[MCU] upgrade tier and scaling feats for doctor strange and scarlet witch and america chavez

[Yokoahh5743]

How does she scale to this she is purely hax based

Also Wanda can’t have that durability only attack power as she died to a temple falling on her so she’s a glass canon

So you should edit it to say only attack power

How is her ability hax-based because she quite literally punches through the fabric of space-time when she releases her multiversal energy and her punches create that same exact shape of her portals that literally puncture those barriers

 

[darkphantom9805]

How is her ability hax-based because she quite literally punches through the fabric of space-time when she releases her multiversal energy and her punches create that same exact shape of her portals that literally puncture those barriers

Because it’s the ability to open portals through the multiverse not ap it is why Wanda wanted to steal it so she could travel the multiverse

Her portals aren’t even the same color as incursionss her is blue incursions barriers are purple ish

 

[Yokoahh5743]

Also Wanda can’t have that durability only attack power as she died to a temple falling on her so she’s a glass canon

The temple that fell on her was due to her willingness to sacrifice herself to destroy the darkhold in every universe. As she once said

 

[Yokoahh5743]

Because it’s the ability to open portals through the multiverse not ap it is why Wanda wanted to steal it so she could travel the multiverse

You haven't even read America Chavez's scan yet

 

[Yokoahh5743]

Because it’s the ability to open portals through the multiverse not ap it is why Wanda wanted to steal it so she could travel the multiverse

Her portals aren’t even the same color as incursionss her is blue incursions barriers are purple ish

Her ability to open portals is also channeled through her energy powered punches which you can see her punches releasing that star shaped burst that opens into a multiversal portal or hole in space-time

And hax based where she blew clouds away from the mountain with her punch opening a portal

And the portals being the same color as incursion doesnt matter because the point is that she’s displaying the power to punch through the fabric of space-time, not the power to create an incursion which creating an incursion doesnt require the power dar benn used only creating that hole

 

[Yokoahh5743]

Also Wanda can’t have that durability only attack power as she died to a temple falling on her so she’s a glass canon

She has mountain level striking strength and durability by breaking through wong’s tao mandalas, and tanking america’s punches that can disperse clouds and snow off of mountains, that does not sound like glass canon at all

Yeah she died to the darkhold castle but you can make the argument that she didn’t just get crushed immediately and she rather just died from suffocating under all the pile of rubble and also it didnt even show her getting crushed, only the castle falling over her and covering anything before we can assume she got crushed into bits by the rocks

Also her being durable wouldnt make anything weird either considering shes amped by the Darkhold and we see Sinister Strange whos also amped by the same book being able to tank attacks from Doctor Strange, and that the Darkhold is an amplification totem

 

[darkphantom9805]

The temple that fell on her was due to her willingness to sacrifice herself to destroy the darkhold in every universe. As she once said

She can’t lower her own durability nor did she do that she accepted death yes but her durability is the same meaning it caps out at that tier

And the portals being the same color as incursion doesnt matter because the point is that she’s displaying the power to punch through the fabric of space-time, not the power to create an incursion which creating an incursion doesnt require the power dar benn used only creating that hole

It does because the low 4c stuff is specifically about incursions or causing holes not opening a portal and Wanda tanking a low 4c punching doesn’t make sense with how low her durability is

She has mountain level striking strength and durability by breaking through wong’s tao mandalas, and tanking america’s punches that can disperse clouds and snow off of mountains, that does not sound like glass canon at all

Yeah she died to the darkhold castle but you can make the argument that she didn’t just get crushed immediately and she rather just died from suffocating under all the pile of rubble and also it didnt even show her getting crushed, only the castle falling over her and covering anything before we can assume she got crushed into bits by the rocks

it’s glass canon to her tier yes if your durability is leagues under striking that glass canon

Suffocating is head canon and can’t be proven does she even need oxygen in the first place?

 

[Yokoahh5743]

She can’t lower her own durability nor did she do that she accepted death yes but her durability is the same meaning it caps out at that tier


It does because the low 4c stuff is specifically about incursions or causing holes not opening a portal and Wanda tanking a low 4c punching doesn’t make sense with how low her durability is


it’s glass canon to her tier yes if your durability is leagues under striking that glass canon

Suffocating is head canon and can’t be proven does she even need oxygen in the first place?

No, the Low 4C stuff is about Dar-Benn and Carol and Kamala producing the energy to blow a hole into space-time and stopping that hole, the incursion is caused by that hole spreading which Monica use the power to close the hole itself, it is not about causing in cursion it is about the hole being the cause of the incursion itself and not directly from the power source

And America Chavez powers is literally blowing holes into the fabric of space-time and realities as described in the scans

And Also it didnt show her getting crushed only with the rubble falling over her and blocking the entire scene before we see what happened to her and right after the rubble falls on her she releases a magic blast after that same exact scene, the only thing we see is just the castle falling, and if she got crushed immediately where did the chaos magic blast come from

Her durability upscales from no selling America Chavez’s punches in the first place so I dont know what you mean it wouldnt make sense if she upscales from America Chavez

And also shes amped by the Darkhold so it would make it less weird if she could punch through wong tao mandala and take punches from chavez but it would be more weird if her past selves like her Endgame would do the same because she has only building level durability and she doesnt have the advantages of the Darkhold

