Mushoku Tensei Discussion Thread

[Zabazab]

I don't want Rudeus to have too many keys, it'd be unnecessarily complex.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

I don't want Rudeus to have too many keys, it'd be unnecessarily complex.

But i think is the best to specify the character, a least must be one for each "saga". There are a lot of characters with much more keys.

 

[Digital_Franz]

Xd I was expecting you to answer something to reply but yes. It's a shame that many people think that accepting polygamy = bad writing. It is obvious that they do not pay attention to the story or the characters.

This is the community's problem. Once they hate a work, that's it.

Leaving Silphy aside. Did you do any of the small calculations for speed, etc?

Hmm. I haven't started doing the calcs yet. Otherwise except for Paul's feat, there is no more speed feat.

In the next update of the scale I will modify a little how I put it since right now there are many characters and I would like to visualize their AP level and for this I would like support for the calculations. Since right now there is really only the Cumunulimbus one.

Oh OK.

 

[Digital_Franz]

I don't want Rudeus to have too many keys, it'd be unnecessarily complex.

I think that:
Rudeus (Volume 1-2)->Saint-tier
Rudeus (Volume 3-6)->King-tier

And like that it just adds one key. Does it bother you that much?

 

[Zabazab]

I think that:
Rudeus (Volume 1-2)->Saint-tier
Rudeus (Volume 3-6)->King-tier

And like that it just adds one key. Does it bother you that much?

5 Keys is still a bit much, but I can't beat the majority opinion.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

I think that:
Rudeus (Volume 1-2)->Saint-tier
Rudeus (Volume 3-6)->King-tier

And like that it just adds one key. Does it bother you that much?

Why volume 3 is king tier?

 

[Narutouchiha95]

5 Keys is still a bit much, but I can't beat the majority opinion.

I think that:
Rudeus (Volume 1-2)->Saint-tier
Rudeus (Volume 3-6)->King-tier

And like that it just adds one key. Does it bother you that much?

In fact, if we get "technical" the profiles should be quite laborious since in the case of magicians it would be necessary to specify how much AP the characters have according to the level of the spell they use

 

[Zabazab]

In fact, if we get "technical" the profiles should be quite laborious since in the case of magicians it would be necessary to specify how much AP the characters have according to the level of the spell they use

This thankfully won't be the case for Silent-Casters.

 

[Digital_Franz]

5 Keys is still a bit much, but I can't beat the majority opinion.

I myself find that it's quite a lot especially since he doesn't have many abilities but it would serve to separate his physical characteristics.

 

[Digital_Franz]

This thankfully won't be the case for Silent-Casters.

What about Roxy who can shorten her incantations?

 

[Narutouchiha95]

What about Roxy who can shorten her incantations?

This thankfully won't be the case for Silent-Casters.

We can put something like "Wall with his weakest spells to Island with his strongest" for the magicians in general if we don´t want to specify that much

 

[Digital_Franz]

We can put something like "Wall with his weakest spells to Island with his strongest" for the magicians in general if we don´t want to specify that much

Not bad.

 

[Zabazab]

We can put something like "Wall with his weakest spells to Island with his strongest" for the magicians in general if we don´t want to specify that much

For Mages who cannot silent-cast it'd be something like;

Attack Potency: Street level physically; higher with Beginner magic; Wall level with Intermidiate magic; City-Block level with Advanced magic; Island level with Saint-class magic; far higher with King-class magic; Small Country level with Emperor-class magic; Multi-Continent level with God-class magic

I don't actually know where Advanced and Emperor-class magic scales so that's just a guess.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

For Mages who cannot silent-cast it'd be something like;

Attack Potency: Street level physically; higher with Beginner magic; Wall level with Intermidiate magic; City-Block level with Advanced magic; Island level with Saint-class magic; far higher with King-class magic; Small Country level with Emperor-class magic; Multi-Continent level with God-class magic

I don't actually know where Advanced and Emperor-class magic scales so that's just a guess.

I thought you didn't want the profiles to be too complicated xd

 

[Zabazab]

I thought you didn't want the profiles to be too complicated xd

There are very few mages with so many classes, especially among non-chantless mages.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

There are very few mages with so many classes, especially among non-chantless mages.

Really there are a lot, basic all the students of the university have advance magic xd

 

[Zabazab]

Really there are a lot, basic all the students of the university have advance magic xd

Then that's only 3 magic AP values.

