Sonic vs Kirby

[DragonLord]

why was when sonic was weaker people just ruled this match out instantly cuz it was a stomp and kirby resists everything sonic has but now that he’s stronger he suddenly has wincons again lmaoooo

Because I’m here babyeeeee

 

[The_Pink_God]

why was when sonic was weaker people just ruled this match out instantly cuz it was a stomp and kirby resists everything sonic has but now that he’s stronger he suddenly has wincons again lmaoooo

Pretty sure Kirby doesn't resist half of what sonic has

 

[DragonLord]

Also, the Sealing with Magic Hands is one of his main Upgrades in SA2 that you can do by just being right next to an enemy as long as I think there a certain size?, Kirby is certainly small enough to fit and I’d say it’s reasonably in character

it’s not on the profile right now but I’d also like to have a special mention to Super Rush from Chronicles which likely increases Sonic’s AP by a few since it one shot a equal opponent

 

[sanicspood]

it’s not on the profile right now but I’d also like to have a special mention to Super Rush from Chronicles which likely increases Sonic’s AP by a few since it one shot a equal opponent

if it’s not on the profile it ain’t a factor here tbh

 

[The_Pink_God]

I'll still stay on Kirby side cuz of one-shot and mild haxes that masonic format resist

 

[DragonLord]

I’m going Sonic (Nitpicky and Biased I know) because Sonic has a few Hax and would likely Live out the Match to utilize them, I also don’t really have the numbers to decide if it’s a one shot and Sonic pretty much passively reflects and Eliminates projectiles at times

 

[sanicspood]

idk man, sonic never starts out with hax and all kirby has to do is one shot

 

[DragonLord]

idk man, sonic never starts out with hax and all kirby has to do is one shot

I pointed out several moments where he did and tried to explain why he’d live out long enough to start considering other tactics, he may be cocky but even against foes he considers easy pickings he can keep his time to wait for a opening

I’m also not really even sure it is a one shot, plus doesn’t Sonic have his own resurrection?, it’s listed there, he’d be getting a second chance

 

[sanicspood]

I pointed out several moments where he did and tried to explain why he’d live out long enough to start considering other tactics, he may be cocky but even against foes he considers easy pickings he can keep his time to wait for a opening

but when has he lived out long enough to realize he needs hax, i under stand he has like analytical prediction and can find fighting patterns etcc but when has he used hax with that type of thinking

 

[DragonLord]

but when has he lived out long enough to realize he needs hax, i under stand he has like analytical prediction and can find fighting patterns etcc but when has he used hax with that type of thinking

I mean, he did pretty much instantly figure out how to Pacify Perfect Chaos and how to Hurt Solaris’es Mind to Knock them out (which is listed as Limited Mind Manipulation on the profile), he also just started the Match against the Egg Wizard only doing Reflection

 

[sanicspood]

I mean, he did pretty much instantly figure out how to Pacify Perfect Chaos and how to Hurt Solaris’es Mind to Knock them out (which is listed as Limited Mind Manipulation on the profile), he also just started the Match against the Egg Wizard only doing Reflection

so it looks like he’ll use the hax that he needs, what would he figure out to do before he gets practically one shotted or just straight up knocked out?

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Sonic has used Color Powers and Time Break in-character. He starts with physical attacks but will use his more versatile abilities if he lasts long enough.

 

[DragonLord]

so it looks like he’ll use the hax that he needs, what would he figure out to do before he gets practically one shotted or just straight up knocked out?

He’d probably figure out fast how to deal with ranged attacks near instantly, In Time Stop he would have some time to figure out his physical attacks aren’t doing much, after that I think him using The Magic Hands is decently in character if he’s right next to the opponent (I mean remember like 80% of Super Sonic matches have the opponent running away from him)

 

[sanicspood]

He’d probably figure out fast how to deal with ranged attacks near instantly, In Time Stop he would have some time to figure out his physical attacks aren’t doing much, after that I think him using The Magic Hands is decently in character if he’s right next to the opponent (I mean remember like 80% of Super Sonic matches have the opponent running away from him)

i can see the time stop stuff but idk about magic hands, sonics like always flying around while kirby is mostly on ground, so i’m not sure if he’d be right next to kirby, and if he was he’d prob get one shotted ig

 

[DragonLord]

i can see the time stop stuff but idk about magic hands, sonics like always flying around while kirby is mostly on ground, so i’m not sure if he’d be right next to kirby, and if he was he’d prob get one shotted ig

Usually he’s flying around to get to an opponent, Sonic could just use Magic Hands in time stop too, there’s no limitation on Sonic using his abilities in time stop last I recall

I don’t really remember any long cooldowns between Time stops ether

 

[sanicspood]

Usually he’s flying around to get to an opponent, Sonic could just use Magic Hands in time stop too, there’s no limitation on Sonic using his abilities in time stop last I recall

I don’t really remember any long cooldowns between Time stops ether

i see. i’ll remain neutral for now i just wanna see some kirby arguements before i votr

 

[The_Pink_God]

it's funny how when I did the thread everyone said, Kirby stomped but now everyone actually arguing for Sonic's side

 

[DragonLord]

it's funny how when I did the thread everyone said, Kirby stomped but now everyone actually arguing for Sonic's side

Guess just AP difference + people think Sonic just has never used Hax at all In fights for some reason, he may be cocky but he’s not stupid

 

[The_Pink_God]

My vote still goes for Kirby btw, better AP, Hax, Versatility, and he's also smarter than Sonic
Just rephrasing that cuz my vote wasn't counted

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Anyone know the exact number to Kirby’s 4-A AP?

 

[DragonLord]

If it wasn’t obvious I Vote Sonic

 

[The_Pink_God]

Does anyone know the exact number of Kirby’s 4-A AP?

