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I’m sorry, did Native tank attacks or harm a High End or something? Do you even know his quirk? Stop trying to bring up ridiculous instances of things with no context to downplay what’s being said
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My Hero Academia - Scaling Revisions [Top Tier Edition]
- Thread starter Kingofwolves999
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Native died, we don't see how the fight went down and we never saw anyone take a hit from them. Also the Near High-Ends that should scale to Hood are the ones that Miro and the others were fighting, the Dog one seem to have killed Native as we see it about to bite through his arm.
That shot is likely seconds before Native died.
That shot is likely seconds before Native died.
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All Might's weak spot is the only part of his body that was bleeding, at other times he just spits blood out of his mouth, but that is something he always does when he is about to reach his limit or when he is punched at said weak spot.
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A more accurate representation of this is Mirko has greater AP than AM and Endeavor has equal or greater durability since the HE have greater quirkless strength but have quirks on top to go higher than AM and USJ
Chapter 19 around page 13 I think. The page Deku says he's going beyond 100%. There's a graze sound effect and a piece of AM's face flies off
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We see Native fighting the same Nomu for several minutes which means Native is comparable to it, and isn’t being speedblitzed, making Stain, Deku, Iida and Todoroki all as fast as 100% All Might via scaling with USJ Nomu.
Native’s quirk is to throw feathers at his enemies, apparently, as that’s what he appears to be fighting the Nomu with.
Native’s quirk is to throw feathers at his enemies, apparently, as that’s what he appears to be fighting the Nomu with.
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That graze just pulled out a small bit of scalp, no blood came out of that tiny wound, or we would have seen drops of blood sliding off All Might's face.
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Still means the USJ Nomu can break his skin with a punch and therefore Hood and the others can as well. This also means Mirko could harm AM quite a bit. Actually no we see some blood run down it in the next chapter.
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This is basically my feelings about scaling on here. Especially when people were on the Endeavor > Kamino All Might agenda which made no sense.
Anyway, I've found that people completely ignore quirks when scaling Nomus and High-ends.
A Nomu with strength enhancing and defensive quirks could be in a completely different tier from one that isn't even if they are both Black Nomu or High-ends.
People still don't see that Hood had like 3 or 4 strength enhancing quirks. Yeah, his base stats are similar to the other High-ends but all the others only had one or two gimmicks: Woman had Acid, while Helmet had Warp and Lasers. These quirks would do nothing to boost their physical stats and are obviously meant for long range.
On the other hand, The elephant Nomu and the Bone tentacle Nomu have clear defensive quirks. The bone Nomu specifically went from being shredded by Mirko to tanking her attacks when it sprouted that Bone rib cage armor meaning it's defence with the armor >>>>>>> it's normal High-end tier durability.
It's an exponential difference considering how Mirko easily tore through the High-ends.
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I wouldn't say that. After all, Deku admits that the reason Muscular was able to withstand his 100% Smashes is that he's able to regenerate his muscle fibers very quickly. We even see in both the manga and anime that his muscle fibers are being torn away and being regenerated every second.
Not saying Muscular doesn't scale to Deku, I'm just saying that he's not really on par. He's up there, but not quite equal.
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I'd also like to note that 20% should be 8-A. The calculation which puts him at 8-B+ is severely flawed, as it says he created a vortex of wind. If anyone paid attention to the clip, nothing was spinning. It was just a bunch of air pressure or wind being launched up or debris I guess. It'd be better to consider Deku's attack as some sort of shock wave and use the ground explosion formula to calculate it.
You could also just calculate the kinetic energy of it. Either way, any rendition of the calculation puts 20% Deku between 8-A to 7-C, according to my estimates at least.
You could also just calculate the kinetic energy of it. Either way, any rendition of the calculation puts 20% Deku between 8-A to 7-C, according to my estimates at least.
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I’m confused as to why anime scenes can’t be used but less than 3 frame long movie scenes which show a MASSIVE outlier compared to the manga are allowed.
