Sailor Moon Discussion Thread

[IkaniL]

The image of it alone seems to agree with it being a Galaxy.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Nebulae can look like that.

 

[Nephillim99]

Nebula is star system...

No it is not. A Nebula is an archaic term used to refer to a large collection of celestial bodies like a galaxy, and today is used to refer to a specic kind of star system groups. It is WAY WAY bigger then a star system

 

[IkaniL]

Nebula is star system...

No it is not. A Nebula is an archaic term used to refer to a large collection of celestial bodies like a galaxy, and today is used to refer to a specic kind of star system groups. It is WAY WAY bigger then a star system

Isn't their Galaxy being compared to the Tau system in one of those panels? If it is. They both seem around the same size.

Not sure if thats what it is though.

 

[Nephillim99]

It's not. The Tau System doesn't enter the dimension because, being a galaxy, it would destroy the entire galaxy. It is referred to techncially as the Tau Nebula, with being the old school definition like "galaxy". This is really easy to find information online, though even today a nebula does not and has never meant a star system. From the on panel pictures you can clearly tell it's supposed to be a spiral galaxy.

 

[DarkLK]

The word there is "µÿƒÚø▓" Seiun which translates to "Nebula" or "Galaxy" not "µÿƒþ│╗" Seikai which is "Solar System"

µÿƒþ│╗ is "Star System".

"Solar System" is Õñ¬ÚÖ¢þ│╗.



Maybe I missed something, but I see here only µÿƒþ│╗.

 

[IkaniL]

It's not. The Tau System doesn't enter the dimension because, being a galaxy, it would destroy the entire galaxy. It is referred to techncially as the Tau Nebula, with being the old school definition like "galaxy". This is really easy to find information online, though even today a nebula does not and has never meant a star system. From the on panel pictures you can clearly tell it's supposed to be a spiral galaxy.

I see.

Like I said, the visuals say its a galaxy xD

Btw. I will be obtaining the Kodansha translation of Sailor Moon soon. So, I will be able to post pictures of the scans for any of the feats needed. Since thats the version we would need to use for this,

 

[Nephillim99]

Maybe I missed something, but I see here only µÿƒþ│╗.

I was looking at the panel after that where Pluto says it's a very distant galaxy in the Miss Dream translation and the Kodansha translation and it looks like it says Seiun. I'll be honest I don't speak Japanese and my eyesight isn't great so it's hard to see. Sorry for any confusion there.

Look it's 1 AM here so I probably am gonna have to go, if you want we can continue sometime tomorrow with this civil debate.

 

[DodoNova2]

I think synonymous galaxy, because if the were trusted to a single translation, Tau would be a Universe

Or a Enormous Nebula....

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Okay folks. I will start reading Sailor Moon in-full. Can you people recommend to me an website where I can read the manga in english?

 

[DodoNova2]

The best site is Miss Dream but I must warn you that some translation are false

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Miss Dream is the best one, like DodoNova2 some of the translations are false but that can be figured out via discussion and comparing translation like here. For the most part, it is quite useful.


And I'm heading to bed also, I'll join back here tomorrow. Hopefully we can start talking about the second arc in greater depth.

 

[DodoNova2]

Regarding the images of Dark, and It is necessary to translate the small box next Because it is or rather it designates



And ..... I'm not blind but it looks a lot like a galaxy or a huge star system

 

[Karin_Shaku]

I was looking at the panel after that where Pluto says it's a very distant galaxy in the Miss Dream translation and the Kodansha translation and it looks like it says Seiun. I'll be honest I don't speak Japanese and my eyesight isn't great so it's hard to see. Sorry for any confusion there.

Look it's 1 AM here so I probably am gonna have to go, if you want we can continue sometime tomorrow with this civil debate.


"Seikei" can be star systems, star clusters or galaxy. In Chinese it would mean galaxy, although that may not be relevant at all in this case. Just because Japanese is exclusive in its use with "ginga", which is transliterated from the same source as the western term for galaxy, doesn't make it any less so when not being used. Plus pLuto was hinting at its appearance from afar, but it resembles a spiral galaxy more than any type of stellar congregation.

