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- #41
Funny Valentine doesn't exist everywhere, tho.TheJ-ManRequiem said:
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Omnipresence and Speed Equalized
- Thread starter FateAlbane
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- omnipresence
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I can list a bunch of SMT characters who would be "Omnipresent" by the logic applied to BB but they aren't listed as such. And equalization still affects them.
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He exists across universes and his dupes have all his memories and info with D4C.
BB's mind exists across time have all her memories and info too.
It's not the same but as I said, overly simplified.
BB's mind exists across time have all her memories and info too.
It's not the same but as I said, overly simplified.
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BB doesn't exist everywhere either too, so that's a moot point.
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Let's just move away from BB.
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@J-Man
Them it is not speed, don't list it as speed and use it as a speed argument. If she share a mind with herself in the past and the future, if you kill BB at one point in time she won't exist from there on.
Them it is not speed, don't list it as speed and use it as a speed argument. If she share a mind with herself in the past and the future, if you kill BB at one point in time she won't exist from there on.
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- Thread starter
- #47
Pointing this out: No one will gain or lose powers as a result of this.FateAlbane said:
What'll happen is that I suggest a footnote to be added to the Omnipresence page explaining whether it's equalized in matches or not to end any controversy in threads by the end of this one so this matter is settled. That is all.
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It's right Fate.
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Else she lose the Omnipresence from her profile OvOThisIsMySwagPack said:
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ovo
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My stance is Omnipresence shpuld be a power. Take Zamasu, he's omnipresent but it's not like his attacks are immeasurable, his is a state of being, same with Giygas. BB's is temporal opposed to being everywhere, so it's not a speed kind.
Some characters are omnipresent through concepts or people.
I consider omnipresence an ability opposed to a speed.
Some characters are omnipresent through concepts or people.
I consider omnipresence an ability opposed to a speed.
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I don't really know why you are so fixated on BB and at this point I personally don't think you should be making decisions about BB.
Let me rephrase it. Let's just move away from BB because it will reach 150 comments, like every BB thread lately, and nothing will be concluded.
Edit: Monarch, that is correct.
Let me rephrase it. Let's just move away from BB because it will reach 150 comments, like every BB thread lately, and nothing will be concluded.
Edit: Monarch, that is correct.
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>fixated
It's more of I can't think of many omnipresent characters off the top of my head.
It's more of I can't think of many omnipresent characters off the top of my head.
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- Thread starter
- #54
@J-Man No separation such as "equalizes for x but not for y". Every Omnipresent will be treated the same by the end of this, especially when we have like 2375853dimensional omnipresents that got equalized so far anyways.
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@Swag Oh no, we are moving away from BB right now. The logical conclusion of TPI is never explored and should never be considered unless it is explicitly shown as a power.
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Telling me to stop debating a character simply because I think they are somewhat wanked is one hell of a claim. I could do the same to you and tell you to stop debating BB since you brought up Tier 2 and Tier 1 BB many times in the past.
Would I be fair in doing that? No. I still think it is wanking but you have the right to say what you think about her. Likewise, don't tell me to stop discussing BB.
Would I be fair in doing that? No. I still think it is wanking but you have the right to say what you think about her. Likewise, don't tell me to stop discussing BB.
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@J-Man, sorry. I was referring to Matthew, but my comment came out late.
And here you go again. Accusing me of something which didn't happen, but you have some kind of grudge against me from what I see.
Again, let's move away from it.
And here you go again. Accusing me of something which didn't happen, but you have some kind of grudge against me from what I see.
Again, let's move away from it.
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>ninja'd
No problem, happens all the time, I didn't take offense anyway.
No problem, happens all the time, I didn't take offense anyway.
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- Thread starter
- #59
Anyways, I'll start counting the stuff here. If possible, a highlight to this thread would be appreciated as it's a rather major point for the community.
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- Thread starter
- #60
Also I removed BB from the thread title as the matter is not exactly in regards to her, she's just the most evident example it seems.
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Omnipresence should be invalidated by speed equalization. No one blitzes anyone. This doesn't invalidate other powers that a character may have linked with their omnipresence, such as BB's consciousness spreading to her past and future selves. Basically, with speed equalization, any speed advantage that omnipresence confers is negated, but other effects should remain, I think.
Guys, don't derail the thread with talking about BB unless it's absolutely necessary to bring her up for the sake of examples.