20% Deku with a kick caused only enough air pressure to break a few twigs off leaves and scar the bark. But by the time of the movie, which is at best only a month or two from when he unlocked 20%, he’s supposedly gotten strong enough to create tornados that send whole trees flying despite the fact the trees and entire surrounding area is completely fine when it cuts back to him?
Seems pretty sketchy. May as well take All Might dodging point blank Bakugo explosions in the anime one time as a concrete feat. If that’s an outlier, Deku’s movie tornado feat is also an outlier. This sounds very hypocritical.
20% Deku with a kick caused only enough air pressure to break a few twigs off leaves and scar the bark. But by the time of the movie, which is at best only a month or two from when he unlocked 20%, he’s supposedly gotten strong enough to create tornados that send whole trees flying despite the fact the trees and entire surrounding area is completely fine when it cuts back to him?
Seems pretty sketchy. May as well take All Might dodging point blank Bakugo explosions in the anime one time as a concrete feat. If that’s an outlier, Deku’s movie tornado feat is also an outlier. This sounds very hypocritical.
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First of all, no, Hood only had two strength-enhancing Quirks, which were Power (a passive Quirk that gives him superhuman strength) and Muscle Augmentation, a Quirk he doesn't need to use to hurt Endeavor.
Secondly, every time you bring up this argument, you forget that the Near High-End Nomus were stated to be just as strong as Hood, who can hurt Endeavor with brute strength alone, and the complete High-Ends would obviously be stronger.
And finally, Endeavor himself was unable to one-shot the Hospital High-Ends by himself, and needed the help of dozens of Pro Heroes to restrain Woman and kill her without a chance to defend herself.
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This is fine by me honestly, I should get higher results using the explosion formula.
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Mirko blitzed and tore through several High Tier Nomu who, according to the current logic of this site, are as strong as the USJ Nomu because he’s “totally not an outlier”, and USJ Nomu was similar if not equal in speed to All Might.
Therefore Mirko should be capable of blitzing All Might and defeat him. According to this site.
She also tanked a High End slamming it’s hand into her face and didn’t even break her nose. Making her similar in durability to All Might. So the giant gap between Endeavour and All Might didn’t actually exist because Mirko was already on All Might’s level, and Endeavour is supposedly as good as her.
Makes sense.
Therefore Mirko should be capable of blitzing All Might and defeat him. According to this site.
She also tanked a High End slamming it’s hand into her face and didn’t even break her nose. Making her similar in durability to All Might. So the giant gap between Endeavour and All Might didn’t actually exist because Mirko was already on All Might’s level, and Endeavour is supposedly as good as her.
Makes sense.
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All Might at his weakest was portrayed as still being MILES ahead of everyone else. This is why Endeavour could do nothing at Kamino besides distract All For One for just a few attacks and then dipped.
Theoretical Prime Deku > Prime AFO = Prime All Might >>>>>> USJ All Might = or a little > USJ Nomu >>> Kamino All Might = Kamino All For One >>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone else.
Theoretical Prime Deku > Prime AFO = Prime All Might >>>>>> USJ All Might = or a little > USJ Nomu >>> Kamino All Might = Kamino All For One >>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone else.
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Blitz? Mirko herself stated that her attacks had stopped landing after the High-Ends started to adapt.
And after hundreds of punches from the USJ Nomu, All Might only lost a little bit of skin, while Mirko was severely bleeding after being thrown by a Nomu, not even taking a punch.
Your comparisons make no sense.
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Also, All For One's Air Cannon (which he was preparing to use against All Might) failed to reach Endeavor, and only managed to scatter his fire.
Which means that in terms of power these characters are more or less on the same level, although AFO still has his Ultimate Quirk Combination, and All Might can go beyond his limits, so even at their weakest, they would still win against characters like Mirko.
Which means that in terms of power these characters are more or less on the same level, although AFO still has his Ultimate Quirk Combination, and All Might can go beyond his limits, so even at their weakest, they would still win against characters like Mirko.
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I said blitzed upper tiers, not High Ends.
What? Is USJ Nomu NOW considered an outlier and not an upper tier, but now a High End in strength??