 

[Digital_Franz]

For Mages who cannot silent-cast it'd be something like;

Attack Potency: Street level physically; higher with Beginner magic; Wall level with Intermidiate magic; City-Block level with Advanced magic; Island level with Saint-class magic; far higher with King-class magic; Small Country level with Emperor-class magic; Multi-Continent level with God-class magic

I don't actually know where Advanced and Emperor-class magic scales so that's just a guess.

With what I plan to do, Intermediate could be Building level, Advanced could be Town level if Shiraito's calculation is accepted, King could be Small Country level and Emperor could be Country level for a little more consistency between levels.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

Here are some feats and info from volume 10 of Mushoku Tensei:

Chapter 3:

.- The mannequin of the mansion unable to pierce Zanoba's skin with its broken arm

Chapter 5:

.- Rudeus's new tunic resistant to acid and poison

Chapter 6:

.- Zanoba gets good grades at the academy in earth magic

Chapter 7:

.- Luke is intermediate in sword and beginner in water style
.- Luke´s sword is enchanted and can easily cut steel
.- Luke's boots are like Siphy's and increase speed
.- Luke's cloak withstands the heat
.- Luke's gloves increase his strength
.- Luke's uniform is sword proof
.- Luke is as fast as Linia but he is considered slow for Rudeus
.- Eris was superior to Soldat and Soldat is superior to Luke. All this speaking in terms of speed
.- Rudeus easily disarms Luke and defeats him
.- Rudeus does not need the demonic eye to defeat Luke

Chapter 8:

.- Silphiette learns to do magic distortion

Chapter 9:

.- Zanoba able to resist the magic of a first year student until he ran out of mana

.- Siphiette statistics:

Fire: Intermediate
Water, Earth, Wind, Healing, Detox: Advanced

.- The previous elements are considered the six fundamental ones and all 3rd year students know how to do them all at least a beginner level

.- Rudeus once again emphasizes that he stands out compared to the rest for his mana capacity, comparing himself to being a car that never consumes its gasoline.

Parallel story:

.- Eris slower than Ghislaine
.- Ruijerd faster than Ghislaine
.- Gal Farion faster than Ruijerd
.- Orsted faster than Gal Farion
.- Eris uses the sword of Light against Auber and he deflects her attack

To calculate the distance I think it is best to use the image from the novel itself.

.- Auber is a north emperor
.- Ghislaine unable to react to Gal Farion's movements
.- Gal Farion the fastest man in the world
.- Orsted can use all three sword styles
.- Eris reached the level of north saint in 1 year

 

[Digital_Franz]

.- Rudeus's new tunic resistant to acid and poison

New Resistances.

.- Rudeus easily disarms Luke and defeats him
.- Rudeus does not need the demonic eye to defeat Luke

Pride damage.

.- Gal Farion faster than Ruijerd

Wow

.- Eris uses the sword of Light against Auber and he deflects her attack

To calculate the distance I think it is best to use the image from the novel itself.

Idk.

.- Auber is a north emperor

So Ruijerd = Emperor.

.- Ghislaine unable to react to Gal Farion's movements

Hum.

 

[SatellaTheWoE]

conflicted between giving Emperor continental or Country level?

 

[Digital_Franz]

conflicted between giving Emperor continental or Country level?

Not really.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

New Resistances.

Yeah. It's a shame though, I was hoping for some mention of it being sword proof or super tough or something.

Pride damage.

The best thing is how boosted Luke was with his team, which puts him above a normal intermediate since he is already intermediate. As for the boots, I don't know why but I remember that it was said somewhere that they tripled the user's speed. Does something like that sound familiar to you?

Wow

I don't know why it surprises you xd

.- Ghislaine unable to react to Gal Farion's movements

I already said when Gal Farion blitzed Eris Greyrat that neither kings nor emperors could see him when he was serious

 

[Digital_Franz]

Yeah. It's a shame though, I was hoping for some mention of it being sword proof or super tough or something.

Really.

The best thing is how boosted Luke was with his team, which puts him above a normal intermediate since he is already intermediate. As for the boots, I don't know why but I remember that it was said somewhere that they tripled the user's speed. Does something like that sound familiar to you?

I'll look. Maybe in the anime.

I already said when Gal Farion blitzed Eris Greyrat that neither kings nor emperors could see him when he was serious

That was perception. Now it's reactions.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

That was perception. Now it's reactions.

To give you more context is when Ghislaine complains that Gal Farion is not training Eris greyrat correctly so she rebukes him to which Gal Farion takes out the sword and puts it to her neck. Ghislaine comments that she could see her draw the sword but could not react to his attack.

