:29, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #291
  Lapsad wrote: We must to fixed after the move , it's looks be confuse
  I ahve been wanting to do that, also to create/restore the profiles of the daedric Gods and make profiles for the daedric and Aedric weapons and clean profiles and add the powers and resistances they are missing ot to mention finally immplement the updates
  
  03:33, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Also , we have a discord channel for VSB TES ? (i doubt not) , it woule need to be use it to talking about lore and unpack the feat from ESO
  
  04:03, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #293
  Lapsad wrote: Also , we have a discord channel for VSB TES ? (i doubt not) , it woule need to be use it to talking about lore and unpack the feat from ESO
  As far as i know there is no VSB TES
  
  04:11, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Throught on TES dis , i had a many channel but not form VSB , it being from written in uncertainty , TES fandom , Tel mora , imperial libarry
  Most of those memeber is versatile in lore but not expert in feat
  
  04:21, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #295
  Lapsad wrote: Throught on TES dis , i had a many channel but not form VSB , it being from written in uncertainty , TES fandom , Tel mora , imperial libarry
  Most of those memeber is versatile in lore but not expert in feat
  Yes they are very knowledgeable when it comes to lore, even the subreddit of TESlore but they dont really pay attention to things like we do here when it comes to scaling etc.
  
  04:31, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  I was saw some text in profile probably that put people misunderstanding
  In two primodial force profile
  "define the entire Dream of the Godhead at its most primal level"
  This can boiling my mind in to mistrust agian
  
  08:32, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #297
  Lapsad wrote: I was saw some text in profile probably that put people misunderstanding
  In two primodial force profile
  "define the entire Dream of the Godhead at its most primal level"
  This can boiling my mind in to mistrust agian
  U mean padomay and ANU? Or the AE? or Anu-El and Sithis?
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 14:31, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Padomay the change and Anu the stasis
  
  15:13, August 28, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #299
  Lapsad wrote:
  Padomay the change and Anu the stasis
  Yes they are both fundamental ideas being what define the entire Dream of the Godhead at its most primal level.
  
  
  Anu-El is the everlasting, ineffable Light of Existence which encompasses, surrounds and exists beyond the Aurbis and the endless realms of unstructured chaos that stand above it, and which sparked its creation through its interplay with the infinite, inexpressible Void of Sithis
  
  
  so if i try to put it simply it would be
  Godhead/amaranth (painter)
  
  ANU and padomay (Canvas)
  
  Anu-El and Sithis (paint and brush)
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 15:33, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  That wrote " entire of dream " there is so far greater onto H1A , all i know the dream is working H1A plane
  
  16:15, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #301
  Lapsad wrote:
  That wrote " entire of dream " there is so far greater onto H1A , all i know the dream is working H1A plane
  Sorry i could not understand the question, are u asking if the dream is H1A or tier 0?
  
  16:30, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  The dream is most basically H1A various degree , that what i curios if Anu and padoamy both exist in fundamental part of the dream thus making them are high-level of H1A too ?
  
  16:39, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #303
  Lapsad wrote:
  The dream is most basically H1A various degree , that what i curios if Anu and padoamy both exist in fundamental part of the dream thus making them are high-level of H1A too ?
  Oh! u are asking if ANU and Padomay are high level of H1A?
  
  16:44, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Yes , sorry for my vague question it's so complex , do you mind if i used "Anu" instead "ANU" , becuz ANU is it use in his godhead state
  
  16:58, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #305
  Lapsad wrote:
  Yes , sorry for my vague question it's so complex , do you mind if i used "Anu" instead "ANU" , becuz ANU is it use in his godhead state
  sure, as for ur question yes they are high into the H1A
  
  16:59, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  How hight ? , many poeple would said it only one or two trasncendance baselin
  
  17:01, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #307
  Lapsad wrote:
  How hight ? , many poeple would said it only one or two trasncendance baselin
  i would need to read more but i bellieve that there was a thread with the strongest H1A and anu and padomai were there
  
  17:06, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Jockey-1337
  1: Akatosh = Talos (CHIM)
  2: The Void Dragon
  3: Kamijou Touma
  4: Lucemon
  5: UltraforceVeedramon = Belphemon = Leviamon
  6: Haunglongmon
  7: Dovakhin
  8: Barbatos
  9: Nicol Bolas
  10: Ugin
  11. Dragon God (Project A-ko)
  12: Invisible Dragon
  13: Miraak
  14: Alduin
  Updated.
  
