Ragyō Kiryüin vs Raiden (Metal Gear)

[FateAlbane]

Nanomachines vs Life Fibers .

Raiden at his best vs Base Ragyo. Who wins and why? Victory by any means.

• Rules can be changed to make the match more fair, if need be.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Hmm...Raiden is much faster but i dont think the HF Blade would be able to bypass Ragyo's Life Fiber regen, whereas one good hit would turn Jack into a puddle

 

[FateAlbane]

So, you're going with Ragyo?

Also, bump.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Yes

 

[Yomi_Schwarz]

High frequency blade are not enough to cut through her life fibers without regen going with ragyo as well.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Hmm...Wouldn't the HF Blade cut through the Fibers though? The Hi-Freq vibrations would weaken and destabilize the molecular bonds of the Life Fibers, destroying it's molecular structure and therefore the Fibers would lose all properties including the regen.

Also mandatory

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Yeah the HF blade should cut through it. I vote Raiden on this one due to his HF blade.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Yeah the HF blade should cut through it. I vote Raiden on this one due to his HF blade.

I wouldn't be so sure though. Ragyo could play it smart, let him charge first, let herself be pierced by the blade, trap Raiden and slap him silly, effectively turning him into Nanopaste (totally not on purpose )

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Well Raiden does have a speed advantage here as well I do believe.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Would severing molecular bonds cancel Regenerationn?

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Would severing molecular bonds cancel Regenerationn?

Depends on what he cuts I guess.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Would severing molecular bonds cancel Regenerationn?

I'm a little rusty on my chemystry but I believe it will. If the molecular(covalent) bonds are severed, the atoms cannot share electrons anymore, therefore they will revert back to their postively or negatively charged states. The molecule is the smallest level in which substance properties are maintained, so the Fibers would lose the regenerating properties.

 

[FateAlbane]

Ok, if I understood it right...

Ragyo: 2 (WeeklyBattles, Yomi Schwarz)

Raiden: 2 (ScarletFirefly, Dragonmasterxyz)

 

[FateAlbane]

Bump.

 

[Shozo_Irie]

Raiden for reasons above

 

[FateAlbane]

Ragyo: 2 (WeeklyBattles, Yomi Schwarz)

Raiden: 3 (ScarletFirefly, Dragonmasterxyz, Shozo Irie)

 

[AquaWaifu]

I vote Ragyo, just because Raiden can ignore conventional durability with his HF blade does not mean it can do the same to Ragyo's regen. It can cut through things because of it, I'm not going to assume it just straight up negates regen. Show me that weakening the bonds would mean a permanent disconnect to not allow Ragyo's level of regen to be nullified completely.


Ragyo's life fibers are quite different from nanomachines, considering she can easily survive freaking decapitation. and no, verse equalization would not make up for said differences. At least I dont think they would.

 

[FateAlbane]

Ragyo: 3 (WeeklyBattles, Yomi Schwarz, AquaWaifu)

Raiden: 3 (ScarletFirefly, Dragonmasterxyz, Shozo Irie)

 

[AquaWaifu]

When you get right down to it, Raiden's HF Blade is for all intents and purposes merely an absurdly sharp blade.

 

[Shozo_Irie]

When you get right down to it, Raiden's HF Blade is for all intents and purposes merely an absurdly sharp blade.

HF Blade is not only an absurdly sharp blade. With each hit It weakens the target durability to a molecular level. Raiden doesn't need to decapite her to win. I can see him wining the same way he defeated Amstrong, ripping her hearth and destroying it

 

[WeeklyBattles]

@Shozo I would say that wouldnt work considering Ryuko had her heart ripped out when she was much weaker and during the final fight she was impaled through the heart multiple times and shrugged it off like it was nothing, but that is how Ragyo killed herself...

 

[ScarletFirefly]

It's not a sharp blade per se.

The reason it is so effective in cutting stuff is the fact that it has a very powerful alternating current running through it and resonated at very high frequencies. The blade therefore moves back and forth (also known as oscillation) at extreme speed. This is what causes the molecular bonds of the thing being cut, to weaken.

 

[Cropfist]

Raiden for reasons above.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

If it's base I don't see any issue on why Raiden can't win

 

[AquaWaifu]

If it's base I don't see any issue on why Raiden can't wi

How about the fact that her base AP is ATLEAST 6 tiers higher than his durability.

Ragyo's durability is small island compared to small town agian 6 tiers....and yes thats due to regen somewhat but she was able to tank attacks simultaneously from her daughters both of whom were capable of doing moutain to large mountain level attacks. She causally overpowered two characters that could each easily effortlessly overpower mountain level enemies. So I'd gauge even without regen she can take a LOT.


Plus...can Raiden resist mind and menory manipulation, are people here forgetting Ragyo can do that? He doesnt seem to give n his profile.


HF blade may be able to bypass conventional durability but theres a REASON he has small town AP. One hit from her and Raiden is DEAD. Who's to say she couldnt bust that blade with her bare hands given her much much higher AP something Raiden has NEVER dealt with. Even Armstrong the FINAL BOSS is only Small town AP.


Raiden honestly doesnt have much given his AP and durability.

 

[Happydudey5]

Have to give this one to Raiden.

 

[FateAlbane]

@Aqua You make a fair point in Ragyo's Ap vs his Dura. Yes, one good hit and Raiden will be down, I had that in mind when I made the thread. But as Weekly pointed out in the very first reply here, speed is not equalized so Raiden is much faster than her base form - a classical match of "Can X put Y down with their speed before taking that one hit that Y needs to destroy him/her?" As for her Durability, that's what doesn't matter much in the long run due to Dura Negation.

