Santōryū vs Niten Ichi-ryū

[ThatDarnFish]

This is something I've wanted to do for a LONG time. He's already fought Sasaki Kojiro but NOW--!!

Roronoa Zoro:

vs

Musashi Miyamoto:


Inconclusive(Ends in booze and sex):

Speed Equal, Wano Zoro vs Base/Pre-Zero Musashi. Fight takes place in Wano's Flower Capital.
Two Swords vs Three Swords
Please don't be a stomp--
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/483985030755123203/897532451885285396/22663576.png

 

[ThatDarnFish]

Zoro would make a great Saber. Just sayin'

 

[SnookB]

Zoro would make a great Saber. Just sayin'

Zoro would make a god tier saber because Fate's fancy flowerly language would make his trichiliocosm cutting a literal concept-

Anyway- Voting Zoro.
Without her Zero Hax, he has the edge in just about everything. Causality/Fate manipulating attacks like hers are usually dealt with similiarly to Gae Bolg, where good Precog or even instinct like Artoria's can help avoid them, so his Kenbunshoku should be a clutch there.
He's got far more range, extremely outclasses her in versatility (far too many projectiles and a good AOE attack with Tatsumaki), and unless their speeds are equalized she's getting blitzed through the whole fight.
Assuming you're using 6-C key for both here? Otherwise if she taps him once he could be one shotted. Most of her other abilities (like fear manip, acausality and reality warp resistance) are either not combat applicable against Zoro or flat out don't work for the first one.

 

[John985]

What you just said are wrong, for the other servant, Fate and Causality are not combat applicable but for her it is. Its her Heavenly Eye, you cant do anything to her if you dont have any fate manip.

 

[ThatDarnFish]

Zoro would make a god tier saber because Fate's fancy flowerly language would make his trichiliocosm cutting a literal concept-

Anyway- Voting Zoro.
Without her Zero Hax, he has the edge in just about everything. Causality/Fate manipulating attacks like hers are usually dealt with similiarly to Gae Bolg, where good Precog or even instinct like Artoria's can help avoid them, so his Kenbunshoku should be a clutch there.
He's got far more range, extremely outclasses her in versatility (far too many projectiles and a good AOE attack with Tatsumaki), and unless their speeds are equalized she's getting blitzed through the whole fight.
Assuming you're using 6-C key for both here? Otherwise if she taps him once he could be one shotted. Most of her other abilities (like fear manip, acausality and reality warp resistance) are either not combat applicable against Zoro or flat out don't work for the first one.

1 for Zoro!
Though, some people have a misconception about getting past Gae Bolg/causality changing attacks with just Precog. It's also stated, even on servant profiles, that their Luck stat is what really lets them overcome fate/causality based attacks like Gae Bolg. B rank Luck or higher is needed.

Though, again, if Zoro were a Saber Servant, I'm sure he'd have a high Luck stat since it's how he won over that shop keep and got Yubashiri. His luck over the curse.

 

[SnookB]

What you just said are wrong, for the other servant, Fate and Causality are not combat applicable but for her it is. Its her Heavenly Eye, you cant do anything to her if you dont have any fate manip.

Her heavenly eye seems far more offense than defense, though. Her fifth form can be argued to be some form of intangibility/Invincibility, but if it's the former then Busoshoku should force her to take form regardless. We've seen it negate space manip after all. If anything her heavenly eye gives her a high chance of landing fatal blows on him that should be the definitively landing strikes, but it feels like his precognition would just negate THAT as well.
Only reason it feels that way is because Artoria avoiding an NP that does warp fate and causality was attributed to not just her luck but "instinct" as well, meaning her pseudo precognition had a role in it. And I highly doubt instinct is close to Kenbunshoku in its accuracy. Do feel free to educate me regardless- I know less about Fate than I do One Piece.

