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Some abilities for Anti-Spiral

DaFritzi

DaFritzi

590
35
Since the Anti-Spiral is basically the manifestation of the collective consciousness of the Anti-Spiral race there are some traits he logically should have as a result.

Immunity to Soul Manipulation: Since he is the manifestation of a consciousness he himself is technically soulless.

Resistance to Mind Manipulation: The manifestation itself doesn't contain a mind to be manipulated. Also should the opponent have an ability to directly affect the collective consciousness behind the manifestation he would have to manipulate the minds of thousands of Anti-Spirals at the same time in order to succeed.

Type 8 Immortality reliant on the Anti-Spiral race: Destroying the manifestation of a consciousness doesn't destroy the consciousness itself. As long as the Anti-Spiral race exists they should be capable of creating a new manifestation. In the series the entire Anti-Spiral race happened to be eliminated alongside the manifestation, that is why this ability could not be used by AS when he was defeated.

Input is appreciated.

EDIT:

Instead of Type 8 Immortality, low-godly regen might be more appropriate.

Some other abilities have been suggested, look here for a summary.
 
I am unsure about no.1 but personally I have no problem, anti spiral is an abstract cosnciousness of an entire universe of spiral beings.

Given AS has trillions of spiral being's consciousness blended, it would be immensely hard to mind control such a being (not impossible however). Also AS itself has mind manipulation so it knows how it works.

I am uncertain about type 8 immortality, other members might have better input

Also shouldn't the category abstracts be added to Anti Spiral? The mecha is not its true form
 
1. Seems good

2. True, especially since the planet was shelled up inside what looks like planetary concrete, and was at an unknown location until AS became Granzeboma.

3. Also seems good. I would add Type 1 Immortality (longevity), via the AS race being in suspended animation.
 
I would agree with 1 and 2. The Anti-Spiral halted their evolution and destroyed their individualities - In that way they got rid of their own souls. That same reasoning also extends to Resistance to Mind Manipulation. Additionally, I think they should also get Mind Manipulation given how their Extradimentional Labyrinth affects any sentient being. It's also a very high level of Mind Manipulation/Illusion Creation.

Point 3 also looks to be technically true, considering that they can't be permanently killed without finding the hidden universe where they hide themselves (and travelling there), but I am not 100% behind it
 
I agree with the suggested Type 1 Immortality and Mind Manipulation. The Extradimensional Labyrinth wasn't the only time AS used mind manip. There was also the scene were he enforced a vision of the spiral nemesis on Simon and his crew.

I'm not 100% abstract entity. However since AS is basically a consciousness it should be plausible. Maybe we should also consider adding non-corporeal to his abilities. Since he is a consciousness it should apply to him.
 
1. If the Anti-Spiral is the collective consciousness of the Anti-Spiral race, there are basically billions, if not more souls pretty much gathered in a single character, although is there an episode that states this? The episodes only show us that the entire Anti-Spiral halted their evolution (kept themselves in stasis), but not much else.

2. Given the reasons that Joseph listed above, the AS has billions, if not trillions of consciousness blended in, thus mind controlling something like that is akin to controlling trillions of beings. Plus with AS's skill in mind manipulation (attempting to mind control NIa/Anti-Spiral Nia), he would likely have developed a resistance for that as well.

3. Type 8 Immortality = Reliant Immortality. The definition for that term is

  • The power to be immortal as long as a certain object, person, or a concept exists.
The issue with this is that the Anti-Spiral seems to exist very well on its own, as there was nothing mentioned in the series that the AS was reliant on a specific object/person to keep himself immortal. We do know however, that the Anti-Spiral has been existing in his own universe for an unknown period of time (if not billions of years), and never seemed to suffer any effects from old age/illness, etc. Also noting that the entire anti-spiral race kept themselves to their own planet in stasis, which would mean that while they are shown to be unconscious, they were not stated to have completely died from this.

Thus, a better qualification of the Anti-Spiral's immortality would be Type 1, which states that

  • Characters gifted with this type of immortality cannot die from natural causes, such as old age or conventional illness, but can be killed by unnatural causes.
The Anti-Spiral's immortality would fit right into this definition.
 
From an outsider's perspective though, the AS seems to have Type 8 Immortality because they can defeat or kill their Manifestations but the actual Anti Spiral exist safely in a remote, hidden universe. It's more like an appearance of Type 8 Immortality
 
@Lina

About #1, that's not quite true.

It's the manifestation of the species, but its souls are still contained in their locked away bodies. The manifestation itself that we see is strictly their consciousness, nothing about their souls.
 
This would mean that the Anti-Spiral is still vulnerable to soul manipulation then since the Anti-Spiral still has a soul.
 
No. The Anti-Spiral's manifestation that we always see has no soul, the bodies that make up its being do. It's different.
 
So this means point 1 and 2 of OP as well as type 1 immortality have been accepted?