 

[DodoNova2]

To summarize: The world of pharaoh 90 is called "Tau Nebula" in English, it is designer like a galaxy It names "Tau Star System" in Japanese, it is designer as a small universe (only once)

I agree with Karin On the other hand, the translation of the word is Chinese, it has two meanings which say the same thing, the word translated in English means Star system but it refers to the Chinese word meaning galaxy





It is obvious that this is galaxy with the proof and the Galaxy Drawing of the Manga

Also this definition also

:

 

[DodoNova2]

In Japan star system means galaxy, I took some pictures when I type the word in Japanese




and the definition of µÿƒþ│╗ in japa

https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/星系

Conclusion: Tau Star system = Galaxy

And to finish in beauty, here is the definition Enflish of Star system: "A Star System or stellar system is a small number of stars that orbit each other, bound by gravitational attraction. A large number of stars bound by gravitation is called cluster or Galaxy"

Now when you see the images of Tau, this is an obvious so the deal is concluded

PS: For those who would say no, ginga(Úèǵ▓│) means galaxy, The word Ginga in Japan designates the Milky Way and not a galaxy random

 

[Dariel_Senju]

I'm not a fan but if it's a kanji theme I can get an idea, and according to the discussion I understand the point. I just want to say what the three words mean:

The word for Solar System is Õñ¬ÚÖ¢þ│╗ - I have not seen it in any of the images above but it is to clarify at what point they refer or not to one. Your page in Japanese Wikipedia is https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/恒星系

The word for Star System is µÿƒþ│╗ - shown in two images above. When you search for that word in Wikipedia in Japanese, you go to this page https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/星系 that explains the term and gives three links:

A star system is a gathering of stars like a galaxy or a cluster.

• Star system - a star system with multiple stars.
• Binary system - a star system with two stars.
• Planetary system - a star system with a planet like the solar system.

The word for Universe is Õ«çÕ«Ö - shown in one of the images above. Its page in Japanese Wikipedia is https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/宇宙

The only word that is not shown in any of the two images is the solar system so maybe the manga does not refer to that, I only say this by the evidence. If we stick to the term star system, a galaxy is a type of star system so in the parts that use that term may be referring to a galaxy, I guess it depends on the context shown.

I really do not know how I got here, I do not know anything about Sailor Moon but I saw a kanji theme and I'm interested, sorry if I'm reckless getting into a subject I do not know, I can only talk about the translations of the kanji.

 

[DodoNova2]

Do not apologize this discussion is for everyone, thank you for having enlightened on this so the images of the manga shows a galaxy "star system

this page Can also enlighten you

https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/星系

 

[CantStoptheCrobat]

1: ....Alright a peanut contains less mass-energy then a nuke. But you can't blast a nuke and form a peanut. It takes a lot of energy to create something but it doesn't JUST take energy. Sailor Galaxia has the Crystal of DESTRUCTION, no duh she can't CREATE a galaxy.
2: Why on Earth would I use a FAN TRANSLATION over the latest official English Translation, the Kodansha Translation? What is Buu a galaxy buster now cause a fan translation said he was?

3: "Constellations" are not just in a galaxy, they are an ordering of the stars in the sky and so would contains many galaxies. That not's even getting into the fact that you haven't given a reason why it's not a universe. it's described as such in-universe, and it's called a parallel world, like a parallel universe, so it's clearly referencing that idea. There is evidence and there is no counter-evidence other then you don't think there is enough evidence which I'm sorry is just your opinion.

4:Tau Nebula is a galaxy. It's several times referred to as a galaxy

I can tell you what the Kodansha scan says if you want, but Kodansha translation is not uploaded online. It's in act 53 before Princess Small Lady says she is going to go back to the past to help Sailor Moon

5: I brought up the thematics because you were claiming the entirety of the 5th arc takes place in the milky way, and that the story is contained in the galaxy, which goes against the central tenet of the story

1. So?

2. But then inconsistencies happen. We should honestly use the same translation for every series we debate. Otherwise I can very well mix the original translations and other fan translations in DBZ and say Buuhan is universe level+. Also, NO fan translation EVER said Kid Buu = galaxy level

3. It's NOT ENOUGH proof. Saitama is called the One Punch Man in-verse, doesn't mean he can one-punch anything. What you described is enough evidence for at least small galaxy level. Proof would be for example a scan where it's literally shown as a universe. How does the space-time continuum behave there, for example?

4. "miniature replica of a galaxy"

"yes, it's a very distant galaxy"

Well the thing is it's not the size of the Milky Way. So I guess multi-star system level+? Maybe small galaxy level.

