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So, TheC2 and I felt that the Officio Assassinorum file has some problems, specifically concerning the Callidus Assassin and Culexus Assassin. Let's fix that.
General Stuff
The blanket striking strength of Building Level is weird. Even Vindicare bodies are noted to be enhanced likely to about Space Marine levels. Others, especially the Eversor, should scale to their AP due to physical attacks being a thing that is used, except possibly the Culexus. As such, I propose rating the Vindicares at Large Building Level in this regard, and scaling Calliduses and Eversors to their AP.
Vindicares don't seem to have a reason to be listed as At least High 8-C. Their scaling physically to Space marines doesn't cut it, as Space Marines have no at least and while they may be physically comparable, I doubt that that comparison was to a fully armored marine in the first place.
Eversors may get a minor weakness of their bio meltdown being able to be triggered without killing them by messing around with enough toxins, due to this:
This is said by a Vanus Assassin, which is like the information specialist branch of the Assassinorum. As such, the warning here should be accurate. However, given that this is Callidus Poison, coupled with the immune system of the Eversor being enhanced to such a degree that they can not only survive with the drugs running through their blood that cause violent explosions otherwise, but also allows Torq to shrug off the regular effects of her poison, this may be more a feat for Callidus poison. Not really sure.
Callidus Stuff (Credit to C2)
Right now, the key for the Callidus Assassin is listed at "Unknow" for almost everything, which doesn't need to be the case. While the profile says that it's due to them not having weapons that don't ignore durability, TheC2 found a scene where the Callidus Klara Rhasc defeated Eversor Sylas Torq in combat, hurting him without weapons. Here's the relevant parts.
While Eversors have 2 tiers, Torq is not an especially high end Eversor assassin and as such usage of the 8-B key for scaling makes more sense.
As such, C2 and I came to agree on something kinda like this.
Attack Potency: Unknow, up to City Block level (Though weaker, is capable of contending with an Eversor for short periods of time with supreme effort as well as knocking one out with a well placed blow). At least City Block Level with Poison Knives (The knives are capable of piercing the bodyglove of an Eversor) Neural Shredder and C'tan Phase Sword ignore durability.
He decided that removing the explanations on the Neural Shredder and Phase Sword since the standard equipment already details that, and it makes the AP section crowded beyond that they do.
As for the other stat,
Durability: Likely City Block level (Synskin can absorb Bolter fire, can endure attacks from an Eversor assassin).
Culexus Stuff
Culexus Assassins should not be Low 5-B, or at least not flat out. Right now they scale from killing Malfecius, a powerful daemon prince noted to have given Eversors and Vindicares a tough time. There's some other feats that I can think of pertaining to these guys as well. The problem? Considering their abilities, these defeats make more sense to be counted as due to their hax. I'll post some examples here and discuss them.
Malfecius
So what's the issue here? Well, first off he waits for Malfecius to ascend to Daemon Princehood. Daemons are beings of the Warp, meaning that they are among the most susceptible to the terrible effects of the Culexus. High level Psykers and Daemons are probably about as bad as you can get when fighting these guys. As such, this ascension only amplifies the powers of a Culexus, and as such isn't related to AP so much as it is their warp devouring voids. Also, note how it specifically says that the new form renders him vulnerable to psyk-outs. Psyk-outs are grenades made from the Emperor's dandruff (yes, really) that do nothing to muggles but are devastating to psykers and daemons. Psykers are hit with power null and agony even worse than the default form of that of the Culexus, and daemons can be killed outright by these. Killing Malfecius by crippling him with psyk-outs then shooting it to death (note that the Animus Speculum also negates durability) does not demonstrate Culexuses as Low 5-B by default, it demonstrates the potency of their arms and abilities. Also, Low 5-B isn't where their animus speculums cap out at. An Omega Minus culexus once gave Ahzek Ahrima terrible seizures and convulsions due to being too close to the astral projection of Ahriman. One once killed a Lord of Change (Greater Daemon of Tzeentch) by being near it, when such a creature would either scale to this or this. Hell, a group of Blanks (who weren't even enhanced to be Culexuses iirc) once blotted out a sizable chunk of The Emperor of Mankind's Astronomicon, and a Culexus Assassin was noted to terrify Tyrranids when their connection to The Hive Mind was severed. We don't scale Culexus AP to any of those (though the last two are hopefully obvious why), as it is the potency of their hax being shown by this. Their abilities are stronger on magically stronger people, and this is reflected in this. Just in case you don't agree still, here's another quote.
The Dread Gestalt
Ooh, a feat with a Culexus passively wrecking something that was described as terrifyingly powerful and able to repel space marine attacks with ease. Shame this is also a hax feat, and a clear example of how the presence of a Culexus weakens those with a stronger link to the warp, something not really translatable into AP.
