Summer Time Rendering: A few additions (Part 1)

[Astral_Trinity439]

seems good

 

[Theglassman12]

@Fallen_Angelicx I'm not asking for you to correct him, I'm talking about the characters themselves in the series correcting him. Also time not being there doesn't really mean transcendence, it's a neutral statement when it comes to tier 1 stuff.

 

[Wikisource]

That doesn’t exactly answer my point, they say that they’re seeing timelines but not that they transcend space and time into a higher plane of existence, this sounds more like 4-D than anything with the explanation.

I don't agree with this, one thing is clear as I show the scan shows Tokoyo is above the lower dimensions, what is referred to as contextual timelines/worlds.

With that, they see the timeline as a 2D plane which is more than enough. And if you want to transcend space and time then yes, the eye has full control over space and time and transcends them.

and what exactly does the lower dimension in particular comprise of? Because the fact that no one's correcting the guy who claims they're in the 4th dimension whatsoever, on top of not elaborating that they're transcending the 4th dimension makes the tier 1 stuff pretty iffy.

I have solved it here.

In the timelines section, I showed Haine's eyes observing the timelines from a higher dimension.

In the Tokoyo section, I also show scans stating that Haine observes timelines from a higher plane of existence and Tokoyo is similarly claimed.

And finally Shinpei said



It is clearly a question, and we clearly cannot rely on a question to impose standards on it. Especially between a question from a lower dimensional being and a direct statement from a being from a higher dimension, the latter is clearly much more reliable. Therefore I do not agree with your above point of view.

 

[Theglassman12]

You didn’t really answer my point that he wasn’t corrected on at all in terms of where they’re at in the first place. The fact that no one corrects him that they’re in a higher plane than the 4th dimension isn’t helping your case

 

[Wikisource]

You didn’t really answer my point that he wasn’t corrected on at all in terms of where they’re at in the first place. The fact that no one corrects him that they’re in a higher plane than the 4th dimension isn’t helping your case

About what? I really don't understand what you're trying to say since the evidence is valid. So please tell me why it is possible to use a question as evidence to negate all accompanying supporting feats?

Just because it is stated is actually a question of whether it should be Low 2-C? Then SCP 5800 should be downgraded to Low 1-C instead of High 1-A because it is called the 5th dimension.

 

[Theglassman12]

If the question being asked is not answered in a way to correct the character’s statement that they’re not in the 4th dimension, but in the 5th dimension instead, it won’t help your claim. Plus being stated to be in a higher dimension can also mean it being the 4th dimension unless further elaborated to be beyond the 4th dimension.

 

[Wikisource]

If the question being asked is not answered in a way to correct the character’s statement that they’re not in the 4th dimension, but in the 5th dimension instead, it won’t help your claim. Plus being stated to be in a higher dimension can also mean it being the 4th dimension unless further elaborated to be beyond the 4th dimension.

That's not a revision because it's clearly a question, and you still haven't told me why you can rely on a question and say it's a statement and then use it as an argument? Second, how many D do you think the timeline is? It is clear that verses tend to use exaggerated statements in style, can you really give an H1B to a verse just because it claims to have infinite dimensions despite the claim? Is that correct or not?

 

[Wikisource]

One thing worth noting is that they observe the timelines/parallel worlds from the higher dimension, from the context it is clear that the timelines will be the lower dimension. Haine's eye has transcended time and ascended to a higher dimension. I'm still confused as to why you would jump into a question and ignore all the feats that come with it.

Based from here, here and here. Please check them carefully.

 

[Theglassman12]

I literally did, if you're just going to ignore why I'm pointing at the 4-D statement then you're just ignoring the conversation at this point when you're just saying it is.

That scan doesn't remotely say transcend time to a higher dimension wtf are you talking about? The power to overcome time doesn't mean tier 1, that can mean many things, you need to prove that they're referring to transcending dimensions and not some overpowering an ability type feat. The scan about "outside the world" doesn't exactly help your point since being outside of the universe/world doesn't mean transcendence.

 

[Wikisource]

Ahhhh, how many times have I told you how to use a question as an argument against something?" Second, it is clear that higher dimensional beings see lower dimensional beings. like a 2D plane, so why isn't tier 1 approved? Third, they overcome time and advance to a higher dimension with the power of the higher dimension, and the word "overcome" is synonymous with "transcend".