  17:09, August 28, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  TOAAPRESENCE1
  ? i think u have the wrong thread
  
  17:14, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  reply to #308
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  Lapsad wrote:
  How hight ? , many poeple would said it only one or two trasncendance baselin
  i would need to read more but i bellieve that there was a thread with the strongest H1A and anu and padomai were there
  Probably we have a chance to gain that level from this text
  "Anu and Padhome, stasis and change, both vast realms sitting in the void, they created it. Not vast, infinite, as the void was infinite. Imagine an infinity enclosed by another; you come away with a bubble. Now watch as the two bubbles touch. Their intersection is a perfect circle of pattern and possibility that we shall call the Aurbis. The Aurbis is the foundation of the Wheel."
  Does it mean the dream is a void setting which have anu and padomay is a two bubble inside ?
  
  17:30, August 28, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #311
  Lapsad wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  Lapsad wrote:
  How hight ? , many poeple would said it only one or two trasncendance baselin
  i would need to read more but i bellieve that there was a thread with the strongest H1A and anu and padomai were there
  Probably we have a chance to gain that level from this text
  "Anu and Padhome, stasis and change, both vast realms sitting in the void, they created it. Not vast, infinite, as the void was infinite. Imagine an infinity enclosed by another; you come away with a bubble. Now watch as the two bubbles touch. Their intersection is a perfect circle of pattern and possibility that we shall call the Aurbis. The Aurbis is the foundation of the Wheel."
  Does it mean the dream is a void setting which have anu and padomay is a two bubble inside ?
  basically, before it all it was a void anu and padomay define the entire Dream of the Godhead at its most primal level. and they gave birth to anuel and sithis and those 2 started to create basically from the light of anuel and the void of sithis
  
  17:41, August 28, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Can we doing this in the storyline , CHIM is working like turn on and turn off from the sermon said "put in the brillaint armor" that mean you can put on it as you want
  Like other said before " Low-2C , at least 1-A likely higher via chim "
  Literally you can stand still in CHIM as long as you want
  
  15:42, August 30, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #313
  Lapsad wrote:
  Can we doing this in the storyline , CHIM is working like turn on and turn off from the sermon said "put in the brillaint armor" that mean you can put on it as you want
  Like other said before " Low-2C , at least 1-A likely higher via chim "
  Literally you can stand still in CHIM as long as you want
  i mean CHIM is like using the commands on the game and putting GOD mode on u
  that would need to be in all his keys
  low 2-C (when he was at his weakest)
  High 1-B (when he was at his prime)
  
  15:47, August 30, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Yes in morrrowind vivec already achive CHIM , probably he can using it too
  
  15:58, August 30, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #315
  Lapsad wrote:
  Yes in morrrowind vivec already achive CHIM , probably he can using it too
  for what i remeber he only achieved it after his wedding to molag bal and the 88 days and nighs
  
  16:02, August 30, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  I mean in morrowind strory he owned CHIM anyway probably we can assume that he can using it even in his weakest state
  
  16:29, August 30, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #317
  Lapsad wrote:
  I mean in morrowind strory he owned CHIM anyway probably we can assume that he can using it even in his weakest state
  oh yea by the point of morrowind he had CHIM
  
  16:31, August 30, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  So yeah and vivec in his weakest state can use CHIM probably
  
  00:44, August 31, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #319
  Lapsad wrote:
  So yeah and vivec in his weakest state can use CHIM probably
  more than likely if i remeber right he entered CHIM after the whole main quest to kill Azura as a last FU
  
  00:55, August 31, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Lapsad
  Yes this solidly he can , that why i would like to made his new
  Low-2C , At least 1-A possibly higher
  
  00:59, August 31, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #321
  Lapsad wrote: Yes this solidly he can , that why i would like to made his new
  Low-2C , At least 1-A possibly higher
  Makes sence, we would need to discuss it with the others tho
  
  02:59, September 3, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  What are truely mean about " didgital " i heard it frim CODA but what is that thing ?
  
