Satoru Gojo vs Saitama

[Tuxidoe_Redo]

Also, where does the source come from that says Sukuna has a processing speed greater than a human (6 months in 0.2 seconds)? Like, where does that information come from?

WAit wtf? Oh hell nah I'ma just vote Gojo here

 

[EnderLord8]

Are we deadass right now?

I was asking for the link that claims Sukuna has such information processing capabilities, but since I later saw that Sukuna ranks to Gojo in this department, it doesn't matter...

 

[Ourosboros]

WAit wtf? Oh hell nah I'ma just vote Gojo here

Dude, you said that you made this thread to specifically challenge us OPM fans with Gojo, did you ever intend not to vote for Gojo? And if you did, why does someone asking an ignorant question make you switch sides? We've been discussing for five pages now, I don't know why someone being unfamiliar with Sukuna's reaction feats alters the outcome

 

[Tuxidoe_Redo]

Dude, you said that you made this thread to specifically challenge us OPM fans with Gojo, did you ever intend not to vote for Gojo? And if you did, why does someone asking an ignorant question make you switch sides? We've been discussing for five pages now, I don't know why someone being unfamiliar with Sukuna's reaction feats alters the outcome

WHich arguments are active? I found a good gooning material which is why I have been busy my bad gang

 

[Ourosboros]

WHich arguments are active? I found a good gooning material which is why I have been busy my bad gang

Alright, I did not need to know that second part (I suggest you try to get a girlfriend/partner to meet your needs instead).

Currently, there are two primary issues being debated as well as a few others.

FIRST, does Saitama's argument allow him to move Infinity? If yes, can he separate Infinity from Gojo?

Argument: yes, Saitama has four non-physical interaction feats that support him being able to treat Infinity like a movable object allowing him to hit Gojo.​

Counterargument: the non-physical interaction feats are not comparable to Infinity's infinite subdivision of space.​

SECOND, does Unlimited Void's sure hit affect Saitama, and if it does, is it a permanent win-condition?

Argument: yes, even someone with super enhanced reactionsl like Sukuna was affected by it with limited exposure and SBA normally gives opponents enough CE to register as targets for the sure-hit affect.​

Counterargument: no, UV has a finite limit on the information expressed and it's unclear how that would affect a character with FTL reactions.​

• Addendum to 2nd counterargument: Saitama would be able to potentially shatter the domain in the same way he damaged the Phoenix Space or pulled Empty Void out of Hyperspace in the retconned chapters

 

[MochOath]

voting Robert FRA

 

[Phoenks]

if he moves with the barrier Gojo should just turn into a strawberry smoothie from the internal kinetic shock of acceleration, no?

Yea, exactly. You have a 3-C guy punching or kicking away the spatial bubble, so it just obliterates Gojo, who is currently inside of that bubble. Doesn't even matter if he can't destroy it.

 

[LaserPrecision]

It would obviously move independently in the case that an external force is 'physically' applied to Infinity. This is something that has never happened in JJK and something that Gojo is not going to account for.

It is tho... when pressing against Hanami with it physically and slowly walking it into him until he got pancaked.

I wish I could think of an analogy.

It's like Gojo has a bubble around himself. That bubble usually remains around him, but Saitama can just kick the bubble away from Gojo's body. And since it surrounds him, he'll make contact with the inner walls of the bubble. Thus, he gets crushed in the same way he crushed Hanami. It's like the forcefield has been inverted on himself.

I get the analogy. I disagree with it. Using your own analogy as an example:

Gojo has a bubble wrapped around him at all times. The bubble keeps an infinite distance between it and the enemy, and the bubble also keeps an infinite distance between itself and Gojo. Which is substantiated by the fact sure-hits of Domain work on him (They spawn directly on you), and that when crushing Hanami with Infinity, it wasn't behaving like walking against a wall for Gojo. There was no distortion in his features as if he were walking against a solid.

This means if Saitama punches Infinity, and it starts moving towards Gojo, it will need to travel the infinite distance between him and the barrier of the bubble.

Really I think the only reason there's so much confusion here is because people are viewing this exclusively as space manip when Infinity should be both mathematics manipulation and conceptual manipulation (The former of which is on the profile, and the latter of which I'm working on). If that distinction is made it's much easier to follow this.