 

[Nierre]

following

 

[Regidian]

Her heavenly eye seems far more offense than defense, though. Her fifth form can be argued to be some form of intangibility/Invincibility, but if it's the former then Busoshoku should force her to take form regardless. We've seen it negate space manip after all. If anything her heavenly eye gives her a high chance of landing fatal blows on him that should be the definitively landing strikes, but it feels like his precognition would just negate THAT as well.
Only reason it feels that way is because Artoria avoiding an NP that does warp fate and causality was attributed to not just her luck but "instinct" as well, meaning her pseudo precognition had a role in it. And I highly doubt instinct is close to Kenbunshoku in its accuracy. Do feel free to educate me regardless- I know less about Fate than I do One Piece.

Her heavenly eyes are for the two, she just use it more offensively but when she had battle yagyuu it was in defense term when she could just see al possibility to know where she need to evade.

The fifth form negate space atk it described even in the text. But she got it with Zero so not with pre zero.


And she already countered many preco with her eyes + her preco would be way better.

For gae bolg it was mostly due to her luck for the causality part, the instinct just was her to know that he was doing that. It like instinct she know he atk>he atk>her luck counter the NP.


And for instinct it depend, mhx can sense you from an another universe and predict pretty much everything you do. And she have only it at rank C, but rank doesn't latter that much now lol

 

[Bernkastelll]

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/483985030755123203/897532451885285396/22663576.png

this pic is not my wallpaper

And she already countered many preco with her eyes + her preco would be way better.

y?

Also, Zoro precog shouldnt work due acausality type 4, yeah

 

[Bernkastelll]

Zoro would make a god tier saber because Fate's fancy flowerly language would make his trichiliocosm cutting a literal concept-

Anyway- Voting Zoro.
Without her Zero Hax, he has the edge in just about everything. Causality/Fate manipulating attacks like hers are usually dealt with similiarly to Gae Bolg, where good Precog or even instinct like Artoria's can help avoid them, so his Kenbunshoku should be a clutch there.

Will it work against her acausality?

 

[Regidian]

this pic is not my wallpaper


y?

Also, Zoro precog shouldnt work due acausality type 4, yeah

Heavenly eyes is preco and fate manip, it's allow her to always see infinite possibilities in combat and predict every movement

 

[Regidian]

And yeah like bernkastell, zoro wouldn't be able to have his precognition work to her because her acausality type 4.

 

[Everything12]

Gae Bolg works by making it so that it reverses Causality so the effect of "the heartening pierced" leads to the cause of "the Spear being thrust", thus the heart has already been pierced even before the spear has moved. Its only through Luck great enough to change fate that Saber was able to dodge this strike even with the help of Instinct, otherwise not even EX rank speed would help survive the strike.

Basically, on its own Instinct or Eye of the Mind would do nothing to allow you to escape Gae Bolg or Musashi's Causality Manipulation, and having fate defying Luck is absolutely necessary to even attempt to survive.

Also, yeah. Acausality Type 4 goes no to Precognition anyway.

 

[SnookB]

Heavenly eyes is preco and fate manip, it's allow her to always see infinite possibilities in combat and predict every movement

The difference between her precog and his is that she foresees all possibilities, which is more analytical. Zoro sees the definitive outcome due to his precgnition being more based on sensing one's intent than foreseeing what "could" be the next move. I'd say definitive precognition is superior to predicting every outcome of a move and choosing the best counter, even if the latter sounds far fancier.
Why would Type 4 Acausality negate Kenbunshoku? Typical precognition relies on foreseeing the future, while Kenbunshoku directly foresees one's very intent. (That's why Lufy's precognition countered Katakuri's precognition, even though Katakuri's was far superior.)