5. how does it go against the central tenet of the story... who's to say Cosmos vs Chaos cannot happen in a galaxy? Or better yet, on a planet. Yes, they do mean what they mean, but each writer can adapt them to their story however they want. And I remember Naoko saying Sailor Moon is first and foremost a love story.


I haven't read Sailor Moon in a while, but I do remember reading the Miss Dream translation, one which simply put doesn't show enough proof for universe level Sailor Moon. How is it that until 2015 everyone believed Moon is only galactic?

 

[DodoNova2]

1. So?

2. But then inconsistencies happen. We should honestly use the same translation for every series we debate. Otherwise I can very well mix the original translations and other fan translations in DBZ and say Buuhan is universe level+. Also, NO fan translation EVER said Kid Buu = galaxy level

3. It's NOT ENOUGH proof. Saitama is called the One Punch Man in-verse, doesn't mean he can one-punch anything. What you described is enough evidence for at least small galaxy level. Proof would be for example a scan where it's literally shown as a universe. How does the space-time continuum behave there, for example?

4. "miniature replica of a galaxy"

"yes, it's a very distant galaxy"

Well the thing is it's not the size of the Milky Way. So I guess multi-star system level+? Maybe small galaxy level.

5. how does it go against the central tenet of the story... who's to say Cosmos vs Chaos cannot happen in a galaxy? Or better yet, on a planet. Yes, they do mean what they mean, but each writer can adapt them to their story however they want. And I remember Naoko saying Sailor Moon is first and foremost a love story.


I haven't read Sailor Moon in a while, but I do remember reading the Miss Dream translation, one which simply put doesn't show enough proof for universe level Sailor Moon. How is it that until 2015 everyone believed Moon is only galactic?

1-What he tries to tell you is that creates = / = Destroy, in other, in the first 4 Arc, we saw the power of destruction of silver crystal but in the fifth, its use can create a universe and SM Reboot the timeline

2-You misunderstood what he said, he says that the translation kodansha is the original trans, it does not come from fan, We do not mix the trad but we make rectification while waiting for the best trad

3- Very bad example ..... for Saitama it is just said that it was too strong so that it beat its enemies in one blow (which is discredited in the manga) for nehellenia, it is said that it is a Alternate Universe / World and have shown us the vacuum of space and constellations through its mirror, give us a proof that could discredited this

4-Okay .... Galaxy means galaxy so I do not need to argue anymore ....


5-I agree with ..... the last sentence but What you say does not discredited Universal SM (I'm sick of repeating so read below)


Is that an argument or not? But I can enlighten you on that The SM manga has much less fan than the anime, the people who read the whole manga are not very numerous, in 2015 sailor moon was only galette because the last arc it was based on the galaxy, coupled with a misunderstanding that Led us to galactic SM

But yet the proof that we have come from the translation of Miss dream and we have proved that SM is universal since 2016 with Imperator

We did not need calc for SM but if you doubt the level Universe: https://forums.hero-academia.com/xf...t-up-the-universe-sailor-moon-calc-2-0.36184/ (Accepted)

The change is now!

Sailor Moon Universe proof:

• Disturb All Space Time With silver crystal
• Sources of all Energy in the universe
• Restore All the Cosmos Static'
• Destroy The Universe Via paradox
• Light Up All Time Space
• Total control of the Galaxy Cauldron (creator of the universe)
• Immeasurable and infinite
• Chaos Can create a new universe Fully modifying the timeline
• Chaos Warp "Far Reach of" Space Time
• Sailor Chaos have all faculty of chaos spawm so Warp All Space Time
• Nehellenia 's Universe

Sailor Moon Galaxy proof of Crobat:

• The battle that happens in the galaxy'
• Galaxia Mentions Creates New Galaxy
• Full Hyperbole
• 2015

I would no longer speak for the sailor moon universe level because it is more than an obvious, I leave the floor to others if it persists

 

[IkaniL]

Okay folks. I will start reading Sailor Moon in-full. Can you people recommend to me an website where I can read the manga in english?

Would you like me to send you scans of the Kodansha translation for anything thats mistranslated by the one you're reading? I'd be happy to help with providing that.

 

[IkaniL]

1: ....Alright a peanut contains less mass-energy then a nuke. But you can't blast a nuke and form a peanut. It takes a lot of energy to create something but it doesn't JUST take energy. Sailor Galaxia has the Crystal of DESTRUCTION, no duh she can't CREATE a galaxy.
2: Why on Earth would I use a FAN TRANSLATION over the latest official English Translation, the Kodansha Translation? What is Buu a galaxy buster now cause a fan translation said he was?

