Small Punch Out!! CRT

[DaReaperMan]

so, is there any reason that Mike Tyson and First Key Little Mac aren't 9-B? i mean, i get that we scale Mike Tyson to his real life prime counterpart at least in some regards but everyone else who is in the 1987 Punch Out!!(which was all of them with the exception of Nick Bruiser) don't have 9-C keys even though they are all much weaker then Tyson who one-shots Little Mac for the first 90 seconds of the fight, it doesn't make sense that a character who is such a top-tier that you needed to get EVERY championship done in order to even attempt to fight him is a bottom tier for the entire verse, with the only lesser characters being Little Mac in his first key and Nick Bruiser, who i honestly don't even know anything about but being a supposed champion he should just outright scale to being 9-B.

Also why does Mike Tyson have peak human stamina? that implies that he is capable of fighting for at least over 10 minutes and not get tired, which his blows are weak by the eight minute mark, implying exhaustion, also everyone should scale to Superhuman with Subsonic reactions and combat speed.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I agree that classic era key should get axed; there's no reason for everyone to be that much weaker and Mike Tyson in this game obviously isn't the real Mike Tyson; a fictional version that can be much stronger instead.

I also pretty much agree with everything here.

 

[DaReaperMan]

So from these changes the pages that are effected are: Mike Tyson, Little Mac, Nick Bruiser, Mr. Sandman, Bald Bull, and Super Macho Man. The ladder half being due to speed changes and the fact that Subsonic+ is pretty ridiculous upscaling when Little Mac sits at Subsonic. And as for other changes LS should be scaled to Class 25, Mike in particular should be "At Least 9-B" scaling above Mr. Sandman, and Little Mac+Nick Bruiser will just scale normally

As for stamina id say Mike Tyson should get Average stamina due to tiring himself out and heavily implied exhaustion after just 8 minutes of fighting

 

[DaReaperMan]

There's also the whole "fear" weakness on Tyson's profile that is scaled from his IRL self, though I won't go into details on Mike Tyson IRL for you know why. But the fear weakness should be removed.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Yeah, I do now see how that is canon either.

 

[Armorchompy]

I mean, the 9-B feats are from the Wii game and obviously the NES one is earlier in the timeline, I don't see any concrete evidence for backscaling.

Also, there's no way a pro boxer is only Average in stamina, the fact that he can go on for almost 10 minutes while constantly being punched in the face, even if by a lightweight, is honestly more than IRL boxers can pull off- remember that blows to the face can easily lead to a full-on KO

 

[SamanPatou]

Isn't the first Punch-Out a totally different timeline/universe? They were 9-C because of that.

 

[MistaClean]

All of the Punch-Out boxers should get a NES Key, since Little Mac is the only character who has one.

 

[DaReaperMan]

i mean, is there any proof that NES Punch Out is a separate timeline to WII Punch Out? which is the big question that im sure might be answered by "well why should WII backscale to NES?" the answer is if there is no real proof of an alternate timeline then Mike Tyson, Little Mac, and Nick Bruiser should all go 9-B, and for the former go "At least 9-B" Though i can see Nick Bruiser staying 9-C due to a pretty clear time difference and Wii Punch out throwing anything in Super Punch Out right out the window.

 

[Starter_Pack]

Can we have a Captain Rainbow key for Little Mac when he was "Big Mac?"

 

[SamanPatou]

I mostly remember that LM's story was different, as in the first Punch Out he was 17 and had a different backstory, or even just by the fact that in both games he starts as a newbie and ends up becoming the champion and stuff like that.

Super Punch Out was also a thing, and some boxers have been used in the Wii one, but I think the real thing is that they do not seem to have real connections plot-wise.

 

[Armorchompy]

NES Mac is also like, 30 cm shorter iirc

 

[DaReaperMan]

I can see that lol, so we have to make 9-C keys for the cast and reword the tiering on 9-C for Tyson and Little Mac to something like "most, if not all professional boxers should be of this tier"

By the way I still think we should downgrade Tyson's stamina because by the time the third round comes around his punches are very much weak, which once again heavily implies exhaustion considering during the first round he deals a crap ton of damage.

