RandomGuy2345
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My votes for Ryuko now.
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Ryuko matoi vs Tomura Shigraki
- Thread starter Spinoirr
- Start date
- Status
XSOULOFCINDERX
They/Them- 18,594
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Ryuko FRA.
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Yeah but that 6-A slashing can be used to cut people with inferior durability to her ap apart cartoonishly easily. She’ll instantly reduce him to ribbons the second she gets close and his regeneration is either not going to work or barely work afterwards. Ignoring how it would probably be on the higher end of high mid and he’ll just be dead anyways.
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The misconception of Shigaraki’s regen is quite palpable.
His regen doesn’t “run out” just due to getting punched a lot. It only started to do that because of several factors.
1) Endeavor literally hitting him with attacks that vaporize people. Flashfire attacks disintegrate people due to their sheer heat, and as Endeavor noted, Shigaraki was just regenerating so fast that he was healing over the burning before it could kill him. You can literally see Shigaraki having to regenerate his face when Endeavor punches a fist of flashfire into it, literally lighting his entire skull on fire, only to ignore it and blast himself away. He has the exact same quirk that Hood has, which allowed him to regenerate from just a head in less than a second. It was only after his regen was SHUT OFF and he went over his limits while still getting severely burned by Endeavor that it began to wear down, and even then it kept him alive through the second reason.
2) Deku. He beat the ever loving shit out of a weakened, nerfed regen Shigaraki and Shigaraki STILL healed through the damage, despite it each hit from Deku prior being able to tear his flesh off his body. He survived dozens of direct hits like that, while his regen was nerfed, and, still survived because his regen is that good.
3) After all of that, when his regen was at its lowest, he got hit directly, no shielding or dodging whatsoever, by Endeavors strongest attack, that also vaporizes people instantly. His regen kept him alive through the attack long enough for AFO to take over and attack Endeavor off his back, but literally had his eyes burned out of his head and left him as a charred corpse until he regenerated his body back in seconds right after.
So when you say “oh she’ll just punch him and because she’s 6-A his regen will automatically become weaker,” you’re not speaking facts or correctly.
It doesn’t matter what hits him, he will regenerate near instantly unless his entire head is instantly destroyed, because even attacks to the head will just heal faster than you can destroy it. She can cut him in half and he’ll just move forward anyway and regenerate his entire lower half before her sword can even come back for another swing.
His regen doesn’t “run out” just due to getting punched a lot. It only started to do that because of several factors.
1) Endeavor literally hitting him with attacks that vaporize people. Flashfire attacks disintegrate people due to their sheer heat, and as Endeavor noted, Shigaraki was just regenerating so fast that he was healing over the burning before it could kill him. You can literally see Shigaraki having to regenerate his face when Endeavor punches a fist of flashfire into it, literally lighting his entire skull on fire, only to ignore it and blast himself away. He has the exact same quirk that Hood has, which allowed him to regenerate from just a head in less than a second. It was only after his regen was SHUT OFF and he went over his limits while still getting severely burned by Endeavor that it began to wear down, and even then it kept him alive through the second reason.
2) Deku. He beat the ever loving shit out of a weakened, nerfed regen Shigaraki and Shigaraki STILL healed through the damage, despite it each hit from Deku prior being able to tear his flesh off his body. He survived dozens of direct hits like that, while his regen was nerfed, and, still survived because his regen is that good.
3) After all of that, when his regen was at its lowest, he got hit directly, no shielding or dodging whatsoever, by Endeavors strongest attack, that also vaporizes people instantly. His regen kept him alive through the attack long enough for AFO to take over and attack Endeavor off his back, but literally had his eyes burned out of his head and left him as a charred corpse until he regenerated his body back in seconds right after.
So when you say “oh she’ll just punch him and because she’s 6-A his regen will automatically become weaker,” you’re not speaking facts or correctly.
It doesn’t matter what hits him, he will regenerate near instantly unless his entire head is instantly destroyed, because even attacks to the head will just heal faster than you can destroy it. She can cut him in half and he’ll just move forward anyway and regenerate his entire lower half before her sword can even come back for another swing.
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It would take either the exact same circumstances that occurred in the manga, which is several, durability negating attacks on top of negating his regen for a long time to push his body over the edge and then hitting him with several > AP attacks, or likely several hours to possibly days to make his regen weaker to the point it becomes irrelevant to his combat.
RandomGuy2345
He/Him- 24,065
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Do you think Ryuko is capable of doing any of these?
If not, then is this an Incon, or are you making an argument for Shigaraki? I'm not very knowledgeable on him, but you seem to be knowledgeable, so I'll trust you.