3: "Constellations" are not just in a galaxy, they are an ordering of the stars in the sky and so would contains many galaxies. That not's even getting into the fact that you haven't given a reason why it's not a universe. it's described as such in-universe, and it's called a parallel world, like a parallel universe, so it's clearly referencing that idea. There is evidence and there is no counter-evidence other then you don't think there is enough evidence which I'm sorry is just your opinion.

4:Tau Nebula is a galaxy. It's several times referred to as a galaxy

I can tell you what the Kodansha scan says if you want, but Kodansha translation is not uploaded online. It's in act 53 before Princess Small Lady says she is going to go back to the past to help Sailor Moon

5: I brought up the thematics because you were claiming the entirety of the 5th arc takes place in the milky way, and that the story is contained in the galaxy, which goes against the central tenet of the story

1. So?
2. But then inconsistencies happen. We should honestly use the same translation for every series we debate. Otherwise I can very well mix the original translations and other fan translations in DBZ and say Buuhan is universe level+. Also, NO fan translation EVER said Kid Buu = galaxy level

3. It's NOT ENOUGH proof. Saitama is called the One Punch Man in-verse, doesn't mean he can one-punch anything. What you described is enough evidence for at least small galaxy level. Proof would be for example a scan where it's literally shown as a universe. How does the space-time continuum behave there, for example?

4. "miniature replica of a galaxy"

"yes, it's a very distant galaxy"

Well the thing is it's not the size of the Milky Way. So I guess multi-star system level+? Maybe small galaxy level.

5. how does it go against the central tenet of the story... who's to say Cosmos vs Chaos cannot happen in a galaxy? Or better yet, on a planet. Yes, they do mean what they mean, but each writer can adapt them to their story however they want. And I remember Naoko saying Sailor Moon is first and foremost a love story.


I haven't read Sailor Moon in a while, but I do remember reading the Miss Dream translation, one which simply put doesn't show enough proof for universe level Sailor Moon. How is it that until 2015 everyone believed Moon is only galactic?

Adding to Dodonova's reply. I'm mainly pointing out the issues with your arguement.


1 - "So?" Sounds like an avoidance. He made a very convincing analogy explaining why what Galaxia said cannot prove Galactic level SM. And since you like comparing DBZ so much.

I guess the same can be said for Beerus. Since he is nothing but a destroyer, if he was asked if he could create a planet. But replied with a "No." Then, according to your arguement, DBZ has only been planet level all along.

Now, Beerus and Galaxia are very similar in their powers. LIke Beerus is the destroyer for the DBZ universe, Galaxia is the destroyer for the SM universe. ..So, just by Simple logic. They cannot create anything the size of a galaxy since their power is mainly destruction and not creation at all.


2 - Okay, I can agree. Using fan translations or anything thats not the technical English translation isn't a good idea. Unfortunately, Kodansha is very tight on their manga, and its nearly impossible to find scans of it on the internet.

I'm going to obtain the Kodansha translation for this purpose though. And scans will be available whenever needed.


3 - Seriously.. Why do you keep using Saitama? OPM does not compare to SM's situation At All actually.

Saitama is for a single thing, a comedy character as much as he is a serious character. The joke is that he has gotten so strong, anybody to our knowledge can easily be defeated by him in a single punch. This isn't as Blatant as saying constantly the Silver Crystal is Infinite or has Immeasurable power. Which all the villains wanted so they could use said power for their own evil purpose.

Also, why would they mention it SO MUCH if it didn't have the power? You would think they would have realized at some point, it didn't have Infinite power. Let alone Chaos, who specifically wanted it to create another UNIVERSE with it.


4 - I don't really have much to add to what Dodonova said. You're just trying too hard now. ._.


5 - Okay. The big reason alot say SM is Galaxy level is because the fight takes place in the Galaxy.

But if we go by that logic. Every DBZ character is planet level and nowhere beyond. Simply because, they fight on a planet and don't fight in space. Ofcourse, its kinda obvious why they fight only there. If you understand.