The problem with this way of thinking is the fact that the relativistic reaction only comes from fans. The author doesn’t view Sukuna nowhere near that high in canon. Which is the real reason UV is effective against him. Bro should really be around Mach 3.

Bro

Even if you want to say he's "around Mach 3" that shit doesn't even work. With the reactions they'd have at that speed processing 6 months of information in 0.2 seconds would be effortless. They can easily perceive and consistently time a timeframe of a millionth of a second, and process years of information in a split second. If 6 months of info in 0.2 seconds only left people in a vegitative state for a few months or whatever then someone with processing speed many many many times greater is going to shrug that off.

It's dependent on the opponent's own senses because the opponent's senses are what is being forced to put all of their efforts/energy into processing information throughout their life and beyond it endlessly.

Addendum to 2nd counterargument: Saitama would be able to potentially shatter the domain in the same way he damaged the Phoenix Space or pulled Empty Void out of Hyperspace in the retconned chapters

Saitama doesn't need the ability to break domain. ANYONE can break in or out of a domain. They just need the strength to be able to do so. Which Saitama has. Not that I think this matters cuz again, paralyzed immediately but you get the gist.

 

[EnderLord8]

Even if you want to say he's "around Mach 3" that shit doesn't even work. With the reactions they'd have at that speed processing 6 months of information in 0.2 seconds would be effortless. They can easily perceive and consistently time a timeframe of a millionth of a second, and process years of information in a split second. If 6 months of info in 0.2 seconds only left people in a vegitative state for a few months or whatever then someone with processing speed many many many times greater is going to shrug that off.

Could you send the manga panels/statements of him performing these feats so I can do an analysis?

 

[LaserPrecision]

Could you send the manga panels/statements of him performing these feats so I can do an analysis?

Which one? Or all of them? If you mean all of them I could but that's sort of a pain in the ass since I'll have to go digging through a **** ton of chapters for it but ig I could.

 

[EnderLord8]

Which one? Or all of them? If you mean all of them I could but that's sort of a pain in the ass since I'll have to go digging through a **** ton of chapters for it but ig I could.

Processing years of information in a fraction of a second, in this case.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Processing years of information in a fraction of a second, in this case.

Sure, here you go:

All possibilities were rejected by his Six Eyes. And then it all came flowing into his brain. Three years of his youth... Even though it was just an instant, for Satoru Gojo, one minute had already passed...

Gojo recalled three years of his youth with Geto to try and understand how he was standing before him after his Six Eyes rejected any other possibility that it wasn't Geto. An instant passed, which was a minute in his brain where he processed those 3 years.

 

[EnderLord8]

Sure, here you go:

Gojo recalled three years of his youth with Geto to try and understand how he was standing before him after his Six Eyes rejected any other possibility that it wasn't Geto. An instant passed, which was a minute in his brain where he processed those 3 years.

I'll tell you, for someone who doesn't know much about JJK, this is a confusing feat. Is he using some kind of special ability to remember those three years? Also, why does Sukuna scale to this feat? Is there any special statement or aspect from high-level sorcerers that Sukuna specifically uses to scale to this?

 

[Mbpoops]

I'll tell you, for someone who doesn't know much about JJK, this is a confusing feat. Is he using some kind of special ability to remember those three years? Also, why does Sukuna scale to this feat? Is there any special statement or aspect from high-level sorcerers that Sukuna specifically uses to scale to this?

The six eyes is making gojo process every possibility this could be geto, which forces him to go through his past years with geto, and gojo is denying it. Sukuna shouldnt scale from this feat but he can send unlimited voids to his host

 

[EnderLord8]

The six eyes is making gojo process every possibility this could be geto, which forces him to go through his past years with geto, and gojo is denying it. Sukuna shouldnt scale from this feat but he can send unlimited voids to his host

Let me see if I understand, Sukuna doesn't scale directly to this feat? Is there anyone who scales to this Gojo feat in JJK?

 

[Mbpoops]

Let me see if I understand, Sukuna doesn't scale directly to this feat? Is there anyone who scales to this Gojo feat in JJK?

Youd have to ask another jjk supporter but to me no because no one else is gojo even past 6e users

 

[AppleMaker]

Did anyone counted the votes or not?

 

[EnderLord8]

It would be very funny if this feat were repeatedly brought up to argue in favor of the power of Gojo's domain expansion, only to ultimately prove scalable for no one but Gojo himself.