For Culexuses, I propose one of two things, favoring the first option more right now. Help with the wording would be nice though.
1: Culexus AP goes to something like: Large Building level physically (Vindicare justification probably), far higher against magically/spiritually/astrally/whatever powerful opponents (Culexus Assassins can drain the power of those with a strong connection to the warp, weakening their foe and amplifying themselves. Several of their abilities work better on opponents stronger in this regard, allowing them to defeat Greater Daemons). Durability stays as is.
2: To take into account high end Culexuses like the Grand Masters and stuff, they have a variable tier like what the Eversors have right now. Justification for this includes the Grand Master who fought Liegenstrasse (though she did get killed in the end), who had defeated, among others, Darnath Lysander. Lysander beat someone stronger than Velthinar. If we use this, their durability should scale accordingly. I like this version less though.
In terms of scaling, this only affects a profile I'm not done with (Spear, the Black Pariah), and Ephrael Ster. Stern's low 5-B justification would be gone, but she should probably be downgraded back to low 5-B as we aren't assuming all greater daemons are storm prince level anymore, so it shouldn't be too bad in the long term.
Big thanks to TheC2 for finding all the Callidus stuff and some of the misc stuff. I didn't know of any physical feats for Calliduses, and wouldn't have been able to have included that without his help.
So, what are your thoughts?
General Stuff
The blanket striking strength of Building Level is weird. Even Vindicare bodies are noted to be enhanced likely to about Space Marine levels. Others, especially the Eversor, should scale to their AP due to physical attacks being a thing that is used, except possibly the Culexus. As such, I propose rating the Vindicares at Large Building Level in this regard, and scaling Calliduses and Eversors to their AP.
Vindicares don't seem to have a reason to be listed as At least High 8-C. Their scaling physically to Space marines doesn't cut it, as Space Marines have no at least and while they may be physically comparable, I doubt that that comparison was to a fully armored marine in the first place.
Eversors may get a minor weakness of their bio meltdown being able to be triggered without killing them by messing around with enough toxins, due to this:
"Talk to me, Klara! What is going on down there?!" "I have the situation under control!" Rhasc barely ducked a punch that would have torn off her head. "How?" "Poison." She stabbed another blade through the Eversor's bodyglove. Green toxins and blue sheathed blood licked out. "Poison?? On an EVERSOR?! Are you mad?! You'll disrupt the other toxins running through his blood stream! You'll trigger his suicide clause and take you with him!" | ||
~ Assassinorum: The Emperor's Judgement |
Callidus Stuff (Credit to C2)
Right now, the key for the Callidus Assassin is listed at "Unknow" for almost everything, which doesn't need to be the case. While the profile says that it's due to them not having weapons that don't ignore durability, TheC2 found a scene where the Callidus Klara Rhasc defeated Eversor Sylas Torq in combat, hurting him without weapons. Here's the relevant parts.
1. (Towards the end of their first fight): He bulled forward, knocking into Rhasc, driving her over the bodies of the dead guards. The Callidus operative cracked into a marble pillar. Stars shone in her eyes and dancing visions of skulls pulsed in time with her labored heart. 2. (After this, the Eversor leaves and Rhasc tracks him down to a public bath where they fight again): "She sprinted forward, each step sure despite the wet ground. He readied to meet her, whipping out his power sword, muscles bunched out along his arm. His legs were wide, his stance ready. He half crouched, his sword ready to block her own blade. His other hand, each finger ending in a needle sharp knife, twitched and dance with metallic clicks. He would parry any sword strike Rhasc offer, so she didn't offer. Instead, she leapt as she neared, spinning. Her heel smashed into his skull mask, cracking his head to the side. The skull mask caved in, shards of bone like material crunching into his cheek. Her other foot followed through the spin, hammering into the same place. Blood oozed from the wound, thick and wet with an oily sheen. Torq lashed out and Rhasc let momentum carry her, ducking beneath his sword with boneless fluidity. Her phase sword flickered up to block. Pain bloomed as his blow struck, breaking her guard and nearly wrenching her shoulder from her socket." 3. (Soon after that, the Eversor gets more information for his next target and abandons the fight with Rhasc trying to stop him as he climbs up a statue in the bath): His foot lashed out, hooking under her chin and cracked up. She held on, despite the pain, pulling. Trying to stop his escape. She failed and the Eversor kicked again, the force of the blow knocking her backwards. She flipped in midair and landed on her feet. 4. (Rhasc tracks him down one final time before finally bringing him down): The flat of her sword caught his temple, knocking him back, arresting his dodge. He recovered quickly and his left hook caught her knee in a sickening crack of cartilage and bone. She almost fell. She gritted her teeth through the immense pain. Her sword ripped into Torq's shoulder blade, punching through the bone, severing the tendon. The Eversor growled, taken aback. His left arm hung uselessly at his side. Her orders were to bring the assassin back to the ship, they said nothing about him being uninjured. (...) He advanced on her. Strength and threat were his weapons. Tubes gurgled on his shoulders, pushing his rage to greater heights. Rhasc flung a handful of daggers, bursting tubes in sprays of acrid chemicals. Their scent filled the air and brought his rage resurging. (...) He scrabled at the punctured tubes, trying to contain the liquid that spilled out. He failed. His right arm are flailed out, thundering towards her in a haymaker. She flowed beneath it. Already the Eversor was slowing, a slight pause betrayed his actions. A hesitation. Still, he came on. Slower but still full of lethal intent. He punched again and she met it with her left palm. Pain thundered up her arm but she gripped his fist and held it while her right hand grabbed his forearm. She pulled. The Eversor grunted as his elbow popped from its socket. He staggered, sucking in deep astonished breaths. Her foot, spinning into the side of his head, stole all thoughts of him, dropping the Eversor into unconsciousness. | ||
~ Assassinorum: The Emperor's Judgement |
As such, C2 and I came to agree on something kinda like this.