Her form of acausality is reliant on her not existing within the regular flow of the universe, but even she has intent when attacking. And as far as I'm aware we've never seen a kenbunshoku user that relies on intent than typical precognition (Like Katakuri) fail to foresee the right outcome. In luffy's case he just Failed to react when against Kaido.
As far as I know, instinct isn't even basic foresight, it's more akin to Sharingan than actual future seeing, since it's described as "the ability to instantly identify “the best personal course of action” during combat. Because this Skill allows for the prediction of trajectory, it is possible to avoid attacks from firearms." And is specifically called PREDICTION rather than foresight/precognition.

Musashi has precognition? I thought her ability to shave down all possibilities was only post-Zero. (Even then it doesn't qualify as precognition as much as it's just fate manip). Again- it's so far only been offense applicable since she only does it for attacking, since it's specifically said that HER STRIKE bends space to let the outcome of it be in her favor. Nothing's mentioned about defense. Still, even then- Kaido and Big Mom were shown to passively negate space manipulation with their haki. What's stopping Zoro from flat out overcoming it the same way they did Room's properties? (Which are basically nearly the same, since a slash in your general direction within Room is guaranteed to hit since it literally shaves the space between you and your opponent and negating their dura entirely while at it, unless their Haki's superior, like in Law/Kaido's case)
As for her fifth form- I'm curious.
Does it remove her from the dimension of battle entirely, or does it just grant her intangibility? Or invulnerability? Wouldn't haki just bypass her intangibility if it were the former? (Unless it's bfr based like Obito/Hit existing in a seperate dimension with their abilities.)
It's strange how Zoro doesn't have Ryuou via Enma on his profile, even though we've seen Enma bypass Kaido's durability during Black Rope Tatsumaki.

 

[Nierre]

The difference between her precog and his is that she foresees all possibilities, which is more analytical. Zoro sees the definitive outcome due to his precgnition being more based on sensing one's intent than foreseeing what "could" be the next move. I'd say definitive precognition is superior to predicting every outcome of a move and choosing the best counter, even if the latter sounds far fancier.

Yup. Well said.

 

[Regidian]

The difference between her precog and his is that she foresees all possibilities, which is more analytical. Zoro sees the definitive outcome due to his precgnition being more based on sensing one's intent than foreseeing what "could" be the next move. I'd say definitive precognition is superior to predicting every outcome of a move and choosing the best counter, even if the latter sounds far fancier.
Why would Type 4 Acausality negate Kenbunshoku? Typical precognition relies on foreseeing the future, while Kenbunshoku directly foresees one's very intent. (That's why Lufy's precognition countered Katakuri's precognition, even though Katakuri's was far superior.)

Her form of acausality is reliant on her not existing within the regular flow of the universe, but even she has intent when attacking. And as far as I'm aware we've never seen a kenbunshoku user that relies on intent than typical precognition (Like Katakuri) fail to foresee the right outcome. In luffy's case he just Failed to react when against Kaido.
As far as I know, instinct isn't even basic foresight, it's more akin to Sharingan than actual future seeing, since it's described as "the ability to instantly identify “the best personal course of action” during combat. Because this Skill allows for the prediction of trajectory, it is possible to avoid attacks from firearms." And is specifically called PREDICTION rather than foresight/precognition.

Musashi has precognition? I thought her ability to shave down all possibilities was only post-Zero. (Even then it doesn't qualify as precognition as much as it's just fate manip). Again- it's so far only been offense applicable since she only does it for attacking, since it's specifically said that HER STRIKE bends space to let the outcome of it be in her favor. Nothing's mentioned about defense. Still, even then- Kaido and Big Mom were shown to passively negate space manipulation with their haki. What's stopping Zoro from flat out overcoming it the same way they did Room's properties? (Which are basically nearly the same, since a slash in your general direction within Room is guaranteed to hit since it literally shaves the space between you and your opponent and negating their dura entirely while at it, unless their Haki's superior, like in Law/Kaido's case)
As for her fifth form- I'm curious.
Does it remove her from the dimension of battle entirely, or does it just grant her intangibility? Or invulnerability? Wouldn't haki just bypass her intangibility if it were the former? (Unless it's bfr based like Obito/Hit existing in a seperate dimension with their abilities.)
It's strange how Zoro doesn't have Ryuou via Enma on his profile, even though we've seen Enma bypass Kaido's durability during Black Rope Tatsumaki.