 

[Mbpoops]

It would be very funny if this feat were repeatedly brought up to argue in favor of the power of Gojo's domain expansion, only to ultimately prove scalable for no one but Gojo himself.

This cant be the case right…

 

[LaserPrecision]

The six eyes is making gojo process every possibility this could be geto, which forces him to go through his past years with geto, and gojo is denying it. Sukuna shouldnt scale from this feat but he can send unlimited voids to his host

Sukuna scales off of Gojo's reactions on his profile. He can perceive similarly small timeframes when domain clashing with him, and Gojo Sukuna is stated to be superior to Gojo in every way except cursed energy efficiency.

However, even if you wanted to argue it only scales to Gojo (for some reason), Sukuna's reactions would still be more than enough to process that information AND the fact that Gojo's Unlimited Void would work on himself if he didn't design how it works (He made it so it hits everything in the domain indiscriminately except himself, and whoever he is touching).

 

[EnderLord8]

Sukuna is stated to be superior to Gojo in every way except cursed energy efficiency.

Sukuna is stronger.
Sukuna is faster.
Sukuna is more durable.
Sukuna has better stamina.
Sukuna is more handsome.
Sukuna is taller.
Sukuna smells better.
Sukuna has better techniques.
Sukuna is kinder.
Sukuna is more evil.
Sukuna has better aura farming.
Sukuna is better at math.
Sukuna has better eyesight.
Sukuna has more arms.
Sukuna has more eyes.
Sukuna is better than Gojo in everything except cursed energy efficiency.

However, even if you wanted to argue it only scales to Gojo (for some reason), Sukuna's reactions would still be more than enough to process that information

This is already somewhat confusing territory for me, since I remember another debate I participated in where Gojo was involved, and they said that reaction speed wasn't related to speed/capacity for information processing, but now in this debate it is related? It's kind of convenient.

AND the fact that Gojo's Unlimited Void would work on himself if he didn't design how it works (He made it so it hits everything in the domain indiscriminately except himself, and whoever he is touching).

How does this relate to the argument? Is there any instance of Gojo being hit by the domain expansion itself and being affected by it???

 

[LaserPrecision]

This is already somewhat confusing territory for me, since I remember another debate I participated in where Gojo was involved, and they said that reaction speed wasn't related to speed/capacity for information processing, but now in this debate it is related? It's kind of convenient.

Uh, no. The other threads said that reaction speed isn't combat speed because you can't attack that fast in quick succession, it's for making a quick/short movement. But reactions inherently require perception speed, because you need to perceive a thread in order to react to it. That's not convenient. That's just how perception speed works.

How does this relate to the argument? Is there any instance of Gojo being hit by the domain expansion itself and being affected by it???

The point is Gojo purposefully makes his domain not target himself so he doesn't get fried. Implying that despite his processing ability, he would be affected by his own domain if it wasn't set up to exclude himself. If such a weakness of UV was a thing, it would absolutely have been mentioned. Especially against Sukuna of all people. The point is the domain works off of the opponent's senses. The information transfer rate is going to depend on their senses and their speed. Because their senses work at a different rate than Gojo's.

 

[Raiden38]

Did anyone counted the votes or not?

It seems that whoever made the versus doesn't want to count the votes that were given...in any case I vote Saitama FRA

 

[EnderLord8]

Uh, no. The other threads said that reaction speed isn't combat speed because you can't attack that fast in quick succession, it's for making a quick/short movement. But reactions inherently require perception speed, because you need to perceive a thread in order to react to it. That's not convenient. That's just how perception speed works.

Sorry, I don't think you saw the match I was in, which is quite specific. Everyone there said that you need adequate information processing feats to withstand Gojo's domain expansion, and that speed, reaction/perception/combat/movement, etc... were all that mattered, because you needed feats for domain expansion.

It's more likely that the person in that line was wrong, because considering the arguments used at that time, domain expansion would be ineffective, which at the time was the only win-win situation. I hope I expressed myself adequately and that you understood what I meant, as it was difficult to formulate this explanation.

The point is Gojo purposefully makes his domain not target himself so he doesn't get fried. Implying that despite his processing ability, he would be affected by his own domain if it wasn't set up to exclude himself. If such a weakness of UV was a thing, it would absolutely have been mentioned. Especially against Sukuna of all people. The point is the domain works off of the opponent's senses. The information transfer rate is going to depend on their senses and their speed. Because their senses work at a different rate than Gojo's.

