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Miraculous Ladybug General Discussion 2
- Thread starter Gilad_Hyperstar
- Start date
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That’s Stormy Weather's volcano.
Anyways, current profiles are outdated also as of site requirements, so yeah, format needs to be reworked. Certain retroactive and overlook abilities and explanations need to be added, and formats needs to be made less cluttered or Marinette, Adrien, Gabriel, Alya, Chloé and so on will become utterly unreadable. Let alone the hassle that it’s Ladybug/Monarch's abilities post-Miracle Box.
Speaking of Monarch, anyways, who is he supposed to be indexed? Debut is easy, but Perfect Alliance!Monarch rotates with up to six different powers (not including the butterfly).
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Monarch actually do have some miraculous powers he used more than other. Speficially he used the Rooster-Mouse-Bee combo several times (creating several invisible copies of himself each armed with venom)
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Yeah, but Monarch picks them over what he needs at the moment. The Mouse-Rooster-Bee Trilogy was, for an instance, completely disregarded for his plans on Intuition (Until Chat Noir became annoying enough for him to use the Bee Miraculous to jab his neck). This goes without mentioning the irony of the power of Tiger being one of the most distributed by him, but one that he never used himself other than to transfer it.
The only one he always uses is the Horse for evident reasons.
The only one he always uses is the Horse for evident reasons.
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Also still not for himself but to send the megakumas
Gilad_Hyperstar
He/Him- 11,438
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Gabriel can't use all kwamis at once though. If he uses more than 6 or so he actually gets weaker from overusage and it could even kill him
This is why he only uses a few of them at a time
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Even without the Rabbit he can still use the Snake Miraculous to win fights.
Also we all know for a fact the Rabbit Miraculous was lost because it would he too overpowered to have.
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The thing with Gabriel was kinda deliberate during the final day. You get to wonder why he just didn’t Miraculized himself unless you assume being Miraculized makes you incredibly stupid ("We are looking for Kagami and Adrien and we have this power to pick whatever ability we want… let’s all fly!" Idiots)
Anyways, they put Monarch on a collar by not letting him access the Kwami's remotely, which makes no sense since they both transfer and receive back the powers remotely. Gabriel switching powers remotely would make sense for an upgrade to the traditional Miraculous and wouldn’t be much of a trouble since the heroes only engage him directly twice in the season (the first time is already stupid as it was, and the second would honestly feel more tense as it’s not like Monarch has more usable powers than Bugnoire - Monarch can’t even use his own original power in this context)
The whole thing with Snake Miraculous was explained in Intuition (Gave it anyways to Miraculized, and the idiots didn’t even use it anyways for all we know). They also low-key confirmed Adrien’s stamina feat in Desperada, but that’s appreciated, so I won’t complain.
Anyways, they put Monarch on a collar by not letting him access the Kwami's remotely, which makes no sense since they both transfer and receive back the powers remotely. Gabriel switching powers remotely would make sense for an upgrade to the traditional Miraculous and wouldn’t be much of a trouble since the heroes only engage him directly twice in the season (the first time is already stupid as it was, and the second would honestly feel more tense as it’s not like Monarch has more usable powers than Bugnoire - Monarch can’t even use his own original power in this context)
The whole thing with Snake Miraculous was explained in Intuition (Gave it anyways to Miraculized, and the idiots didn’t even use it anyways for all we know). They also low-key confirmed Adrien’s stamina feat in Desperada, but that’s appreciated, so I won’t complain.
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Gabriel tried to use the Snake Miraculous, but it doesn't guarantee victory. In Desperada Aspik tried to use the second chance over 25,000 times and failed every time, and Intuition shows it too since he didn't account for the AI realizing Gabriel lied and deakumatizing itself
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Miraculous London is out.
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Bunnyx is now Inmeasurable because she pulled Marinette out of the way of the blast that consumed the timeline/ s
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This can be added to her Jokes Wiki profile
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Ladybug never referred to the Burrow as a connection between multiple universes. The Burrow clearly connects events from the same timeline, not from different universes, and a perfect example of this is the Cat Blanc episode.
Imagine a timeline, a continuous line with past, present, and future. That’s the basic framework. When Adrien discovered that Marinette was Ladybug, it triggered a huge catastrophe that essentially erased the future and rewrote it. This is supported by Bunnyx watching her time windows during the fight between Cat Blanc and Ladybug. One of those screens freezes, as if it’s stuck, waiting for the timeline to resume after the disaster. This proves that it wasn’t a matter of jumping to another reality or parallel universe but rather a disruption within the same flow of time.
The catastrophe occurred when Adrien learned that Marinette was Ladybug. This discovery halted the flow of time, and the timeline took a new direction, leading to the Cat Blanc timeline where Adrien gets akumatized and chaos ensues. In the original timeline, none of this ever happened. When Ladybug used her Miraculous Ladybug power, everything that occurred in the Cat Blanc timeline was completely erased, as if it never existed, and the timeline resumed its natural course. The fact that the Cat Blanc timeline was completely erased, with no lingering effects, confirms that it wasn’t a separate universe but rather a temporary diversion within the same timeline. If it were a multiverse, this alternate timeline would continue to exist as a parallel universe, but this clearly doesn’t happen.