 

[Yokoahh5743]

So yes we can say she died because she sacrificed herself and we see the castle falling on top of her but how exactly did she die as a result of the castle? Her getting crushed? Suffocation? Her obliterating herself with that chaos magic blast that happened after she destroyed the castle? We only see her dropping the rocks right after it skips to the darkhold castle falling

 

[Lloydblitzed]

Because it’s the ability to open portals through the multiverse not ap it is why Wanda wanted to steal it so she could travel the multiverse

meh, her portals affecting those planes would still scale to her AP via Environnemental Destruction

 

[Yokoahh5743]

If America Chavez scaling to Strange would be an issue She could just have Low 4-C with Portal Creation if the stat shaped energy she releases would just be applied to her fracturing holes in fabric of space-time rather than her normal striking strength and Wanda durability wouldnt be upgraded

Either way if she does scale to Strange and Monica it could also provide more justifications for Wanda if she were to upscale from them both since Wanda beat Strange and was on the verge of overpowering Chavez before Chavez sent her to her children

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Unfortunately I have to disagree with Strange and America scaling. We can't equate one portal shenanigan to another like this without proper statements. Specially when the circumstances are so different: Strange's based on a spell that traveled through "dark borders between known and unknown reality" according to Wong; The Marvels stuff tied directly to their powers; and America having some unique multiversal power of her own.

With Bambu also rejecting this and Qawsedf not seeming to vote, I'd feel this is safe to be closed at this point.

 

[FentyBeauty]

well honestlyy

like if strange were to scale to monica sealing that incursion, which she like needed the power to do what dar-benn did, then it wouldn’t make sense if strange, wong, and ppl at kamar taj would be impressed by chavez being able to open multiversal portals if they would be powerful enough to tear holes in space-time

also that could make wanda’s situation a lil weird- bc if wanda would scale to dar-benn opening a hole to another reality n monica closing it n strange, M.O.M wouldn’t even make sense if wanda got that amount of power yet she needed america’s powers in order to do so or like the power to puncture holes in general if we assume every situation like that requires the same thing that dar-benn did- and in that same scan it also says that reaching realities is far beyond her abilities too so…

and ig america scaling wouldn’t make sense either relating to wanda being above dar-benn and not being able to reach other universes on her own since wanda like stopped her punch with her magic so it would make better sense of america’s powers being unique?? idk if im making a point here

 

[Yoazkk6188]

Dr Strange should have a tier on Monica's level that can close the space-time portal, clearly requiring the same level of energy as opening it. It is an incursion that sucks reality from another universe. Come crash into another universe which happened to dr strange and he closed it as script
scarlet witch can scaling above dr strange

Monica:"She tore a hole in space time"...."Can we fix that"..."in theory you and carol can produce the same amount of energy that was used to open it, ill absorb it, and release it but from inside the tear"

This is such confirmation

captain marvel talk to monica
"wait you want us to blast you with the same amount of power that punch a hole in the fabric of space time"... "if we want to unpunch it.. yeah"

and this

Even though the reasons for invading are different, the results are the same

America Chavez should also scale to Dar-Benn with both Quantum bands who tore a hole in space-time because she is also able to open holes in the fabric of space-time as well with her multiversal punches

The Art of Multiverse of Madness describes her being able to punch through realities, suggesting that her ability to display such power is related to her punches/physical strength

Her multiversal portals are also described to break apart different planes of reality

And the MCU Timeline book state that she has the power to puncture the barrier between realities which is like Dar-Benn who used the power to punch a hole in the fabric of space-time which hurt Captain Marvel and Captain Marvel had to use all her power and Kamala use all her power from both bands to generate the power to break space-time

People can argue that her not being able to break glass in the Illuminati is an anti-feat, but that cannot apply to her currently because she did not have control over her powers prior to Wanda capturing her and when she got control it was when Strange tell her to trust her power and her self and she became confident

Her creating the portals or holes in space time should be connected to her AP and striking strength because she uses her strength to create those star-shaped holes in space-time, as shown in this scene when she punches Wanda, her energy being released from her fists manifests into star - shaped burst which turns into a multiversal portal and crack in space-time and its also shown when she uses that same energy to break a stone slab in a shape of a star and her punch created a star shaped crack in the illuminati glass cage thats like the shape of all her portals

So since the power to punch a hole into space time required Kamala to use all her power from both quantum bands that was stated could be used to restart Hala star and required Captain Marvel to also use all her power to generate that same power, America Chavez would scale to Dar-Benn and Kamala with the bands, and Captain Marvel (Low 4-c) because she is also able to display the power to punch holes into the fabric of space-time

scarlet witch should have durability physical (low4-c) she was not harmed by the punches by america chavez had punched her many times with her realised powers

I don't know if it will pass or not. As I read it carefully, I thought it was reasonable and I agreed

 

[Yokoahh5743]

bump

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

This whole thing just feels iffy to me, and is based too much on trying to compare separate feats, and equate them. Not only that, but it would really mess up scaling, and as Fenty said, make not much sense story-wise.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

With that, I consider this fully rejected. So closing.