 

[Wikisource]

Even the characters in the verse sometimes call the parallel worlds is timelines, or time is used to refer to the world, so overcoming time is also overcoming the world. Not to mention that time is also dimension

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Said world they transcend is 2-C to 2-A. 4D construct being being seen as a 2D plane hence 5D. Not to mention the "higher dimension" statements and their control over inferior time and space. This should be tier 1 or at the very least a possibly tier 1. There is no way that a person can say this verse has 0 evidence for tier 1

 

[Theglassman12]

Can you actually provide evidence on your claims on overcoming means transcend to a higher dimension in this verse, on top of time and worlds being interchangeable?

 

[Wikisource]

Can you actually provide evidence on your claims on overcoming means transcend to a higher dimension in this verse, on top of time and worlds being interchangeable?

I will explain again.

First in this scan, Shide stated that Haine's eyes observe the timelines from a higher dimension. This is further stated again by Hizuru when she also states that Haine observes time from a higher plane of existence. And in this scan they say that the eye observes parallel worlds and repeats them.

=> Parallel worlds or time are equivalent. They are all terms to refer to 4D universes (including 3 spatial dimensions and 1 time dimension orthogonal to each other by default).

The second is that Shinpei's ability is essentially to move to other times in the past and erase old timelines.

According to this wiki's universe page, there is an additional dimension between universes and moving between them requires higher dimensional movement.

The most typical example is the presence of a higher dimensional space serving as a separator. In other words, two separate universes coexist in a four dimensional or even higher dimensional space, occupying different position along some additional dimensional axis. Therefore, in order to travel between such universes, the movement must be through the higher dimensional space between them.

And Haine's eyes were directly declared "overcome" time. When put into context, they clearly transcend time and space as explained above. It is also stated to be able to ascend to a higher dimension/plane of existence and observe time/the world the way 3D beings view a manga that represents the 2D world or itself. refers to the fact that they see lower dimensions as a 2D plane.

 

[Theglassman12]

You didn’t answer my question, does the series use worlds and time itself as interchangeable terms, if so where’s the scans for that? Same with overcoming and transcending.

 

[Wikisource]

You didn’t answer my question, does the series use worlds and time itself as interchangeable terms, if so where’s the scans for that? Same with overcoming and transcending.

Yes, it's all been explained and proven above.

 

[Theglassman12]

None of them answered my questions, it's just repeating the same thing without elaborating if time and worlds are used interchangeably, at this point we're going in circles, I'll tag some staff members.

@Planck69 @Emirp sumitpo @Maverick_Zero_X Any input on the tier 1 stuff would be appreciated.

 

[Wikisource]

None of them answered my questions, it's just repeating the same thing

I've given explanations but what you've done is repeat the same question over and over again and negate them without providing any reasonable reasons or counter-arguments. I still don't really understand what you want?

without elaborating if time and worlds are used interchangeably

Excuse me but wtf do you think I'm talking about ???????

First in this scan, Shide stated that Haine's eyes observe the timelines from a higher dimension. This is further stated again by Hizuru when she also states that Haine observes time from a higher plane of existence. And in this scan they say that the eye observes parallel worlds and repeats them.

=> Parallel worlds or time are equivalent. They are all terms to refer to 4D universes (including 3 spatial dimensions and 1 time dimension orthogonal to each other by default).

 

[Theglassman12]

I want some actual proof that overcoming time is a transcendence of higher dimensions and not some resistance feat, saying overcoming time isn't a tier 1 feat unless you can prove it means specifically that in the verse. You're not giving me anything in terms of actual transcendence of timelines here, just that they can see time, and said higher dimension is referred to the 4th dimension, which is time.

 

[Wikisource]

I want some actual proof that overcoming time is a transcendence of higher dimensions and not some resistance feat, saying overcoming time isn't a tier 1 feat unless you can prove it means specifically that in the verse. You're not giving me anything in terms of actual transcendence of timelines here, just that they can see time, and said higher dimension is referred to the 4th dimension, which is time.

Ahhhhh, that's why I wrote this.

And Haine's eyes were directly declared "overcome" time. When put into context, they clearly transcend time and space as explained above. It is also stated to be able to ascend to a higher dimension/plane of existence and observe time/the world the way 3D beings view a manga that represents the 2D world or itself. refers to the fact that they see lower dimensions as a 2D plane.

They had ascended to a higher dimension and by "overcoming" they were referring to "transcending" time (which I have proven to refer to 4D worlds). THEY SEE PARALLEL TIMELINES/WORLDS AS 2D and you are constantly ignoring this.

So let me ask you, what do people call a being that sees a 4D world as 2D?

 

[Theglassman12]

It literally did not say they saw a 4-D world as 2-D. They said that they see the manga world as 2-D, the most they ever said is that they’re in the 4th dimension, and you’ve yet to show me anything that they corrected him on where they are.