  06:54, September 4, 2020
  
  
• 1 Kudos
  Lapsad
  So , ahhhh does anyone has an idead to made a profile for chimere graegyn , it is look fun we had a old man who's 7-C AP with H1B durability and possibly H1B hax
  
  Edited by Lapsad 05:53, September 17, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #324
  Lapsad wrote: So , ahhhh does anyone has an idead to made a profile for chimere graegyn , it is look fun we had a old man 7-C AP with H1B durability and possibly H1B hax
  Kong has a lot of profiles on his blog from a lot of chatacters, artifacts and even civilizations of the verse tho they are a lil outdated when it comes to their tier
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 05:56, September 17, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  I saw a lot , also many of them would be fine after the move all of it need to be discussed
  
  06:01, September 17, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #326
  Lapsad wrote: I saw a lot , also many of them would be fine after the move all of it need to be discussed
  Yea to be honest i wish if we could get all of those profiles on the page it would be great to have the artifacts and the civilitations etc.
  
  06:04, September 17, 2020
  
  
• KongKing23
  reply to #326
  Lapsad wrote: I saw a lot , also many of them would be fine after the move all of it need to be discussed
  They are mostly for references. Ain’t gonna get published because the Elder Scrolls verse will be too overcrowded.
  
  06:56, September 17, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #328
  KongKing23 wrote:
  Lapsad wrote: I saw a lot , also many of them would be fine after the move all of it need to be discussed
  They are mostly for references. Ain’t gonna get published because the Elder Scrolls verse will be too overcrowded.
  I mean....have u seen verses like marvel and DC pages?
  Marvel Alone has about 200 or more profiles there already
  I dont know what would make TES having more profiles of characters and artifacts that people could use to make vs or to see what they can do, I dont see that as bad, it might even bring more life to the page
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 07:10, September 17, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  So, I'd have a question, why is Kirkbride's stuff being used? While the fandom has it's own takes on what they want to be canon, this wiki still takes canon for, well, what canon is. The story written by the IP holders or those they hire to do so.
  Of course, I'm aware how much he had written back in the time, and that he sometimes gets rehired to write some new things, but that alone doesn't mean that the things they didn't have him write is canon. The fact that they openly state that things outside the game like the loveletter from the fifth era are not canon is a major problem with it too.
  There's also C0DA being about IP having no rights over personal canons and all fanon stories being equally worthwhile, but that would still not be allowed on the wiki. So, am I missing something here?
  While I could see his interpretation getting profiles of their own, I could only see that working the same manner as legends and canon star wars, not as the default canon.
  
  Edited by Ricsi-viragosi 15:42, September 17, 2020
  
  
• ZacharyGrossman273
  Is everyone forgetting the godhead isn't sentient? The profile is neccesary for cosmology purposes but it's not really a character.
  
  15:51, September 17, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #331
  ZacharyGrossman273 wrote: Is everyone forgetting the godhead isn't sentient? The profile is neccesary for cosmology purposes but it's not really a character.
  No one is talking about him so idk why u bring him up to begin with.
  
