Speed downgrades for high-tiers to below-lightspeed

[Goodyfresh]

He's not, he ate the piece, in chapter even.

Yes we know. What we're talking about is that when *********** first released their scanlation of the chapter where Don Slime is talking about it later, they mistranslated what he said to say that THE PIECE OF NEO HAD EATEN MOON! Seriously. That was the very first available English version of that chapter too. A lot of people online were FLIPPING OUT for a few hours until *********** realized their mistake and corrected it.

But that to me means that I just can't really trust ***********'s translations very much for the series. I mean if they could make a huge, glaring error like that, who knows how many of the smaller details they've mistranslated?

 

[Primaris_Brian]

yep, and *********** somehow say otherwise, but they already fixing the translation, I mean the translator made an apology letter because of that.

 

[Primaris_Brian]

http://c.mhcdn.net/store/manga/3660/352.0/compressed/l014.jpg?v=1450375325

this...

 

[Goodyfresh]

http://c.mhcdn.net/store/manga/3660/352.0/compressed/l014.jpg?v=1450375325
this...

"Moon has been eaten." Man I remember FREAKING OUT when I first read that, and then once I sat and thought about it thinking to myself "man, that HAS to be a mistranslation. Total BS, man."

Anyway guys you've all managed to convince me that characters like Bambina in this series actually are, in-fact, FTL, and that in terms of the seeming contraditictions to that involving ANOTHER escaping Moon it's probably just a case of highly inconsistent writing/an author who can't make up his mind. So this thread can be closed

That being said, it WOULD be nice to to figure out some kind of rudimentary calc for the mold-spear dodging-feat. I could make an attempt to do one someday,j but it would probably be best if someone on here more experienced at doing calcs took care of it. The questions would be: How far away from Coco do we think Bambina was (it's not clear in the panels in question, we aren't given proper perspective, but it has to be a shorter distance than the width of the Enbu Match Ring, obviously), and just how close to the speed of light were the spears moving (90 percent? 99 percent? 99.999 percent? At this point in the story with Coco having powered-up with Enbu, I'd GUESS it is probably something like at least 99 percent lightspeed)? If anybody from on here starts a thread for a Bambina-dodging-feat calc, I'd love it if they could remember to PM me about it, because I'm very curious to figure out just how FTL Bambina would have to be to weave between those spears like that.

Oh, another question for the calc would be: Are we or are we not making considerations involving relativistic physics when it comes to the motion of the mold-spears (obviously we aren't for Bambina's motion, if he's FTL he is violating relativity). If we are, then in terms of how Bambina manages to weave between the spears, we'd have to keep in mind the relativistic length-contraction of the spears themselves at that velocity! Meaning the spears he's weaving between would actually have a far shorter length than when we see Coco holding a spear in his hand. I'm not sure but it seems like that should make a difference for the calc in terms of how short a period of time Bambina had available to weave between all the spears.

I suspect that beings with living cells empowered with a field of appetite-energy are able to ignore relativistic physics and thus travel FTL. But the mold-spears are something released and separated from Coco's body, thus separated from his appetite-energy-field, and thus probably limited by relativity and the lightspeed-barrier.

 

[Heatforce]

are they being downgraded? I remember making a post about the mold spears too but the official english translation apparently had Coco's mold spears at light speed. Still, interesting point about how coco telegraphs his attack. Did not think to use that in my debate lol.

 

[Alakabamm]

It is a lightspeed attack so the length contraction goes to zero hence we can't use it.

 

[RavenSupreme]

regarding the FTL stuff - another is the only thing officially confirmed to be FTL due to authors/ narrators textbox

the moldspear only has a character statement which are less accurate.

 

[Heatforce]

@RavenSupreme, Devil's advocate - Coco is probably the most intelligent of the four heavenly kings with Toriko a close second. I think we can beleive Coco but it's just crazy how his one statement makes or breaks the verse in regard to speed.

 

[Goodyfresh]

It is a lightspeed attack so the length contraction goes to zero hence we can't use it.