The High Ends did not ”adapt”, they began waking up properly. Mirko still took a full on hit from at least one of them and did not die. Making her comparable to All Might, who was being held down by USJ Nomu, hurt by USJ Nomu, and stalemated by USJ Nomu. He needed Todoroki’s help to break free.
What? Is USJ Nomu NOW considered an outlier and not an upper tier, but now a High End in strength??
The High Ends did not ”adapt”, they began waking up properly. Mirko still took a full on hit from at least one of them and did not die. Making her comparable to All Might, who was being held down by USJ Nomu, hurt by USJ Nomu, and stalemated by USJ Nomu. He needed Todoroki’s help to break free.
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What upper tiers Nomu are you even talking about, Mirko only fought the High-Ends and she wasn't able to blitz them.
USJ Nomu was never stated to be an outlier, and when the Doctor was comparing the stats of the all the Nomus, the manga showed an image of the USJ Nomu.
And I'm not sure what's wrong with Mirko being "comparable" to All Might, she is still clearly inferior demonstrated by her feats against similar opponents.
Taking hundreds of punches and only losing a bit of skin >>>>> Severely bleeding after getting thrown just once.
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On her way to the doctor when the raid first started, she went down an entire hallway of Upper Tier Nomu who, according to the people above us in this thread, are in the same strength tier as USJ Nomu. She turned them into meat chunks without taking a single hit.
Oh no, Mirko isn’t comparable, she is above him according to this site. Cuz y’know, High Ends >>> Upper Tiers in all stats as this site states, and All Might fought USJ Nomu who isn’t a High End, but an Upper Tier, and took massive effort to defeat him, meanwhile Mirko blitzes several Upper Tiers and then battles multiple High Ends and tears a few of them apart too.
So, as it stands, Mirko = a High End at minimum >>> Upper Tier Nomu = All Might having to use everything he’s got to the point where he can’t even take 1 step without losing his muscle form after.
Oh no, Mirko isn’t comparable, she is above him according to this site. Cuz y’know, High Ends >>> Upper Tiers in all stats as this site states, and All Might fought USJ Nomu who isn’t a High End, but an Upper Tier, and took massive effort to defeat him, meanwhile Mirko blitzes several Upper Tiers and then battles multiple High Ends and tears a few of them apart too.
So, as it stands, Mirko = a High End at minimum >>> Upper Tier Nomu = All Might having to use everything he’s got to the point where he can’t even take 1 step without losing his muscle form after.
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No one has ever argued that all the Upper-Tier Nomus are equal.
Doctor Garaki: "Those in the Upper-Tier are at least as strong as ten average people combined".
Notice the word "at least", denoting that not all the Upper-Tier Nomus are comparable.
Doctor Garaki: "Standing above all of them, are the High-End Nomu, possessing stats beyond those of the Upper-Tier".
The Doctor's statement is now referring to all the Upper-Tier Nomus, which includes the USJ Nomu.
The Upper-Tier Nomus are inconsequential and they don't even have a profile anymore, the only important thing is that the doctor compared the High-Ends to the strongest Upper-Tier Nomu we have ever seen.
Doctor Garaki: "Those in the Upper-Tier are at least as strong as ten average people combined".
Notice the word "at least", denoting that not all the Upper-Tier Nomus are comparable.
Doctor Garaki: "Standing above all of them, are the High-End Nomu, possessing stats beyond those of the Upper-Tier".
The Doctor's statement is now referring to all the Upper-Tier Nomus, which includes the USJ Nomu.
The Upper-Tier Nomus are inconsequential and they don't even have a profile anymore, the only important thing is that the doctor compared the High-Ends to the strongest Upper-Tier Nomu we have ever seen.
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I think the point is that, since Mirko is > Upper tier Nomu by a considerable margin and even =>Individual High-ends considering she could kill 1 of then in a 5 on 1 or even 5 on 1 then the scaling with USJ Nomu vs All Might makes no sense unless you literally think Mirko > USJ All Might. Logically if any of the heroes could stop AFO, they would have done it, but they were just fodder to him, even Endeavor.