A galaxy is essentially a very big place, and nowhere near the size of the universe. Ofcourse the fights are only to be centered around the Galaxy, thats where they live. Plus, why do they need to go to other Galaxy's? The Galaxy cauldron is already there. And thats what Chaos and Galaxia wanted to control. Since if you gain the Crystal of Creation and Destruction, gather all the Sailor Crystals, you gain control of the universe and the Galaxy Cauldron, which gives you alot of power, like.

Actual destruction feats aren't usually going to happen. Most of tiering is done with powerscaling actually, and feats are used when they are found. Also, the feats for Universal SM is there. And its really not that hard to understand why the Infinite power around the Silver Crystal holds up when you have Chaos basically proving he is universal and such.


I mean, there is way more evidence regarding Universal SM than what you have provided. Most of what you're saying is merely pointing out things you can't essentially prove to try and make an arguement, you constantly also disregard alot of the evidence thats is displayed to you in favor of continueing with the same material you have.

I'm sorry, but if you are this misinformed, I reccomend you find a way to read the English translation, and actually look at the points you're trying to make.

 

[CantStoptheCrobat]

1) But why does Galaxia say "forge a new galaxy"??? And Chaos says "it's time to create a new universe". Who is right? Galaxia or Chaos? Because from what I read, the final chapters show neither one really is right.

Well yeah but Vegeta destroyed the ROSAT which, according to the specs I use (OBD), makes him universe level+... iirc here the ROSAT was considered planetary no?

2) BTW, for those who know Japanese, how have you determined the Kodansha translation is the most reliable?

3) No matter how constantly it was pointed out (via statements) that the Silver Crystal "has infinite power", it doesn't matter. What matters is if the Silver Crystal has shown universal destruction, creation, or something to that effect.

Let's see what you guys have provided:

Chaos wanted to use the Silver Crystal to create a new universe - he wanted to... but doesn't necessarily mean he could. Galaxia also said galaxy in the former scan, so who is right?

If the two silver crystals collided (in the 2nd or 3rd arc), the universe would have ended - but they didn't. And yes, Pluto stopped time just before the collision, because the impact could have, indeed, destroyed the entire area where the Sailors were fighting and the Sailor Senshi with it. But the "universe destroying" could have very well been a hyperbole.

The Silver Crystal is the source of all the energy in the universe - statements that aren't backed up by consistent feats.

Disturbing all space-time with the Silver Crystal - would NOT call that feat a universe level feat tbh...

Destroy the universe via paradox - how again?

Total control over the Galaxy Cauldon, creator of the universe - if it's repeatedly stated through the manga that the Galaxy Cauldron holds the Milky Way together, how is it "the creator of the universe" -_- It's not "Universal Cauldron".

Lights up all of the time and space - not a universe level feat.

Restores all the cosmos' static - because it's called the Lambda Power and the Lambda constant is what it is? It's also stated to be the strongest power in the universe, but IT DOESN'T MEAN it can control it. Also, you have ignored the posibility of Sailor Cosmos not knowing of possible higher powers than the Lambda Power.

Otherwise, by your logic, Boros is star level beause his attack is called "Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon". Hell, Cell Saga Vegeta is universe level because his attack is named "Big Bang".

Immeasurable and infinite - statement, statement, statement.

Nehellenia's Mirror World - it being called a parallel universe doesn't mean it is. I could call my dog's bite something that can destroy the entire galaxy. You guys provided evidence of it having constellations (which are by definition regions of the celestial sphere). But that isn't enough...

Freezing the entire universe - it never happened and it's not a universe level feat either.

4) But you guys point out Saturn is galaxy level by that arc, even though the Tau nebula is nowhere now the size of the Milky Way.

5) Hmm. Look at Goku vs Kid Buu... it took place in the Kaioshin realm, which is 1/10 the universe. DBZ wouldn't be planet level.

And if Chaos wanted to control the Galaxy Cauldron, well as I explained earlier it doesn't make him universal, only galactic.


Unfortunately I can't get the Sailor Moon translation you're referring to here because I live in a country where no one really cares about manga in general.

 

[DodoNova2]

"Statements that are not backed up by consistent feats." .......

"Would NOT call that feat a universe level feat tbh ..." ......

"But they did not know what to do, but they did not know what to do with it. Very well been a hyperbole. " ......


"Not a universe level feat" Multi Galactic


"Statement, statement, statement" ......
It is called a parallel universe does not mean it is. I could call my dog's bite something that can destroy the entire galaxy. You guys provided evidence of it having constellations (which are by definition regions of the celestial sphere). But that is not enough ........