  16:02, September 17, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #330
  Ricsi-viragosi wrote: So, I'd have a question, why is Kirkbride's stuff being used? While the fandom has it's own takes on what they want to be canon, this wiki still takes canon for, well, what canon is. The story written by the IP holders or those they hire to do so.
  Of course, I'm aware how much he had written back in the time, and that he sometimes gets rehired to write some new things, but that alone doesn't mean that the things they didn't have him write is canon. The fact that they openly state that things outside the game like the loveletter from the fifth era are not canon is a major problem with it too.
  There's also C0DA being about IP having no rights over personal canons and all fanon stories being equally worthwhile, but that would still not be allowed on the wiki. So, am I missing something here?
  While I could see his interpretation getting profiles of their own, I could only see that working the same manner as legends and canon star wars, not as the default canon.
  https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Matthew_Schroeder/The_Elder_Scrolls:_Consistency_&_Canon
  Matt did a blog on the whole thing, here u go
  
  19:07, September 17, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  But that is a pretty dishonest way to look at things. First of all, not everyone dismisses his writings as nonsensical fanfiction, they simply don't take it as a part of canon. The idea of KINMUNE isn't that complicated despite the way its written, but many still don't like and agree with the idea of a mining AI from the future being the Queen of the Thalmor, among many other things.
  His influence on the games is undeniable. The fact that some of the things he wrote is directly stated to not be canon, is also undeniable however.
  They directly say things such as the love letter from the Fifth Era, are no-canon as they do not appear in-game. Obviously the newer and older writers still ask and take influence from him, but the simple fact that his writings aren't canon by default remains all the same.
  We do not know that the Thalmor wish to destroy the towers and create a world without humans, and the mystery of what will happen to the dwemer is still very much a thing.
  After all, the "third" kind of people about Kirk, is the ones that enjoy his writings, but only take them for canon, when they are confirmed canon in game.
  
  There are hundreds of arguments on the canonicity of his works online. Almost all agree that while he is an important figure, nothing he wrote is absolutely true or even something the writers of the new lore have to respect, and they may contradict it at will. One of his writings goes against the idea that IP holders don't own the canonicity of a story after all, but that standard isn't something this wiki can take.
  I am perfectly fine with taking the ideas that are confirmed as canon as canon, obviously. But still, not everything he has claimed is canon, some of what he has written is not canon, and some lore claims and such seem to be contradicted ("seem" since what is meant literally and what isn't is up in the air).
  
  04:45, September 18, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  You should talk it with matt.
  i personally accept his work as cannon
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 04:52, September 18, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  Simply out, Bethesda's response to whether love letter from fifth era, nu-mantia intercept, "etc." are canon or not.
  "Remember that only things that have been published in Elder Scrolls games should be considered official lore."
  Of course, things openly stated to be canon (see the novels for Skyrim. Which, yeah, there's a reason why those two were directly said to be canon while many of the other things written out of game were not) are still canon as well.
  Intresting it might be, Kirkbride's concept is just not something possible to really take on the wiki properly:
  "Tamriel never belonged to Bethesda. It was the other way around. As for canon, it's really all interactive fiction, and that should mean something to everyone. That said, I appreciate and understand the stamp of "official", but I think it will hurt more that it will help in the long run. TES should be Open Source. It is for me.$
  Tuat is just now how things work.
  
  04:52, September 18, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  Matt also said this:
  What you like doesn't matter. What matters is what is.
  And this isn't about feats. It's about Lore as a whole. TES Lore is incomplete without OOG texts from Kirkbride. This is an objective statement.
  
  
  so i really thing u should talk with him about it, given he is basically the Lore master of TES on this wiki.
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 04:59, September 18, 2020
  
  
• Ricsi-viragosi
  Yes, that does not prove Kirkbruie's writing are canon as a whole, and I don't think I mentioned feats. I also disregarded personal feelings too. However, the major problems are: 1, the lore being incomplete is purposeful, and is not a justification to take his explanation as canon. 2. Despite many writings from him being canon, his beliefs over The Elder Scrolls (such as it being open source) are simply not true.
  He gives his explanation or expansion on in-verse stories, yes. However, such explanations are only canon, when they are shown or claimed to be.
  The fact that some of his writings are directly stated to be not canon, as they are out of game, should already tell that however.
  