 

[Phoenks]

I don't really understand the nitpicking here the scans clearly state that they are looking down at timelines from a higher plane of existence. It seems pretty cut and dry to me.

 

[Wikisource]

It literally did not say they saw a 4-D world as 2-D. They said that they see the manga world as 2-D, the most they ever said is that they’re in the 4th dimension, and you’ve yet to show me anything that they corrected him on where they are.

WTF are you talking about ?????? They say they look at the lower worlds like a 3D being looks at a 2D manga, so what do you think this means????? And I've said many times that it's just a question, not a direct statement. For example, "Is A B?" So A is really B????????

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

All this is a basic analogy.

Wikisource can you show the scan that says that they're seeing timelines specifically as a lower dimension?

First of all, the two scans here and here confirm that Haine's eyes can observe time streams from a higher dimension/higher plane of existence.

And here it is mentioned that the owner of the eye can move to a higher dimension and is explained more specifically like a 3D being that can throw and burn a manga symbolizing the 2D world.

Note that Haine's eye originally belonged to Haine (the being from a higher dimension or Tokoyo) and using a power from a higher dimension to reach said dimension is acceptable.

The questions about the dimension structure of tokoyo and the mortal world was already addressed/proven. Idk why this is being nitpicked.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Wikisource you do realize the 4th dimension would already cover seeing the 3-D world as a lower plane right? That doesn’t automatically mean they’re in the 5th dimension when being in the 4th dimension would qualify enough.

@Fallen_Angelicx None of my questions were remotely answered though, you haven’t remotely proven that overcoming time is the same exact thing as transcending to a higher plane of existence. Especially when overcoming something can just mean you overpowered it like a resistance feat.

 

[Wikisource]

@Wikisource you do realize the 4th dimension would already cover seeing the 3-D world as a lower plane right? That doesn’t automatically mean they’re in the 5th dimension when being in the 4th dimension would qualify enough.

WTF???? Why ????

 

[Mizuki67]

Man this crt is still going ? I thought it was over

 

[Wikisource]

Man this crt is still going ? I thought it was over

It lasted longer than I expected, I actually started to feel tired and lose my temper.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Man

 

[Theglassman12]

@Wikisource Do you not have any idea on how timelines work? Especially when they treat normal universes as infinitesimal snapshots that extend from the past, present and future? That's still seeing the 3-D world as a lower plane. The only thing you have that remotely talks about transcending time itself is just a statement on overcoming time, something that doesn't mean transcendence as that can mean a resistance feat, again for the last time do you have any scans that show in the verse that overcoming something doesn't mean resisting/overpowering it, and instead is transcending the dimension in its entirety? If you can prove that's what they mean by overcoming time then I'll concede to this point.

 

[Wikisource]

@Wikisource Do you not have any idea on how timelines work? Especially when they treat normal universes as infinitesimal snapshots that extend from the past, present and future? That's still seeing the 3-D world as a lower plane. The only thing you have that remotely talks about transcending time itself is just a statement on overcoming time, something that doesn't mean transcendence as that can mean a resistance feat, again for the last time do you have any scans that show in the verse that overcoming something doesn't mean resisting/overpowering it, and instead is transcending the dimension in its entirety? If you can prove that's what they mean by overcoming time then I'll concede to this point.

Of course I know how it works, that's why I say seeing lower dimensions as 2D means you're in a higher dimension. As for transcendence, I have said it over and over again. Because apparently claims like "spacetime transcendence" are often reduced to BDE1 or feats of resistance until evidence is provided that the transcendence is qualitatively or quantitatively transcendent. quantity. And apparently I did that too when I showed the scans showing them seeing lower dimensions as 2D. This is clearly a superiority in quality, but normally how tf can you see a 4D object as 2D when it is also 4D?

 

[Theglassman12]

@Wikisource Space time transcendence doesn't always mean BD1, it's a bit more specific than that. You can ask Ultima Reality on that since he's more knowledgeable on that ability than I am. Also when it comes to space time transcendence, it can count for tier 1 scaling if transcending space and time is specified to be about transcending timelines/spacetime structures as a whole, and not just a random vague line.

If they're referring to the time and space as a whole being 2-D when they say that it's at his command then I guess I can see 5-D here.

 

[Wikisource]

@Wikisource Space time transcendence doesn't always mean BD1, it's a bit more specific than that. You can ask Ultima Reality on that since he's more knowledgeable on that ability than I am. Also when it comes to space time transcendence, it can count for tier 1 scaling if transcending space and time is specified to be about transcending timelines/spacetime structures as a whole, and not just a random vague line.