She have precog with heavenly eyes, it does not only shave possibility.

Sensing one intent is not really precognition and pretty much every servant can do this... And i don't understand how sensing an intent is supperior when skilled can just like make atk that defies her intent or like musashi just manipulate time and space to make her intent an absolute. And Pretty much every servant resist space manipulation in a better extant than OP and they still get affect by musashi.

+ Musashi can not only see the possibility, she chose the one she want to win by shaving the other

For the rest i mean it doesn't exist a acausality type 4 in op so not failing for normal people doesn't mean it will not fail for her. And

And why you talk about instinct skill? We talk about heavenly eyes. And what you described is what do at base instinct, every instinct is distinct from the other and rank A allow to see the futur

At that time, the "Heavenly Eye" that were honed to the utmost limits can see through the enemies' each and every defensive actions, and demolish them.

She use them too to see the action, same for her predict analysis, and her style of fighting. (And if you ask she have do these with people she never fighted before)

 

[SnookB]

Mind's eye isn't FORESIGHT, it's basically "imaginary training" in dragon ball, or Garou's prediction (where he foresaw dozens of possibilities of King doing an attack, when King wasn't even the one that attacked him in the end.) To quote it directly, it's literally- "localized as: False Insight is a natural talent to foresee/sense and avoid danger on the basis of an innate 6th sense, intuition, or prescience. The accuracy of this instinct can be augmented by experience."
While TRUE Mind's eye : "is a heightened capacity for observation, refined through training, discipline and experience. A danger-avoidance ability that utilizes the intelligence collected up to the current time as the basis in order to predict the opponent’s activity and change the current situation. This is not a result of talent, but an overwhelming amount of combat experience. "
BOTH rely on prediction, one just more combat and instinct oriented while the Fake mind's eye is basically studying/Predicting outcomes prior to combat.
In Musashi's case, quoting her:
"The essence of my Niten Ichiryu lies in ADAPTING TO THOUSANDS OF POSSIBILITIES." Hers is the fake mind's eye and true mind's eye in one, since she can read thousands of outcomes during the battle itself, than analytically viewing it beforehand, while ALSO being able to image train even before fighting her opponent.

The difference between her and Zoro is that Zoro doesn't foresee possibility, he foresees OUTCOME the second you intend it. Kenbunshoku for the likes of Zoro and Luffy has been repeatedly shown to be always accurate, while Katakuri's precognition has several instances of it being countered/Changed due to his being overall precognition, while Zoro's, albeit far inferior in the length of foresight, is still definitive since it foresees what you "intend" to do, not predicts what thousands of things you COULD do.
To make it simpler one would be:
Mind's eye: Foresees thousands of things you COULD do and chooses a single outcome that can negate all
Kenbunshoku: Foresees what you "intent", meaning it doesn't rely on "chance", just definitive foresight with the only way of overcoming it being far too fast for the user to even react to what they foresaw (>Luffy vs Kaido's thunder Bagua on the roof). They don't "predict" it, they just foresee your intent the second you have it.

Kenbunshoku is just far superior. It has far less inconsistencies. You could counter mind's eye by foreseeing what the user's move is going to be and countering it. (Similiarly to how Luffy's Kenbunshoku negated Katakuri's foresight).

That aside- her mind's eye clashing with his Kenbunshoku would likely result in both being practically pointless, since every outcome she could predict, he'd foresee her countering it before she even does it. To attack, she'll need to "intend" her attack first. Unless she has Ultra instinct-

It boils down to being a head on battle. So what does she have offensively that can put Zoro down before he breaks her swords?

