Sirzech vs Grimmon

[Firephoenixearl]

Except that Sirzechs doesn't in character start with that range. Something YOU stated multiple times.

Something i stated. Why do you make this so hard for me m8?

Sirzechs in character has 10-40 m PASSIVE RANGE and several kilometers ACTIVE.

Sirzechs bloodlusted several kilometers PASSIVE same for active.

Don't mistake passive with active. In character sirzechs doesn't change from bloodlusted in active range, only in passive range.

 

[Schnee_One]

Didn't know Dragon had control over you contradicting yourself at every possible turn.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Oh so now in character he is passively several kilometers? Wow, now that your are not trying to make Sirzechs vs Medaka not a stomp, your arguments have changed.

In character, according to you he starts with passive range be a few meters. By the time the thinks to do anything, he gets mind haxxed.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Oh so now in character he is passively several kilometers? Wow, now that your are not trying to make Sirzechs vs Medaka not a stomp, your arguments have changed.
In character, according to you he starts with passive range be a few meters. By the time the thinks to do anything, he gets mind haxxed.

Grimmon's mind hax is active. Sirzechs' EE is active. Speed is equalized. They both activate at the same time.

Mind hax will be too slow compared to EE in result doe.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Grimmon's mind hax is active. Sirzechs' EE is active. Speed is equalized. They both activate at the same time.

Mind hax will be too slow compared to EE in result doe.

You yourself said he doesn't start with it.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

When did i actually say that?

Pls do quote it.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Except it won't? Against mindhax of this level and the fact that Sirzechs has other things he can apparently start with according your other threads, Grimmon has much better chances.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

When did i actually say that?

Pls do quote it.

"Sirzechs is faster than Grimmon which will enable him to act first and essentially bomb the place. Bombing doesn't take anything more than a thought basically as he can make a ball of PoD appear to where Grimmon is or he can just create a ball of PoD enveloping the entire SBA range."

That's you. You first argument is that he bombs the place or creates a ball of destruction.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

"Sirzechs is faster than Grimmon which will enable him to act first and essentially bomb the place. Bombing doesn't take anything more than a thought basically as he can make a ball of PoD appear to where Grimmon is or he can just create a ball of PoD enveloping the entire SBA range."

That's you. You first argument is that he bombs the place or creates a ball of destruction.

Both of them do the same thing.

He either just envelops grimmon in PoD, or he just "bombs" (which means enveloping the whole place in PoD. Both of them are instant kill moves though he is more likely to erase only grimmon to avoid dmg to the surroundings.

Whatever sirzechs starts with it's an instant 1 hitter. Since he is PoD whatever he does will EE grimmon. The level of mindhax is irrelevant as it only means the potency, it's still just mind hax.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

And if he is mind haxed, his attack is stopped. Unlike Grimmon who mind haxes and it takes immediate effect, Sirzechs has to think on whether he wants to nuke or expand. And then he has to hope Grimmon doesn't Chrono DSR (which I brought up before) while mind haxing. Chrono DSR requires a thought as well. Chrono DSR which is PoD on steroids.

Also notice how you say Medaka had a chance to close the range on Sirzechs to get hit by a passive. But now it is a bomb of destruction or expansion of PoD. Based upon the Medaks thread, Sirzechs is more likely to let someone start attacking before he acts.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Either way, I have given my input and vote, I am done debating here.(As I would rather not deal with this at all. Stress I don't need, especially when the guy changes up his story to fit the situation)

 

[DragonEmperor23]

I think that Sirzechs can make the PoD spawn on grimmmon with a thought which would make it incon since both die/uncapped simultanesouly

 

[Schnee_One]

<TFW you and three other people type paragraphs of what he leads with and what doesn't

 

[Firephoenixearl]

EE takes immediate effect. It's EE.

If Grimmon destroys the mind then it's inconclusve, then again "it's just a possibility".

Nuke is really unlikely though it's still a possibility. He would rather avoid dmg-ing the surroundings so wrap would be his most likely choice. Then again whethen he nukes or wraps they are both instant kills unlike with Grimmon where the fight depends on what he opens up with.

Again Mind Hax is not lethal, while EE is. Start fights, both attack Grimmon is erased, Sirzechs gets mind haxxed. Though since Grimmon is dead, it doesn't mean much.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

So NOW he starts with wrapping? Stop contradicting youself.

How long does his wrapping take?

Also going by both you and Burning, the opponent has enough time to charge at him before he acts. Or are we gonna act like that Medaka thread never happened?

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Grimmon FRA

 

[Firephoenixearl]

So NOW he starts with wrapping? Stop contradicting youself.
How long does his wrapping take?

Also going by both you and Burning, the opponent has enough time to charge at him before he acts. Or are we gonna act like that Medaka thread never happened?

