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Overwatch Revisions

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Would the freezing yield just scale to Mei's weapons? But I guess is need to find any yield for individuals characters weapons; and that is just considering that freezing has realistic physic, if just freeze people there with no damage doesn't means much... And still need a base AP feat if the Winston's isn't enough.
 
Ah Aiden, after looking at the speed page I now agree. Peak Human Minimum, likely Superhuman. If they can casually jog at 5.5 m/s then their sprint speeds are going to be 11 m/s+

Also I just meant to make sure to give the profiles thorough look overs to update any scaling edits.
 
Antoniofer said:
Would the freezing yield just scale to Mei's weapons? But I guess is need to find any yield for individuals characters weapons; and that is just considering that freezing has realistic physic, if just freeze people there with no damage doesn't means much... And still need a base AP feat if the Winston's isn't enough.
Click to expand...
She has two mode in her weapon tho.

Both can harm the characters, obvioulsy one more than the other.


And they can harm each other with weapons. That's they current and accepted scaling.

That wouldn't be changed.
 
EsotericDichotomy said:
Ah Aiden, after looking at the speed page I now agree. Peak Human Minimum, likely Superhuman. If they can casually jog at 5.5 m/s then their sprint speeds are going to be 11 m/s+
Also I just meant to make sure to give the profiles thorough look overs to update any scaling edits.
Click to expand...
Until better calcs are make, they would remain the same.


No changes until that.
 
@LordKill You almost convinced me. But after consulting my friend who plays Overwatch and enjoys the lore. The rifle in the comic is shooting bullets. .338 rounds specifically. In the game it is stated that the projectile shooting rifle that Ana uses shoots healing darts. These darts are fired from a different rifle and do not have the same speed.

Thus it is not a valid calculation to give them the debunked x10 speed modifer.

The accurate speeds should Be "at least Peak Human, Possibly Superhuman"
 
@Aiden

Why would we need new calcs the old one has several problems and assumptions with it. At the very least wouldn't travel speed be shifted to Unknown rather than stay at a known incorrect number?
 
Because we need new calc, if the old ones are wrong.


If you are against that, I'm going to start considering that you just want to downplay instead of reasonable downgrades.
 
Isn't the problem Lucio's weapon?


Anyways, going with Ana bullets speed....

Lucio In-Game Speed (Speed Mode) - 7.1 m/s or 81.38 m/s

Genji and Tracer In-Game Speed - 6 m/s or 68.772 m/s

All Other Hero Speeds - 5.5 m/s or 63.041 m/s

Reinhardt (Charge) - 16.66 m/s or 190.956725078 m/s (Subsonic+)

D.Va Mech Boost - 12.5 m/s or 143.27485375 m/s

Lucio (Amped Speed) - 11.66 m/s or 133.646783578 m/s

Solider: 76 Sprint - 8.25 m/s or 94.561403475 m/s

Winston (Primal Rage) - 7.1 m/s or 81.38 m/s

Reaper (Wraith Form) - 7.1 m/s or 81.38 m/s
 
@Aiden

I'm not sure Ana's "Bullet" speed can be used either. Since the one that shoots real bullets, is not what she uses in game.

In game her Projectiles are Darts moving at 85.5 m/s and in her comic she uses .338 rounds that go 980 m/s

This makes it impossible to use as a basis for scaling everyone.

[Edit]

(copy/pasted post from a vent of mine, that is relevant)

The character Ana, uses a Kinamura rifle in her comic, it is stated to have bullet speeds of up to 980 m/s, this is similar to real life rifles and becomes an obvious choice to use when scaling characters.

You can find her rifle specs here:

https://comic.playoverwatch.com/en-us/legacy

However, in the game she uses a different rifle, her Biotic Rifle, that shoots biotic darts. These projectiles are stated to be fired at 85.5 m/s. She has come out of retirement as a support character to aid people rather than take people out with her deadly rifle.

You can find her Biotic Rifle specs here:

http://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Ana

However in the Overwatch post, people are saying the rifles are the same and that every character speed should be 11x faster since in game the speed is 85.5 m/s and in the comic that rifle is stated to be 980 m/s.

It's frustrating because they are not the same rifle Dx
 
Antoniofer said:
Isn't the speed boost x10.21? is what Xcano writte here
EDIT: Wait, the link was already posted, so what was the problem then?
Click to expand...
The problem I find is people using real world data for things, when those things are not similar enough or outright different than in the context of the game/series of Overwatch.