And I've highlighted.
Guys, don't derail the thread with talking about BB unless it's absolutely necessary to bring her up for the sake of examples.
And I've highlighted.
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- #62
@Prom Ok, so let me get this straight so there's no doubt later: If an Omnipresent exists across time (like Say, Dialga) and speed is equalized, they can share knowledge but if they wanted to, say, kill someone in the past, their present self would still have to time travel or would they be there already?
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- Thread starter
- #63
Because if it's the latter that will make a significant ammount of matches currently added invalid as many characters who actually won against a Omnipresent can't quite kill them across time, space or a large area, as opposed to the equalization.
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That's a good question and I don't have a solid answer for you, but I think it'd be more fair for time travel to be necessary to accomplish that. I didn't think about that side of things, so yes, I think it'd be better to discount that stuff as it'd cause problems otherwise, on second thought.
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Ok. Thanks for the input and the highlight, Prom.
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I am leaning towards the Prom side of things too.
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form day one i've never really like the speed equalization rule. sure it stops speed blitzing but isn't that what WOULD happen if two characters were to fight? and at the same time just because they can rappied puch some one does not mean they will hurt them. especially if the character inquestion durrability is higher. superman might be faster then batman but it does not mean that he has betten batman all the time.
and characters who are slower then the flash have beaten the flash as well. like captian cold on rare ocations.
that also lets characters who relay on speed get stompped by everyone because they can't use there power since the speed is there power. liket the flash or sonic or dash from the incredibles.
but thats just my opinion. the only reason i use speed equalization dispite not liking it is because people will use speed blitz as a reason for every thing on winning even if the character whos faster is fighting is someone who has somthing like intagability or super dense durability greater to that then the speedy character.
and characters who are slower then the flash have beaten the flash as well. like captian cold on rare ocations.
that also lets characters who relay on speed get stompped by everyone because they can't use there power since the speed is there power. liket the flash or sonic or dash from the incredibles.
but thats just my opinion. the only reason i use speed equalization dispite not liking it is because people will use speed blitz as a reason for every thing on winning even if the character whos faster is fighting is someone who has somthing like intagability or super dense durability greater to that then the speedy character.
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This is not about speed equalization as a whole, just about how it interacts with omnipresence, so please don't derail the thread with this.
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- Thread starter
- #69
@Hazerd The thread is in regards to whether Omnipresence is affected by the Speed Equalization rule. Not whether or not said rule should exist, so while I appreciate the input, I'd ask that, if you want to talk about that topic, to make another thread.
EDIT: Ninja'd by Prom.
EDIT: Ninja'd by Prom.
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well if were talking about Omnipresences and speed doesn't the Omnipresences kind of mean they are not Omnipresences if they are slower then X inside there sphere of Omnipresecnes. then again there being everywhere and then being able to react to everything. but i kind of Get what Fate is talking about
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What are you talking about?!
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Well, from what I undestand from omnipresence, it means that you're literally everywhere, so if speed is equal it would affect the abilitie? I think not, because the opponent is already touching you, regarless of speed equal, you cannot avoid or block something that is already under your nose. If the omnipresence is through space and time then is even worst for you.
But I'm not really the guy to say something about the matter.
But I'm not really the guy to say something about the matter.
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about the rock and the OmnipotentGargoyle One said:
if the Omnipotent creates somthing stronger then itself then it is not Omnipotent, but if it can't make somthing stronger then itself then its not Omnipotent
wouldn't the same apply to Omnipresences if a character was able to get somewhere before the Omnipresences doesn't that mean they don't have Omnipresences?
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I side with Prom as well.
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- Thread starter
- #76
Just pointing out, as the OP I'm also siding with Prom's view on this subject.
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I believe Prom makes sense.
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Agreed with Prom
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I agree with Prom. From my own interpretation, omnipresence isn't a speed stat so much as it is the invalidation of speed. No need to calculate how fast they move when they are literally everywhere at once. But in a speed equalized setting, that one aspect is removed and their physical form will be focused to one location as any other character's would be.
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- Thread starter
- #80
So far Prom's idea seems to be mostly/generally accepted (going both from replies and kudos received), though I don't know how much more input we'd need on this one before settling anything (Maybe more staff or Ant as well? I don't know) or if it's sufficient as is .
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