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Sasuke Uchiha vs Ken Kaneki

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Monarch Laciel said:
Also for god's sake, Kaneki's dragon form basically just sleeps. Why is it being used?
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I did, if you were frustrated by this why continue on with it

<So close to Kaneki vs alex Mercer

(Sigh)
 
Now people are saying this version of Sasuke can't use chidori?

@Monarch

TBH, there are instances of substitution jutsu working while characters are being held down.

depending on where they are fighting.

Windmill tripple blades, Chidori, Sharingan, Cursed seal, and better martial arts...Kaneki would have to deal with all of those, and he would have no idea how to respond to most of them.

From what I've read on this thread Ken's highest regen feat is still that fight against Arima, so it's not like Sasuke can't put him down at all, it would just be really difficult.
 
YungManzi said:
Windmill tripple blades, Chidori, Sharingan, Cursed seal, and better martial arts...Kaneki would have to deal with all of those, and he would have no idea how to respond to most of them.
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They're big blades. They are really nothing special.

Covered above. It's a piercing attack that requires Sasuke to charge for a moment then run at Kaneki. Easily blocked, easily dodged, and easily regenerated from unless it destroys his brain, which is not where Sasuke typically aims with it.

Sharigan is not as useful as you are making it out to be either. It can't read Kagune due to their weird biology, and that's Kaneki's main form of attack. Only thing it could do is close the skill gap between them after some time ny reading Kaneki's body movements if he attacks with them.

Cursed seal is statistics amp, nothing more. Kaneki deals with it via Regenerationn, dodging, and Kakuja.

Better martial arts is not provable, considering Kaneki's own incredible skill and proficiency in the subject.
 
@Monarch

1. I was more thinking about the the wire rather than the blades. It's also more for distraction (Which is what Sasuke typically uses tools like that for).

2. Saying Sasuke has to charge a chidori is like saying Goku has to charge a Kamehameha wave (It has practically no charge time except for a stance/hand signs, and there are instances even in part 1 where Sasuke doesn't even need that.) He also doesn't need to run straight at his opponent with it and can use it at max power without a running start. I already said Sasuke wouldn't aim Chidori at Ken's head off the bat, but he can certainly use Chidori more than once.

3. Kaneki's Kagune can be tracked by sharingan, the only reason Sasuke couldn't accurately predict 1 tailed Naruto was because his chakra could grow extra "limbs" of varying shapes and sizes, and he was aleready much faster than Sasuke (In this fight Sasuke would be faster than Kaneki).

4. Sasuke is more skilled, he would also be faster as well as having sharingan's precognition.

Kaneki cannot instantly regen from dangerous injuries. I say Sasuke is more skilled via what I said before:

Full power base Rock Lee (Who is a taijutsu genius, even in base) <<<<<<<<<Neji<Kyuubi amped Naruto<<<<This version of Sasuke (Even in the chunin exams, he had achieved Lee's speed and copied his martial arts moves). Even if Kaneki is somehow on par with Sasuke in martial arts, once Sasuke gets used to his moves (Which doesn't require a lot of time at all) he could track everything kaneki can do.

5. I haven't even brought up the fact that Sasuke is the better battle tactician.
 
@Blue

I don't recall Sasuke ever using an explosive tag, but TBH if Naruto has them Sasuke likely also has them..but I'm not going to argue that point in this fight.
 
YungManzi said:
@Monarch
1. I was more thinking about the the wire rather than the blades. It's also more for distraction (Which is what Sasuke typically uses tools like that for).
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>Completely ignores the examples I've brought up of Kaneki's experience with traps, wirelike tentacles and distractions.

Also, Eto's Kakuja and sprouts tentacles with mouths that talk about eating people and things like that from all different angles. Pretty damn distracting I'd say. Kaneki didn't care, and tore her apart despite that. Then later he uses the strategy of distracting the opponent with a talking tentacle. He has plenty of experience with distractions.

2. Saying Sasuke has to charge a chidori is like saying Goku has to charge a Kamehameha wave (It has practically no charge time except for a stance/hand signs, and there are instances even in part 1 where Sasuke doesn't even need that.) He also doesn't need to run straight at his opponent with it and can use it at max power without a running start. I already said Sasuke wouldn't aim Chidori at Ken's head off the bat, but he can certainly use Chidori more than once.

He's can only use the basic chidori here, not any of the other applications that he develops in Shippuden. And while he might not need to have a running start to use it, he certainly will need to run at Kaneki if he wants to hit him with it, seeing as Kaneki's style of fighting involves using his Kagune to keep them at bay from a distance.