The series scaling is pretty clear so I don't know why people are trying to twist it. Even when Aizawa is thinking about perfected Nomu, he thinks about USJ. High-ends are impressive and all but none have USJ's level physical stats apart from maybe Hood. I've used Helmet High-end numerous times in this example.
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That still infers Mirko is above or equal to AM since he bled from a punch from a Nomu weaker than the ones she takes hits from and can tear apart. Heck Endeavor is as tough as AM by this scale.
This also means Nejire’s quirk has comparable power to AM since she could pin a NHE
In fact anyone who takes an attack from a HE is either rivalling AM or stronger than him since according to all of you the HE surpass USJ in ALL stats which includes base physicals which means Hood and many others are stronger than Shigaraki as well since they have AM tier strength plus their quirks on top.
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I’m getting real sick of you guys claiming this “AM tier” thing. They are not as strong as All Might, they are as strong as him after giving away One For All and having a debilitating weakness after 6 years. Stop acting like we’re claiming everyone is Prime AM tier. You’re making up this tier where AM cannot ever be reached in his current state.
Also, like we’ve been saying, Mirko does not ever take hits from High Ends. She gets torn up and injured everytime they touch her. Heck, All Might takes literally hundreds of punches from USJ Nomu and isn’t anywhere near as torn to pieces like Mirko or Endeavor are from their encounters. His durability is literally leagues higher than theirs.
And why are people ignoring that AM is stronger than the USJ Nomu? It can damage him, but he literally is strong enough to withstand all its punches and overwhelm its Shock Absorption while already being past his time limit. The only reason it didn’t get torn to pieces like Mirko does the High Ends is because of Shock Absorption.
Also, like we’ve been saying, Mirko does not ever take hits from High Ends. She gets torn up and injured everytime they touch her. Heck, All Might takes literally hundreds of punches from USJ Nomu and isn’t anywhere near as torn to pieces like Mirko or Endeavor are from their encounters. His durability is literally leagues higher than theirs.
And why are people ignoring that AM is stronger than the USJ Nomu? It can damage him, but he literally is strong enough to withstand all its punches and overwhelm its Shock Absorption while already being past his time limit. The only reason it didn’t get torn to pieces like Mirko does the High Ends is because of Shock Absorption.
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Even though the story never portrays them as comparable to weakened AM. Endeavor got bullied by someone almost as strong as AM yet you guys are saying he takes attacks from people stronger than him. If AM can be reached why didn’t Endeavor solo AFO at Kamino? Why didn’t Edgeshot?
AM didn’t take hundreds of blows from the USJ Nomu. It is likely he dodged several of them since we explicitly see a punch that only grazes him rather than actually landing. Plus AM showed previously he could dodge blows from the USJ Nomu while landing his own. Mirko took a hit from Woman and shrugged it off. Even if she cancelled the force that was only her impact to the wall and if she wasn’t comparable her face should’ve gone splat or she would’ve broken something.
Furthermore all the ‘HE tear through her’ stuff isn’t true with their blunt attacks. They only punch through her with piercing attacks such as the tentacle quirk or bites. Mirko also tore straight through them even with their quirks with her kicks.
It’s literally stated it’s a strong as AM. You gonna ignore the statements and its showings? AM had to go beyond 100% to beat it.
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As long as you guys keep pushing this scaling you’re pretty much saying Mirko could solo AFO so long as she avoids his hands. Endeavor could solo AFO if he keeps his distance since after all both are superior to AFO based on their showings with the HE.
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What, against Hood? Who was literally tossing him around and piercing him? And against Shigaraki whose attacks he also was getting through? Both of those examples can be true and he can still have durability that’s worse than All Mights. Edgeshot doesn’t even scale to anyone, why even mention him?
That’s head canon that he dodged those blows. You can clearly see the USJ Nomu landing hits on All Might during their clash, and even if it wasn’t hundreds, it was way, WAY more than what Mirko or Endeavor took. Mirko didn’t shrug off a hit from woman, she got injured by it way worse than AM ever was injured by Nomu, and the reason she was even more better off is because she canceled the force Woman threw her with out via her legs. You can have inferior durability and not be instantly killed by someone touching you, I don’t get what is hard to understand with this.