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Considering her main methods of attack are “punch and slash with strong sword,” no, not before he just starts dodging which prolongs the fight enough that his regen will essentially reset back to full power since she can’t pressure it hard or fast enough to push him past his limits.
Her best bet would be cutting his head in half with the Scissor Blade.
RandomGuy2345
He/Him- 24,065
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So, is this is an Incon, or does this go to Shigaraki?
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What are Ryuko’s answers to Decay
RandomGuy2345
He/Him- 24,065
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Using her brain and try avoiding it. She's hot headed and reckless, but not an idiot.
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I’ll reply more later, but she massively out skills him to the point he’ll literally never be able to hit her ever.
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If he waits for her to hit him and grabs the scissor blade, what happens
Spinoirr
He/Him- 14,840
- 7,958
- Thread starter
- #56
"It would take either the exact same circumstances that occurred in the manga, which is several, durability negating attacks on top of negating his regen for a long time to push his body over the edge and then hitting him with several > AP attacks, or likely several hours to possibly days to make his regen weaker to the point it becomes irrelevant to his combat."
Which Ryuko would be entirely capable of doing as her AP and speed constantly grow in combat and she has the stamina to fight for over a month straight without tiring. So she should keep up with shigarakis stamina
Which Ryuko would be entirely capable of doing as her AP and speed constantly grow in combat and she has the stamina to fight for over a month straight without tiring. So she should keep up with shigarakis stamina
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Except she’s not even 2x him in AP vs Dura. So she doesn’t do NEARLY the damage to push him to that point, since the results needed for it are AP over 4x him AFTER a bunch of durability negating attacks.
The only real way she can beat him long term, while not dying instantly to decay, is the Scissor Blade, which he can destroy by slightly touching since I don’t see any resistance to Decay.
So I’m waiting for Keeweed to come back with his arguments or other arguments
Spinoirr
He/Him- 14,840
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- Thread starter
- #58
"Except she’s not even 2x him in AP vs Dura. So she doesn’t do NEARLY the damage to push him to that point, since the results needed for it are AP over 4x him AFTER a bunch of durability negating attacks."
Her amps let her grow in strength to the point of being able to blitz and oneshot opponents that were able to match her at the start of the fight. Given enough time she would be well above the threshold needed to deal that much damage and she's aware of her zenkai's ability to the point of being willing to harm herself in order to amp herself, such as skinning herself alive, biscting herself, or impaling herself
Her amps let her grow in strength to the point of being able to blitz and oneshot opponents that were able to match her at the start of the fight. Given enough time she would be well above the threshold needed to deal that much damage and she's aware of her zenkai's ability to the point of being willing to harm herself in order to amp herself, such as skinning herself alive, biscting herself, or impaling herself
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Except none of that matters if Shigaraki decays the scissor blade and her by just baiting attacks with his regen and slightly touching them. That’s why long term isn’t an option. Because he just adapts after the first few attacks and destroys the scissor blade.
So unless she starts the match killing herself, she’s not going to get the opportunity to amp, because Shigaraki doesn’t prolong fights despite his regen. The entire argument of outlasting is regen isn’t even feasible, I was just addressing the misconceptions of his regen.
Spinoirr
He/Him- 14,840
- 7,958
- Thread starter
- #60
"Except none of that matters if Shigaraki decays the scissor blade and her by just baiting attacks with his regen and slightly touching them. That’s why long term isn’t an option. Because he just adapts after the first few attacks and destroys the scissor blade."
He's opening with the decay wave and Ryuko isn't dumb enough to charge headlong into an opponent that she sees is capable of doing that, she wouldnt let herself be baited into cqc sh would use ranged attacks or speed amp to prevent shigaraki from hitting her
He's opening with the decay wave and Ryuko isn't dumb enough to charge headlong into an opponent that she sees is capable of doing that, she wouldnt let herself be baited into cqc sh would use ranged attacks or speed amp to prevent shigaraki from hitting her
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She absolutely would get into close range against Shigaraki, even if she saw the decay wave. Her ranged attacks are either shockwaves or can also be decayed.
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Shigaraki has information analysis that enables him to analyse the weaknesses of others so wouldn't extremely prolonged exposure to Ryuko's fighting style enable him to analyse any weak spots and counter attack?
Also Shigaraki is able to cause illusions of death and has fear manipulation potent enough to freeze dozens of people willing to die for their cause while also being further encouraged by another ability.
What stops Shigaraki from illusion/fear haxing Ryuko and then 1 tap decaying her or worst case scenario taking hits for prolonged time until his information analysis eventually works.