 

[Armorchompy]

By the way I still think we should downgrade Tyson's stamina because by the time the third round comes around his punches are very much weak, which once again heavily implies exhaustion considering during the first round he deals a crap ton of damage.

Fiction has kind of warped our view on that but that's absolutely normal for boxers, to get tired after a few rounds, and IRL boxers block blows instead of taking them face-first. I can't agree with it going below Athletic Human

 

[DaReaperMan]

I know thats normal for boxers, its that no other boxer in the NES Punch Out has their punches weaken over time

 

[Armorchompy]

I mean, that's just a stamina feat for them, doesn't mean Mike's should be below that of a normal boxer

 

[DaReaperMan]

Bump

 

[MistaClean]

So are we gonna add 9-C keys to the rest of the cast?

 

[DaReaperMan]

Yes

 

[DaReaperMan]

Also I want to make a Bear Hugger page for the lols

 

[MistaClean]

Bear Hugger pulled a bear and a sleigh in his title defense montage and defeated a bear in hockey (most Canadian thing ever award of 2009). That's his best feats aside from fighting with Little Mac iirc

 

[DaReaperMan]

That's LS and he would scale to the bull punch for LS anyway

 

[MistaClean]

I feel that the boxers should be 6-B scaling from Donkey Kong

 

[DaReaperMan]

I feel that the boxers should be 6-B scaling from Donkey Kong

would probably have more matches there lol

 

[Armorchompy]

Idk if you're still thinking of applying that but i still disagree with average stamina for mike tyson

 

[DaReaperMan]

I'm planning to do "At least above average (While Mike Tyson has high stamina as a boxer his punches get weaker over time, implying fatigue)"

 

[Armorchompy]

that doesn't sound too bad

 

[DaReaperMan]

you have any ideas on how to word it better?

 

[DaReaperMan]

as for the rating for every 9-C key except for Tyson and Little Mac see below

Street level (Able to fight against Little Mac. Should comparable to Real Life professional boxers who would all have this rating regardless of weight class.) (/knock down Little Mac in one hit.)

for Tyson

Street level (Able to knock Little Mac down in one hit. Should comparable to Real Life professional boxers who would all have this rating regardless of weight class. and is also superior to every other boxer in the game)

for Little Mac

Street level (Should comparable to Real Life professional boxers who would all have this rating regardless of weight class and can also damage every other boxer in the game.)

 

[Armorchompy]

you have any ideas on how to word it better?

At least Above Average (Although Tyson's attacks get weaker after the first round, he's still able to get up from getting knocked down and fight for all three rounds despite being constantly pelted with punches from Little Mac)

idk, does that sound good?

as for the rating for every 9-C key except for Tyson and Little Mac see below

Street level (Able to fight against Little Mac. Should comparable to Real Life professional boxers who would all have this rating regardless of weight class.) (/knock down Little Mac in one hit.)

for Tyson

Street level (Able to knock Little Mac down in one hit. Should comparable to Real Life professional boxers who would all have this rating regardless of weight class. and is also superior to every other boxer in the game)

for Little Mac

Street level (Should comparable to Real Life professional boxers who would all have this rating regardless of weight class and can also damage every other boxer in the game)

Perhaps "Should comparable to Real Life professional boxers who reach this level regardless of weight class" sounds better? idk

 

[DaReaperMan]

I think each boxer should have a standard tactics section on top of a notable abilities section, although I feel comfortable axing the ladder for Tyson, since his is really basic.

as for Tyson's

Standard Tactics: Mike Tyson opens the fight with uppercuts and will continuously do them for 90 seconds, after that he mixes Uppercuts, jabs, hooks, and blocks in an extreme offensive and defensive front.

 

[DaReaperMan]

At least Above Average (Although Tyson's attacks get weaker after the first round, he's still able to get up from getting knocked down and fight for all three rounds despite being constantly pelted with punches from Little Mac)

idk, does that sound good?

Perhaps "Should comparable to Real Life professional boxers who reach this level regardless of weight class" sounds better? idk

those sound good, disregard my previous statement, the notable attacks covers the tactics pretty well.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Am I free to begin applying the changes?

 

[Armorchompy]

Yea I think so