Now, if the Burrow truly connected multiple universes, Bunnyx's screens wouldn’t freeze, because each universe would have its own timeline. But in the Cat Blanc event, multiple screens froze, not just one. This shows that Bunnyx was observing different points of the same timeline, not parallel universes. If each screen represented a separate universe, only one screen would freeze. But that’s not what happened—several screens were affected at once, indicating they were all part of the same timeline. This demonstrates that the timeline itself had been interrupted, and each of these points in time was waiting for the timeline to be fixed, reinforcing the idea that we’re dealing with one timeline, not a multiverse.
Also, it’s well-established in the series that each window in the Burrow leads to a different moment within the same timeline. One window might show the age of the dinosaurs, while another might reveal the future. Bunnyx even warns Ladybug not to look through the windows unless she wants to know what gifts she’ll get for her next birthday, reinforcing the idea that these windows connect to different points in a single continuous timeline. If they connected to separate universes, such a specific warning about future events wouldn’t make sense, because each universe would have its own distinct future, and Ladybug wouldn’t be affected by events in another universe.
Additionally, in one of the specials, Lila discovers Ladybug’s identity and manages to steal her Miraculous to make a wish. When she makes this wish, you can also see in the Burrow that all the windows start disappearing, and the kwami Gimmi only rebuilds one universe when fulfilling a wish. The Burrow was being destroyed because, as Sass explained, when someone makes a wish, the entire reality is erased and rebuilt again. This further proves that everything operates within a single timeline, as the wish doesn't create a new universe, but rather replaces the existing one, showing that there aren’t multiple timelines or universes at play here
I don't know if I managed to make it very clear, especially my explanation about the Cat Blanc episode since I didn't know the right words to use. But if that's the case you can ask me
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Yeah, I know, The Special made it limited to one timeline. That comment was from a while back.
We still know that other timelines exist, though.. thats only from Thomas Astruct's tweet. I'm kind of against 2-A Miraculous. Gabriel might have said there are infinite universes. But Tikki, a far more reliable source said there are billions of universes.
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Hello.
The following page does not seem to have the same number of statistics keys as it has actual statistics sections. That needs to be fixed.
vsbattles.fandom.com
The following page does not seem to have the same number of statistics keys as it has actual statistics sections. That needs to be fixed.
Ladybug
Marinette Dupain-Cheng Marinette Dupain-Cheng is the main protagonist of Miraculous: Tales of Ladybug & Cat Noir. Marinette is a student at Collège Françoise Dupont in Paris, France. She is also a budding fashion designer. With her magical earrings, inhabited by a Kwami named Tikki, she has the...
vsbattles.fandom.com
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Ladybug's profiles will need to get overhauled, we'll be working on it to fix the profileHello.
The following page does not seem to have the same number of statistics keys as it has actual statistics sections. That needs to be fixed.
Ladybug
Marinette Dupain-Cheng Marinette Dupain-Cheng is the main protagonist of Miraculous: Tales of Ladybug & Cat Noir. Marinette is a student at Collège Françoise Dupont in Paris, France. She is also a budding fashion designer. With her magical earrings, inhabited by a Kwami named Tikki, she has the...
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Bit of a random topic, but do we consider fusions to be stronger than those with a single miraculous?
Gilad_Hyperstar
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I'd say probably, but they come with a catch that if someone uses too many miraculouses at once they'll be weakened since they use too much power at once
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Fair enough, but how should we consider the power increase?
- Additively (Power increase 1:1, where the raw power of each miraculous is added to eachother)
- Upscaled (A miraculous fusion is still stronger, but the increase isn't additive so their are just considered to upscale from a normal miraculous wielder's feats)
Gilad_Hyperstar
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The latter. Fusions are shown mostly to not have a too big of an increase in terms of raw power, but rather being more dangerous since they can use more abilities. We see it directly when Ladybug and Rabbit Noir were facing Monarch in Evolution
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Gimmi recreated the universe with Gabriel's wish right? If we are to believe that wishes reset the timeline, then why could Bunnyx go back to before Gabriel made the wish and furthermore see the timeline survive after it but Ilya's wish blacked out the future?
Gilad_Hyperstar
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I think the scope of the destruction depends on the wish. Gabriel's wish was a simple revival so there's no need to change space-time, but Lila/Cerise's wish is so destructive it'll basically end the universe. Lila's wish is a clear Low 2-C feat
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Because the writers are dumb, thats why.
Bunnyx as a character was designed long before the writers even came up with the season 5 finale and they ended up writing themselves into a corner with her time travel gimmick and the whole "the wish remakes reality" thing, so they basically have to write this softcore version where Gabriel wish DID rewrite reality, but it was a "light remake" that somehow didn't change much, wheras Lila's wish straight up destroys reality because I guess she's now the Satan of MLB now I guess.
Sorry for the rant, but my hatred for the S5 finale aside this show has a lot of plot holes in its writing.
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Gimmi is a one time thing that required stealing Ladybug's Miraculouses. He shouldn't get a Gimmi key since it's not his own power.