  05:06, September 18, 2020
  
  
• 3 Kudos
  Ultima Reality
  Bethesda's statements regarding Kirkbride's writings were really only relevant in 2005 or so, where much of his writings were indeed still fairly obscured and divided from the game series. This changed over time, though, and many of his relevant texts ended up being directly used and referenced in it; Nu-Mantia Intercept, for instance, was written before Oblivion and actually foreshadows many things that happen in it.
  C0DA's entire plot is also directly described in the 37th Sermon of Vivec, down to the destruction of time across the Aurbis and Jubal's existence and role as Vivec's husband, not to mention her making a direct mention of the Amaranth at the end of it. The latter being also mentioned almost by name in the Truth in Sequence as part of Sotha Sil's ideals.
  Ultimately, though, whether you consider Kirkbride's stuff to be canon or not is irrelevant to much of the ratings on the profiles, since all of the texts relevant to them have been included in-game. And even those that weren't are just MK explaining lore that has been present in the games since Morrowind (The 36 Lessons talk about basically the entire cosmology as he describes it, for instance), or arguably even Redguard, so I'd say they're fine to use as support regardless.
  
  Edited by Ultima Reality 05:37, September 18, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #339
  Ultima Reality wrote:
  Bethesda's statements regarding Kirkbride's writings were really only relevant in 2005 or so, where much of his writings were indeed still fairly obscured and divided from the game series. This changed over time, though, and many of his relevant texts ended up being directly used and referenced in it; Nu-Mantia Intercept, for instance, was written before Oblivion and actually foreshadows many things that happen in it.
  C0DA's entire plot is also directly described in the 37th Sermon of Vivec, down to the destruction of time across the Aurbis and Jubal's existence and role as Vivec's husband, not to mention her making a direct mention of the Amaranth at the end of it. The latter being also mentioned almost by name in the Truth in Sequence as part of Sotha Sil's ideals.
  Ultimately, though, whether you consider Kirkbride's stuff to be canon or not is irrelevant to much of the ratings on the profiles, since all of the texts relevant to them have been included in-game. And even those that weren't are just MK explaining lore that has been present in the games since the Morrowind (The 36 Lessons talk about basically the entire cosmology as he describes it, for instance), so I'd say they're fine to use as support regardless.
  i thought vivec was the husband......
  
  05:30, September 18, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  It doesn't matter if something isn't "licensed", it is still lore created by developers and it will either reflect something that was already planned behind the scenes, or which will eventually be used in a game.
  Check the Canon Page in the Elder Scrolls wiki for quotes from devs.
  
  05:30, September 18, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  this should be put in your blog of canon and put alongside the links of the cosmology and lore etc. for people that have doubts and questions about cannon
  
  05:34, September 18, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  That old blog sucks tbh.
  
  05:34, September 18, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #343
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  That old blog sucks tbh.
  its not that bad really, and it would help people if things like the link you provided + it would be helpful to have something for people that want to know what is "canon" and about Kirkbride work.
  
  05:39, September 18, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  I do like Ted Peterson's way of handling things. He recommends looking at TES less in terms of "Canon" and "Non-Canon" Binary and more through "Primary" and "Secondary" sources.
  
  05:44, September 18, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #345
  Matthew Schroeder wrote:
  I do like Ted Peterson's way of handling things. He recommends looking at TES less in terms of "Canon" and "Non-Canon" Binary and more through "Primary" and "Secondary" sources.
  i do agree with that, but we still have people like Ricsi for example that seem confused by the whole thing imo.
  
  05:52, September 18, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  I have a silly question again , padomay in the child of anuad are represented to same padomay the change so ?
  
