Masadaverse AP Clarification.

[Blackcurrant91]

Even if one of his Jaws is equal to 100 nights worth of Darkness. Isn't that 50 times planet level?

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Not interested in talking about this as I have work to do, but it seems that nobody bothered to point out that the "at least Planet level, likely far higher" was something put as a super lowball at the time as it could have been much higher than Reinhard's DI key...which is now 3-A but before that was 4-A via scaling off of Amakasu's God summons.

Seeing as Reinhard's DI key is now 3-A, however, perhaps now it doesn't have to be seen as such.

But that's for you all to decide if Methuselah should go higher or not beyond Planet level. Although really that's more of Durability case and if it stays as it is, it probably should be Small Planet level+ rather than Planet. Never really understood why it was 5-B if half of planet means it's less than baseline 5-B but whatever.

 

[TISSG7Redgrave]

found the calc rep did and quote from him:

A single night = either wipe out continents or planets.

Methuselah has decillions of nights at his disposal due to the passage of time and Mercurius' time loops.

Baseline nergy to wipe out half the planet: 10^30 Joules of Energy. Mercurius counted at least several tredecillion before stopping from boredom.

1 Tredecillion = 10^33.

10^30*10^33 = 10^68 = Galaxy level.

But, the universe has reset so many times that even Mercurius hasn't recalled how many years have passed. So multiply that number exponentially.

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1277175#16

 

[Blackcurrant91]

So it's implied Methusala can remove his 'restraint's' and use all of his nights at once? surely he should be 'At least 3-C' then?

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

Where does the bit about meth embodying all the nights of the entire multiverse even come from?

 

[Warren_Valion]

Where does the bit about meth embodying all the nights of the entire multiverse even come from?

If I remember right, its notion came about after I asked ALRF some questions about Meth, here. And he responded saying that Meth is the darkness of all creation.

For its actual appearance in the story, I can't tell you because I don't really remember it.

If there is proof it is real, it probably wasn't written super bluntly like, "I am darkness in the entire multiverse!", but more nunanced like, "I am the shade of the Mercury's creation." or something like that.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

I don't remember seeing it in my run with the story so I can't really call on this.

Although if that's truly the case, wouldn't that make Methuselah like High 3-A or a really high 3-A?

 

[VoidGoji]

I think its more because Methuselah is the "dark" side of Merc, which would make him be present in all of Merc's law.

 

[Lenus010]

No. Methuselah is a Byproduct of Mercurius's law, he acts independently as his own entity, he hasn't been shown to have a connection to it, so i dunno where all of this is coming from.

 

[Lenus010]

Where does the bit about meth embodying all the nights of the entire multiverse even come from?

If I remember right, its notion came about after I asked ALRF some questions about Meth, here. And he responded saying that Meth is the darkness of all creation.
For its actual appearance in the story, I can't tell you because I don't really remember it.

If there is proof it is real, it probably wasn't written super bluntly like, "I am darkness in the entire multiverse!", but more nunanced like, "I am the shade of the Mercury's creation." or something like that.

That was never stated nor even implied, Methuselah and Mercurius had their own segment where it was revealed that Methuselah is a creation of Mercurius's Law, but never once was it stated that he was on that magnitude in his influence.

 

[Warren_Valion]

I kind of remmeber Meth being the "Dark Side of Mercury" or somehting like that as SchroKatze stated.

 

[Lenus010]

At least for the darkness spheres he stuck Machina in, I think he separated them from himself so he wouldn't be destroyed by Machina destroying them. If he kept doing that I assume he could run out of nights eventually.
Dunno if he separates the nights from himself normally or if they do get used up. I'll check the scans against next time I get a chance.

And we can use the infinite night if you want high 3-A meth...

Methuselah's nights are seperated from himself, it was stated that if Machina hit methuselah himself all the nights would've dispersed, if they were truly connected to Methuselah directly machina would have been able to hit one of Methuselah's nights that were entrapping him and Meth would've be erased.

