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MCU Phase 5 General Discussion Thread

Kisaragi_Megumi said:
Tfw Namor Kukulkan got overshadowed hard by Fate Kukulkan
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That’s because she’s best girl
 
RoTt35 said:
Thor was weakened during Avengers due to the dark magic Odin used to transport him to Earth
Click to expand...
True, but I'm referring to the fight in Thor (2011), not The Avengers (2012)
OneBleachHurricane said:
Didn't it also clash with Hela when it was used by Thor before she snapped it in half?
Click to expand...
She didn't snap it in half, but yeah. Though it creates a weird scaling chain:

Mjolnir > The Destroyer > Gungnir =< Hela >> Weakened Hela >> Mjolnir

Maybe Thor didn't know what Gungnir was really capable of in 2011? Or Hela has shit durability against piercing damage (even random Asgardian swords pierced her body whereas she stopped Mjolnir completely unharmed)?
 
MARVEL_Future_Fight_Gamer said:
Mjolnir > The Destroyer > Gungnir =< Hela >> Weakened Hela >> Mjolnir
Click to expand...
How big is the 6-B scaling in the MCU currently?

• Crippled Surtur (Could push back Pre-Awakening Thor but got One-Shot in the end)

• Loki w/ Gungnir/Chitauri Scepter (Fought against a held back or weakened Pre-Awakening Thor but gets overpowered when Thor gets pissed)

• Aether Malekith (Could fight against Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Hulk (Could draw blood from Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Abomination (Could fight, draw blood, and overpower Hulk)

• Cull Obsidian (Could knock IW Warmachine down, and hold his own against the Hulkbuster and Mark 55 Armors)

• Fenris (Could draw blood from Hulk)

• Hulk w/ Rage (Could overpower Pre-Awakening Thor, Fenris and the Hulkbuster Armor)

• Vibranium Ultron (Could draw blood from Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Kurse (Could deflect Mjolnir and beat up Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Weakened Hela (Destroyed Mjolnir and can fight Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Recharged Hela (Can beat Pre-Awakening Thor w/Gungnir and was still regarded as stronger than Post-Awakening Thor)

• Thanos (Could beat up Post-Awakening Thor, Mark 55/85 Iron Man, Worthy Cap, and Hulk in IW and Endgame)

• Power Stone Ronin

• Surtur w/ Eternal Flame (One-Shot Recharged Hela then Asgard)

• Prime Hela (Was a threat to Prime Odin where he couldn't kill her and had her be sealed away instead)

• Hulkbuster Armors (Could hold their own against Hulk and Cull Obsidian)

• Warmachine Armors

• Rescue Armor

• Vision (Even with Vibranium Ultron, worthy of wielding Mjolnir during AoU)

• AoU-CW/IW/EG/WV/MoM Wanda (Could overpower Thanos, Vision, and tear open Vibranium Ultron's chest)

• Mark 55/85 Armors (Could hold their own against Thanos for a while)

• Worthy Cap (Can fight and draw blood from Thanos, and possesses the power of EG Thor)

• Post-Awakening Thor (Can fight and hold his own against Thanos)

• Captain Marvel (Can overpower Thanos)

• EG Gi-Ant-Man (One-Shot Cull Obsidian)

• Prime Odin (Crippled Surtur, banished Hela)

• Old Odin (Regarded by Pre-Awakening Thor as stronger than him)
 
OneBleachHurricane said:
How big is the 6-B scaling in the MCU currently?

• Crippled Surtur (Could push back Pre-Awakening Thor but got One-Shot in the end)

• Loki w/ Gungnir/Chitauri Scepter (Fought against a held back or weakened Pre-Awakening Thor but gets overpowered when Thor gets pissed)

• Aether Malekith (Could fight against Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Hulk (Could draw blood from Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Abomination (Could fight, draw blood, and overpower Hulk)

• Cull Obsidian (Could knock IW Warmachine down, and hold his own against the Hulkbuster and Mark 55 Armors)

• Fenris (Could draw blood from Hulk)

• Hulk w/ Rage (Could overpower Pre-Awakening Thor, Fenris and the Hulkbuster Armor)