Lucio's projectiles do not function like real sound waves, and so can be ignored for scaling purposes just like non-real lightning, or non-real black holes.

Ana's Bullet's are given a speed in her comic, but in the game she is mainly a support character using healing darts from her Biotic Rifle rather than the Deadly Kinamura she used to use.

Based on this and the speeds of the characters in the cinematics, it seems reasonable to use the listed speeds of the characters as a casual speed they can perform at. Which makes them all Peak Human at the bare minimum, but likely Superhuman at most.
 
Cristobal1234 said:
What if Lucio sonic waves are not "Real Sonic Waves"? Like real lightning or real black holes.
Click to expand...
Thank you Cristobal, this is the point I have been trying to make since the beginning.
 
Lucio's weapon shots being Mach 1 doesn't sound unrealistic, I mean, several guns already surpass SoS; other thing, why the franchise give us two totally differents speed with movement and shots? I'll try to settle this: what's is the in-game speed of Widowmaker's rifle?
 
Antoniofer said:
Lucio's weapon shots being Mach 1 doesn't sound unrealistic, I mean, several guns already surpass SoS; other thing, why the franchise give us two totally differents speed with movement and shots? I'll try to settle this: what's is the in-game speed of Widowmaker's rifle?
Click to expand...
Widowmaker's rifle is a "Single Shot Hitscan" http://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Widowmaker

Meaning it automatically hits anything she aims at.

Hitscan weapons are automatic hits because the projectiles they fire are too fast to be physically dodged. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitsca

Tracer being able to aim dodge Widowmaker's rifle shot is made even more epic since in game that is pretty much the only way to dodge such a shot. You must dodge before the trigger is pulled.

Even in the cinematic, it is shown that Tracer can dodge the bullets by being untargetable. Widowmaker can't get a direct hit because tracer zips around. However with Winston, who is heavily armored, every single one of her shots hits him (only to bounce off making him flinch).
 
I see, welp, since the rifle in cinematic works as a real rifle, we should use the values statement closer to those values; does the characters has another stated movement speed, or the in-game is the only one given? Also, what's the calc that put them in subsonic or superhuman movement speed?
 
@Antoniofer

The ingame speeds are the only ones directly calculatable. If someone wants to and can do so accurately I imagine the speed of Widowmaker's rifle could be obtained from her cinematics, but it would have to be drawn from and averaged, so that it isn't just one shot that gets calculated.

The only calcs that puts them at subsonic speeds are taking the game speed and multiplying them by 10 or 11, by assuming Lucio's weapon is shooting at Mach 1 or Ana's Biotic Darts travel at the same speed as her .338 Rounds.
 
After watching "Alive" several times, I want to bring up another point, that the guards in "Alive" can see and react to Widowmaker, as well as shoot at her (though they miss because she is agile and moving around)

I think this advocates for Peak Human to Superhuman Travel Speed as she zips along the rooftop because the guards do not have subsonic reactions able to react to her pouncing on one or meleeing the other. If she was moving and fighting at subsonic speeds they would not have time to react, unless they too are superhumans. I don't think anyone is advocating for an entirely superhuman Overwatch verse.

Here is Alive at the part where Widowmaker interacts with the guards most:

https://youtu.be/U130wnpi-C0?t=3m9s
 
We already said that combat would be Hypersonic.

About movement, I just can't simply accept anything lower than Superhuman, I mean, Isn't Winston a Gorilla? Pretty sure that's enough to make everyone at least on that level of movement
 
AidenBrooks999 said:
We already said that combat would be Hypersonic.
About movement, I just can't simply accept anything lower than Superhuman, I mean, Isn't Winston a Gorilla? Pretty sure that's enough to make everyone at least on that level of movement
Click to expand...
I was only talking Travel speed. I agree with the Hypersonic combat speed, given some of their extraordinary reflexes and reactions.

Male Gorillas can apparently sprint at 20 to 25 mph... which is 9 to 11 m/s Again it's Peak Human.

I think Low Superhuman given that he isn't just a gorilla, he is trained and athletic and everyone else is too. Wouldn't be out of the question.

I'm really only opposed to the x10 multiplier fan calcs that put them all at subsonic. If they are just listed at Low to Mid Superhuman Travel Speeds, I would be fine with it. Preferably Low Superhuman, because their game mechanic numbers point towards High Peak Human / Low Superhuman.

Aiden, do you think that is fair for now until further evidence.calculations are made/found?
 