 

[Digital_Franz]

To give you more context is when Ghislaine complains that Gal Farion is not training Eris greyrat correctly so she rebukes him to which Gal Farion takes out the sword and puts it to her neck. Ghislaine comments that she could see her draw the sword but could not react to his attack.

Yes. Reactions.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

Well people, I proceed to update the scale with the data from volume 10. I think that for this volume there is nothing really to calculate so I save myself from searching and passing things from the anime/manga.

TIER LIST

Orsted = Dragon God
Technique God
Fighting God
Laplace = Demon God
Death God
Gald Farion = Sword God
Kalman II = North God

God Level

Rudeus Teenager Aqua Hartia Water (x5) > 2,3 TER TNT

Imperial Level = Rudeus Teenager Aqua Hartia Earth & Wind (x3) = Ruijerd = Auber > 1,38 TER TNT

Rudeus Teenager Aqua Hartia Fire (x2) > 920 GIG TNT

King Level = Rudeus Teenager Magic = Badigadi = Almanfi = Ghislaine = Roxy Staff Water King (x2) > 460 GIG TNT

Roxy King > 230 GIG TNT
Roxy Staff Fire King (x0,5) > 115 GIG TNT
Rudeus Aqua Hartia Water (x5) > 115 GIG TNT
Rudeus Aqua Hartia Earth & Wind (x3) > 69 GIG TNT
Fitts Magic (>1/7 Rudeus Teenager Magic) > 65 GIG TNT
Rudeus Aqua Hartia Fire (x2) > 46 GIG TNT
Rudeus Magic
Jinas Halfas Magic = Nina

Saint = Gino = Roxy Staff Water (x2) = Gallus Cleaner = Klein Dinoltas = 23 GIG TNT
The calc for the 23 GIG TNT: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Kepekley23/Mushoku_Tensei:_Rudeus_makes_a_storm

Eris LN6 = ~20 GIG TNT -> Close to Saint
Roxy Magic = 11,5 GIG TNT
Roxy Staff Fire (x0,5) = 5,75 GIG TNT
Class A Monster
Cliff Magic
Paul
7º Year Student Magic

Gyes >= Advanced Level = Eris = Soldat = Silphiette Magic = Strong Bandit = Linia Magic = Pursena Magic = Leno Magic = 5º Year Student Magic

Class B Monster
Class C Monster
Class D Monster
Luke = Linia = Pursena
3º Year Student Magic
Pope´s Assassin

Intermediate Level = Timothy Magic = Roxy Child Magic = Ginger = Therese = Rudeus Teenager = Rudeus LN6 = Regular Swordsman

Rudeus -> Close to Intermediate
Eris Magic

Beginner Level = Elinalise Magic = Ghislaine Magic = Patrice Mag

Nokopara
Geese = Mimir = Timothy
Zenith = Lilia = Jinas Halfas
Pax > Fitts = Nanahoshi
Roxy
Class E Monster
Cliff
Kishirika
Ashia = Norn
Silphiette
Roxy Child

No Level

The changes:

.- The scale system is changed to a vertical one and the energy calculations of the characters are indicated along with the calculation of the feat by which they start.
.- Luke is solidified as superior to the average intermediate
.- Linia and Pursena comparable to Luke. They are really only compared in speed but there is nothing better to scale them with so I put them there for now
.- Auber joins as emperor
.- Knowing the author's information, Ruijerd is placed at the level of Auber
.- Incorpore Fitts magic as stronger than 1/7 Rudeus Teenager Magic, making her Saint Tier

Previous Doubts:

.- I don't know where the following characters will be: Bloody Kant, Blaze, Dale, Leno and Gadalf Rangid, Elanaise, Talhand, Zanoba, Shierria, Vierra and Class S- Monster, Sara, Suzanne, Patrice, Ogre God.

Any suggestions to change or disagrees/agrees? am i missing some character?