And you are correct he can use it more than once. He can use it twice actually. He can use it twice per day. If he uses it any more, he overuses his chakra/stamina and dies

3. Kaneki's Kagune can be tracked by sharingan, the only reason Sasuke couldn't accurately predict 1 tailed Naruto was because his chakra could grow extra "limbs" of varying shapes and sizes, and he was aleready much faster than Sasuke (In this fight Sasuke would be faster than Kaneki).

You misunderstand what I am saying, and are trying to use a strawman. I never brought 1 tail Naruto into this. Sharigan precog works by reading the opponent's muscle movements. Sasuke's sharigan at this point has yet to evolve in anyway, having only just appeared, and has only shown the ability to track the muscle movements of normal human bodies. Saying it can track the motions of Kagune, which are made of RC cells and are biologically and structurally different to anything Sasuke has ever tracked, is a massive fallacy.

And Sasuke only starts being able to see chakra after his sharigan further evolves. It hasn't reached that level of evolution here.

4. Sasuke is more skilled, he would also be faster as well as having sharingan's precognition.

He's not more skilled, and the sharigan's precog won't work on Kagune for reasons above.

Kaneki cannot instantly regen from dangerous injuries.

>Gets impaled through the chest by a giant lance -> regens and keeps fighting >Gets impaled through the chest by multiple kagune spikes in multiple battles across the series -> regens instantly and keeps fighting >Gets stabbed through the head and eye-> keeps fighting, requiring another stab through the head and eye to put him down. > someone inferior to him in regen is decapitated->their head reattached to their body before it hits the ground and they keep fighting

Please, do tell me more about "can't instantly regenerate from dangerous wounds"

I say Sasuke is more skilled via what I said before:

Full power base Rock Lee (Who is a taijutsu genius, even in base) <<<<<<<<<Neji<Kyuubi amped Naruto<<<<This version of Sasuke (Even in the chunin exams, he had achieved Lee's speed and copied his martial arts moves). Even if Kaneki is somehow on par with Sasuke in martial arts, once Sasuke gets used to his moves (Which doesn't require a lot of time at all) he could track everything kaneki can do.

Basic ghouls (many of which spend their lives fighting and killing, and are quite skilled at it) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Non-Killing Owl (decades of experience of fighting and killing other ghouls) <<< Arima at 16 (trained from birth) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< current Arima (decades of fighting and killing ghouls) <<<<< Kaneki

Ghouls who have needed to learn to fight since they could move just to survive <<< Investigators with decades of experience <<<< Kanae Rosewald (bodyguard trained to protect Shu) <<<<<<< Eto (survived in the 24th ward, fighting to live from the moment she was born against other ghouls) <<<<<<<<<<<< Arima <<<<<< Kaneki

Juuzou (a genius at killing ghouls, to the point that at about 16 he can beat ghouls with decades of experience with nothing but a few knives, while even investigators with decades of experience fighting against ghouls themselves require Quinques) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Kaneki

I've explained how he can't track Kagune, and Kagune are something that Sasuke has never experienced or fought against anything like before.

5. I haven't even brought up the fact that Sasuke is the better battle tactician.

No he isn't. I've explained that countless times.
 
@Monarch

1. You're missing the whole point my metioning his weapons. I'm saying Sasuke has been shown to use tatics which Kaneki wouldn't really be prepared for (I'm also not saying it would take him down, I'm saying it would distract him long enough to get a good hit in) . An example of this is what Sasuke did to Zaku, hiding shuriken inside of flames while swiftly moving behind him (and like I keep metioning, Sasuke would be faster in this fight via cursed seal).

2. Sasuke can actually use chidori three times in a day, but he's pretty much done after that.

3."Sasuke's sharingan can only predict human moves" Sasuke could predict Gaara's moves even in the shukaku state (And that was with a weaker sharingan), so that's not correct either.

4.I never said he couldn't continue fighting after taking a lot of damage, I just said he can't instantly regen from serious damage. Iirc he still sustains damage and needs time to fully regen.