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HAHAHA no
The akuma's are specifically empowered by their negative emotions of their hosts: the stronger the emotions, the stronger the akuma. Miraculouses can also be empowered if the wielder is akumatized, but the amp that it gives isn't necassarily a power increase: it more or less enhances what powers it already has.
On the topic of Chat Blanc, aside from the fact that he was a miraculous wielder prior to the akumatization, Chat Blanc having multiversal power is only really exclusive to him and not any other akuma, nor does any miraculous hero scale to his power (aside from maybe Chat Noir's Cataclysm because thats the main power that was modified, and it would only be a downscale). If we allowed miraculous characters to scale to him in any capacity, we would be looking at both Low-2C heroes and akumas, which would be a massive outlier for the feats already shown in the series.
Profiles are outdated atm, they are being worked on.
I personally wouldn't say so as he only managed to get the wish at the very end of the series and its a one time thing like Sir_Ovens said, but even if it was accepted we are currently still updating profiles.
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Can we at least let Gabriel scale to the base cat noir cataclysm? (due to him tanking cat noir's cataclysm and Plagg's self-destructing cataclysm )
It's weird to see him still at town level vs Dwarf star level Ladybug and Cat Noir, despite Monarch on death's door fought evenly with bug noir
It's weird to see him still at town level vs Dwarf star level Ladybug and Cat Noir, despite Monarch on death's door fought evenly with bug noir
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First of all, neither heroes are physically Dwarf Star level, both them and Hawkmoth are still town level. Ladybug and Chat Noir's higher ratings come from their superpowers.
Second of all, neither power really has a numerical AP due to the way that the abilites work, as their power mainly relies on the fact that they are both hax based abilities. The Miraculous Ladybug works by restoring things to the way things were before an akuma attack, which can range from repairing structures, reviving people, moving planets back in orbit or fixing split timelines. Cataclsym works by either destroying a target by corroding it to dust or damaging it to the point it can no longer function properly. The AP levels given to their abilites vary based on what they used it on, and their high end feats are usually just used to showcase the absolute limit of said power rather than being an AP value in itself (example: Ladybug's superpower is Low-2C, meaning it can repair damage up to that of a single universe, but not any higher than that)
On the topic of Cataclysm being used on Gabriel, the whole scaling bit goes out the window with how Cataclysm doesn't have an AP. Second of all, Gabriel wouldn't scale to it regardless due to the fact that it still affected him, it just took more time to do so due to the fact he was transformed.
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On a different topic however, I firmly believe that if we are to update all the profiles we have for Miraculous Ladybug, we should do the following.
- Remove the seperate keys we have for Ladybug and Chat Noir depending on the season. It's too messy and nothing really suggest that either hero has gotten stronger as the seasons gone by, only that they understand their powers better. It also doesn't help that other auxillary heroes like Viperion, Vesperia, and any other mentioned hero show themselves to be immediately capable and comparable to the main two heroes even if its their first time transforming.
- Create a simple page to showcase general abilties all heroes hold that aren't exclusive to any miraculous.
- Limit all Miraculous fusion profiles to a single page in which all possible miraculouses powers that have been shown to use are listed (outside of the normal/main miraculous they use):
- Because of the way the fusion power works, it would be fair to allow hypothetical mergings of miraculouses as it wouldn't break any rules of the show (IE, it would be possible to have Ladybug fuse with both the Horse and Bee Miraculous as it is a possible combination, despite it not being seen in canon). On that same note, having a single list to show all the miraculouses they have used while fusing are fine as well.
- Of course, this wouldn't apply to special miraculous transformations like Lady Noire and Misterbug, as both are transformations of circumstance and their powers aren't normally something they can access.
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Agree to some extent, for example Ladybug became able to create amulets at one point which is not something she knew she could before but the real problem cames from the last season where Ladybug and Cat Noir "grow up" becoming able to use their powers with "no limitations" this one is not something they could do before.
Miraculous holder physiology? That's cool but there isn't much to add there because most abilities are miraculous exclusive, they would get superhuman physic some illusion manipulation because of their mask and not much other than that is it really worth making a page for it? It would be much better to just add it to the kwami physiology page as "powers on a host" or something like that.
You could just do something like "At least x up to y level by fusing miraculous" the fusions basically only apply to Marinetta and Hawkmoth.
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Anyone I know?
Gilad_Hyperstar
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I pretty much agree to all of these
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It is to be a surprise.
Gilad_Hyperstar
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Bunnyx will need 3 keys following Miraculous London, since she has both her present, adult and elderly selves all at once
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We have basically nothing from those other versions of her, her adult self actually shown up longer and yet she has nothing that normal Alix doesn't already have
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Disagree on that statement.
Aside from the Elderly version having no feats to speak of (though she does look dapper as ****), the young and adult version of Alix have pretty much no distinction from eachother in terms of stats, aside from maybe experience with their power and as a hero. I would perhpas be fine to perhaps include seperate keys for Alix and Future!Alix at base without their miraculous, but aside maybe from that it would be over saturation to include profiles, otherwise we would have too many redundant keys from Alix. Don't forget that we also have to include Akuma forms on their profile as well.
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