The abilities we still need to discuss are:

  • Mind manipulation (Can enforce visions on others, also via Extradimensional Labyrinth)
  • Non Corporeal, possibly Abstract Entity (Collective consciousness only, not for the manifestation, not for Anti-Spiral race)
  • The ability he gets from not dying as long as the collective consciousness exists (Manifestation only)
The thought behind point 3 here is that the manifestation of AS can theoretically always be recreated as long as the consciousness exists. If one were to destroy the manifestion (and unlike Simon in the series does not eradicate the AS race alongside) it can be recreated over and over as long as the consciousness exists. Should the consciousness be destroyed however the AS race would most likely die as well. I suppose low-godly regen would be the most appropriate in this case, as the manifestation can theoretically be recreated from said consciousness as long as such exists.
 
Well AS got a hole drilled in him and recognized he was going to die before the whole universe went boom, so there's that.
 
In my opinion the explosion came from destroying the manifestation. That explosion eradicated the AS race, since they were fighting on the AS home planet. With them the collective consciousness died and that in turn caused the universal space-time it was upholding to collapse.

But of course everyone can have his/her own opinion on what happened in that scene. It's not like it is obvious what really happened.
 
AS low-godly
AS low-godly 2
The scene of AS defeat has always bugged me and I finally remembered why. In the pictures I posted you see Boota completely destroying the manifestation of AS. And in the next scene AS appears behind him.

I think that should support my suggestion as well as my previous theory.
 
Ooooh nice find. Is that the scene where Boota does that and he just casually walks back from the same spot that he arrived on?
 
Yeah, Boota destroyes the manifestation, you hear AS laughing omnidirectional and then he casually appears behind him. (Video 14:45)
 
I'd say that most of these abilities in the OP as well as the other powers and abilities checks out, I do question how the universe blows up due to its destruction at the hands of Simon but doesn't when Boota destroys him. If I had to take a guess it would be that the amount of Spiral energy he was pierced with caused him to explode not unlike how a lightbulb can combust when it is infused with too much electricity. I would also add that AS was able to theorize the idea of the Spiral Nemisis before any other species, not sure if it is notable enough to add but it does imply cognitive abilities. I wouldn't say straight pre-cognition, but something along the lines of being able to predict events extremely well. Maybe add it to AS's intelligence.
 
My interpretation is that Anti-Spiral basically committed suicide after aknowledging that he's unable to defeat Simon and unable to cause him to Despair. Simon presented a different outcome to what the AS feared would have happened and the Anti-Spiral admitted defeat
 
@XimXim This is definitely something we can add to the intelligence section, but I'll rewatch the scene when I have time.

@XimXim and RoyGundam Both of your theories are plausible and fit the events. Taking AS last words into consideration I kinda prefer RoyGundam's version. Mainly because it really felt like AS accepted his defeat, maybe he was even happy about being finally able to pass on the responsibility he had to bear for so long.

Anyways both of those theories support my claim since they solve the question of why he blew up in this specific scene, but didn't do so in another. We might want to wait for a bit more input but I think we are on a good way of getting low-godly regen accepted.

It also seems like adding mind manipulation was generally accepted, but what do you guys think about non-corporeal (consciousness only). Given a consciousness doesn't have a body it does only make sense in my opinion.
 
AS was talking as the universe itself before he created that giant portal where his head popped out, so yeah.
 
You can probably ask Matt for his thoughts on this, or go to the staff listed on the supporters of the verse section of the GL verse.
 
The Everlasting is knowledgeable about Gurren Lagann. I will ask him for input.
 
@XimXim Probably a good idea since we're talking about a serious ability upgrade.

@Ant Thanks, Ever already commented on the OP and I'm sure his opinion on the abilities suggested afterwards will be helpful as well.

@Unite My Rice I have asked some people for input, now we'll just have to wait for a few days like XimXim suggested.
 
1. Well from what i remember the spirals souls are just in the bodies and the manifestation is just consciousness with the soul not really shown at all so i feel this is legit

2. I can see that being his power as there are so many anti-spirals minds blended in so i guess this is legit as well

3. As others mentioned type 1 should be added due to them living for so long with type 8 well idk it was never truly reliant on a specific thing and after winning it went extinct so i'm iffy about it as it's based on the consciousness but not an object or person

I'm just answer from my memory so it could be not accurate Ever is the expert of TTGL here
 
1. Ok with this.

2. Mind controlling thousands of minds would be hard, so he should hav mind manipulation resistance yes.

3. Unsure about this
 
I personally think that 1, 2, and 3 (the type 8 immortality version) all seem to make sense.
 
Okay. I think that the accepted changes can be performed then.
 
I do not think that the Regenerationn seems appropriate.
 
Since this was generally accepted and the thread open long enough for others to give their opinion I'm going to add the results now. I'm going to add the following abilities to AS page:

Immunity to Soul Manipulation

Resistance to Mind Manipulation

Type 1 and Type 8 Immortality

Mind Manipulation

Non-Corporeal (Collective consciousness only) - Since Unite My Rice agreed and nobody objected I guess this was accepted as well. Please correct me if I misunderstood it.
 
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