  18:11, September 19, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #347
  Lapsad wrote: I have a silly question again , padomay in the child of anuad are represented to same padomay the change so ?
  I think so
  I would have to re-read it to make sure but I do believe so
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 18:13, September 19, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  I just fulled my head with a question mark , padomay the brother of ANU both are exist in same metaphor in child of anud , does it mean we has a another padomay who're exist in same level of godhead Wattttt ? is very weird
  
  18:17, September 19, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #349
  Lapsad wrote: I just fulled my head with a question mark , padomay the brother of ANU both are exist in same metaphor in child of anud , does it mean we has a another padomay who're exist in same level of godhead Wattttt ? is very weird
  Okey for what i remember ANU and Padomay existed then the 3rd came, padomay killed her and ANU went to dream
  In his dream he put "Himself" and Padomai inside there and then those 2 versions of himself and padomay created sithis and Anu-El
  Thats how i interpret all of it
  
  18:40, September 19, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Yeah , but what is that being first version of padomay ?
  
  05:01, September 20, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #351
  Lapsad wrote:
  Yeah , but what is that being first version of padomay ?
  the brother of Anu
  
  06:07, September 20, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  I think that padomay the brother would has a real person or its just a metaphor
  
  06:48, September 20, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #353
  Lapsad wrote:
  I think that padomay the brother would has a real person or its just a metaphor
  i mean both were born out in the empty for what i remember i just call them brothers
  
  06:50, September 20, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Actually, does we had a two version of padomay then ?
  
  06:56, September 20, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #355
  Lapsad wrote:
  Actually, does we had a two version of padomay then ?
  the one born along side anu is dead if i am not mistaken
  
  07:04, September 20, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Then padomay the brother should have a real person and it is a new key for padomay
  
  07:08, September 20, 2020
  
  
• Matthew Schroeder
  It's not a thing that can be given a key.
  
  07:38, September 20, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #357
  Lapsad wrote:
  Then padomay the brother should have a real person and it is a new key for padomay
  we dont know how strong he was or anything about him so we cant really give him a key, the only padomay we oknow about is the one ANU created on his dream.
  
  Edited by TOAAPRESENCE1 07:59, September 20, 2020
  
  
• ZacharyGrossman273
  Aren’t most of the “strongest” “characters” in TES fully non-sentient and not characters but the profiles are neccesary for cosmology purposes
  
  18:03, September 20, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  It seems Microsoft bought the company that owns Bethesda, so the game might only come to Xbox and PC, gonna be interesting to see what they do and plan to do
  
  16:46, September 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  TES VI with unreal engine 5 ( its just a fading dream)
  
  Edited by Lapsad 16:50, September 21, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #362
  Lapsad wrote:
  TES VI with unreal engine 5 ( its just a fading dream)
  thats what mods are for
  
  16:56, September 21, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Only thing we can do here it just wait for greymoir
  
  17:21, September 21, 2020
  
  
• KongKing23
  reply to #361
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  It seems Microsoft bought the company that owns Bethesda, so the game might only come to Xbox and PC, gonna be interesting to see what they do and plan to do
  Now, I can play ESO uninterrupted by the crappy servers. Microsoft servers are the best in the world.
  
  05:54, September 22, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #365
  KongKing23 wrote:
  TOAAPRESENCE1 wrote:
  It seems Microsoft bought the company that owns Bethesda, so the game might only come to Xbox and PC, gonna be interesting to see what they do and plan to do
  Now, I can play ESO uninterrupted by the crappy servers. Microsoft servers are the best in the world.
  Someone in there got tired of waiting for TES 6
  
  06:52, September 22, 2020
  
  
• Zhepar
  
  Last boss fight in the new arena of ESO is a void lich, they tell much but from what i could see from lives it was a being corrupting the realms of molag, hircine and dagon, i imagine if ESO is going to have chapter focused on SITHIS and the void next year, because i cant imagine a stronger final boss after we defeated nocturna in Summerset and off course we would gain a lot of information about this kind of stuff
  
  Edited by Zhepar 22:34, September 22, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  H1A boss fight in full gameplay , its very great i dont truly know , how the gamplay and design deverlop gonna do portraying sithis form
  