The problem here is that unfortunately even official english translations for manga are not always actually accurate. What we really need is an actual Japanese/English bilingual speaker who reads the manga in the original Japanese to tell us whether it says "lightspeed" or "near lightspeed." Because it seems kinda weird that at least two different scanlation-groups would end up with the word "near" or something along those lines in there, but the official English translation wouldn't.

Anyway, postulating that the official translation IS the correct one (which I doubt), then if it IS lightspeed, that could be precisely due to it using energies that violate relativistic principles ("appetite energy" mumbo-jumbo), and thus relativistic concerns like length-contraction probably don't apply to the spears if that is in fact the case and they are able to go 100% lightspeed.

It's actually a very well-known fact that certain feats in very high-profile anime and manga like DBZ have been misrepresented in "official" English translations of those series before. To this day, in fandoms for manga where people are super-obsessive, like Berserk, people still debate the merits of the "official" English translations of certain passages in the series vs. those from scanlation groups.

"regarding the FTL stuff - another is the only thing officially confirmed to be FTL due to authors/narrators textbox

the moldspear only has a character statement which are less accurate."

--RavenSupreme, I agree with you on that, actually. We only have one thing in the series "officially confirmed" as FTL. But I mean, stuff has to be taken by what we see, too, I suppose. I mean why do you think everybody acknowledges that Dragon Ball Z characters are FTL and FTL+ and Dragon Ball Super characters are MFTL+? It's because they exhibit speed-feats clearly on such a level. It's NEVER been STATED "oh my goodness, Goku is going faster than light!" or anything like that, but that doesn't matter because he clearly is.

I guess the problem that made it hard for me to see this in Toriko is that the FTL feats are not nearly as clear-cut.

I do not agree with you about character statements in Toriko though. They tend to be very reliable and in fact are clearly used in the series to show us the current power-scale of the characters involved (like when Setsuno yelled "Jirou, don't hit the planet, you'll destroy it!"). If Coco says "nearly lightspeed" (which I suspect is the more literal translation rather than the "lightspeed" translation in the "official" English versions), then we can take that as being true. The question is, what does he mean by that? Something like, say, 75% lightspeed is still high-enough relativistic to potentially be called "nearly" lightspeed in a certain context, you know. Or does he truly mean "high relativistic," like 99% or more of lightspeed?

Heatforce: "are they being downgraded? I remember making a post about the mold spears too but the official english translation apparently had Coco's mold spears at light speed. Still, interesting point about how coco telegraphs his attack. Did not think to use that in my debate lol."

It is true what I said that Bambina could easily observe the motions of Coco's body and all the other sensory information coming off of his body in order to predict the trajectories of all the mold-spears once thrown, yeah I mean, come on guys, we have to remember what has been stated as actually the most impressive thing about the Eight Kings--their unbelievable instincts and senses! So while he did still weave between the spears and thus is FTL, we have to keep in mind that Bambina certainly did not have to percieve and react to the mold-spears AFTER they were already throwaaaaaa

 

[RavenSupreme]

I don't have the time to dive into it. I thought it's clear that toriko is a FTL verse - just wanted to point out some things

Going to take a look at it tomorrow again

 

[Heatforce]

@Goodyfresh, here's my thread. Even though I was debunked tell me what you think: https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/101332 Also, I made the thread because I was under the impression Coco's spore worked similar to this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilobolus_crystallinus

 

[Goodyfresh]

@Goodyfresh, here's my thread. Even though I was debunked tell me what you think:
https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/101332 Also, I made the thread because I was under the impression Coco's spore worked similar to this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilobolus_crystallinus

Yeah see I don't think he was going FTL when trying to kiss them. He only went FTL when dodging the mold-spears because doing so actually REQUIRED FTL movement. I doubt taht even the Eight Kings actually go to the trouble and presumably fairly-extreme effort of using their appetite-energy to bypass relativististic physics with like, any movement they make, or even more semi-serious movements like that kiss. They probably only bother to hit those speeds when theya re in combat and it actually REQUIRES such speeds.

Unlike GOD which clearly didn't even NEED to dodge the mold-spears but did so anyway at the last possible moment as if just to SHOW-OFF how stupid-fast it is. "Divine Beast," holy crap man. Haha.

 

[Goodyfresh]

I was wrong about this, can someone please close the thread?