But in the same source it said that he just can move at 5.5 m/s, that is the half; if we accept the in-game scaling but not the values that would be strange. We can give Winston At least Peak human speed, and Likely/Possible at least Peak human to the other ones with same speed, and Likely/Possible Superhuman to Hanzo, Tracer and Lucio, until something new happen.
 
Lucio In-Game Speed (Speed Mode) - 14.4272 m/s (SuperHuman)

Genji and Tracer In-Game Speed - 12.192 m/s (Peak Human+)

All Other Hero Speeds - 11.176 m/s (Peak Human+)

Reinhardt (Charge) - 33.8666667 m/s (Superhuman+)

D.Va Mech Boost - 25.4 m/s (Superhuman+)

Lucio (Amped Speed) - 23.7067 m/s (Superhuman+)

Solider: 76 Sprint - 16.764 m/s (SuperHuman) Winston (Primal Rage) - 14.4272 m/s (SuperHuman)

Reaper (Wraith Form) - 14.4272 m/s (SuperHuman)
 
Antoniofer said:
But in the same source it said that he just can move at 5.5 m/s, that is the half; if we accept the in-game scaling but not the values that would be strange. We can give Winston At least Peak human speed, and Likely/Possible at least Peak human to the other ones with same speed, and Likely/Possible Superhuman to Hanzo, Tracer and Lucio, until something new happen.
Click to expand...
First, Hanzo is nothing close to the speedsters in the verse.


Second, that they In-Game speed, the same that gave bullets speed barely subsonic. It's just the speed that they show, not the speed that they truly move.
 
I though that the one below Tracer and above the others was Hanzo; welp, since Peak human+/Superhuman speed doesn't seem far-fetched at all, I think that those rating of you from above will work.

EDIT: I just confused Hanzo with Genji, the last one is the faster.
 
AidenBrooks999 said:
Lucio In-Game Speed (Speed Mode) - 14.4272 m/s (SuperHuman)
Genji and Tracer In-Game Speed - 12.192 m/s (Peak Human+)

All Other Hero Speeds - 11.176 m/s (Peak Human+)

Reinhardt (Charge) - 33.8666667 m/s (Superhuman+)

D.Va Mech Boost - 25.4 m/s (Superhuman+)

Lucio (Amped Speed) - 23.7067 m/s (Superhuman+)

Solider: 76 Sprint - 16.764 m/s (SuperHuman) Winston (Primal Rage) - 14.4272 m/s (SuperHuman)

Reaper (Wraith Form) - 14.4272 m/s (SuperHuman)
Click to expand...
Since the movement in-game is much more casual than a sprint, and these numbers represent a sprint, I fully support these. They are consistent with my findings and viewings of the gameplay/cinematics.
 
Now, do you agree with the AP downgrade?

Because tomorrow I was going to take the time to calc Mei's Ice Wall.


Oh, and about Strking, the In-Game melee showed that even the weakest characters can break parts of metal fences and cut metal sing in half, so 9-C+ could work?

Wall level for the rest would remain
 
9-C+ for the weakers and 9-B for the rest sound good, I'm guessing that the ones with weapons would remain 8-C to High 8-C with them, right? Durability should be equal to the ST if not a little higher.
 
Oh right, with the talk about the movement and the speed, I've forgett that, I guess we just need to wait the freezing feat that you plan to calculate.
 
I think the tiers of durability have an enough of a range to cover most characters. I would note that the characters in game have varying amounts of toughness. Tracer being one of the least armored characters in the game, and having 150 health, and Road Hog... being a tank (though also seemingly unarmored) having like 600 health. So they are at most a maximum of x4.

I think all the characters should be Building+ to Large Building Level.

One example is the D.va MEKA explosion doing 1000 in game damage, no one can survive a direct hit from it. It is listed as Multi-City Block so At most people could be City Block, and likely much lower.

Here are character Health and Armor and Shielding: http://overwatch.gamepedia.com/Hit_points#List_of_hero_hit_points

If you want to use any of this to scale them to each other.
 
Mmm, not sure if it could worklike that, considering that characters can be damaged by gorilla and robots strikes, they shouldn't be that different from 9-B, most likely they reach 9-A, but better to wait for the calculation and see.
 
Hmm, I suppose I have trouble seeing why we can't use game mechanics as a sort of reference.

They are game characters after all. And their ability to tank small arms fire is present only in the games not the cinematics.

I'm not saying we should scale everything from the game mechanics alone, but it does give a sense of comparison if one character in game has a bunch more health than another, that that character should be a bit more durable.

Roadhog with 600 health should not be the exact same durability as Tracer with 150 right?
 
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