I mean, Gojo could have simply excluded him for convenience, I mean, even if he has the processing capacity to comprehend all the information that the domain expansion forces into his mind, it would still be very inconvenient if part of his mind was being forced to process the information dump from the domain expansion, especially in a fight.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Sorry, I don't think you saw the match I was in, which is quite specific. Everyone there said that you need adequate information processing feats to withstand Gojo's domain expansion, and that speed, reaction/perception/combat/movement, etc... were all that mattered, because you needed feats for domain expansion.

Oh, yeah. I dunno what match-up that is, but I would've disagreed with that lol.

It's more likely that the person in that line was wrong, because considering the arguments used at that time, domain expansion would be ineffective, which at the time was the only win-win situation. I hope I expressed myself adequately and that you understood what I meant, as it was difficult to formulate this explanation.

Nah, it's fine. I getcha.

I mean, Gojo could have simply excluded him for convenience, I mean, even if he has the processing capacity to comprehend all the information that the domain expansion forces into his mind, it would still be very inconvenient if part of his mind was being forced to process the information dump from the domain expansion, especially in a fight.

Maybe but I have doubts that would be the case. It relies on the victim's senses, not Gojo's senses. It forces the opponent's brain to allocate all resources towards reiterating/living through their own memories indefinitely so it doesn't make much sense to me that if he made their brains process information way slower than usual. It just makes most sense with what is shown that the info dumped varies on the person's own senses/perception.

 

[Ourosboros]

Did anyone counted the votes or not?

I once again vote to close this thread because either Saitama can bypass Infinity and he effortlessly stomps, or he cannot and Gojo fries his brain. I personally believe in the former and do not want to count a 4-tier difference match-up when I think the losing party's hax doesn't even alter the outcome

 

[EnderLord8]

I once again vote to close this thread because either Saitama can bypass Infinity and he effortlessly stomps, or he cannot and Gojo fries his brain. I personally believe in the former and do not want to count a 4-tier difference match-up where the losing party's hax doesn't even alter the outcome

I'm also in favor of closing the topic.

 

[Tuxidoe_Redo]

Alright, I did not need to know that second part (I suggest you try to get a girlfriend/partner to meet your needs instead).

Currently, there are two primary issues being debated as well as a few others.

FIRST, does Saitama's argument allow him to move Infinity? If yes, can he separate Infinity from Gojo?

Argument: yes, Saitama has four non-physical interaction feats that support him being able to treat Infinity like a movable object allowing him to hit Gojo.​

Counterargument: the non-physical interaction feats are not comparable to Infinity's infinite subdivision of space.​

SECOND, does Unlimited Void's sure hit affect Saitama, and if it does, is it a permanent win-condition?

Argument: yes, even someone with super enhanced reactionsl like Sukuna was affected by it with limited exposure and SBA normally gives opponents enough CE to register as targets for the sure-hit affect.​

Counterargument: no, UV has a finite limit on the information expressed and it's unclear how that would affect a character with FTL reactions.​

• Addendum to 2nd counterargument: Saitama would be able to potentially shatter the domain in the same way he damaged the Phoenix Space or pulled Empty Void out of Hyperspace in the retconned chapters

Nah, fiction > irl

I dont mind the first one

Saitama cant shatter the domain if he took the hit first, also where did the argument that ftl characters can avoid UV entirely?

 

[Bernkastelll]

According to Jujutsu Kaisen chapter 539, Saitama can stomp Gojo just fine and interact with Infinity

 

[Second22]

I'm actually gonna wait for the OPM fans that were arguing against Yhwach (delulu ik), wanna see how they gonna argue their egg against the Honoured One

Nah bro, let those opm fans come. I wanna run my fade against their egg

 

[Pearly0nsams]

Bruh fr I just came back from gooning and people already start saying domain wont work

WHich arguments are active? I found a good gooning material which is why I have been busy my bad gang

Nah he'd goon while other people argue for him

 

[Quangotjokes]

Wait, silly me I overlooked something Zero punch bypasses infinity. It doesn’t travel it just lands. Saitama already swing from within the timestream. The punch lands before it’s thrown lol

Yeah we can close the thread.