• Vibranium Ultron (Could draw blood from Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Kurse (Could deflect Mjolnir and beat up Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Weakened Hela (Destroyed Mjolnir and can fight Pre-Awakening Thor)

• Recharged Hela (Can beat Pre-Awakening Thor w/Gungnir and was still regarded as stronger than Post-Awakening Thor)

• Thanos (Could beat up Post-Awakening Thor, Mark 55/85 Iron Man, Worthy Cap, and Hulk in IW and Endgame)

• Power Stone Ronin

• Surtur w/ Eternal Flame (One-Shot Recharged Hela then Asgard)

• Prime Hela (Was a threat to Prime Odin where he couldn't kill her and had her be sealed away instead)

• Hulkbuster Armors (Could hold their own against Hulk and Cull Obsidian)

• Warmachine Armors

• Rescue Armor

• Vision (Even with Vibranium Ultron, worthy of wielding Mjolnir during AoU)

• AoU-CW/IW/EG/WV/MoM Wanda (Could overpower Thanos, Vision, and tear open Vibranium Ultron's chest)

• Mark 55/85 Armors (Could hold their own against Thanos for a while)

• Worthy Cap (Can fight and draw blood from Thanos, and possesses the power of EG Thor)

• Post-Awakening Thor (Can fight and hold his own against Thanos)

• Captain Marvel (Can overpower Thanos)

• EG Gi-Ant-Man (One-Shot Cull Obsidian)

• Prime Odin (Crippled Surtur, banished Hela)

• Old Odin (Regarded by Pre-Awakening Thor as stronger than him)
Click to expand...
This but ordered differently ofc
 
Carrying over some Wakanda Files stuff that got buried in the previous thread, plus a few extra things:

Black Panther's updated nanite suit would prevent a repeat of Black Widow's electrical weapons stunning him in his previous suit. (presumably this would be a resistance to electricity and presumably paralysis inducement)

Information on Black Widow's arsenal (The shock batons can deliver up to 300,000 volts at 4.5 milliamps of current)

Can't find any actual scans for it, but apparently, Black Widow's Bite emits 40,000 to 50,000 volts on its lowest setting, (which is what was used on Black Panther) which could cause "weakened or sore muscles, cramping, epidermal burns, temporary nerve damage, and temporary lapses in consciousness" on an unprotected person. On it's highest setting, it gives off 250,000 to 300,000 volts to pass through an enemy, capable of inflicting "permanent nerve damage, third-degree subdermal burns, loss of vision, even death."

The book features a report from Coulson regarding the events of the Item 47 one-shot, which specifically takes place after the Avengers movie, which would indicate that Coulson being alive post-Avengers is being treated as canon by the book.

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All Hammer Drones are powered by Arc Reactor technology

All Hammer Drone types except Air Force are stated to have Chobham armor strong enough to withstand a barrage of BGM-71 missiles, with the Marines variety having the armor double plated

Air Force Drones are focused on aerodynamics and speed, and have flight speeds of over Mach 1 when safeties are engaged (presumably they were not engaged when pursuing Iron Man)

Marine Drones are focused on brute strength, and are armed with grenade launchers, automatic rifles and anti-tank weapons

Navy Drones are equipped with shoulder mounted Stinger Missile torpedo cannons similar to those used on battleships

Army Drones are armed with assault rifles and infantry-specific weapons for ground forces, with the feet being able to set up reinforcement tripods to fire anti-aircraft flak

Also, the details given of the Hammer Drone's arsenal as given by the Guidebook to the Marvel Cinematic Universe - Iron Man 2:
  • Army Drones
    • M32 M6l Multi-Grenade Launcher
  • Navy
    • FIM-92 Stinger Missiles
    • Fixed-point coil lasers
  • Air Force
    • Thermal vision vortex ring guns
  • Marine Corps
    • High-definition cameras
Plus stuff from the Iron Man Manual:
Screenshot_20220815-064547_Chrome.jpg

Screenshot_20220815-133028_Chrome.jpg

Bonus: Between the first two Iron Man movies, Iron Man Mk. IV helped land an airliner, and Sound Manipulation and Underwater Breathing were present as early as that armor:
IMG_0201.png
 