 

[Regidian]

Mind's eye isn't FORESIGHT, it's basically "imaginary training" in dragon ball, or Garou's prediction (where he foresaw dozens of possibilities of King doing an attack, when King wasn't even the one that attacked him in the end.) To quote it directly, it's literally- "localized as: False Insight is a natural talent to foresee/sense and avoid danger on the basis of an innate 6th sense, intuition, or prescience. The accuracy of this instinct can be augmented by experience."
While TRUE Mind's eye : "is a heightened capacity for observation, refined through training, discipline and experience. A danger-avoidance ability that utilizes the intelligence collected up to the current time as the basis in order to predict the opponent’s activity and change the current situation. This is not a result of talent, but an overwhelming amount of combat experience. "
BOTH rely on prediction, one just more combat and instinct oriented while the Fake mind's eye is basically studying/Predicting outcomes prior to combat.
In Musashi's case, quoting her:
"The essence of my Niten Ichiryu lies in ADAPTING TO THOUSANDS OF POSSIBILITIES." Hers is the fake mind's eye and true mind's eye in one, since she can read thousands of outcomes during the battle itself, than analytically viewing it beforehand, while ALSO being able to image train even before fighting her opponent.

The difference between her and Zoro is that Zoro doesn't foresee possibility, he foresees OUTCOME the second you intend it. Kenbunshoku for the likes of Zoro and Luffy has been repeatedly shown to be always accurate, while Katakuri's precognition has several instances of it being countered/Changed due to his being overall precognition, while Zoro's, albeit far inferior in the length of foresight, is still definitive since it foresees what you "intend" to do, not predicts what thousands of things you COULD do.
To make it simpler one would be:
Mind's eye: Foresees thousands of things you COULD do and chooses a single outcome that can negate all
Kenbunshoku: Foresees what you "intent", meaning it doesn't rely on "chance", just definitive foresight with the only way of overcoming it being far too fast for the user to even react to what they foresaw (>Luffy vs Kaido's thunder Bagua on the roof). They don't "predict" it, they just foresee your intent the second you have it.

Kenbunshoku is just far superior. It has far less inconsistencies. You could counter mind's eye by foreseeing what the user's move is going to be and countering it. (Similiarly to how Luffy's Kenbunshoku negated Katakuri's foresight).

That aside- her mind's eye clashing with his Kenbunshoku would likely result in both being practically pointless, since every outcome she could predict, he'd foresee her countering it before she even does it. To attack, she'll need to "intend" her attack first. Unless she has Ultra instinct-

It boils down to being a head on battle. So what does she have offensively that can put Zoro down before he breaks her swords?

Musashi doesn't have mind eyes (neither of the two) + have you read the heavenly eyes quote i send?

And Musashi doesn't need to foresee outcome (even tho she does as she litteraly foresee every outcome so death she had when facing lancer and had chose the outcome when she win) she litteraly chose the one she want when facing him, zoro can't litteraly does a thing as she litteraly chose the possibility she want to be the outcome

Except the thing you tell doesn't work in fate as nobody have only one intent, musashi litteraly fighted yagyuu who have is intent present in every possibility she was able to see + acausality type 4 will litteraly mean that he can't foresee her intent.

She have litteraly better prediction than arturia/scathach who can see the futur, and you talk about foresee bruh when she litteraly fight and win guy that do it better....

+ How you can tell that he have far less inconstency when we have see it failed so many time? You litteraly tell it that his preco fail the moment someone do something like him or his quicker when she has use it to fight someone who was several quicker than her and infinity speed (yagyuu) before entering go zero.

And to atk musashi chose her possibility, she doesn't intent something, she see all possibilities and chose the one she want to win.

And zoro would never be able to broke her sword, Ivan a 1-C wasn't able to do it, it not zoro who could make it.

 

[XDragnoir]

Kenbunshoku for the likes of Zoro and Luffy has been repeatedly shown to be always accurate, while Katakuri's precognition has several instances of it being countered/Changed due to his being overall precognition, while Zoro's, albeit far inferior in the length of foresight, is still definitive since it foresees what you "intend" to do, not predicts what thousands of things you COULD do.

