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REDO! Medaka Kurokami vs HAD

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Sure:

Case 1: It's by default. Something that has never been there wins vs instant. I can show you scans of Kumagawa saying "it never happened" and Ajimu explaining how All Fiction works but you can find that on Kumagawa's profile. 2-A overwrite needs contact so it gets nailed.

Case 2: No. GER doesn't reduce it. He resets it. It's just causality reversal. Bookmaker is not causality reversal. Not all types of willpower are the same so bookmaker 1 shots. Again IF GER even used it on Dio.
 
@Fire

My point is that saying that something is wrong because admin didn't agree with it is a textbook appeal to authority, which is a fallacy.
 
A staff member is needed (multiple is possible), since they are the ones who gotta add this. There is also the fact that there needs to be someone who is really knowledgable on the rules of the wiki etc. So yeah a staff member is pretty much needed. You can't just gather fans and decide on something before someone comes in.

Yeah, 3 admins agreed to it in the original thread.
 
The Wright Way said:
Should we just wait for that discussion to finish first?
Click to expand...
ro is active, all ficion is retroactive so it doesn't make much of a difference, besides i don't wanna needlesly wait that long.
 
All Fiction isn't retroactive or anything close to passive for Medaka. She still has to activate it and has only used it once in the series.

Oh so the match says "bloodlusted". Yeah, Dio Time Stops and Overwrites.
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Sure:

Case 1: It's by default. Something that has never been there wins vs instant. I can show you scans of Kumagawa saying "it never happened" and Ajimu explaining how All Fiction works but you can find that on Kumagawa's profile. 2-A overwrite needs contact so it gets nailed.

Case 2: No. GER doesn't reduce it. He resets it. It's just causality reversal. Bookmaker is not causality reversal. Not all types of willpower are the same so bookmaker 1 shots. Again IF GER even used it on Dio.
Click to expand...
1. But they need to activate it still. Also timestop.

2. Reseting willpower to 0 and making a person not have any willpower are the exact same thing.
 
Lancer45Man said:
All Fiction isn't retroactive or anything close to passive for Medaka. She still has to activate it and has only used it once in the series.
Oh so the match says "bloodlusted". Yeah, Dio Time Stops and Overwrites.
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retroactive =/= passive. Retroactive = has never been there. If Medaka erases Dio, he will have never been there which wins vs intant abilities by our rules.

I love how now the argument is basically "reinhard throws his spear". Time stop gets countered by time stop.
 
retroactive =/= passive. Retroactive = has never been there. If Medaka erases Dio, he will have never been there which wins vs intant abilities by our rules.

I love how now the argument is basically "reinhard throws his spear". Time stop gets countered by time stop.

But she needs to activate it first. No indication Dio won't beat her to the punch.

She can't time stop while time stopped as she doesn't resist.
 
1. Never said they don't need to be activated. Also let's just assume time stop and af happen at the same time (let's forget that af is retroactive for a sec). Dio is gone, Medaka gets stoped in time, before being instantly released by lack of Dio and TWOH. I wonder who wins in this case.

2. No. EE and Causality Erasure are by that logic the same thing? So goku causality manipulation when? Mechanics say a lot about an ability.

GER- affects will through causality manipulation, by reversing causality

Bookmaker- seals the will

Conceptual will manip- Will manips via affecting the concept of will

Idk what other thing can do will manip. Point is, not all will manips are the same. Dio ain't resisting having his will sealed or having his concept of will manipulated (not saying bookmaker affects the concept of will btw, just saying concept manip can still do will manip, but dio doesn't resist it), because he has never resisted those. He resists causality reversal. He doesn't resist getting his will sealed.
 
Lancer45Man said:
Man I now understand why people keep spiting Medaka and why she has a long list of Ls in her profile.
Click to expand...
Cus she's broken af? I mean most of her loses are due to being in character so...
 
The Wright Way said:
But she needs to activate it first. No indication Dio won't beat her to the punch.

She can't time stop while time stopped as she doesn't resist.
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Dio won't beat her to the punch, it's freaking speed equalized m8.

Neither can he time stop in her time stop.
 
Theglassman12 said:
Yes he can. He has thought based time stop while already resisting timestop.
Click to expand...
Thought based time stop...like Medaka you mean?

Resist time stop... oh yeah right, he resits time stop. Too bad Medaka's is Pseudo Time Stop also known as "we call it time stop to make it simpler to understand, but the actual name is All Fiction used on time which is not a time stop".
 
Theglassman12 said:
@Fire Medaka has never shown to timestop infinite beings at all. HA Dio can do that very easily
Click to expand...
1. Except Medaka doesn't time stop.

2. HA Dio can stop infinites....Medaka is not infinite so useless ability.

3. This is speed equal so Dio isn't infinite.

So idk why you even brought that up.
 
Because his timestop is far superior to the point that medaka cannot get out of it at all. No matter how hard she tries.
 
Theglassman12 said:
Because his timestop is far superior to the point that medaka cannot get out of it at all. No matter how hard she tries.
Click to expand...
He can't get out of Medaka's time stop either so...your point here?
 
1. Except Medaka doesn't time stop.

2. HA Dio can stop infinites....Medaka is not infinite so useless ability.

3. This is speed equal so Dio isn't infinite.

So idk why you even brought that up.

1. Using All Fiction on time just nullifies time right? That's time stop.

2. It's proof his time stop is better.

3.Speed based powers aren't negated by speed equalization. Otherwise, Flash wouldn't be usable in matches those matches at all. Infinite speed characters retain resistance to time stop in speed equalized matches.
 
Also, people still get the benefits from their speed, be it equalized or not, so Dio should still ignore Medaka's pseudo-TS.
 
Given how Dio can stop time for how long he wants while Medaka needs to undo a certain amount... she'd still be frozen in time by the time the time is not erased. After that, DIo's reality warping and soul manipulation does her in so casually firephoenixearl cries as she does not resist timestop
 
Xantospoc said:
Given how Dio can stop time for how long he wants while Medaka needs to undo a certain amount... she'd still be frozen in time by the time the time is not erased. After that, DIo's reality warping and soul manipulation does her in so casually firephoenixearl cries as she does not resist timestop
Click to expand...
That amount of time is all she needs to 1 shot Dio doe. Amount of time rly isn't a problem here. It's just a needlessly strong ability in this case.

Medaka thinks Dio is gone, she doesn't even need to time stop.
 
1. It's all fiction on her own personal time which causes a skip to the result (any result she wants).

2. Different mechanics.

3. So? Medaka thinks Dio is dead. Easy as that.
 
Given how Jotaro could resist reality erasure from Dio as they are THE SAME KIND OF STANDS, Dio would resist being erased from reality as well.

And Medaka trying to erase the events that made him such would not affect him because HADio is acasual
 
Theglassman12 said:
It is finished, Fire just wants to debate more.
Click to expand...
I still haven't heard a good argument for how Dio beats this:

Match starts: Medaka All Fiction's Dio.

Possible things Dio might do: Time Stop

Why it's useless: 1. Dio time stops at the same time he gets erased so he ain't gonna do a lot.

2. Retroactive erasure vs active time stop.
 
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