Majin Buu vs Nadakhan (10-2-1) (GRACE)

[Detective_Blizzard]

He didn't talk before instanly attacking Nya

And? That doesn't change the fact that it's not consistent for him to just immediate hit a instant win move.

What does the ability being magic base even affect anything? Mind resistance would at best help him against Dream based tactics, nothing more

Buu specifically has his resistance because of magical mind manip

Regen from what? Getting soul haxed and put into a sleep into Nadakhan's Blade?

Regenerate from the planet blowing up because Buu just teleports out of the way of the sword swing.

Yes, Nadakhan will start processing in a death match for unknown reasons, but Buu won't

It's called basic logic, when a character starts a fight they typically need to think of their plans of attack or what actions they will do. Buu however is a monsterous animalistic intelligence that doesn't have this trait to him.

Double standards

It's not a double standard when one character has a functioning brain and the other one practically doesn't

I said he loves his hax. He simply toyed with Ninjas and thought himself invincible against them, I’m pretty sure that is linked on the profile. In case of such huge range gap he’d rather just insta-wish the guy.

However it's not a huge range gap considering he has means of simply getting there quickly/attacking through various means. Also again, him wishing isn't a consistent win condition and if you want to go with that logic then he decides to wish Buu away which Buu responds with teleporting back and suprise blows up the planet

It says that he “tried to do it”, which implies that he didn’t do it for whatever reason, and we visually see the Earth being fine, so he won’t lead with destruction of the entire planet.

It says he tried to do it because they literally stopped him

 

[Fezzih_007]

How was he able to stop him

Vegeta, a guy who can destroy planets, as able to stop another person of blowing up the planet, by redirecting the attack with his own attack, because he is strong enough to do so.

And all Nadakhan will do is just think of literally any way to deal with Buu and he’s done.

You not giving me much examples with what you suggest so Far.

Also, Attack Reflection should work, check how he redirected Lloyd’s energy blast.

I think thats a different things.

His attack reflection would only work If he can reflect a attack thousands stronger than him, that is also AoE. Which apparently, It can't.

 

[Fezzih_007]

I don’t need to? Attack Reflection is a hax, not AP-based.

It depends on the Type of attack reflection actually.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Nadakhan def can't TP himself and Buu outside the timestream

Buu def can't just blow up the area Nadakhan creates and also outrange it because his teleportation is on par with it + better in range

Why is his feat against Nya keep behind ignored?

Why is all his examples of him not instant winning every fight being ignored?

Why didn't he directly fire at the pillar he was standing in then? Both your scans heavily implies otherwise

Buu is animalistic, trying to understand his thought process is pointless and it doesn't matter since he isn't standing on a arbitrary pillar. He points downwards and fire a ki blast to blow up the planet without warning, that's what the scan heavily implies

Not to count Nakakhan can litterally restrain him and stop him from doing...anything

Wow, great, if only he actually knew what Buu was going to do so he could wish he didn't do it

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Vegeta, a guy who can destroy planets, as able to stop another person of blowing up the planet, by redirecting the attack with his own attack

And y’all say Attack Reflection is not a valid counter lol

You not giving me much examples with what you suggest so Far.

Smth

I think thats a different things.

No? It is hax, not smth AP-based. If it was so, it would be said on the Attack Reflection page.

His attack reflection would only work If he can reflect a attack thousands stronger than him, that is also AoE. Which apparently, It can't.

The whole point of it is redirecting against opponent mate

 

[Lloydblitzed]

And? That doesn't change the fact that it's not consistent for him to just immediate hit a instant win move.

There's no way you said that

Buu specifically has his resistance because of magical mind manip

False equivalency is insane
Magical Mind Control ≠ Sleep inducement

Regenerate from the planet blowing up because Buu just teleports out of the way of the sword swing.

Nothing stops Nadakhan from teleporting himself or both out of the Universe itself, which he used against someone he considered a threat btw

It's called basic logic, when a character starts a fight they typically need to think of their plans of attack or what actions they will do. Buu however is a monsterous animalistic intelligence that doesn't have this trait to him.