They hit her once with a blunt attack, which was just a throw, and it damages her more than AM was ever damaged by Nomu. They never hit her with another blunt attack, so your claim that they “only” tear her with piercing is wrong since you haven’t seen her take a blunt attack from any of them head on.
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No one is claiming anyone could solo AFO, since we’re constantly saying they have inferior durability to the USJ Nomu, High Ends, AM and AFO. Endeavor and Mirko cannot take hundreds of hits from Nomu, AM can. We are however stating they can reach their level of attack potency.
Can AFO survive a Prominence Burn head on? No, he would die. He is, however, way faster than Endeavor and Endeavor has worse Durability. He would just dodge and beat his ass. Mirko has possibly comparable Attack Potencty to super weakened AM but worse Dura, so AFO would blast her away with ease. Edgeshot doesn’t scale to anyone, so that is irrelevant. Claiming that people should be able to solo AFO simply because they have attack potency around his level is not an argument.
Can AFO survive a Prominence Burn head on? No, he would die. He is, however, way faster than Endeavor and Endeavor has worse Durability. He would just dodge and beat his ass. Mirko has possibly comparable Attack Potencty to super weakened AM but worse Dura, so AFO would blast her away with ease. Edgeshot doesn’t scale to anyone, so that is irrelevant. Claiming that people should be able to solo AFO simply because they have attack potency around his level is not an argument.
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Endeavor getting tossed around isn’t an anti feat for his durability. The fact still stands that he took hits from someone with AM level strength and two enhancer quirks and didn’t pass out or die. His durability would at least be equal to AFO and AM.
Nomu took off a chunk of AM’s face. Mirko suffered a minor head injury. AM came off worse than she did. AM dodged the blows. It’s your head canon that he didn’t since I literally have a panel of a punch missing him and only grazing him. While you have vague pages showing tons of fists. Even then I never said AM dodged them all just that he dodged quite a few especially since we’ve seen him go in close combat with Nomu and dodge and tag him multiple times.
Mirko would’ve cancelled the impact to the wall not the actual attack hitting her.
Then you can’t make the claim that all their attacks tear her apart
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They literally take blows from characters stronger than all the people you mentioned by your logic. How do they not fully scale? You’re really saying taking blows and fighting someone with AP equal to AM then enhanced by more power up quirks doesn’t make you scale to AM really?
Heat doesn’t equal blunt force. You do realise Endeavor can attack faster than Hood who is as fast as AM and still react when he’s amped by Muscle Augmentation right? So Endeavor would actually beat up AFO since he’s at worst equal to his speed and at best faster than him.
The fact that Mirko’s legs can cancel out AM level force means she could stop anything AFO could hit her with that way. Even then Mirko didn’t even suffer a broken nose form Woman’s attack. Even if she’s weaker she still somewhat scales.
Strawman. That wasn’t my point. My point is they fight people stronger and faster than AFO and AM and therefore would beat him.
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How are you getting he has the same Durabilith as them when, after taking those hits from Hood, he can’t even move his body from the damage it took? He was so damaged by Hood’s attacks that he had to propel himself with his flames and needed the pain to stay conscious, he is not in the same ballpark as AM or AFO.
So now you’re claiming he took a chunk of his face? Nomu barely grazed AM and made his cheek bleed, that’s a thing that happens is real life fights, stop acting like every hit from Nomu was tearing chunks out of his body. AM literally takes a direct punch from Nomu to save Bakugo and just has bruised arms. The punch clash literally starts off with them clashing fists together and AM’s arms aren’t torn from their sockets. Your claims that Nomu was tearing him apart are terrible, you’re just taking a single instance where a graze makes him bleed and claiming that’s all the evidence you need that Nomu is infinitely stronger than AM and can kill him with one hit.