Because it's called the Lambda Power and the Lambda constant is what it is? It 's also stated to be the strongest power in the universe, but DO DOES NOT MEAN it can control it. Also, you have ignored the posibility of Sailor Cosmos not knowing of possible higher powers than the Lambda Power ........


If it's repeatedly stated through the manga that the Galaxy Cauldron holds the Milky Way together, how is it "the creator of the universe." -_- It's not "Universal Cauldron". .......


It is called a parallel universe does not mean it is. I could call my dog's bite something that can destroy the entire galaxy. You guys provided evidence of it having constellations (which are by definition regions of the celestial sphere). But that is not enough ... .......


But why does Galaxia say "forge a new galaxy" ??? And Chaos says "it's time to create a new universe". Who is right? Galaxia or Chaos? Because of what I read, the final chapters show neither one really is right. ......

 

[DodoNova2]

• Sources of all Energy in the universe This is mentioned ten times in the manga .....
• Disturb All Space Time With silver crystal So this is the bad liver ..... Disturbing All Space time is not a Universal Feat ???????
• Restore All the Cosmos Static This is not a hyperbole, why compare you with the big bang attack ???? We are told a power that restores The integrality of Cosmos Static, this is not a hyperbole if not all the feats of Naruto are false, and besides, She does it! She reparates all the damage of chaos In space Time and Reboot the universe!
• Destroy The Universe Via paradox You have not read the scan? He says it clearly "Then the entire world will collapse in Upon itself, the distortion in space time will be too great to Stop "
• Light Up All Time Space Multi Galactic
• Total control of the Galaxy Cauldron (creator of the universe) It is also said that the galactic cauldron is the source of all in the galaxys
• Immeasurable and infinite Repeat dozens of times ...
• Chaos Can create a new universe Fully modifying the timeline Create = / = Destroy, the example of kaltias is good too, Chaos with crystal can create a new universe, why lie ??? And he did not do it because he never had silver crystal and just nothing with his presence it disturbing the space up to the bottom of space time what would change the timeline If it's like that, dialga and palkia are not Universe level because they did not create the new Universe
• Chaos Warp "Far Reach of" Space Time it's Okay
• Sailor Chaos have all faculty of chaos spawm so Warp All Space Time it's Okay
• Nehellenia 's Universe Not enough proof ..... it's a joke?

There is far too much evidence to put Sailor Moon Universe....

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Honestly, crobat's arguments are just going to circles. I mean really, "it being called a parallel universe doesn't mean it is. "

You're basically asking everyone to ignore and disregard all statements. That's not how it works. The dailogue, the written literature, and statemetns are part of the story and shape that. You're basically accusing the author of lying about her own work. Which at this point makes no sense and is running this thread to the ground with the repeated arguments. It doesn't matter what we say or do. Nothing will ever convince you Sailor Moon to be at any level than the one you've prescribed.

You keep saying Sailor Moon is at Galaxy level, yet Dodo has already shown you a calc that puts her at multi-galaxy level by OBD standrds, the one you say you ascribe to. (nevermind this is not the OBD and is vsbattle) Yet you still cling to the notions that she's just Galaxy level. That makes no sense, and shows that you have no interest in being convinced or evolving past your stance.

 

[DodoNova2]

This time I stop arguing to speak in a vacuum, I prefer to wait for Matt to discuss with him all this, nothing will convince you but your arguments will not convince us either

PS:There are calc Universe level too ...

 

[IkaniL]

This guy either never actually read the maga, or just is a strict OBD person, which he likely is.

 

[IkaniL]

1) But why does Galaxia say "forge a new galaxy"??? And Chaos says "it's time to create a new universe". Who is right? Galaxia or Chaos? Because from what I read, the final chapters show neither one really is right.
Well yeah but Vegeta destroyed the ROSAT which, according to the specs I use (OBD), makes him universe level+... iirc here the ROSAT was considered planetary no?

2) BTW, for those who know Japanese, how have you determined the Kodansha translation is the most reliable?

3) No matter how constantly it was pointed out (via statements) that the Silver Crystal "has infinite power", it doesn't matter. What matters is if the Silver Crystal has shown universal destruction, creation, or something to that effect.

Let's see what you guys have provided:

Chaos wanted to use the Silver Crystal to create a new universe - he wanted to... but doesn't necessarily mean he could. Galaxia also said galaxy in the former scan, so who is right?

