My Little Pony: Revisions are Magic

[Lightbuster30]

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Thats exactly my point. There were literally tens of thousands of "great sorcerers"? You don't think that's a little off?

I'm not even suggesting we scale her to Celestia, I'm suggesting we scale her to Starswirl. I'm suggesting she is scaled to top tier unicorns, who are weaker than Celestia.

She most certainly does having scaling, I'll give you that she has no feats, but scaling? Yes. She scales to Starlight (cast an unbreakable spell on the princesses, and performed a spell only "the strongest unicorns can do" on the fly). She broke Neighsay's seal easily (again, the guy is strong enough to make portals, which only low top tiers have ever been seen doing). And the infamous PoS word of mouth. The feats aren't there, but the scaling is. In my opinion anyway.

What do you mean she "has yet to realize her potential?" She realized her potential 4 seasons ago. That's what Celestia was grooming her to become. I seriously doubt; WoG not withstanding, that the show writers are gonna expand more on Twilight's potential when they did exactly that already. If they do, it will likely be in her role, not power.

So it only exploded with Changeling magic, while returning the drained magic? Guess that makes sense. Is it still possible to scale here? I mean, love is stated, and shown to be more powerful when shared by a large margin. If a fully fed Chrysalis is = Celestia, then could we scale to Thorax, who should be well fed? Or is that too much?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Meh, Twillight is still clearly going to become 2-A in the comicbook finale. o3o

 

[Lightbuster30]

Meh, Twillight is still clearly going to become 2-A in the comicbook finale. o3o

???

 

[Js250476]

He's referencing the recent legends of magic annual and it's implications

 

[Lightbuster30]

He's referencing the recent legends of magic annual and it's implications

I'm pretty sure it was established above to be 2-C.

 

[Js250476]

Well the "infinite worlds" part means it could be interpreted as 2-A

 

[Lightbuster30]

Well the "infinite worlds" part means it could be interpreted as 2-A

Didn't effect time-space. Apoarently you have to affect time and soace to be 2-A. All they did was hollow out infinite worlds. So hjgh 3-A to 2-C.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I also agree with Azzy, as I said earlier. Theirs a few, mostly vague, statements that puts Twilight on their level, but they're contradicted by her consistent showings of not being that strong yet.

99% certain she's gonna be 4-C or above by the end of the show though.

About the 2-A comic stuff. It has to affect space-time to be Tier 2. For now, it's High 3-A at best, but the story ended on a cliffhanger so who knows. I also kind of doubt the comics will end on a cosmic tier battle as well, given most of the recent arcs have been mostly chill stories. The next major arc is going The Return of Tempest Shadow so that might have good stuff.

 

[Lightbuster30]

How many of these "consistent showings" post alicorn are there? Can we post anything specific? Storm guards I don't really care for as I already know. Because I think there is enough evidence to warrant a possibly.

And as far as I know, there is no mention of Twilight having "great potential" post alicorn. Maybe there is, and I just missed it, but I'm not seeing anything.

Not to mention suspension of belief: I mean, we're expected to believe Twilight doesn't come anywhere close to even one of what is literally 10s of thousands of random unicorns who assisted in Raising the Sun? When she's trained her entire life? Compared to them, who given their sheer number, can't have had much training time? Look, I get it's a fallacy, but SoD can only go so far.

 

[Antvasima]

As a sidenote, I bought the Legends of Magic annual via Comixology, and did not notice any concrete evidence of tier 2 or even tier 3 within it.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Not to mention suspension of belief: I mean, we're expected to believe Twilight doesn't come anywhere close to even one of what is literally 10s of thousands of random unicorns who assisted in Raising the Sun? When she's trained her entire life? Compared to them, who given their sheer number, can't have had much training time? Look, I get it's a fallacy, but SoD can only go so far.

Again, going to point out that said unicorns did this by expending all of the magic they would ever have at once and then never being able to use magic, again. This is not a regular level of power. Not only is this not something we know if Twilight is aware of how to do, but it's also something she never would do outside of the most dire life-or-death scenario.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I have no idea where Thorax is, by the way. Don't think he's Tia's level, though.

 

[Jinsye]

There's Hearth's Warming Eve too for unicorn raising the sun but you know.

It's probably not the best source of history.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Do you mean i the play, or a statement?

 

[Jinsye]

Play if I get what you said right.

They said the unicorns moved the sun/moon iirc, I have no idea how many though and it's probably not true, just thought I'd bring it up.

 

[Lightbuster30]

Technically they should still be a tier below at the very least, because island level normally to small star level is a pretty damn huge gap, even with "all their power."

I still need to see Twilight having issues with menial threats consistently post alicorn, not one or two times.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

@Edward I mean, they did, but it's clarified that they expended all of their magic forever in order to do so once (after which they could never use magic, again), which isn't normal AP. Only Starswirl could do it consistently, and he still needed five other sorcerers in order for it to work.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Technically they should still be a tier below at the very least, because island level normally to dwarf star level is a pretty damn huge gap, even with "all their power."

I still need to see Twilight having issues with menial threats consistently post alicorn, not one or two times.

No, that is still completely unquantifiable. It's not like they're Island level normally and then Low 4-C via all their magic for one year or something. They're Island level normally and Low 4-C with all of their magic ever expended completely in one go. We can't calculate that.