Kata's FS has only ever failed against other FS users (Sanji and Luffy) while Luffy before getting his own FS was being hit by Kata all the time, regardless of his own Kenbu. Pre-FS Kenbu is also just a combo of mind reading and aura reading, hard to deal with but nothing impossible as you are trying to make it seem.

I don't care about the outcome of this thread as Post-TS OP is going through a heavy downgrade now but meh.

 

[Regidian]

Kata's FS has only ever failed against other FS users (Sanji and Luffy) while Luffy before getting his own FS was being hit by Kata all the time, regardless of his own Kenbu. Pre-FS Kenbu is also just a combo of mind reading and aura reading, hard to deal with but nothing impossible as you are trying to make it seem.

I don't care about the outcome of this thread as Post-TS OP is going through a heavy downgrade now but meh.

He like telling that being able to see one outcome based one something as simple as intent is better than seeing every possibility and choosing the one you want...

In all the possibility she see she like litteraly see the moment zoro use his preco so she like counter it directly

 

[SnookB]

You're misunderstanding the "intent" quote entirely.
Intentions aren't what result in Kebunshoku working. Kenbunshoku foresees what you're straight up going to do because that's what your intent lands on. It isn't "predicting every intention" it's "Foreseeing what action your intent lands you on". That's why Katakuri's foresight can be argued to be inferior to Luffy's, because Luffy flat out foresees the outcome based on your emotions, than just foresee what COULD occur.
Again- causality type 4 works on traditional foresight, not combat precognition. Foreseeing the universal future vs Foreseeing what you're literally going to do next are two different things.

Kata's FS has only ever failed against other FS users (Sanji and Luffy) while Luffy before getting his own FS was being hit by Kata all the time, regardless of his own Kenbu. Pre-FS Kenbu is also just a combo of mind reading and aura reading, hard to deal with but nothing impossible as you are trying to make it seem.

Didn't Katakuri's foresight entirely fail him during the wedding too? Where everything he foresaw was getting changed because the events involving Bege, the cake falling and the box exploding basically resulted in an entirely different future?
That's supernatural luck at its finest, not precog countering precog.

Also fair- Zoro's getting downgraded back to tier 7? Didn't Damage say the Pica scaling is left on hold until the PRE-TS ones are done? There's still a chance he says 6-C because of Hody, Hyozu and all.

 

[LordGinSama]

Honestly they exgange blows for like two seconds, then they get drunk and end up creating the ultimate swordsman child.

 

[SnookB]

He like telling that being able to see one outcome based one something as simple as intent is better than seeing every possibility and choosing the one you want...

Foreseeing what you're going to definitely do > Predicting thousands of things you COULD do. It's only logical.

 

[LordGinSama]

Also let me address the "Zoro's Precognition won't work." that's outright bull shit since Zoro doesn't utilize Future Sight. His Kenbunshoku Haki works via reading the mind, intents, danger and so on. Zoro isn't Kata who looks into the future so her type 4 is meaningless.

 

[Regidian]

You're misunderstanding the "intent" quote entirely.
Intentions aren't what result in Kebunshoku working. Kenbunshoku foresees what you're straight up going to do because that's what your intent lands on. It isn't "predicting every intention" it's "Foreseeing what action your intent lands you on". That's why Katakuri's foresight can be argued to be inferior to Luffy's, because Luffy flat out foresees the outcome based on your emotions, than just foresee what COULD occur.
Again- causality type 4 works on traditional foresight, not combat precognition. Foreseeing the universal future vs Foreseeing what you're literally going to do next are two different things.


Didn't Katakuri's foresight entirely fail him during the wedding too? Where everything he foresaw was getting changed because the events involving Bege, the cake falling and the box exploding basically resulted in an entirely different future?
That's supernatural luck at its finest, not precog countering precog.

