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TENSURA CRT : DIGITAL LIFEFORMS

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The_golden_and_silver_house94

The_golden_and_silver_house94

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Still, I can perform research into it. And what I found was that in this
world, magic is the power to interfere with the laws of nature. There’s a mysterious set of laws to this world—people call them the World Language —and when you earn a new power, or the value of your life rises in some way, like when you evolve, then that’s how nature tells you about it. Magic
runs under the same rules as this World Language; when you cast the spell, it turns that nonphysical phenomenon into real life. And if you look at it the other way…”
Yuuki paused. I tried to guess where this was going. Look at it the other
way…
“Everything has a cause and an effect, and if you figure out the laws
behind all that, you might even be able to find a way home…is what you’re saying?”
I was familiar with the World Language. My skill, the Great Sage, used
the term when talking to me. It was my familiarity with it that led me to that
conclusion.
“…Right. That's very good, Rimuru. I'm surprised… You understood a concept that I had to spend years researching.”
Take the concept of “returning home,” render it into a set of laws, and translate it into the World Language. Easy for me to say, but trying to discover those laws would take a lifetime of research. Even with that much effort, it may not be possible at all.
But if you were able to interfere with the World Language on a deeper
level…
Click to expand...
Unlike the frozen world—where only one law defined everything—the real
world had an entire set of laws that defined how things affected one another.
Many factors needed to be observed at the same time,and the ability to control all cause and effect was nothing but a pipe dream.It’s impossible to completely predict the future, because it’s impossible to have perfect control over all the world’s laws. And since she couldn’t fully predict what the overwhelmingly powerful Daggrull would do,the limits of Shion’s skill set began to show
Click to expand...
From the scan above,it becomes clear that causality is the foundational principle underlying the natural laws,these laws define different causal relationships,to understand and control the laws is to understand and control how causes and effects are structured in the world


The flow of time adds complexity to causal interactions make it a framework of causality


In short, Chloe was the one who made that power her own. While the thought of that was
already absurd, I also wanted to scream aloud that being able to stop time was basically cheating.
Needless to say, I wouldn’t be able to see anything even with my perceptual speed stretched
by a million. There was no way for us, whose bodies yielded to the flow of time, to perceive
events that happened in a frozen world.
Click to expand...
«…!! One possibility has emerged. Assuming that the individual ‘Chloe Aubert’ can use
the power of the Unique Skill ‘Time Travel,’ which has been integrated into Ultimate Skill ‘Yog￾Sothoth,’ to control time, ‘Analyze and Assess’ will always fail, since it is impossible to observe
phenomena that are not on the same time axis.»
Ah, is that so…
The true nature of the power that Chloe acquired was the ability to stop time, or something
to that effect.
Raphael, too, was using ‘Analyze and Assess’ on the inner workings of the Unique Skill
‘Time Travel,’ but it’d still take some time before it got any conclusive results. It looked as
though ‘Time Travel’ had firmly been incorporated into Chloe’s ‘Yog-Sothoth.’
Well yeah, it’s hard to understand something you can’t even observe.
Click to expand...

Even though ultimate skill users have acausality type 4 they are still bound by the flow of time There exist a wall between those who can move and those who can't , digital lifeforms can move in the suspended world,a phenomena disconnected from the flow of time , are not bound by time

So I propose 1 layer/higher degree of acausality type 4 for digital lifeforms


AGREE: FinePoint, ActuallySpaceMan42 , DarkDragonMedeus

NEUTRAL:

DISAGREE:
 
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Rather than working on a higher system of causality, this is more so that only the law of causality exists.
We already know from the working of SW that Causality > Time (Time does not exist in SW, yet Causality thus).

It's simply that it's easier to control causality in the suspended world because you don't have to control the "extra" causes and effects surrounding the causality of the person you're controlling.

But eh, perhaps the fact that Causality itself > Time could be something? I'll be neutral for now and wait for staff input.
 
Astral_Trinity439 said:
Rather than working on a higher system of causality, this is more so that only the law of causality exists.
We already know from the working of SW that Causality > Time (Time does not exist in SW, yet Causality thus).
Click to expand...
Since ultimate skill users already operate on higher laws ,that makes time a higher system as it still binds them which doesn't apply within the suspended world making the law of causality an even higher than time
 
The_golden_and_silver_house94 said:
Since ultimate skill users already operate on higher laws ,that makes time a higher system as it still binds them which doesn't apply within the suspended world making the law of causality an even higher than time
Click to expand...
Well, something like Atemporal causality, yeah. But I'm not sure how we qualify that ability on this vsbw.
Perhaps you can use these scans too:
In conclusion, then, nothing can retain its existence in this world. It’s a place where none of the laws of physics apply at all, which is scary if you think about it. You have no idea what’ll happen, and if you carelessly blunder into this world, you’re likely to get seriously burned.