5. Even basic genin are far above average human level (which most ghouls are at iirc, I think most are at average genin level/academy student level). I'll just go a little deeper:

Sasuke at the start of Naruto could hold his own against two chunin (This is without a sharingan). Later Sasuke fights Haku who noted as begin good in taijutsu and can speed blitz multiple assasins easily. Sasuke is even beter than Haku with taijutsu. He then obtains sharingan and gets demolished by base Rock Lee with weights. Base Rock Lee is stated weaker than Neji, who gets destroyed by kyuubi amped naruto, who got destroyed by Sasuke (and this was a stronger version of Naruto). Sasuke could even copy all of their moves after being on the recieving end of them one time (as far as martial arts goes) Sasuke didn't even see Rock Lee fight without his weights, but he still managed to copy his moves and his speed with absolute accuracy. I'm talking about pure skill and ability.


6. How many examples can you give of Kaneki planning out what he is going to do and observing his opponents weaknesses ? How many examples can you give of Kaneki coming up with that while in the heat of battle?
 
1. Kaneki is no stranger to such tactics. They wouldn't fool him for a second.

2. 3 then.

3. Alright. Still doesn't change that he can't mimic Kagune if he doesn't have one. Nor does his precog help against things he can't actually see the movement of. So if Kaneki sets up a trap or tricks him with a kagune mouth, he's done.

4. Even if I agree, which I don't, he has shown that he can keep fighting without slowing down even while regenerating from extreme damage. And I'm also going to point out that Sasuke does not have Regenerationn, and will bleed out from a few deep cuts or extreme damage that Kaneki would laugh off. You really think Sasuke can do the whole fight without taking any damage?

5. Even the weakest ghoul is far above average human level. Neji is not applicable to your scaling, his fighting style does not work by pure skill unlike Rock Lee's, instead by attacking chakra points and using spinjutzu to knock back anyone who gets close. One tail Naruto did not get destroyed by Sasuke either, they were pretty much evenly matched until the final attack.

6. Plenty. Against Jason, against Arima, against Eto, against every single ghoul and investigator he ever went up against who had a different type of kagune/quinque that he hadn't seen and needed to adapt to the tactics of (which is a lot, Kagunes are all individually different and can have multiple functions). He was also a capable team leader of the quinx squad.
 
1. Yes, Sasuke can't mimic a kagune.

2. Sasuke would be faster and have sharingan, are those not enough reasons to say he could effectively dodge Kaneki's attacks? It's not like Kaneki's attacks are instant death either. His sharingan itself can already help him keep track of much faster opponents. Sasuke's standard tactic is to spam fire release and weapons then move in close for an opening (It's unlikely that he won't find an opening because of the sharingan). I will say this, Sasuke would have a tough time getting close to Kaneki if it wasn't for his sharingan (Which TBH impacts this fight a lot).

3. As I said, average ghoul is far above average human level. Neji's style of taijutsu is what makes him dangerous, Sasuke could effectively counter with speed and straight up skill. As far as Naruto being destroyed, I was talking about this.

4. I don't recall any of that in the manga (When I used to read it)...I'll take your word for it.
 
2. He can't dodge what he doesn't see coming, and he can't see something coming, even with the sharigan, if he can't see it in the first place. Which means that attacks from underground, distractions via talking Kagune, and remotely activated traps kagune (both of which he has used) are still very much possible for Kaneki to use. Additionally, the sheer size of Kaneki's kagune would make it more difficult to dodge the attacks even if he sees them coming. And his attacks might not be instant death, but Kaneki can keep fighting a lot longer than Sasuke can, especially if he's spamming fireballs, and Sasuke is going to get tired. He going to get scratches. He's going to start bleeding. He's going to get weaker. And all the while, Kaneki is regenerating from everything and keeps on fighting.

3. That was a fist fight. Big difference between that and the fight going on here.
 
Considering Neji was taken by surprise when Naruto upper cutted him from below, and Byakuyagan can see chakra far better than a Sharingan
 
Like Ricsi said, something like an underground trap isn't going to work on Sasuke via sharingan. Sasuke deals with clones and substitution jutsu on a regular basis (So talking Kagune likely isn't helping much). Not to mention(once again) Sasuke is faster.
 
I think you guys overestimating this Sasuke's Skill level. while it's true that he can dodge the underground attacks but first he would need to know that they are underground
 
Also, Sasuke does not like to use the Cursed Seal in character, so his speed amps aren't going to be coming out from the very start. Which means to begin with, they are the same speed.
 
Shadowbokunohero said:
Considering Neji was taken by surprise when Naruto upper cutted him from below, and Byakuyagan can see chakra far better than a Sharinga
Click to expand...
he didnt have it active dude
 
@Monarch

Sasuke used it pretty early on in his fight against naruto. He can also use chakra control to amp his speed.
 
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