So we’re in agreement that she doesn’t take any direct actual blunt force attacks like All Might does yes? So the claim that they can or can’t tear her apart need to stem from other examples of their Attack Potency vs her Durability, of which we have them tearing her apart everytime they touch her or injuring her worse than AM is injured from something as simple as a throw. Do you understand how little force would’ve been behind that throw as compared to a straight punch? Just based off the damage she suffered from a throw you can tell she isn’t on their level in durability. But you’re stubbornly claiming that, because she didn’t die from that throw, she can tank any hit from them, and therefore is more durable than All Might, and therefore you have an issue. You’re fabricating your own problems with the scaling and acting as if these characters have durability higher than what we’re claiming they have.
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No they do not, they get hit once or twice and are already severely injured. They do not swap blows or trade hits or tank attacks or any of what you’re claiming. Your perception of these events is skewed if your take away from any of the High End fights show people capable of tanking their hits or even swapping.
Mirko’s legs don’t protect her whole body, what? Even if she could cancel out Low 7-B force with them and attack higher than the USJ Nomu, it doesn’t matter when AFO is spamming air cannons and hitting her whole body.
Except in those fights, they get the shit kicked out of them and only win after sacrificing heavily and nearly dying to every attack, as opposed to All Might legit tanking blows from USJ Nomu while already over his time limit and with a weak spot. The only injure even possibly described as “a chunk was torn out” for AM is a graze on his cheek. All the other attacks are him getting bruised at worst. And he as directly tanking attacks from AFO that weren’t the Air Cannon like his Ribet Stab, while Shigaraki’s pierced Endeavor. These characters do not have AM’s level of durability.
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Since you aren’t going to drop this Endeavor vs AFO point, sure, I’ll claim he could beat him. Prominence Burn GG. He didn’t even use Flashfire vs AFO, just basic blasts. Endeavor would kick his ass, he just let AM do it because of the circumstances.
Do you have a problem?
Do you have a problem?
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He took hits from someone stronger than AM and got stabbed and sliced to boot and was overheating (as shown/stated before heat makes it hard to move). Please show me a time when AM was in such a situation and could still move properly.
He took a chunk off his face. You can see it flying off don't downplay it. When the hell did I say Nomu was tearing him apart? Can you read my posts? I literally just said he took a chunk off his face nothing more nothing less.
She literally took a hit to the face but sure continue to strawman and misconstrue my arguments. Charging someone and smacking them in the face isn't little force man. A small cut on your head isn't a major injure and it's certainly less serious than a chunk of your cheek coming off. I'm fabricating nothing. You just don't wanna accept your wonky scaling even though it's right in front of you.
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It's the scaling you agree with. I'd expect you believe that much.
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- #277
He didn’t take those hits, he got messed up everytime he was hit. That is not taking hits, that is surviving.
So what’s the point of Nomu ripping a piece of his face? Clearly AM and Nomu are not overwhelmingly stronger than each other, and instead it can be argued AM is better than Nomu in multiple areas, so what is the point of you constantly citing this single instance of his face being hurt?
She gets her face grabbed and is thrown, how can you even claim that’s comparable to a punch to the face? I haven’t straw manned you once this entire time, what? All of my points are constructed off of what you are saying unless you simply aren’t understanding them.
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If you have no argument against that scaling, than you shouldn’t have problem with it yes?
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Endeavor and Mirko were only majorly injured from stab wounds or spatial manipulation and once again all blunt hits were>AM so that isn't an anti feat for them equalling AM by your Nomu scaling.
She could literally just dodge or cancel it out like AM did or take the hit since Air Cannon doesn't even fully scale to AM.
Yeah but AM is fighting someone weaker than Hood and has to go all Plus Ultra so these aren't comparable. AFO might be weaker than AM and Shiggy since he only clashed with suppressed AM. Even then Endeavor could just have lower piercing durability.
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You're going for trivial wording now?. He survived, he took it whatever. He still got hit by someone greater than AM and kept fighting.
Because you argued Nomu is weaker than AM and that's objective proof he isn't.
You literally tried to say my argument was based solely on AP when I never even said it was. Grabbed? When did Woman close her hand around her face? She smacked her into the wall.
Who knows?
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