1. He's most likely to start with wrapping though bombing is still a possibility. He would probs start with wrapping though.

2. Basically instant. Just spawn a ball of PoD on the enemy.

3. "has enough time to charge at him" Medaka thread:

I said: This is not a stomp because Medaka loses "only if she somehow gets within sirzechs' range before he kills her", remember that i was actually voting that it WASN'T a stomp due to PASSIVE kill?

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Grimmon FRA

Still being argued m8.

Dragon just asked about the wrapping, so the argument is still ongoing, there is no definitive argument for Grimmon yet.

 

[Schnee_One]

Actually, considering that's one move out of any Lucifer leads with, the argument still holds, plus Dragon is voting Grimmon.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Actually, considering that's one move out of any Lucifer leads with, the argument still holds, plus Dragon is voting Grimmon.

Prove me Lucifer will lead with ANYTHING rather than PoD if you can do so.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

2)Basically instant =/= instant. Grimmon mindhaxes.

3) What? Your whole thing was that Medaka goes on to punvh him and gets erased by a passive. Ergo, she has time to actually charge at him. Ergo, Grimmon mindhaxes before Sirzechs decides to wrap.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

2)Basically instant =/= instant. Grimmon mindhaxes.
3) What? Your whole thing was that Medaka goes on to punvh him and gets erased by a passive. Ergo, she has time to actually charge at him. Ergo, Grimmon mindhaxes before Sirzechs decides to wrap.

2) when basically is a "speed" term amirite? Basically instant = instant, it doesn't take time to literally spawn a ball of pod. Same as saying it takes time for the pen to make a dot on a paper after it has already touched the paper.

3) Uhmm what? No. How would i argue for "non stomp" if i was voting on "medaka charges and gets passively ee'd". You said "it's stomp cus passive", i said "no cus the passive only kicks in if Medaka DOES get close, which won't happen". I was arguing for non stomp how was i saying "medaka gets close gg, non stomp".

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Oh wait, PoD is energy? Chrono DSR takes that out. Y'know that power I brought up before that Grimmon uses along with Mind hax but you ignored and instead focused only on mind hax.

 

[Someone_who_likes_to_read]

Prove me Lucifer will lead with ANYTHING rather than PoD if you can do so.

Very well I accept that:

Volume 21

[…This is Rias Gremory's ani. An irregular among the Devils. …A true monster.]

Having become the incarnation of destruction, Sirzechs-sama laughed.

[Fufufu, I think that your transformation is also very irregular right, Ddraig? —So how about the crimson Maou and crimson [9] Dragon Emperor stop this monster together?]

—What! …I haven't had an invitation that could be any more exciting than this!

"Yeah!"

I answered as I turned to face the humanoid being of light in front of us — Trihexa readied its stance! In an instant, all three people silently vanished from their positions! A mid-air battle then began! Trihexa's core gave birth to six wings from its back. They were the wings of a bird, dragon, bat, and various other beasts. I charged directly in from the front while flying in mid-air, and sent the core flying backwards. The core fluttered in the air like a bird to correct its stance, and then flew towards me at high speed once again. I wanted to kick it as a counteroffensive, but the core's figure disappeared from my vision in an instant, and it slid right behind me. Sirzechs-sama then launched an orb of destruction at it, which instantly destroyed the core's entire body! It's over now — just when I thought that, I didn't expect that the miniscule piece of flesh which remained of it would regenerate with a violent momentum, restoring it back to its original form. …If it's like this, it won't work unless we completely eliminate it…! Sirzechs-sama and I coordinated with each other, as we alternated melee attacks and the demonic energy of destruction; the core was defeated several times, but it always restored itself to its original form instantaneously. The core gradually adapted and responded to each of our attacks by using its aura to repel my flying kicks and Sirzechs-sama as the incarnation of destruction. …Well, Sirzechs-sama and I were also unharmed…. However, our opponent was also completely unscathed. While Sirzechs-sama released a burst of destructive energy which was enough to cause more than half of the island to disappear, he said to me


Sirzechs starts with PoD Orbs against one of the cores of Tri-Hexa which is on of the top tiers of the verse and he did not use a PoD burst until he discovered that his attacks did nothing to it.

So I vote Grimmon for Mind hax and Chrono-DSR as both are lethal to Sirzechs and he start with them

 

[Schnee_One]

Someone

You are amazing to a degree unfathomable

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Oof

 

[Schnee_One]

So apparently he starts with orbs

Aight then!

 

[Firephoenixearl]

1. He already knew that PoD wouldn't kill trihexia he was just testing it.

2. I can also make the same argument and bring Sirzechs vs Asmodeus and say that Sirzechs just wraps Grimmon, just like how he wrapped asmodeus before the "fight" even started.