  05:35, September 23, 2020
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #368
  Lapsad wrote: H1A boss fight in full gameplay , its very great i dont truly know , how the gamplay and design deverlop gonna do portraying sithis form
  An avatar of sithis has already appeared btw
  
  06:21, September 23, 2020
  
  
• Lapsad
  Usually i was see sithis he's take in form that so glorious cool , demonic face with four arms
  
  6 days ago
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  this is his avatar
  
  5 days ago
  
  
• Lapsad
  Wait is not cool ever , what i wanna see is just his true form
  
  5 days ago
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #372
  Lapsad wrote:
  Wait is not cool ever , what i wanna see is just his true form
  it would be like staring at the darkness/void u wont see anything cus he has no body
  
  5 days ago
  
  
• Lapsad
  I think it so , every abstract being in TES they obviously abstract we dont truly know what a really form of them , have seen only the manifest
  
  5 days ago
  
  
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  I never appreciated just how badass the dovakhiin was until i played ESO
  Dragons are dangerous. I know that should go without saying, but I never fully appreciated that in Skyrim. In ESO, however, they are absolute forces of nature. They take a group of hardened adventurers to take down, and even the Vestige, a Hero and one of the most powerful warriors of that Era, needs a bunch of help to take them down in the story.
  The first one you kill is severely injured by a ballistae bolt to the chest. The next you are useless against without the use of a magical horn designed to combat dragons, and the help of an incredibly powerful mage to shield you from getting torn apart from Shouts. On your own, you are screwed.
  Now compare that to the Dragonborn, who quite literally eats dragons for breakfast and singlehandedly takes down dozens of them to the point where they are more of an annoyance than a threat.
  
  an hour ago
  
  
• Lapsad
  At last the migration is begun , time for the quake are reached
  
  33 minutes ago
  More
• TOAAPRESENCE1
  reply to #376
  Lapsad wrote:
  At last the migration is begun , time for the quake are reached
  i'll see you on the other side comrade.
  
  26 minutes ago

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

fixed

 

[Ogbunabali]

Huge.

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

TES mod community is something else

We also have skyblivion and skywind

 

[Ogbunabali]

10 (almost 11) year old game, and the mods are not slowing down, but speeding up.

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

Every day comes out a new mod be it a simple follower mod or a whole massive mod like rigmor etc.

 

[Lapsad]

What i heard before backt to 2018 in those time TES is first riase in the top of the strongest video game , did i can think that TES is strongest video game series ?

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

What i heard before backt to 2018 in those time TES is first riase in the top of the strongest video game , did i can think that TES is strongest video game series ?

I personally think so yes.

 

[Lapsad]

Due to somebody stated that other visual novel can called as games , i dont sure they can still call as it

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

Due to somebody stated that other visual novel can called as games , i dont sure they can still call as it

Yes, light novels are considered games

TES is the strongest game verse from the west imo

 

[Lapsad]

By considerably , i think not all VN can counted as a games , some of them are't give you gameplay experience

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

They are not exactly like the games on the west but still count as ones

 

[Lapsad]

That looks so wierd , why we counted here , its just click and point its not differrence like you read a book and flip the book page , that exactly game ?

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

Is because u choose the routes etc.

 

[Lapsad]

Nah , choose the route does't mean grant you game experience , if look up on the defination about " game " it has main sign , the Challenge , a main thing to govern this defination , need to be challeng player skills and solve a problem in thier front , some visual novel not have it , they just have goal in storyline and click your mouse for skip a chapters

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

So this is the Discussion Thread? Alright, well I made something to give people something to do with TES atm.

https://vsbattles.com/threads/miraak-in-your-favorite-verse.110265/

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

So this is the Discussion Thread? Alright, well I made something to give people something to do with TES atm.

https://vsbattles.com/threads/miraak-in-your-favorite-verse.110265/

This is the actual active discussion one

The Elder Scrolls Discussion Thread: RETURN FALSE Edition

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