Novel Kars & Dio AP CRT

[Chritin]

This is just a CRT on the application of this feat, which has already been accepted and applied to Goyathlay Soundman's page.

At the very least, Kars needs to get High 6-A for Dune Ultimate due its very nature as being an improved version of Dune itself. Beyond that however, I believe both Kars and Dio deserve this as a value for their physical AP Key as well. During Kars's battle with Dio, he uses Dune Ultimate to imprison Dio. Not only is Dio able to escape from this trap (putting him firmly above Dune Ultimate's power), but he is also shown able to trade blows with Kars, scaling the two physically to one another.

Now, currently Dune Ultimate's AP varies based on the amount of sand it has. However, I would like to argue against this point, considering how Dune actually functions. Dune doesn't function like a normal Stand, separate from its user. For all intents and purposes, Dune IS Soundman, since both Dune and Soundman are just sand that they have accepted. As well, at no point in the novel are we ever told that Soundman loses or gains strength when absorbing more sand, he just is the sand. My point with this is that no matter how much sand Soundman has, he should still be able to exert the same amount of energy over it, since he's just moving his body when he does. The feat of him pulling all the sand together on Mars isn't a feat for when he has a high amount of Sand, but is just a feat for him and his AP period.

There's also the existence of Dune Ultimate to consider. Kars was on Mars and witnessed everything Dune was capable of, understanding it and creating his own bound in the form of Dune Ultimate. Kars's Ultimate Stands/Bound abilities are so strong, that whenever they are transferred to regular humans via a disc, they will immediately explode as they are unable to handle. This fact is said to apply to humans in general by the way, implying that if Soundman was given a copy of something like Dune Ultimate, he would explode immediately from its power.

Anyways, I hope that makes sense. I know that may sound a bit rambly, but I'm pretty busy today and just wanted to get this out there quickly. Here's what I want to add just as a summary:

• Dune Ultimate: Multi-continental AP (Is vastly superior to Soundman's Dune, which could gather all of the sand on Mars at once)
• Dio Brando: Multi-continental AP (Broke out pillar of sand created by Dune Ultimate)
• Kars: Multi-continental AP (Can harm Dio Brando with his punches)

 

[Chariot190]

I get it, but Kars didn't use Dune in a way that'd exert some sort of relative force against Dio, he just used it to make a structure that is described as being dozens of times more sturdy than the puny buildings they were obliterfucking passively DBZ style. Which kind of also tells us the durability of the 300m mortar pillar, is only like 8-B or something.

Unless we have reason to believe any quantity of Dune's sand's durability is equal to the utmost force it can exert at any point, the AP upgrade don't really do anything besides Kars having an out of pocket High 6-A attack.

Unless there's evidence to fix this caveat, I'd have to disagree with a High 6-A upgrade based on that.
for that anyway, britain flip RKE is literally 6-A, and the calc blog we literally use has a exaton calc for the splash, just slip that into the OP for the basis of the upgrade, and use Dune as a supporting feat. The reason we don't use the exaton calc is ******* dumb as shit anyway.

 

[Chritin]

I get it, but Kars didn't use Dune in a way that'd exert some sort of relative force against Dio, he just used it to make a structure that is described as being dozens of times more sturdy than the puny buildings they were obliterfucking passively DBZ style. Which kind of also tells us the durability of the 300m mortar pillar, is only like 8-B or something.

Unless we have reason to believe any quantity of Dune's sand's durability is equal to the utmost force it can exert at any point, the AP upgrade don't really do anything besides Kars having an out of pocket High 6-A attack.

"And then from the back of the rubble came a wave of sand that swept over the buildings and swallowed Dio. Cars appeared to have added Goyathlay Soundman's sand Bound to his repertory. Pulling Dio with it, the rubble sea came flooding towards us, turned into a whirlpool near the square that rose up into a giant pillar of rubble. More and more rubble was pulled into it and the size of it expanded, and the density grew thicker and when at last it stopped swirling it was over 300 meters tall, and 200 meters across, made of almost solid rock like a giant mortar built right next to Piccadilly Circus."

While he does say it's a lot stronger than the buildings around it, there is the fact that Dio got pulled into it in the first place which I think lends more credence to the idea that it was exerting some kind of a force on Dio. And again, this version of Dune should be vastly superior to anything Dune could preform based on the fact ordinary humans couldn't handle having it.

 

[Chariot190]

"And then from the back of the rubble came a wave of sand that swept over the buildings and swallowed Dio. Cars appeared to have added Goyathlay Soundman's sand Bound to his repertory. Pulling Dio with it, the rubble sea came flooding towards us, turned into a whirlpool near the square that rose up into a giant pillar of rubble. More and more rubble was pulled into it and the size of it expanded, and the density grew thicker and when at last it stopped swirling it was over 300 meters tall, and 200 meters across, made of almost solid rock like a giant mortar built right next to Piccadilly Circus."

While he does say it's a lot stronger than the buildings around it, there is the fact that Dio got pulled into it in the first place which I think lends more credence to the idea that it was exerting some kind of a force on Dio. And again, this version of Dune should be vastly superior to anything Dune could preform based on the fact ordinary humans couldn't handle having it.