That's absolutly not what Nadakhan does?

However it's not a huge range gap considering he has means of simply getting there quickly/attacking through various means. Also again, him wishing isn't a consistent win condition and if you want to go with that logic then he decides to wish Buu away which Buu responds with teleporting back and suprise blows up the planet

Biggest lie of all time

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

It depends on the Type of attack reflection actually.

It just magically redirected Lloyd’s energy blast lol

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Mind Control Resistance = resistance to every existing ability in fiction and beyond trust

Mental inflictions = bypassing mental resistances trust

 

[Fezzih_007]

And y’all say Attack Reflection is not a valid counter lol

No? It is hax, not smth AP-based. If it was so, it would be said on the Attack Reflection page.

The whole point of it is redirecting against opponent mate

Not really:

Attack Reflection is the explicit ability to turn one's opponent's attacks against them. This is a rather powerful ability, being able to perform offense and defense simultaneously by effectively turning one's efforts against them. Some common limitations include only working on attacks of a certain type or power level, a lengthy preparation time, or a specific requirement for use.

For the page of the ability.

It depends on the type. So basically, Nada-chan would need to have feats of reflecting a attack way above his pay grade.

Smth

Wow, i never actually doubt he can insta wish, I saying he won't, due to the profile saying so.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

There's no way you said that

There's no way you keep saying this guy doesn't talk alot and proceed to use a feat with him talking before firing

False equivalency is insane
Magical Mind Control ≠ Sleep inducement

To paraphrase what the other guy said

"If you want to make it to not be general mental resistances, go ahead and make a CRTz"

Nothing stops Nadakhan from teleporting himself or both out of the Universe itself, which he used against someone he considered a threat btw

I have said several times Buu has teleportation on that level and above, Buu has used Kai Kai to teleporte out of Universe 7 which is several times larger

That's absolutly not what Nadakhan does?

Nadakhan doesn't think, good to know

Biggest lie of all time

4 KM to a guy who can travel the distance in a near instant, the biggest lie of all time is acting like that's far for him. Show a scan of him just wishing his opponent's defeat from such a distance.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Wow, i never actually doubt he can insta wish, I saying he won't, due to the profile saying so.

Honestly I appreciate the assist lol, trying to argue against two people at once is annoying and confusing

 

[Fezzih_007]

Honestly I appreciate the assist lol, trying to argue against two people at once is annoying and confusing

Is very annoying to deal It, but I have experience.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Oh yeah

Buu blows up the lego set for my reasons all over the place

 

[Fezzih_007]

Buu Fra yeah.

So I gonna read a fanfic now

 

[Lloydblitzed]

Buu def can't just blow up the area Nadakhan creates and also outrange it because his teleportation is on par with it + better in range

Reflects the attack infinetly

Why is all his examples of him not instant winning every fight being ignored?

Nadakhan instanly going for the win here, here, here, here, here, here

4 KM to a guy who can travel the distance in a near instant, the biggest lie of all time is acting like that's far for him. Show a scan of him just wishing his opponent's defeat from such a distance.

Why was 4 KM even brought in?

Starting distance: The characters start as far away from each other as the highest range of the fighters is, but a maximum of 4 kilometers. For example, if one character has a range of 10 meter and the other has a range of 20 meter they start 20 meter apart. However if the range of one character is 10 meter and the range of the other is 5 kilometer, they start only 4 kilometer apart.
If the character with the higher range is limited to melee combat, having neither ranged attacks nor weapons that expand their reach, then the starting range will be set to their reach plus three steps of the character with the lower step length. This is to ensure that the characters have a minimal ability to make use of positioning.
If extreme advantages are generated via this distance to one side, a balanced alternative should be discussed in the thread.