 

[Someone_who_likes_to_read]

Yeah, he was going against a unknown opponent so he was testing him so what says that he would not do the same here.

Unless he knew for some reason that Grimmon had 2-A hax there is not reason for him to no test this unknown monster

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Yeah, he was going against a unknown opponent so he was testing him so what says that he would not do the same here.
Unless he knew for some reason that Grimmon had 2-A hax there is not reason for him to no test this unknown monster

Trihexia wasn't an unknown monster. He was enjoying fighting with Ise, he already knew that he couldn't beat Trihexia with PoD, so he was just enjoying fighting with his brother in law. Last time he was in "i want to win" mentality....it didn't go that well for his opponent.

He knew trihexia MUCH more than he knew asmodeus.

 

[Someone_who_likes_to_read]

You know that it does not make sense that Sirzechs knew more about a monster that was most likely sealed before he was even born than someone who is A demon like him no?

 

[Firephoenixearl]

You know that it does not make sense that Sirzechs knew more about a monster that was most likely sealed before he was even born than someone who is A demon like him no?

1. Trihexia was sealed sure, none knew it's true form though EVERYONE knew that it was comparable to Great Red, that alone would make Sirzechs know that it's not easy to kill it.

2. They knew so much about Trihexia being so hard to kill that they "devised a plan precisely because they were sure on it, a plan that would cost every god and every top tier basically to have them put an end to trihexia". How can you even argue "they don't know about trihexia"?

3. Asmodeus is a devil. Sirzechs doesn't just automatically have omniscience on every devil you know? Asmodeus is opposing his ruling in secrecy and had never faced Sirzechs before. He was a descenad of the OLD maou so Sirzechs had no way of knowing about his identity.

 

[Someone_who_likes_to_read]

Also Sirzechs vs Asmodeus:

Volume 6

Cruzerey releases huge demonic-powers from both his hands. Sirzechs doesn't flinch, and changed the demonic-powers in his palms to several smaller spheres and then he shot them forward. BANG! GUUUUUN! Cruzerey's demonic-power perishes after it touches Sirzech's demonic-power as if it was ground away. The demonic-power released by Sirzechs moves as if it has its own mind and eliminates Cruzerey's attack. Sirzechs himself dodges or uses defensive spells for the attacks which couldn't be eliminated. One of the spheres of power of destruction goes into Cruzerey's mouth. DON! Cruzerey swells up once. When it calms down, at the same time his demonic-powers decrease drastically! ―Did Sirzechs get rid of the snake Cruzerey consumed? Sirzechs then says it. "—[Rune the Extinct]. I got rid of Ophis's snake in your stomach. ― With this you won't be able to fight with enormous power." By having the snake, which is the base of his power up, destroyed, his confidence from earlier disappears and now he looks impatient. Sirzechs' attack. It's my first time seeing it. One of the reasons why Sirzechs was chosen as a Maou. ― Overwhelming power of destruction. It eliminates everything it touches. It doesn't even leave a trace. Absolute destruction. Even if it was small, it has outrageous power. He didn't overuse the absolute power of destruction, he didn't even increase its mass, he kept it in a small size, and he is able to control several of them like his own limbs. A technique which requires delicate control and a great level of talent. Sirzechs has those. "Damn you! Just like you! And just like Vali! Why do those who carry the name of "Lucifer" are blessed with powers, yet both of you clash with us!?" Cruzerey tries to release more shots while cursing. KUUBAN! — But one of the spheres touches Cruzerey's stomach, and it takes away his whole stomach. Even if small, the power of destruction has enough power. The moment it touches it, it eliminates everything in its surroundings. "…..W-Why…. Why does the real one have to lose against the impostor……" While having blood coming from his mouth, Cruzerey sheds tears of blood. Sirzechs closes his eyes and swings his arm to the side slowly. That moment, Cruzerey's whole body was eaten away by several spheres floating in the sky.


ORBS

 

[Firephoenixearl]

I actually wasn't aware of that since i continued from the anime. Bombing it is then.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

So ..... Grimmon FRA then.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

This is stomp actually. The whole argument was on the speed departament. If grimmon takes that then it's stomp 2-A mind hax, there isn't anything sirzechs can do to that.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

No it's not. Otherwise every Homura thread would be a stomp.

 

[Kaltias]

No it's not. Otherwise every Homura thread would be a stomp.

The one involving mind hax? They usually are. Although that's because it's subconscious and not because it's 2-A

 

[Schnee_One]

No it's not. Otherwise every Homura thread would be a stomp.

They all are

Hence why they got removed

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I forgot her stuff was subconscious. Should not matter here tho. Maybe Akron is a better example?