There exists a wall between those who can move in this stopped world and those who can’t, one as insurmountable as a dimensional barrier. Along those lines, I’m utterly amazed Diablo and Soei survived it at all.
--OTL Volume 19, Chapter 4
Click to expand...
I’m sure it is hard to understand data you can’t even measure—but regardless, Chloe had made it her own. Astounding as it was, stopping the flow of time felt like such a cheat. No wonder my sped-up senses couldn’t track her. If we’re all letting time flow around us, there’s no way we can observe something frozen in that dimension.

But hang on. Assuming that theory is correct, if someone can’t access a world frozen in time, there’s no way for them to interact with someone who is in that world, right?

Understood. This interpretation seems correct.
--OTL Volume 12, Chapter 1
Click to expand...
 
It seems reasonable enough and I find no issues with it. So agree.
Astral_Trinity439 said:
Well, something like Atemporal causality, yeah. But I'm not sure how we qualify that ability on this vsbw.
Perhaps you can use these scans too:
Click to expand...
Well, Type 4 Acausality is governed by or exhibits irregular or higher-order causality, does it not? So, being an atemporal form of causality should still qualify.
 
Astral_Trinity439 said:
I suppose yes.

Of a higher degree, if we give it that.
Click to expand...
Type 4 Acausality is an extremely broad category which is the reason why you’re also supposed to list out specific resistances since any change that isn’t strictly T1 -> T2 generally falls under this. As such (unless I’m mistaken and it is actually allowed on the wiki), an “extra layer” of acausality isn’t really a thing since all that’s actually important is the applications of it.

Though, I think “higher degree” is generally a fine term since it appears that the digital lifeforms—whom exhibit atemporal change—have more expansive usage of the hax than the other characters who only exhibit lesser versions of Type 4. (So in this case you’d list out more resistances for the former.)

In any case, if a mod thinks “1 layer into Type 4” is a valid term, then I’m also fine with it. Not that my vote matters, anyways.

(Like I guess a layer would be the capability of moving in some timeless realms but not others? Like a “degree” in timelessness [whatever that means], I guess? Can’t think of a fiction that would have that. In any case, this specific example doesn’t fit that, so I’d still say it’s just more resistances.)
 
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Super_Nova said:
Type 4 Acausality is an extremely broad category which is the reason why you’re also supposed to list out specific resistances since any change that isn’t strictly T1 -> T2 generally falls under this. As such (unless I’m mistaken and it is actually allowed on the wiki), an “extra layer” of acausality isn’t really a thing since all that’s actually important is the applications of it.

Though, I think “higher degree” is generally a fine term since it appears that the digital lifeforms—whom exhibit atemporal change—have more expansive usage of the hax than the other characters who only exhibit lesser versions of Type 4. (So in this case you’d list out more resistances for the former.)

In any case, if a mod thinks “1 layer into Type 4” is a valid term, then I’m also fine with it. Not that my vote matters, anyways.

(Like I guess a layer would be the capability of moving in some timeless realms but not others? Like a “degree” in timelessness [whatever that means], I guess? Can’t think of a fiction that would have that. In any case, this specific example doesn’t fit that, so I’d still say it’s just more resistances.)
Click to expand...
Pretty sure WN True Dragons also had "higher degree acausality" before, and even now. In the past it was based on layers, not sure if it's the same now tho, in case the standards got revised.
 
FinePoint said:
I think "1 layer into Acausality Type 4" is kind of inherently nonsense unless the two are directly compared canonically, which they're not.

Type 4 just describes an irregular form of causality, or some exception to normal causality. It's vague by its nature, so they can both have it in different ways.
Click to expand...
Are you fine with a higher degree ?
 
The_golden_and_silver_house94 said:
From the scan above,it becomes clear that causality is the foundational principle underlying the natural laws,these laws define different causal relationships,to understand and control the laws is to understand and control how causes and effects are structured in the world


The flow of time adds complexity to causal interactions make it a framework of causality





Even though ultimate skill users have acausality type 4 they are still bound by the flow of time There exist a wall between those who can move and those who can't , digital lifeforms can move in the suspended world,a phenomena disconnected from the flow of time , are not bound by time

So I propose 1 layer/higher degree of acausality type 4 for digital lifeforms


AGREE: FinePoint, ActuallySpaceMan42 , DarkDragonMedeus

NEUTRAL:

DISAGREE:
Click to expand...
I believe we’ve already received three staff approvals, and as far as I know, the grace period has ended. So, shouldn't this thread be closed?
 
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