Attack Potency: Unknow, up to City Block level (Though weaker, is capable of contending with an Eversor for short periods of time with supreme effort as well as knocking one out with a well placed blow). At least City Block Level with Poison Knives (The knives are capable of piercing the bodyglove of an Eversor) Neural Shredder and C'tan Phase Sword ignore durability.
He decided that removing the explanations on the Neural Shredder and Phase Sword since the standard equipment already details that, and it makes the AP section crowded beyond that they do.
As for the other stat,
Durability: Likely City Block level (Synskin can absorb Bolter fire, can endure attacks from an Eversor assassin).
Culexus Stuff
Culexus Assassins should not be Low 5-B, or at least not flat out. Right now they scale from killing Malfecius, a powerful daemon prince noted to have given Eversors and Vindicares a tough time. There's some other feats that I can think of pertaining to these guys as well. The problem? Considering their abilities, these defeats make more sense to be counted as due to their hax. I'll post some examples here and discuss them.
Malfecius
| The Officio Assassinorum, having failed to destroy the obscenely powerful Chaos Lord Malfecius with operatives from the Eversor and Vindicare temples, sends the Culexus Assassin Vaedrex instead. The Culexus haunts the steps of Malfecius across the Eye of Terror. Only when Malfecius ascends to Daemon Princehood does Vaedrex finally strike. With Malfecius' latest incarnation rendering him vulnerable to Vaedrex' psyk-out grenades, the Culexus finally manages to kill the reeling Daemon Prince with a punishing series of blasts from his Animus Speculum. | ||
~ Dataslate: Officio Assassinorum |
The Dread Gestalt
| The Wyrdvane Psykers of the Vostroyan Firstborn 122nd come through a difficult Warp translation as a gestalt entity of terrifying psychic power. Revelling in their new abilities, they rise up amongst the ranks of their former comrades and enslave every one of them to their bloodthirsty desires. When the regiment arrives on Sylvanus II they set about the murder of the populace. The Hammers of Dorn are sent on a planetfall mission to destroy the Dread Gestalt, but the powers of the Wyrdvane Psykers are so swollen that the Space Marine attack is repelled with terrifying ease. Only when the Culexus Assassin known as the Revoker is unleashed into the Vostroyan ranks does the Dread Gestalt lose its power, flopping back to earth as weak as newborns. They are killed to a man by Vostroya bayonets even before the Revoker can close with his target to finish the job. | ||
~ Dataslate: Officio Assassinorum |
For Culexuses, I propose one of two things, favoring the first option more right now. Help with the wording would be nice though.
1: Culexus AP goes to something like: Large Building level physically (Vindicare justification probably), far higher against magically/spiritually/astrally/whatever powerful opponents (Culexus Assassins can drain the power of those with a strong connection to the warp, weakening their foe and amplifying themselves. Several of their abilities work better on opponents stronger in this regard, allowing them to defeat Greater Daemons). Durability stays as is.
2: To take into account high end Culexuses like the Grand Masters and stuff, they have a variable tier like what the Eversors have right now. Justification for this includes the Grand Master who fought Liegenstrasse (though she did get killed in the end), who had defeated, among others, Darnath Lysander. Lysander beat someone stronger than Velthinar. If we use this, their durability should scale accordingly. I like this version less though.
In terms of scaling, this only affects a profile I'm not done with (Spear, the Black Pariah), and Ephrael Ster. Stern's low 5-B justification would be gone, but she should probably be downgraded back to low 5-B as we aren't assuming all greater daemons are storm prince level anymore, so it shouldn't be too bad in the long term.
Big thanks to TheC2 for finding all the Callidus stuff and some of the misc stuff. I didn't know of any physical feats for Calliduses, and wouldn't have been able to have included that without his help.
So, what are your thoughts?