To paraphrase what the other guy said

"If you want to make it to not be general mental resistances, go ahead and make a CRTz"

Prove Babidi mind hax affects the sleep aspect too

I have said several times Buu has teleportation on that level and above, Buu has used Kai Kai to teleporte out of Universe 7 which is several times larger

The fight being taken out of Earth makes it worse for Buu

Nadakhan doesn't think, good to know

Yes, Nadakhan instead of attack directly, stands still and thinks of a plan My fate hax argument remains

 

[Lloydblitzed]

And y’all say Attack Reflection is not a valid counter

Nadakhan infinetly resets the timeline each time

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Mental inflictions = bypassing mental resistances trust

Sadly, very unfortunately, sleep manipulation is not a subset of Mind Manipulation. Make a site-wide CRT for that.

Not really:

For the page of the ability.

“Common limitations include” does not mean that every single one does. It also says that common limitations is a long time to use, does this mean all of Attack Reflection by default takes a lot of time?

It depends on the type. So basically, Nada-chan

Nada-chan?

would need to have feats of reflecting a attack way above his pay grade.

No? This is like saying a person with Mind Manip won’t be able to mind hax the person with higher AP. It would defeat the very purpose of hax.

Wow, i never actually doubt he can insta wish, I saying he won't, due to the profile saying so.

His profile says that this is the case only against opponents he toys with or thinks are not even worthy to fight.
Also, I already said why would he do that. 4 KM is too much for an energy ball, so he’ll go by simplest and fastest: insta-wish.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Why was 4 KM even brought in?

By SBA 4 KM for the case of opponents having far higher Range. Also it does not really much favor either of them, there is an argument for Nadakhan even if it is not 4 KM (aka Attack Reflection & any offensive hax) and Buu just does the same thing no matter Range, it’s just that 4 KM distance would very likely make Nadakhan use insta-wish

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Reflects the attack infinetly

Reflects the attack that isn't aimed at him?

here, here, here, here, here

Every single one of those he either talks, doesn't attack first, both, and the last one is just him firing energy blasts in general directions hitting nobody but rocks.

Why was 4 KM even brought in?

SBA rules, max range is 4KM

a maximum of 4 kilometers.

While yes, a different range can be made through conversation, you are literally trying to argue Nadakhan instant wins Buu no diff no matter what. So I see no reason to change the distance of the fight especially since changing it wouldn't matter since it either stays on planet and Nadakhan dies or he's not on planet and Buu just thought based teleports to him for a surprise instant explosion

Prove Babidi mind hax affects the sleep aspect too

I mean I could just use the general magic nonsense of DB which includes Sleep Manip that Buu has a general resistance to, but that's not on his profile.

The fight being taken out of Earth makes it worse for Buu

How? The literal example of Nadakhan doing it had the environment come alongside them, in fact that makes it even better for Buu because Nadakhan is wasting his time doing stuff that doesn't help him at all.

Yes, Nadakhan instead of attack directly, stands still and thinks of a plan My fate hax argument remains

Yes, instead of using his brain Nadakhan instinctively attacks blindly without thinking of an ability to use. Your fate hax argument doesn't remain because those wishes requires him to know what the enemy intents to do which he doesnt

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Sadly, very unfortunately, sleep manipulation is not a subset of Mind Manipulation. Make a site-wide CRT for that.

Ok then, explain what it is then. What is Nadakhan attempting to do to cause Buu to sleep? If he's not attempting to effect the mind then what

“Common limitations include” does not mean that every single one does. It also says that common limitations is a long time to use, does this mean all of Attack Reflection by default takes a lot of time?

That doesn't mean he gets a no limits fallacy attack reflection. Buu is immensely stronger than him + his attack reflection is against projectiles and not planetary explosion

No? This is like saying a person with Mind Manip won’t be able to mind hax the person with higher AP. It would defeat the very purpose of hax.

Mind manip is a type of durability neg, attack reflection isn't

Also, I already said why would he do that. 4 KM is too much for an energy ball, so he’ll go by simplest and fastest: insta-wish.

You guys have literally argued earlier his first move would be to teleport, which this is in range for him

 

[Fezzih_007]

Common limitations include” does not mean that every single one does

Yes, but he would need to show him having no such limitations.