Also fair- Zoro's getting downgraded back to tier 7? Didn't Damage say the Pica scaling is left on hold until the PRE-TS ones are done? There's still a chance he says 6-C because of Hody, Hyozu and all.

Cool but it just a simple prediction i mean it was countered multiple time on OP so why you try to talk as it's ansolute?.

Yagyu litteraly do it with all possible outcome.

Using this technique, he is capable of accounting for all possible outcomes of a situation, and staying a step ahead of all of them.

Like i tell being to predict/foresse what a guy do based on their emotion/intention is like a thing every servant do, it's on servant physiology, i'm pretty sure it's the absolute basic of prediction.

Also let me address the "Zoro's Precognition won't work." that's outright bull shit since Zoro doesn't utilize Future Sight. His Kenbunshoku Haki works via reading the mind, intents, danger and so on. Zoro isn't Kata who looks into the future so her type 4 is meaningless.

Okay but if we go by this it's even more easy? You can't read the mind of servant they resist it, all servant are able to read/sense danger and intent

 

[SnookB]

^^
Short and simple. Her type 4 negates psychic foresight, or overall foresight. Similiar to Shyrley's or Katakuri's. Zoro's is combat reliant and simply works too differently than traditional future seeing to fall under that same category that's negated by type 4. Her existing outside of the laws of the universe doesn't mean she has no thought process or emotions, which is what Zoro/Luffy's kenbunshoku works off of.

 

[LordGinSama]

Also Zoro has like 3 forms of Analytical Prediction without the usage of Kenbunshoku, Goken based Prediction which in of itself has 2 forms of Prediction and he gets another form of Prediction later on in the form of mental images.


Saying Musashi's precognition / Prediction is better than Zoro's is false as they're two different types of Prediction. Her being able to know infinite possibilities doesn't make it superior to Zoro's.



I also have some very serious doubts on Musashi resorting to her fate hax for an auto win whene against another honorable swordsman like Zoro. That wouldn't make sense as the entire point of her character is that she likes a good sword clash.

 

[Regidian]

Also Zoro has like 3 forms of Analytical Prediction without the usage of Kenbunshoku, Goken based Prediction which in of itself has 2 forms of Prediction and he gets another form of Prediction later on in the form of mental images.


Saying Musashi's precognition / Prediction is better than Zoro's is false as they're two different types of Prediction. Her being able to know infinite possibilities doesn't make it superior to Zoro's.



I also have some very serious doubts on Musashi resorting to her fate hax for an auto win whene against another honorable swordsman like Zoro. That wouldn't make sense as the entire point of her character is that she likes a good sword clash.

She like good clash but doesn't like to lose so no?

 

[SnookB]

Cool but it just a simple prediction i mean it was countered multiple time on OP so why you try to talk as it's ansolute?.

Yagyu litteraly do it with all possible outcome.

Using this technique, he is capable of accounting for all possible outcomes of a situation, and staying a step ahead of all of them.

Like i tell being to predict/foresse what a guy do based on their emotion/intention is like a thing every servant do, it's on servant physiology, i'm pretty sure it's the absolute basic of prediction.
Okay but if we go by this it's even more easy? You can't read the mind of servant they resist it, all servant are able to read/sense danger and intent

Clearly you don't understand what Kenbunshoku is if you're calling it "Only prediction". Every capable fighter in One Piece can predict trajectory. Kenbunshoku is quite literally seeing the future/Sensing the future. In Zoro's case, he sees the outcome that your final decision leads to, rather than predicting what you intend to do before you even decide it.

 

[LordGinSama]

Okay but if we go by this it's even more easy? You can't read the mind of servant they resist it, all servant are able to read/sense danger and intent

All Servant's aren't able to read Danger sensing and Intent, and Kenbunshoku packs a lot of the stuff listed above. Kenbunshoku Haki can detect damn near every emotion possible, on top of Kenbunshoku Haki users having more forms of enhanced senses than the majority of Servant's.