On the topic of regen, I have no idea so I'll refrain from saying anything about that.

Ragyo: 3 (WeeklyBattles, Yomi Schwarz, AquaWaifu)

Raiden: 4 (ScarletFirefly, Dragonmasterxyz, Shozo Irie, Cropfist)

 

[FateAlbane]

@COB So you're voting for Raiden?

@Happydudey What are your reasons for voting Raiden, before I can count your vote.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Just reminding everyone,

Raiden in Ripper Mode is Mach 4000, if not higher. Base Ragyo is ~Mach 400 (maybe somewhat higher). He's nearly 10 times faster than her. If the HF Blade does indeed cut through Life Fibers, Ragyo will get blitzed before even realizing what happened.

 

[AquaWaifu]

@Aqua You make a fair point in Ragyo's Ap vs his Dura. Yes, one good hit and Raiden will be down, I had that in mind when I made the thread. But as Weekly pointed out in the very first reply here, speed is not equalized gere so Raiden is much faster than her base form - a classical match of "Can X put Y down with their speed before taking that one hit that Y needs to destroy him/her?" As for her Durability, that's what doesn't matter much in the long run due to Dura Negation.
On the topic of regen, I have no idea so I'll refrain from saying anything about that.

Ragyo: 3 (WeeklyBattles, Yomi Schwarz, AquaWaifu)

Raiden: 4 (ScarletFirefly, Dragonmasterxyz, Shozo Irie, Cropfist)

She's not small island durability due to JUST regen. We dont KNOW if his blade could even cut Ragyo, The best in terms of durability Raiden has ever dealt with is Small town. Who's to say she couldnt break the damn thing? Its not like Raiden would know of her immense AP, from his perspective someone trying to break the HF Blade would be insanity. just hit the flat side and bam...just like Bakuzan.


Granted his higher speed might make it a little harder, but I think since he wouldnt know her strength it would give the opportunity to do it.


EDIT: I will say Im not the most knowledgeable on Raiden or Metal Gear Rising, Im doing the best I can right now watching bits of stuff on youtube.

 

[FateAlbane]

I know it doesn't come from her regen only. I could reply about the whole durability, negation and stuff but I'm not taking part on the debate - my above reply was just to clarify on the conditions of the match, so I'm not questioning any point that was given.

 

[Ryukama]

I think the regen thing is odd here.

If Raiden is only slicing her in a traditional way, she should be able to regenerate the cuts.

The only way for the regen to be negated is through cutting parts of the body from both sides at once like a pair of scissors.

However even if one is cut this way, they can regen as long as some Life Fibers are still intact.

Since Raiden cuts on a molecular level, he could sever all Life Fibers, but he still needs to do such like a pair of scissors for it to work.

All and all though this doesn't seem like a good match. Either speed is equal, Ragyo taps him on the shoulder and he's dead. Or speed unequal and either Raiden blitzes her badly and kills if he can negate regen, or Ragyo might pull through and one shot if he can't.

Seems like it can only be a stomp for one side or the other. Or the outcome is basically reliant on us assuming who would hit who first.

 

[FateAlbane]

I think Ragyo having Regen on her side along with higher AP makes the match debatable when speed is unequalized (she could always last long enough to give him a slap once and be done with it), but eh. If you believe it's a stomp or blitz for one side or another, not much I can do. Feel free to close it if you think so.

 

[AquaWaifu]

With how life fiber regen works compared to say nonmachines...Id say life fibers are better. I mean hell why are we assuming the HF Blade can just stop regen with how Life Fibe regen works? its not like the regen Raiden deals with in his game it WORKS differently, thats the big problem and deciding factor here, and I personally think...that its superior, not equal.

 

[FateAlbane]

Also, people, there's the Inconclusive option, too, just in case.

 

[AquaWaifu]

@Ryukama, this would boil donw to if once Ragyo realizes her regen isnt working she could say grab his arm with her much higher strength, say take a stab intentionally....basically do waht her daughter did keep him in place so he CANT slice her. and end him.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

I mean hell why are we assuming the HF Blade can just stop regen with how Life Fibe regen works?

I don't know if anyone else is assuming that, but I am.

I mentioned earlier my reasoning. If the HF blade weakens the molecular bonds, atoms cannot share electrons anymore, therefore losing their properties.

Think of it this way, salt (Sodium Chloride, NaCl) is made up of Na and Cl bonded in a crystalline structure through ionic bonds. In this state, this compound has a salty taste, but if we sever the bonds and get the Na and Cl separately, they do not taste salty on their own. A very childish and simple analogy, but that's the best I can come up with right now.

Now, if the Life Fibers do indeed retain their regenerative properties in an atomic level, then they would regen back again.

 

[AquaWaifu]

@ScarletFirefly

THIS....Life Fiber beings like Ragyo/Ryuko/Nui can survive decapitation and near complete bisection.

Also why is no one bringing up her memory and mind manipulation?

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Not forgetting about that, it's just that Raiden is so much faster than her. If he can cut through the Life Fibers, she's dead before she realizes it. If not, he's dead because he can't do anything to hurt her.

As Ryu said, this is a weird matchup no matter what we consider. If we consider one thing, Raiden stomps, if we consider another, Ragyo stomps.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

That would make this match inconclusive