If they're referring to the time and space as a whole being 2-D when they say that it's at his command then I guess I can see 5-D here.

I heard that there was some correction to the BDE but that's not important. Obviously "transcendent", "overcome", "beyond" space-time all provide resistance feats. They are common in works with many different words but all have the same meaning, this is to ensure aesthetics in style, something this wiki itself has also noted because of the tendency to use flowery in works. work. And I have proven many times that they actually transcend time and space to go to higher dimensions and observe them in 2D.

 

[Wikisource]

Bump

 

[Wikisource]

@Wikisource Space time transcendence doesn't always mean BD1, it's a bit more specific than that. You can ask Ultima Reality on that since he's more knowledgeable on that ability than I am. Also when it comes to space time transcendence, it can count for tier 1 scaling if transcending space and time is specified to be about transcending timelines/spacetime structures as a whole, and not just a random vague line.

If they're referring to the time and space as a whole being 2-D when they say that it's at his command then I guess I can see 5-D here.

So what is your opinion rn?

 

[Jozaysmith?]

@Wikisource Space time transcendence doesn't always mean BD1

True, according to a thread i made concerning the clearance on BDE1 & 2
To transcend or exist outside time doesn't count as being BDE, for type 1 one must have a non-temporal, non-spatial existence
Its just like how being outside existence doesn't count as nep, BDE2 is R>F on time and space (which i think they have on this verse which is why they got 5D in the first place), your 4D arguments does make sense and feel this is staffs beings staffs (because its called the 4th dimension so no one cares whatever argument you bring as long as it isnt very very specific about transcending it)
I mean if you do view infinite timelines from a higher dimension according to how you view comics and shit ofcourse its wiki standards of Low 1-C and i agree with that, and then the other one will be R^6 according to wiki standards, so call a staff that'll propely listen to your opinion, i am guessing its not the staffs ignoring your evidence or being bias but because of how it's disaplayed so unless you all want to adjust the dimensional rating of how time works then this counts as Low 1-C according to wiki standards so there's no doubting of @Wikisource arguments but please view it in whole heart and give your number of agreements
The disagreements weren't so justified and i am not doubting your judgment too mod San, but view what he is saying in light
Because when watching the anime i also saw the MC go through the lines of time, the 4th dimensional perception of this is like how 3D views 2D, so this works very much

So what is your opinion rn?

 

[Wikisource]

True, according to a thread i made concerning the clearance on BDE1 & 2
To transcend or exist outside time doesn't count as being BDE, for type 1 one must have a non-temporal, non-spatial existence
Its just like how being outside existence doesn't count as nep, BDE2 is R>F on time and space (which i think they have on this verse which is why they got 5D in the first place), your 4D arguments does make sense and feel this is staffs beings staffs (because its called the 4th dimension so no one cares whatever argument you bring as long as it isnt very very specific about transcending it)
I mean if you do view infinite timelines from a higher dimension according to how you view comics and shit ofcourse its wiki standards of Low 1-C and i agree with that, and then the other one will be R^6 according to wiki standards, so call a staff that'll propely listen to your opinion, i am guessing its not the staffs ignoring your evidence or being bias but because of how it's disaplayed so unless you all want to adjust the dimensional rating of how time works then this counts as Low 1-C according to wiki standards so there's no doubting of @Wikisource arguments but please view it in whole heart and give your number of agreements
The disagreements weren't so justified and i am not doubting your judgment too mod San, but view what he is saying in light
Because when watching the anime i also saw the MC go through the lines of time, the 4th dimensional perception of this is like how 3D views 2D, so this works very much

Thanks for the input, glad you reinforced my topic.

 

[Jozaysmith?]

Thanks for the input, glad you reinforced my topic.

You can clarify it in this thread or give a proper summary sometimes no one wants to "Read allat" , to make it easier for you and other staffs give a summary just saying how the 4th dimension works, because since some see all this as stress they would just end up saying "i agree to glassman opinion" and that would probably wreck the whole thread

 

[Wikisource]

You can clarify it in this thread or give a proper summary sometimes no one wants to "Read allat" , to make it easier for you and other staffs give a summary just saying how the 4th dimension works, because since some see all this as stress they would just end up saying "i agree to glassman opinion" and that would probably wreck the whole thread

Thank you for your advice, I will take note.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Wikisource if the “space and time are his to command” line is treated as seeing them both as a lower plane then I’m fine with tier 1.