Kars doesn't really hit him with an attack where Dio being taking the utmost force it can exert, a giant wave that's probably literally hundreds of meters wide hitting Dio gets the funny surface area meme, Dio would only be taking like a millionth of the force given his body area is about 3m^2 based on Jonathan's i had dale pop his asb model into blender
But as said, this can work for an upgrade, it just needs to be framed differently.

Kars does have a legitimate High 6-A option with Dune, if coupled with the other High 6-A, Dune becomes support to it instead of the foundation,

JORGE JOESTAR: Kars Flips Britain

vsbattles.fandom.com

The waves generated by it have been calced at 12 petatons.

Though looking at this.... Why the FUUUUUUUUUUCK are we using minutes for the flip???? They flatout say it happened so quickly they didn't even realize it happened.
1 second timeframe would be 2,218.08 petatons, which for reference, Dune's accepted value is 1,178.63 petatons. Honestly I'm fine with Dune being used as support for AP, it just needs to be framed a tad differently, the fact Kars' ass should be like that exact level anyway definitely helps.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Though looking at this.... Why the FUUUUUUUUUUCK are we using minutes for the flip???? They flatout say it happened so quickly they didn't even realize it happened.
1 second timeframe would be 2,218.08 petatons, which for reference, Dune's accepted value is 1,178.63 petatons. Honestly I'm fine with Dune being used as support for AP, it just needs to be framed a tad differently, the fact Kars' ass should be like that exact level anyway definitely helps.

Specifically to lowball the feat. That's it, really.

 

[Chariot190]

Im running through some values, the RKE of it based on a 1, 2 and 5 second timeframe while pixel scaling the actual thing (britain itself is actually only a small portion of the surface of it based on the drawings), and the fact Joji said the cube house should be fine being trampled by it (They state the beetle moves at beyond supersonic speeds, we also see the legs in the flip image, we can calc the mass of the leg, and the KE of a singular leg based on the combined movement of them needed to get it moving that fast, Kars smashes through the cube house so pretty easy scaling there).

Both should help and are within tier 6.
There's also like 3 supporting tier 7 feats but those kinda mean jackshit given the gap.

 

[Chritin]

Kars doesn't really hit him with an attack where Dio being taking the utmost force it can exert, a giant wave that's probably literally hundreds of meters wide hitting Dio gets the funny surface area meme, Dio would only be taking like a millionth of the force given his body area is about 3m^2 based on Jonathan's i had dale pop his asb model into blender
But as said, this can work for an upgrade, it just needs to be framed differently.

Kars does have a legitimate High 6-A option with Dune, if coupled with the other High 6-A, Dune becomes support to it instead of the foundation,

JORGE JOESTAR: Kars Flips Britain

vsbattles.fandom.com

The waves generated by it have been calced at 12 petatons.

Though looking at this.... Why the FUUUUUUUUUUCK are we using minutes for the flip???? They flatout say it happened so quickly they didn't even realize it happened.
1 second timeframe would be 2,218.08 petatons, which for reference, Dune's accepted value is 1,178.63 petatons. Honestly I'm fine with Dune being used as support for AP, it just needs to be framed a tad differently, the fact Kars' ass should be like that exact level anyway definitely helps.

I guess that makes sense, although the surface area scaling is a weird thing to use when we normally just say "character could survive a character's attack that has 'x' level of AP" and scale it to them. Overall, we at least need to update Kars's Dune ultimate key, and I guess if we have something else we can use for High 6-A then its okay. If you want I can make an updated blog calc and then add it onto this CRT so we don't need to make another one.

 

[Chritin]

Specifically to lowball the feat. That's it, really.

Honestly not only is it a lowball in speed the speed of the flip, but the islands thickness, considering the artwork shows A MASSIVE chunk of crust is being flipped as well.

 

[Chariot190]

It's true, I'm looking at it in chat, 162m is uh, just ******* wrong. Looks more like 162km tbh.

I would not be surprised if it was like 5-C by the end of everything.

 

[Nemu13]

Does kars smashed the cube house count as AP?

 

[Chariot190]

Does kars smashed the cube house count as AP?

Doesn't matter if it does or not because by sheer virtue of him smashing into it, and it being blown the **** out but him tanking it, means his dura > Cube House. Which obviously scales to Dio pulverizing him, and then back to Kars due to them obliterfucking each other.


As said above, I spent today looking over some feats, got three done (aka the values below) but I'll prob drop them all in one big blog at once.

We got 937 megaton feat (scales to cube house), 236 Gigaton feat (Scales to Cube House), 35 exaton feat (so far, not done that's just a facet of it) which is like, yeah might be looking at 5-C Kars, so come full circle. No it isn't the moon, his moon is only 5km and like 7-B when factoring in the thickness and the gravity of Mars and the speed he moves at with it. What that feat is good for tho is LS, like Class T base Kars. Coincidentally has another Class T base LS feat via the comet jump.

And a handful more ranging from like 8-B to 7-A and maybe another 6 something, there's quite of uncalced straightforward feats so this is gonna take a few days.