And this is just based off what his profile says (haven't read the manga or watched past season 4) so King likely has further points beyond what I'm arguing.
Also Shigaraki is able to cause illusions of death and has fear manipulation potent enough to freeze dozens of people willing to die for their cause while also being further encouraged by another ability.
What stops Shigaraki from illusion/fear haxing Ryuko and then 1 tap decaying her or worst case scenario taking hits for prolonged time until his information analysis eventually works.
And this is just based off what his profile says (haven't read the manga or watched past season 4) so King likely has further points beyond what I'm arguing.
Spinoirr
He/Him- 14,840
- 7,958
- Thread starter
- #69
"Shigaraki has information analysis that enables him to analyse the weaknesses of others so wouldn't extremely prolonged exposure to Ryuko's fighting style enable him to analyse any weak spots and counter attack?"
Uzu does exactly the same thing only he can do it instantly with a single glance at his opponent and Ryuko beat him. Same with Nui, who can instantly identify the weak point of her opponents with a casual glance and knows all the pressure points needed to fully paralyze someone, and Ryuko beat her multiple times.
"Also Shigaraki is able to cause illusions of death and has fear manipulation potent enough to freeze dozens of people willing to die for their cause while also being further encouraged by another ability.
What stops Shigaraki from illusion/fear haxing Ryuko and then 1 tap decaying her or worst case scenario taking hits for prolonged time until his information analysis eventually works."
Ryuko resisted the planetary fearhax of the Absolute Domination Field fearhaxxing the entire planet into submission, resisted Ragyo rewriting her entire lifetime of memories, and easily beat Inumuta whose entire combat style is spamming illusions and information analyzing until he finds his opponent's weak spot. Shikaragi doing that is nothing new to ryuko.
Uzu does exactly the same thing only he can do it instantly with a single glance at his opponent and Ryuko beat him. Same with Nui, who can instantly identify the weak point of her opponents with a casual glance and knows all the pressure points needed to fully paralyze someone, and Ryuko beat her multiple times.
"Also Shigaraki is able to cause illusions of death and has fear manipulation potent enough to freeze dozens of people willing to die for their cause while also being further encouraged by another ability.
What stops Shigaraki from illusion/fear haxing Ryuko and then 1 tap decaying her or worst case scenario taking hits for prolonged time until his information analysis eventually works."
Ryuko resisted the planetary fearhax of the Absolute Domination Field fearhaxxing the entire planet into submission, resisted Ragyo rewriting her entire lifetime of memories, and easily beat Inumuta whose entire combat style is spamming illusions and information analyzing until he finds his opponent's weak spot. Shikaragi doing that is nothing new to ryuko.
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Ryuko doesn’t have resistance to fear hax, but neither does Deku or any of the pro heroes and all of them can fight Shigraki without being affected.
When it comes to the illusions Ryuko’s skill advantage is large enough that even if she thought literally everything plus Shigraki was trying to kill her she’d just be able to causally dodge (Plus neither Deku nor the pro heroes have resistances to illusions and they fight Shigraki just fine). She defeats people that can instantly one shot her with danmaku with little difficulty. Meanwhile Shigraki needs to poke her. Considering someone with vastly better analysis abilities, and people that could just repeatedly nuke her with danmaku both fail to hit her constantly I just don’t see Shigraki hitting her at any point.
When it comes to his healing, while it was vastly weakened due to external sources, we don’t know how good it is without those things. So his regeneration would only last unquantifiably longer than it did in the manga, and it didn’t last long at all. So while it probably should last over an hour, we have no proof to suggest that. Even completely high balling it and saying Ryuko would need to completely beat him down for a week to get past the regeneration: she has the ap, skill, and stamina to do so.
When it comes to the illusions Ryuko’s skill advantage is large enough that even if she thought literally everything plus Shigraki was trying to kill her she’d just be able to causally dodge (Plus neither Deku nor the pro heroes have resistances to illusions and they fight Shigraki just fine). She defeats people that can instantly one shot her with danmaku with little difficulty. Meanwhile Shigraki needs to poke her. Considering someone with vastly better analysis abilities, and people that could just repeatedly nuke her with danmaku both fail to hit her constantly I just don’t see Shigraki hitting her at any point.
When it comes to his healing, while it was vastly weakened due to external sources, we don’t know how good it is without those things. So his regeneration would only last unquantifiably longer than it did in the manga, and it didn’t last long at all. So while it probably should last over an hour, we have no proof to suggest that. Even completely high balling it and saying Ryuko would need to completely beat him down for a week to get past the regeneration: she has the ap, skill, and stamina to do so.
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RandomGuy2345
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Bump
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ryuko fra
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