If the two silver crystals collided (in the 2nd or 3rd arc), the universe would have ended - but they didn't. And yes, Pluto stopped time just before the collision, because the impact could have, indeed, destroyed the entire area where the Sailors were fighting and the Sailor Senshi with it. But the "universe destroying" could have very well been a hyperbole.

The Silver Crystal is the source of all the energy in the universe - statements that aren't backed up by consistent feats.

Disturbing all space-time with the Silver Crystal - would NOT call that feat a universe level feat tbh...

Destroy the universe via paradox - how again?

Total control over the Galaxy Cauldon, creator of the universe - if it's repeatedly stated through the manga that the Galaxy Cauldron holds the Milky Way together, how is it "the creator of the universe" -_- It's not "Universal Cauldron".

Lights up all of the time and space - not a universe level feat.

Restores all the cosmos' static - because it's called the Lambda Power and the Lambda constant is what it is? It's also stated to be the strongest power in the universe, but IT DOESN'T MEAN it can control it. Also, you have ignored the posibility of Sailor Cosmos not knowing of possible higher powers than the Lambda Power.

Otherwise, by your logic, Boros is star level beause his attack is called "Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon". Hell, Cell Saga Vegeta is universe level because his attack is named "Big Bang".

Immeasurable and infinite - statement, statement, statement.

Nehellenia's Mirror World - it being called a parallel universe doesn't mean it is. I could call my dog's bite something that can destroy the entire galaxy. You guys provided evidence of it having constellations (which are by definition regions of the celestial sphere). But that isn't enough...

Freezing the entire universe - it never happened and it's not a universe level feat either.

4) But you guys point out Saturn is galaxy level by that arc, even though the Tau nebula is nowhere now the size of the Milky Way.

5) Hmm. Look at Goku vs Kid Buu... it took place in the Kaioshin realm, which is 1/10 the universe. DBZ wouldn't be planet level.

And if Chaos wanted to control the Galaxy Cauldron, well as I explained earlier it doesn't make him universal, only galactic.


Unfortunately I can't get the Sailor Moon translation you're referring to here because I live in a country where no one really cares about manga in general.

Alright, lets see whats wrong with your reply.

1 - Easy. They live in the galaxy, so forging a new galaxy would be what Galaxia wanted since she can make it how she see's fit. And it could happen with a new universe. Also, Galaxia is not a universal+ reality warper like Chaos. I think she is Universal+ via destruction, but she is only going to really focus on the galaxy she lives in. Meanwhile, Chaos is going to continue warping the universe at large ofcourse. While Galaxia has her galaxy xD

More evidence points to it can create a universe. What he said directly plays into the infinite and immeasurable power that has been said Consistanly through the story. Feats alone don't always determine tier okay.


2 - Can't answer that. But most agree with the Kodansha translation and would use it.


3 - .......So you would want Chaos to actually get the crystal so he can create another universe. And that would be how we prove you wrong?

Look, Chaos is a reality warper with cosmis awareness. Oh, and he is even a primordial being, so its likely he would know that the Silver Crystal is the source of all energy. Or, that the Galaxy Cauldron created the universe.

Chaos alone is evidence for Universal SM.


- So, Galaxia, who didn't even know about the Galaxy Cauldron until Chaos told her. Is to be taken more seriously than Chaos? Who was manipulating her..?

Galaxia in a scan says she wanted to get the Silver Crystal so she can control the galaxy, but then she corrects herself and realizes she can control the universe instead with it. You cannot use her to deny what Chaos said since she is clearly being used by him. Sorry.

- Its said plenty enough, and Chaos would Obviously have known.

- Dodonova pretty much answered that.

- He also answered that.

- Just because it is called the "Galaxy Cauldron" doesn't make it just galactic. It is said to have sourced all the galaxies.

- You're taking that wrong, and you know it. Sailor Cosmos has cosmic awareness and would know how large the universe is. And its also infinite. She would know how powerful the Lambda power is, because she HAS it herself. The Cosmos crystal is HER crystal. How can she NOT know how strong she is..

- Its said so much. And most of them by Chaos's aspects, who would have the information from him.

- Okay, let me explain how you're wrong.

Just because it is a legend doesn't mean it can't be actual fact too.

The Super Saiyan was a legend, until Goku became a Super Saiyan. Also, don't bring up "Well, the Super Saiyan was also said to the strongest of all" type thing. That was specifically contradicted by the plot. And such was not the case with SM.