I'll do you one better. Show me Alicorn Twilight consistently beating down relative fodder with zero issue, because every time something like a Bugbear or Storm Guard shows up, she almost always has trouble.

 

[Lightbuster30]

Wait what? Where is it stated they use up all their magic over the course if their life? Pretty sure they meant the strain damaged their magic to a point beyond repair (think ripping a muscle to the point where you can't use it.) I will admit however, that this is entirely headcanon, I had assumed it worked that way. If what you say is true, I'm willing to drop this point on the spot.

Fine, I'll give your challenge a go. You know Sunset Shimmer? A mid tier, and not a fodder? WoG says she us pretty powerful, yet doesn't even come close to Unicorn Twilight. Not Alicorn, Unicor. Not to mention casually breaking seals from a guy who can open portals (which again, only the powerhouses have been seen doing). I will admit that this one is dubious, so I'm fine if you have problems with it.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

"And every day, the unicorns helping Star Swirl would use so much magic, they lost their powers forever." It's described in a way where they essentially burned through their entire magic reserves ("use so much magic, they lose their powers forever").

This is not Twilight easily beating relative fodder. This is Twilight being comparable to someone seen as decently powerful. I am more looking for stuff along the lines of enemies showing up (who are roughly comparable to Twilight's friends) and her being able to easily handle it.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I too was under the impression that it was't all their magic for their entire lives, just that such a feat was so draining that it removed their ability to do so, or something.

I don't think they exactly have a "finite supply" of magic but I guess I might be wrong

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

@Dark

I feel it can be viewed either way, but the way it's worded suggests to me that it's doing something akin to burning through their entire magic reserve. We know that using too much magic can render a unicorn unable to use it for a while (like what happened with Starswirl when sealing the PoS), similar to pulling a muscle in a sense, but here it's stated that they were completely drained to such an extent that they could never do so, again.

Considering even unicorns who've had their horns snapped off (Tempest) can use some magic, this seems more like it's simply "running out of magic" as opposed to some sort of damage.

 

[Lightbuster30]

Would casually paralysing almost all of her friends at once count? That sounds better than beating enemies relative to their strength. Not to mention this was, again as a unicorn.

What's your opinion on the Neighsay scaling?

@Dark I don't think it makes much sense either, seeing as magic is supposed to re-charge once you use too much.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I'm pretty sure that just counts as paralysis as opposed to power.

Scaling to Neighsay is probably fine, but I don't remember him having any great feats or scaling aside from being considered powerful for a unicorn.

 

[Lightbuster30]

I'm pretty sure that just counts as paralysis as opposed to power.

Scaling to Neighsay is probably fine, but I don't remember him having any great feats or scaling aside from being considered powerful for a unicorn.

Well her paralysis seems to be using her TK to restrain movement.

I want to scale to Neighsay based on him making portals. Because only powerhouses have been seen using them. However, I hope you do not mistake this for reaching. As I'm well aware how dubious this is.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I don't doubt that he's a high-tier unicorn. I just think that's better at supporting Alicorn Twily's "At least" more than anything else.

 

[Lightbuster30]

I don't doubt that he's a high-tier unicorn. I just think that's better at supporting Alicorn Twily's "At least" more than anything else.

So wait you're actually ok with that reasoning? I'd personally take the PoS statement over that due to how direct it is, if we're giving her an "at least" or "possibly."

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I think the PoS statement is unreliable if trying to scale Twilight to tier 4. I don't think scaling to guys like Neighsay is unreliable if trying to give her an "At least" or "possibly/likely higher".

 

[Phoenix821]

I have a question should Princess Celestia have access to Twilight's abiliites?

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I have a question should Princess Celestia have access to Twilight's abiliites?

Which ones? Or just all of them in general?

 

[Phoenix821]

All of Unicorn Twilight's abilities like Sunset has.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Probably? For the ones it's clear she didn't learn or study on her own, at least.

 

[Phoenix821]

I was wondering if they should be added to her page.

Or at least mentioned she has them.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

I would assume so, but I'd want to know what others think.

 

[Phoenix821]

Ok

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I don't know about this downgrade...I think that having incredibly casual feats sometimes being at 4-B contradicts what you've said. Celestia's even commented on how easy it is to raise the sun as she does. And as for the Twilight part, wasn't Starswirl stated as stronger than the princesses? I don't remember where this is from, but I'm sure I heard it somewhere.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

The issue is the assumption that the feat is even 4-B in the first place, which relies on the assumption that relativistic KE can be applied to the sun, while nearly every showing of characters actively moving it in the verse proves this is not the case. Without it, the feat is 4-C, which is what we rate moving the sun at FTL speeds.

 

[Phoenix821]

I've seen people treat moving the Sun at FTL speeds as solar system level ironicly

 

[The_Everlasting]

To elaborate on what Azzy said

It's basically like if a character can move celestial bodies at FTL speed but we rate their stats on them theoretically moving them at, say, .9c, because they can nonetheless do that. Technically that's true, but it also really inflates their tier.

 

[Lightbuster30]

So question: does the Sun raising deal limit the shows power level? Or if a better, yet acceptable feat came along would we just write it off as writers can't do math? I'm not really asking in regards to Twilight, so much as I am the top tiers in general, Celestia, Luna, Candance, and anyone in 4-C?