 

[Lenus010]

And not only that, but putting Meth at anything beyond planet sounds super shaky, compared to his consistent showings he should stay at planet likely higher, albeit the explanation should be better.

 

[Lenus010]

I kind of remmeber Meth being the "Dark Side of Mercury" or somehting like that as SchroKatze stated.

when was this stated? I've gone over Methuselah and Merc's one to one conversations three times by now (which is where id presume such a statement would exist) and haven't come across it. I'll go through it again once i get home but this doesn't seem to fit their relationship, so im not too sure about that.

 

[Warren_Valion]

And not only that, but putting Meth at anything beyond planet sounds super shaky, compared to his consistent showings he should stay at planet likely higher, albeit the explanation should be better.

Meth's nights are consistently planet level or beyond.

Doing the math puts even his weakest attacks of a hundred nights at like really high 5-B to 5-A.

The stronger attacks are easily 5-A to High 5-A.

 

[Lenus010]

I was referring to destruction it has been stated to be able to cause, not anything additional that can be stacked, which is also why i said likely higher would still be good.

 

[VoidGoji]

What I mean is that Methu basically embodies the "dark part" of Merc's law o such an extent that he himself isn't "reseted" like the rest of Creation. He is a byproduct, as well as an entire part of it, the whole "Yin" of "Yin-Yang". He will die if the Law ceases to exist, or if the entire Yin is destroyed (When Reinhard destroyed him its even noted that he was washing away the mystery and Merc's law alike, bringing an entire "new world" there.)

 

[EvilMegaCookie]

Just putting this out there but Meth is the embodiment of the darkness on Earth. Not the entire universe or multiverse. That'd just be ridiculous. I mean. His durability pretty much says that in that one night is equal to half the planet, referring to how light and dark are two halves of the coin. The coin in this case being Earth and the whole yin and yang duality thing going on as well.

 

[TonySansNom]

Just putting this out there but Meth is the embodiment of the darkness on Earth. Not the entire universe or multiverse. That'd just be ridiculous. I mean. His durability pretty much says that in that one night is equal to half the planet, referring to how light and dark are two halves of the coin. The coin in this case being Earth and the whole yin and yang duality thing going on as well.

He's talking about the Earth because it would have an effect on Earth, that of which the LDO should care about. He didn't say "destroying the concept of darkness and night will wreck the entire universe" because who the **** cares about the universe? They care about the planet they are on right now, not the universe at large. And because the fight is on Earth, then the narrative mentions Earth.

A concept of darkness that embodies only half of Earth? Preposterous.

A concept of water or fire or wind or light that only embodies those on Earth for the other arcanes as well? Preposterous.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

I'd be more inclined to believe EMC here to be honest

 

[SomebodyData]

I've seen fiction that has creatures which embody rumors in a city, I think its not as far-fetched as you think @Tony

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Same on EMC.

 

[EvilMegaCookie]

I mean. You have to take into account that he also became who he is through human worship. And that, y'know, it would be really weird to think that freaking Wilhelm can smash a jaw that would, if we take this to the extreme, has a hundred nights of density. Density in this case being half the damn universe. Meaning he'd be punching apart 50 universes worth of matter or some silly nonsense like that.

Edit: Although to be fair, Methuselah existed well before humanity began worshipping him. He just changed in accordance to that faith and definition.

 

[VoidGoji]

Didn't Meth exist since the big bang?

 

[TISSG7Redgrave]

i thought he did as well

 

[TonySansNom]

Edit: Although to be fair, Methuselah existed well before humanity began worshipping him. He just changed in accordance to that faith and definition.

I didn't account for "human faith" in which case you're probably right.

 

[Paul_Frank]

Meth existed since the beginning and has always embodied darkness

He just changed when humans began viewing darkness as a bad thing

So he embodied all darkness since the big bang over all resets

 

[EvilMegaCookie]

What we do know is that he has been active for at least thirty thousand years.

 

[Lenus010]

he has been noted to exist since the beginning of civilization itself. though as far back is never directly noted or stated to my knowledge, other than being born directly after mercurius's law.