From what I heard
16 starry skies times 100 to 1000 IINW

 

[GlaceonGamez471]

From what I heard
16 starry skies times 100 to 1000 IINW

Um, assuming that's even remotely true (I have my doubts) then Kirby would be 3-C even with the x100 low end of that assumption if I'm not mistaken with my math

 

[The_Pink_God]

Um, assuming that's even remotely true (I have my doubts) then Kirby would be 3-C even with the x100 low end of that assumption if I'm not mistaken with my math

Well that's the thing
The explanation in the Kirby scaling pages says that 1 Jamba Heart scales to Magolor's feat which was destroying 16 starry skies, VT is made of condensed power of hundreds if not thousands of Jamba Hearts and then a huge chain scaling which lead to the verse being "Borderline 3-C"
So basically he's really really high into 4-A or that's what's him supposed to be

 

[ShakeResounding]

The explanation in the Kirby scaling pages says that 1 Jamba Heart scales to Magolor's feat which was destroying 16 starry skies, VT is made of condensed power of hundreds-

Let me stop you right there. That alone is not borderline 3-C, that is 3-C. Just one singular hundred would be 3-C, and if 100 is also lowballing it then Kirby in no way should be 4-A in this key.

 

[DragonLord]

Well that's the thing
The explanation in the Kirby scaling pages says that 1 Jamba Heart scales to Magolor's feat which was destroying 16 starry skies, VT is made of condensed power of hundreds if not thousands of Jamba Hearts and then a huge chain scaling which lead to the verse being "Borderline 3-C"
So basically he's really really high into 4-A or that's what's him supposed to be

I feel for this we’d need a more solid number here, specially since it seems unsure just how many Jamba Hearts Void has

 

[The_Pink_God]

I feel for this we’d need a more solid number here, specially since it seems unsure just how many Jamba Hearts Void has

It's a least in the hundreds that's for sure apparently

 

[The_Pink_God]

Let me stop you right there. That alone is not borderline 3-C, that is 3-C. Just one singular hundred would be 3-C.

Wait what :O

 

[DragonLord]

It's a least in the hundreds that's for sure apparently

Anything pointing to that?, not doubting you this just seems like a odd situation

 

[ShakeResounding]

@Pink999999

1.688e63 Joules (starry sky) x 16 x 100 = 2.7008e66 Joules

Baseline 3-C = 1.053e66 Joules

So, again, being conservative to keep 4-A doesn't even make sense here. It ain't even mathematically possible.

 

[The_Pink_God]

Anything pointing to that?, not doubting you this just seems like a odd situation

Is this good enough for you?

On the amount of Jamba Heart pieces/Dark Hearts that make a complete Jamba Heart, while unknown, we do the following:

• The pieces of a complete Jamba Heart spread across space into many planets in the beginning of Kirby Star Allies.
• The spread pieces were described in a Famitsu magazine and the Kirby Star Allies Channel as "countless".
• On the ones that went into Planet Popstar, looking closely they're 6 that rained in front of Whispy Woods, 3 that rained near Meta Knight and 1 that crashed in Dedede's Castle. It might be that the 2 that went inside Whispy Woods and Meta Knight were different ones from the rest, but all the future Jamba Heart pieces seen after this could have been previously seen ones having advanced like Kirby & co. did.
• It's stated that the pieces rained across the universe or the galaxy, but this doesn't necessarily mean anything over how many of them they are.
• It's likely that the Jamba Heart pieces rained on the planets, moons and the star levels Kirby & co. travelled in their adventure given how they were always stated to chase the Dark Hearts and 1 of them sometimes showed up on the moons. The amount of pieces that rained on those celestial bodies (minus the star) isn't necessarily the same as in Planet Popstar as the latter is around 2 times larger than a regular planet, but this places alone are very likely not all the celestial bodies where the Jamba Heart pieces rained, only the ones Kirby & co. visited while following them into 1 direction.

 

[The_Pink_God]

@Pink999999

1.688e63 Joules (starry sky) x 16 x 100 = 2.7008e66 Joules

Baseline 3-C = 1.053e66 Joules

So, again, being conservative to keep 4-A doesn't even make sense here. It ain't even mathematically possible.

I'm... Confused now :V

 

[ShakeResounding]

Is this good enough for you?

Yeah that is in no way less than a measly hundred. And for it to even still be 4-A requires being conservative to a very worrying degree, which makes it ridiculous to not even be 3-C to begin with. So I'm as confused as you are as to how this key isn't Tier 3, because from what I'm seeing? It should be.

 

[DragonLord]

Is this good enough for you?

Hmmm, yeah I suppose I could see 100 even if it’s a bit vague

 

[The_Pink_God]

Ok so I actually was wrong
It's not 100 to 1000
It's several dozens to hundreds
Oops

 

[DragonLord]

Ok so I actually was wrong
It's not 100 to 1000
It's several dozens to hundreds
Oops

Well uh, what now then?

 

[The_Pink_God]

Well uh, what now then?

His AP would actually be 16 starry skies times several dozens to a few hundreds + the chain scaling

 

[DragonLord]

@Maverick_Zero_X is that clear enough?

 

[ShakeResounding]

I'm... Pretty sure that would still make him 3-C. "Several" means 3 or more, a quick Google search shows, so let's just go with 3 dozen to be conservative.

1.688e63 Joules (starry sky) x 16 x 36 = 9.72288e65 Joules.

1.053e66 Joules (Baseline 3-C)/9.72288e65 Joules = A 1.08301244x difference.

That number comes with a scaling chain. Kirby ranks among the top... He's 3-C either way.

 

[BlastX]

Well given that Kirby is about to enter 3-C, this match is gonna be a stomp, so it should be closed.

At least till the Kirby AP Revisions are resolved.

Goodnight everybody.