Giving a example, a street level character have a attack reflection, and his best feats are reflecting a small building level strikes. So that's the cap. If he tries to block a Tier 1 attack, It won't work, since he need feats for that.

Also, I already said why would he do that. 4 KM is too much for an energy ball, so he’ll go by simplest and fastest: insta-wish.

Not sure why he still would't try other things trought. I mean, you saying he gonna insta wish for Buu to die due to the rang, so I guess you arguing he gonna be lazy, but I don't see why he would't try to teleport to attack closer or anything else really.

The profile says he would try only if he is threatend after all.

 

[Lloydblitzed]

Reflects the attack that isn't aimed at him?

He litterally reflected an attack on Jay, which is not where he was aiming

, doesn't attack first

He was distracted by the Ninjas, he wasn't speaking to her

and the last one is just him firing energy blasts in general directions hitting nobody but rocks.

Him missing shots doesn't mean anything

The profile says he would try only if he is threatend after all.

He only toys with people he has knowledge of

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Not sure why he still would't try other things trought. I mean, you saying he gonna insta wish for Buu to die due to the rang, so I guess you arguing he gonna be lazy, but I don't see why he would't try to teleport to attack closer or anything else really.

The profile says he would try only if he is threatend after all.

Legit, it just sounds like they are trying to argue him as being bloodlusted

every single one of these examples go against what they've been arguing for

here, here, here, here, here

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Ok then, explain what it is then. What is Nadakhan attempting to do to cause Buu to sleep? If he's not attempting to effect the mind then what

I don’t care at all. Make a CRT in staff to make Sleep Manip a subset of Mind Manip and put it as its limitation. Otherwise whatever you say is inavlid.

That doesn't mean he gets a no limits fallacy attack reflection. Buu is immensely stronger than him + his attack reflection is against projectiles and not planetary explosion

By that logic Mind Haxing or EEing a person higher tier than you is NLF. NLF does not even work like that lol.

Mind manip is a type of durability neg, attack reflection isn't

Attack Reflection is hax as well tho. All it does is reflect opponent’s blast towards opponent. It does involve AP in any way.

You guys have literally argued earlier his first move would be to teleport, which this is in range for him

Teleport in case of this attack reaching near him. His first move, given the distance, would be insta-wishing against Buu.

 

[Lloydblitzed]

here, here, here, here, here

He consistanly shows he doesn't need to say "I wish..." to throw a wish

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Yes, but he would need to show him having no such limitations.

No? Hax by default is not bounded by AP lmao, unless the show shows otherwise.

Giving a example, a street level character have a attack reflection, and his best feats are reflecting a small building level strikes. So that's the cap. If he tries to block a Tier 1 attack, It won't work, since he need feats for that.

It would, if he can redirect energy blasts without that Attack Reflection explicitly being shown to be bound by AP, he would redirect them regardless of AP of the blasts (unless HDE/BDE).

Not sure why he still would't try other things trought.

I mean, you saying he gonna insta wish for Buu to die due to the rang, so I guess you arguing he gonna be lazy, but I don't see why he would't try to teleport to attack closer or anything else really.

What’s easier and smarter: think for your opponent to die or teleport and try to hit him with energy balls? Also energy balls cannot be used by him regardless due to Speed Equalization rules and his blasts being higher than his R/C on blitz level lol.

The profile says he would try only if he is threatend after all.

“He would likely use his abilities better if he feels more threatened” is not exactly that

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

He litterally reflected an attack on Jay, which is not where he was aiming

.............. what? He redirected an attact to Jay, that doesn't give him the ability to reflect attacks that aren't going towards him that he doesn't know about

He was distracted by the Ninjas, he wasn't speaking to her

.......... You mean the Ninja's who weren't instantly destroyed and that he was reacting to first?