Phase 4 has been a mixed bag for me to

Wandavision: Pretty good and funny, good concept for three episodes, Agatha was a good villain, Wanda and Vision were extremely well-developped and the fact that Wanda is NOT forgiven for brainwashing an entire town is extremely good but like Lacku said, the mystery didn't last long enough and it gets a bit predictable, plus the secondary plot was uninteresting af. 7/10

Falcon & WS: Better than what I expected, Isaiah was excellent, Zemo is awesome, John Walker is GREAT (and I DESPISE the maount of hate he recieve and all the people who see him as a fachist), and we get a good political subtext but at the same time, the jokes are often in the miss category of hit-and-miss, action sequences aren't that good, the whole Sharon plot is meh, the villains are pathetic and I hated how they try to humanize Karli and present her as tragic while she totally deserved to get killed considering she was a text-book terrorist. 5/10

Loki: My only real disappointments are that we don't get that much Magic stuff and I wish this was a series about Loki still being a kind-of-evil jerk who would use the situation for his own benefit and trying to gain power for himself and was disappointed they made him a good guy. Other thant that, the show is very good, great intro for Kang/He Who Remains, pretty funny action sequences, Sylvie is pretty good to, the subtext about free will and fate is always interesting for me, Mobius was really good to, Croco Loki (simple as that), overall it's the best part of the phase with Eternals for me. 8/10

Black Widow: Absolute shit from the beginning to the end. The only good points are BW herself and her sister. And no, David Harbour isn't one of them for me cause his character is annoying af. Also Taskmaster is getting pissed on. Maybe about 1/4 work though. But that's it. 2/10.

What if?: Hits and misses. The concept is very cool and we have cool ideas (evil Hank Pym is spectaculary effective) and funny moments but not all episodes are great. The Infinity Ultron episodes are amazing though and the Supreme Strange episode is magnificently tragic and well-done. Also, Uncle Ben is finally mentionned. 7/10.

Shang-Chi: Pretty good, good characters, Wenwu/The Mandarin is excellent, some funny moments and I like how the characters speak Chinese plenty of times. The movie is overall pretty standard though, especially in fighting scenes, except the final duel, and I will always regret the Ten Rings aren't nearly as versatile as they are in the comics. 6,5/10

Eternals: I said it before, I keep going here, I don't understand what's to heavily dislike about this cause the film is amazing in nearly everything. My only great complains are that the Devianst aren't really developped, Gilgamesh is really meh between not being serious enough and far too weak for my taste (not helped I was discovering Fate at the times so the comparison with an absurdly more powerful and cool GIlgamesh was inevitable), Kingu wasn't really exploited either and not all actors were great. Aside from that, the movie is excellent. Stellar visuals and CGI, Druig, Ikaris, Sersi and Makkari are all amazing af and the others (except Gilgamesh and Ajak) are very good as well, the Sprite dilmena about her appearence is very good and tragic, the music is amazing, the whole conflict about the birth of Tiamut and its consequences is excellent and above all, the Celestials are PERFECT. Granted, I'm probably biased cause I always love works with a mythological aspect and I prefer serious movies but still, it's the best of the phase (and among the best in the whole the MCU). 8,5/10.

NWH: Let's be honest, it's mostly fan service, some jokes are not funny, Jameson, Lizard and Sandman are wasted and I still can't get over how Peter screwed Strange (I HATE the "we will humiliate a previously established skilled and charismatic character to make our younger hero look amazing" trope) but other than that, the movie is really great. Particulary with Electro and, above all, the Goblin. And the fantasy we all hoped for did happen. Also, Andrew Garfield is the best Spider-Man. No debate possible. 7,5/10

Moon Knight: A bit too humorous for my taste, some action sequences are bland and the actors aren't exactly that great either. But the main character is good, the costume is good, some action scenes are great, we got spectacular displays of power, we get to explore Egyptian Mythology in an interesting manner, Ammit is pretty good and, most importantly, Khonshu owns the show. Pretty standard but closer to good than bland. 6,5/10.