 

[LordGinSama]

She like good clash but doesn't like to lose so no?

Why would she lose? She's likely as skilled if not more skilled than Zoro so I see no reason for her to "cut fate GG." instead of taking her time.

 

[Regidian]

All Servant's aren't able to read Danger sensing and Intent, and Kenbunshoku packs a lot of the stuff listed above. Kenbunshoku Haki can detect damn near every emotion possible, on top of Kenbunshoku Haki users having more forms of enhanced senses than the majority of Servant's.

They all do for the emotion, not all for the danger but musashi do as it a basic thing for swordmaster

 

[LordGinSama]

Also "all possible outcomes." is vague as ****. Said outcomes don't have an actual number behind them, unless every Servant has like infinite numbers of attacks they can use. Movements are limited.

 

[XDragnoir]

Didn't Katakuri's foresight entirely fail him during the wedding too? Where everything he foresaw was getting changed because the events involving Bege, the cake falling and the box exploding basically resulted in an entirely different future?
That's supernatural luck at its finest, not precog countering precog.

Not really? When telling Bege to kill Luffy he had yet to see Bege's actions in the future (his precog is just 5 or so seconds), it never failed it just couldn't see far enough to stop every single action the "Alliance" was taking.

Clearly you don't understand what Kenbunshoku is if you're calling it "Only prediction". Every capable fighter in One Piece can predict trajectory. Kenbunshoku is quite literally seeing the future/Sensing the future. In Zoro's case, he sees the outcome that your final decision leads to, rather than predicting what you intend to do before you even decide it.

No, Future Sight users (Kata, Sanji and Luffy) can see the future, no one else can.

 

[LordGinSama]

They all do for the emotion, not all for the danger but musashi do as it a basic thing for swordmaster

Fair enough, what emotions? It's pretty much a basic for any notable swordsman in OP as well.

 

[RazumaHiroki]

Wait. I thought they were just joking when they said about making a Zoro vs Musashi aka a swordsman supposedly less skilled than Kojiro. I can already tell this won't end up well.

 

[Regidian]

[

Also "all possible outcomes." is vague as ****. Said outcomes don't have an actual number behind them, unless every Servant has like infinite numbers of attacks they can use. Movements are limited.

Well suigetsu is tell to be a differt version of infinity of sasaki is juste that sasaki atk with infinitybpossibility in same time when suigetsu can counter every outcome.

It's just in fate possibility are not obligatory outcome

 

[LordGinSama]

Wait. I thought they were just joking when they said about making a Zoro vs Musashi aka a swordsman supposedly less skilled than Kojiro. I can already tell this won't end up well.

It's going fine so far, there just seems to be some confusion with how Kenbunshoku Haki works.




Also a sidenote, Zoro has stupid good Supernatural Luck, back in East Blue he avoided being cut by a cursed sword with his Luck alone and said cursed sword is said to bring a terrible death to the user. So his Luck has essentially been countering a curse for years.

 

[Regidian]

Wait. I thought they were just joking when they said about making a Zoro vs Musashi aka a swordsman supposedly less skilled than Kojiro. I can already tell this won't end up well.

Musashi is more skilled than kojiro now on fgo, just pre zero musashi who is less, but she have her heavenly eyes but that she can make the law of world obey her to counter it

 

[LordGinSama]

[
Well suigetsu is tell to be a differt version of infinity of sasaki is juste that sasaki atk with infinitybpossibility in same time when suigetsu can counter every outcome.

Mind going over this again? I can't quite understand what your saying here no offense.

It's just in fate possibility are not obligatory outcome

Works the same in One Piece, the future can always be changed by the actions of others as seen with Katakuri and Sanji using FS. Katakuri saw what Sanji was going to do and saw himself killing Sanji then Sanji tricked it by dodging with his own future sight.