 

[Zabazab]

Roxy King > 230 GIG TNT
Roxy Staff Fire King (x0,5) > 115 GIG TNT
Rudeus Aqua Hartia Water (x5) > 115 GIG TNT

I think that it should instead be Roxy King > 115 GT of TNT, & Roxy King w/Staff Fire > 57.5 GT of TNT

Incorpore Fitts magic as stronger than 1/7 Rudeus Teenager Magic, making her Saint Tier

Fits with author statements, too.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

I think that it should instead be Roxy King > 115 GT of TNT, & Roxy King w/Staff Fire > 57.5 GT of TNT

We are starting from the following premise:

Roxy Staff Water King (x2) > Roxy King > Roxy Staff Fire King (x0,5) > Rudeus Aqua Hartia Water (x5) > Rudeus Aqua Hartia Earth & Wind (x3) > Rudeus Aqua Hartia Fire (x2) > Rudeus Magic

If no, we are saying that Rudeus in one point is King probably

 

[Digital_Franz]

We are starting from the following premise:

Roxy Staff Water King (x2) > Roxy King > Roxy Staff Fire King (x0,5) > Rudeus Aqua Hartia Water (x5) > Rudeus Aqua Hartia Earth & Wind (x3) > Rudeus Aqua Hartia Fire (x2) > Rudeus Magic

If no, we are saying that Rudeus in one point is King probably

I see the reasoning. It's true that Roxy King could be superior to Rudeus with Aqua Heartia (Volume 1-2).

 

[Digital_Franz]

Well people, I proceed to update the scale with the data from volume 10. I think that for this volume there is nothing really to calculate so I save myself from searching and passing things from the anime/manga.

TIER LIST

Orsted = Dragon God
Technique God
Fighting God
Laplace = Demon God
Death God
Gald Farion = Sword God
Kalman II = North God

God Level

Rudeus Teenager Aqua Hartia Water (x5) > 2,3 TER TNT

Imperial Level = Rudeus Teenager Aqua Hartia Earth & Wind (x3) = Ruijerd = Auber > 1,38 TER TNT

Rudeus Teenager Aqua Hartia Fire (x2) > 920 GIG TNT

King Level = Rudeus Teenager Magic = Badigadi = Almanfi = Ghislaine = Roxy Staff Water King (x2) > 460 GIG TNT

Roxy King > 230 GIG TNT
Roxy Staff Fire King (x0,5) > 115 GIG TNT
Rudeus Aqua Hartia Water (x5) > 115 GIG TNT
Rudeus Aqua Hartia Earth & Wind (x3) > 69 GIG TNT
Fitts Magic (>1/7 Rudeus Teenager Magic) > 65 GIG TNT
Rudeus Aqua Hartia Fire (x2) > 46 GIG TNT
Rudeus Magic
Jinas Halfas Magic = Nina

Saint = Gino = Roxy Staff Water (x2) = Gallus Cleaner = Klein Dinoltas = 23 GIG TNT
The calc for the 23 GIG TNT: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Kepekley23/Mushoku_Tensei:_Rudeus_makes_a_storm

Eris LN6 = ~20 GIG TNT -> Close to Saint
Roxy Magic = 11,5 GIG TNT
Roxy Staff Fire (x0,5) = 5,75 GIG TNT
Class A Monster
Cliff Magic
Paul
7º Year Student Magic

Gyes >= Advanced Level = Eris = Soldat = Silphiette Magic = Strong Bandit = Linia Magic = Pursena Magic = Leno Magic = 5º Year Student Magic

Class B Monster
Class C Monster
Class D Monster
Luke = Linia = Pursena
3º Year Student Magic
Pope´s Assassin

Intermediate Level = Timothy Magic = Roxy Child Magic = Ginger = Therese = Rudeus Teenager = Rudeus LN6 = Regular Swordsman

Rudeus -> Close to Intermediate
Eris Magic

Beginner Level = Elinalise Magic = Ghislaine Magic = Patrice Mag

Nokopara
Geese = Mimir = Timothy
Zenith = Lilia = Jinas Halfas
Pax > Fitts = Nanahoshi
Roxy
Class E Monster
Cliff
Kishirika
Ashia = Norn
Silphiette
Roxy Child

No Level

The changes:

.- The scale system is changed to a vertical one and the energy calculations of the characters are indicated along with the calculation of the feat by which they start.
.- Luke is solidified as superior to the average intermediate
.- Linia and Pursena comparable to Luke. They are really only compared in speed but there is nothing better to scale them with so I put them there for now
.- Auber joins as emperor
.- Knowing the author's information, Ruijerd is placed at the level of Auber
.- Incorpore Fitts magic as stronger than 1/7 Rudeus Teenager Magic, making her Saint Tier

As a temporary scale it's not bad.

Previous Doubts:

.- I don't know where the following characters will be: Bloody Kant, Blaze, Dale, Leno and Gadalf Rangid, Elanaise, Talhand, Zanoba, Shierria, Vierra and Class S- Monster, Sara, Suzanne, Patrice, Ogre God.