Listen, the parrallel universe was a legend until it actually happened. It CAN be assumed a universe based on the evidence provided by the Manga.

- What.. Just because a fight happens in a certain place, doesn't make the characters THAT powerful. And also, thats the same arguement YOU used yourself. With trying to say SM could ONLY be galaxy level.

Reply to the above please if you can. Thats me calling you out.


You need to also reread the manga. The arguement you provide are trying to either use your own way of tiering things, or just try and constantly disprove the clear evidence you have.

 

[Scarletmoon56]

.........

Soooooooo.....

Is anyone hype for Season 4 of CrystalƒÆÄ??

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

I am!

 

[CantStoptheCrobat]

@Dodonova That's not a multi-galactic feat. Read the comment made by Nevermind on that post.

In rest... this is indeed going in circles. I did read Sailor Moon, admittedly a few months ago so I don't remember all the details, but I reached the conclusion that this verse is "all bark and no bite". Naoko is teasing us everywhere about the so-called universal potential, there are statements, statements, statements, disturbing space-time, freaking out, hyperboles, etc... yet there aren't enough feats to support these claims. I love this verse but unless I'm missing something huge I see no reason to think they are universal.

I WILL make one point, though: I believe it's fair to believe Sailor Moon is universe level if you think Cell is solar system level. Since VSwiki is using their own tiering system (unlike OBD), I can see, to some extent, why Moon is way stronger here. Maybe I don't think they're universal for the same reason I don't think Cell is solar-system level.

Also, I'd honestly avoid any Sailor Moon post made by Agent and Imperator, since they are using biased info.

 

[DodoNova2]

Cant@] Read the comment yet down, agents said it's large than large galaxy with the OBD rule, is Petafoe.... 10^60....Multi Galactic.... and check your Wall nevermeind says Multi

"Also, I'd honestly avoid any Sailor Moon post made by Agent and Imperator, since they are using biased info"

I do not say anything any more .....

Good as we know that nobody here will change my mind, I propose to talk about arc 2

 

[IkaniL]

@Crobat

Well, why not reread it? I don't see how you're missing the feats, and you can't exactly take everything as fallacy. I think you're being a bit biased in that regard, let alone saying Agent and Imperator are biased with their information.

If we took everything just by physical feats purely, alot of characters wouldn't be where they should be. Technically, feats can be in words. And I don't think Naoko would say its Infinite 14 times in the manga and it not be infinite. With Cell, he only said it once, even though he doesn't really have any contradiction to what he said. Theres a big difference between saying it a single and saying it 14 times, at that point. Its rather clear.

It does have feats though, and I mean physical feats. I do not think you understand how the SM verse works. Since the Silver Crystal is the source of all energy and infinite, and space-time is said to be a concept of energy and thought together. It makes sense that the SIlver Crystal would control the entire universe. It makes sense for the story aswell for that kind've power to be held by them. Can the Lambda power be called Universal because its named "Lamba"? No. But then again, it has clear evidence its universal. Also. It doesn't have to technically destroy/create a universe to be universal. Alot of characters are universal not by actually destroying and or creating a universe. There are other ways to have feats.

 

[IkaniL]

My points made. So I agree with Dodonova, lets talk about that.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

At this point I'm tempted to close this thread because all that happens here is arguing that goes nowhere.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

I wouldn't say it's all arguing, there have exchanges of ideas and opinions so far. It's better to have this general thread to discuss issues than have other threads be diluted wtih posts when those same issues come up again.


With that said, I do hope we start. The second arc discussion. Specifically with this page:

https://gallery.missdream.org/albums/scanlation_smoon/smoon_act20/023.jpg


Sailor Pluto of course is my favorite senshi. And here learn that she exists outside space and time, and the daughter of Chronos the creater of the spacetime continuum.

 

[DodoNova2]

Does it really exist outside of space and time? It is said between space and time but it really means in the first place?

 

[CantStoptheCrobat]

I'm going to make one final post and then nope out of here.

http://www.narutoforums.com/xfa-blog-entry/universal-sailor-moon.33314/

Basically where everything for the "universal SM stuff" began. Read the comments made by God Movement.


With that, I'm out. Peace

 

[DodoNova2]

@CantStoph thanks but This is not enough at all Oddly the other threads have been all have been accepted by the community ....