Multiverse of Madness: Same problem than Iron Man 3. On one hand, teh actors are all great, Strange is well-developped, Wanda is excellent in it (yes, I love her as a villain), we finally get some real gore in the MCU, the movie is pretty scary more than once, it does have good and imaginative environments when it tries (Sinister Strange's sanctum almost felt like I was in Elden Ring) and the music duel was a ton of fun. On the other hand, the cameos are for the most part wasted except Patrick Stewart, Strange is way too weak in this movie compared to what he does in the previous ones, we only visit what, two, maybe three universes (and really only one new), Sinister Strange is likely wasted (the concept of a Variant who hunst down other versions of himself across universes is absolutely amazing but since he only appears at the end, he has 1/5 of the movie to shine), the film lacks grandiose scenes IW and NWH had with Strange, it missed the opportunity to introduce absurdly OP entities like Cthon and ultimately simply doesn't have the absolute craziness it should have had (more heroes, more crazy cameos, several unique universes, a big duel between Wanda and Strange, etc). Overall a good, solid flick but it should have been much more. 6,5/10.

Ms Marvel: It simply wasn't for me. I can't help it, I know this is the basis of the thing but the whole funny lovey-teen spirit movie ambiance isn't just for me. I watched like one episode, then red about it and that's it. It does have good things, like Khamala and her actress, learning about some shady parts of history and about muslim culture. But I just can't help it, I don't like this kind of stuff. So no grade here.

Love & Thunder: Meh. It's Ragnarok but without most of the qualities. There ARE some good jokes, some good actors, some good images, environments, a great action sequence (the battle in the Shadow Realm) and a good theme about gods, mythologies and how deities can have a negative and positive effect on humanity. But the rest of the movie is the textbook case of a MCU movie cliché: too much jokes, dumb characters who take dumb decisions, wasted potential for the sake of being funny, Thor is once again monstruously stupid, Jane is wasted af, Zeus is half-good (notably for being closer to his mythological self), half-pathetic, etc. And like I said, Gorr shouldn't be in this movie. Yes, he's by FAR the best part of the movie, with a genuinely tragic story, creepy moments, impressive feats and a great actor. But he doesn't fit at all in a movie where jokes are more important than the plot and are beyond stupid. 5/10.

She-Hulk: The good: Jennifer's actress and K.E.V.I.N. Also Wong appears. The bad: Literally. Everything. Else. Getting my ass obliterated by Malenia, Mohg, Rykard and the Elden Beast was a less painful experience than this...this. 2/10.

Wakanda Forever: Much better than the first movie, which for me isn't really that difficult (yeah, I'm not a fan of the first movie). Much better action sequences, better character development, Namor is THE best part of the movie and an excellent antagonist, I just love that they keep him as a kind of villainous character and don't give him a redemption arc at the end, he remains ruthless to the end. The environments are also very good and Talokan is pretty impressive and I loved their attack on Wakanda. Riri Williams however is pretty annoying, the subplot sith Freeman is meh, the final battle (excpet the duel with Shuri) is uninteresting and standard af. Also, Okoye's armor looks like shit. 6,5/10.

Didn't watch the rest and I'm not exactly interested in doing it (maybe Werewolf by Night).
 
altough the only thing i would like to say is that in NWH Strange wasn't excatly going for the kill, so in a way he did hold back, and Spider-Man actually had to use a very creative way to defeat him, using math noneless

like, its not like in Naruto or in Jojo where the new MC outstand the previous one because of plot, here Spider-Man had to use all of his everything to defeat someone as powerful as Strange

in my opinion
 
In fact, why are we even scaling Spider-Man to Rel+ when Strange was clearly holding back with him?
 
Popted2 said:
altough the only thing i would like to say is that in NWH Strange wasn't excatly going for the kill, so in a way he did hold back, and Spider-Man actually had to use a very creative way to defeat him, using math noneless
Click to expand...
Its pretty much an impressive intelligence feat since given the abilities used, most people would've lost, but yeah, Strange didn't wanna kill the guy
 
Lacku said:
Even though he was holding back he was still trying to incapacitate him so the speed scaling should be fine
Click to expand...
But even then, this isn't always how powerscaling works. It's like me trying to get DCEU Bats to scale to Relativistic cause Supes was holding back
 
Propellus said:
But even then, this isn't always how powerscaling works. It's like me trying to get DCEU Bats to scale to Relativistic cause Supes was holding back
Click to expand...
Yeah that’s fair enough, what other justifications does spidey have for relativistic?
 
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