Class S Monsters should be equal to Saint Level.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

As a temporary scale it's not bad.

Class S Monsters should be equal to Saint Level.

Why?

 

[Digital_Franz]

Why?

I believe Red Wyverns should be at this level.

 

[Narutouchiha95]

I believe Red Wyverns should be at this level.

But there is no further evidence xd

We only know that the S-class in groups of hundreds would defeat the low tier god of exhaustion, that Rudeus defeated one and that 5 advanced swordsmen (counting young Ghislaine) defeated one although 2 of the swordsmen died.

 

[Digital_Franz]

But there is no further evidence xd

We only know that the S-class in groups of hundreds would defeat the low tier god of exhaustion, that Rudeus defeated one and that 5 advanced swordsmen (counting young Ghislaine) defeated one although 2 of the swordsmen died.

Whoever was killed, we also don't know what his condition was. Those who are alone always seem to be dying.

 

[Betatester0]

Vol 7, chapter 3:
"As they began to piece themselves together, further down the corridor a partially translucent... something appeared, slowly moving towards us. It was a slender humanoid figure, but it had neither a head nor legs. Dressed in an old, worn robe, it floated weightlessly towards us, as if floating through the air. I was not an expert, but it had to be some kind of ghost."
"Skeletons were immortal creatures. You could smash them into pieces and set them on fire, and they would still attack you while they were burning. You could incinerate them, and they would still put themselves back together. Blunt force trauma was the easiest way to render them unable to move." but this was only a temporary measure. While they were immobilized, it was necessary to destroy the Ghost, which revived them. The magic of fire could burn the Ghost, but this gave little, except a little time. Like the skeletons he controlled, he eventually returned.

Divine magic was by far the most effective answer to the Ghosts. She could erase their ghostly forms much faster and more thoroughly than any fire spell, and the Ghost thus defeated would disappear forever. In addition, skeletons struck by divine spells turned into particles of light and disappeared forever. But as long as the Phantom itself remained intact, it could summon an infinite number of new ones."

Is this enough to give Orsted type 7 immortality negation?

 

[Digital_Franz]

@Zabazab regarding the impasse we had regarding the Durability of Demonic Dragon God Laplace I think I have something:

Dragon Battle Aura Explosion​

During the battle against Necrolia Nacrolia, Laplace concentrated his remaining strength in desperation, which caused his Dragon Battle Aura to swell below his heart and to explode like a suicide bomb, with enough force to destroy an entire mountain and was felt even in Kayos. However, he admitted that he did not know how to activate this ability.

The Dragon World is much bigger than the Human World.

 

[Digital_Franz]

Vol 7, chapter 3:
"As they began to piece themselves together, further down the corridor a partially translucent... something appeared, slowly moving towards us. It was a slender humanoid figure, but it had neither a head nor legs. Dressed in an old, worn robe, it floated weightlessly towards us, as if floating through the air. I was not an expert, but it had to be some kind of ghost."
"Skeletons were immortal creatures. You could smash them into pieces and set them on fire, and they would still attack you while they were burning. You could incinerate them, and they would still put themselves back together. Blunt force trauma was the easiest way to render them unable to move." but this was only a temporary measure. While they were immobilized, it was necessary to destroy the Ghost, which revived them. The magic of fire could burn the Ghost, but this gave little, except a little time. Like the skeletons he controlled, he eventually returned.

Divine magic was by far the most effective answer to the Ghosts. She could erase their ghostly forms much faster and more thoroughly than any fire spell, and the Ghost thus defeated would disappear forever. In addition, skeletons struck by divine spells turned into particles of light and disappeared forever. But as long as the Phantom itself remained intact, it could summon an infinite number of new ones."

Is this enough to give Orsted type 7 immortality negation?

To Divine magic users perhaps.

 

[Zabazab]

@Zabazab regarding the impasse we had regarding the Durability of Demonic Dragon God Laplace I think I have something:

The Dragon World is much bigger than the Human World.

I believe the calc for the destruction of the mountain uses Everest, yes?

 

[Digital_Franz]

I believe the calc for the destruction of the mountain uses Everest, yes?

Yes but if we already assume that the Human World is bigger than our World and the Dragon World is even bigger on an absurd scale then we can't take a mountain here as a standard for that. Anyway, what I meant was that what he launched against Badigadi should be this technique since he should have had time to master it. It is a technique gathering all his strength and exploding like a suicide bomb.