Him missing shots doesn't mean anything

It shows he isn't using wishes to just instant win fights nor using them to just get rid of obvious cover that he clearly knows about since he's firing at them

He only toys with people he has knowledge of

Toying doesn't matter when he literally has no examples of trying to attempt what you claim, the best you've shown was with sleep manipulation which is only one example against a person he was knowledgeable on. Honestly that feels like the outlier at this rate and I feel like he probably did that for strategic reasons.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

every single one of these examples go against what they've been arguing for

here, here, here, here, here

Tommy Andreasen on Twitter

“@amazinglego123 @sojka_jiri He was very focused on toying with the Ninja… I think he thought himself invincible.”

web.archive.org

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Toying doesn't matter

It does. It means you do not take opponents seriously.

which is only one example against a person he was knowledgeable on.

All of his hax showcases are against people he was knowledgeable on LMFAO

Honestly that feels like the outlier at this rate and I feel like he probably did that for strategic reasons.

Then remove Sleep inducement from the profile

 

[Lloydblitzed]

.......... You mean the Ninja's who weren't instantly destroyed and that he was reacting to first?

What?

It shows he isn't using wishes to just instant win fights nor

Wishing people away isn't trying to instant win?

using them to just get rid of obvious cover that he clearly knows about since he's firing at them

Blowing up the rocks where the Ninjas are hiding isn't getting rid of obvious covers????

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

I don’t care at all. Make a CRT in staff to make Sleep Manip a subset of Mind Manip and put it as its limitation. Otherwise whatever you say is inavlid.

Alright, make a CRT where all of your points are valid because with the profiles are as of now the Djinn doesn't fight with everything he's got at the start of fights and gets obliterated

It would, if he can redirect energy blasts without that Attack Reflection explicitly being shown to be bound by AP, he would redirect them regardless of AP of the blasts (unless HDE/BDE).

Fallacy called, they want their limits back

What’s easier and smarter: think for your opponent to die or teleport and try to hit him with energy balls? Also energy balls cannot be used by him regardless due to Speed Equalization rules and his blasts being higher than his R/C on blitz level lol.

What's more consistent, the Djinn instantly winning a fight by doing something he's not shown to do in character or Majin Buu instantly winning the fight by something he does do in character?

“He would likely use his abilities better if he feels more threatened” is not exactly that

Saying he would likely use his abilities better if he feels more threatened directly means he doesn't use his abilities to the best of his capabilities normally, you guys are trying to argue a bloodlusted version

 

[Lloydblitzed]

Alright, make a CRT where all of your points are valid because with the profiles are as of now the Djinn doesn't fight with everything he's got at the start of fights and gets obliterated

His current profile was accepted in a CRT....

What's more consistent, the Djinn instantly winning a fight by doing something he's not shown to do in character

So Nadakhan wishing someone away is OOC? What are u trying to prove?

or Majin Buu instantly winning the fight by something he does do in character?

He only has 1 example of trying to instanly blow up the planet without yapping

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

He consistanly shows he doesn't need to say "I wish..." to throw a wish

He also consistently shows that despite the lack of needing to say 'I wish' that he likes to yap before throwing an attack out and also doesn't constantly use instant killing/winning moves on opponents.

All of his hax showcases are against people he was knowledgeable on LMFAO

And yet only one of them has been shown to side with your arguments. Saying that doesn't help your point since there's still nothing showcasing it's consistent for him to pull instant wins on a character faster than Buu can point to the ground.

Then remove Sleep inducement from the profile

Oh my goodness I was referring to him sleeping the girl without any warning. Since every other example is just him not using hax like that and it's the only one

 

[Lloydblitzed]

He also consistently shows that despite the lack of needing to say 'I wish' that he likes to yap before throwing an attack out and also doesn't constantly use instant killing/winning moves on opponents.

Explosion Manip is a killing move, which is used without yap against Lloyd

Oh my goodness I was referring to him sleeping the girl without any warning. Since every other example is just him not using hax like that and it's the only one

Majin Buu only has 1 example of trying to blow the planet without altercations, so they are even

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Alright, make a CRT where all of your points are valid because with the profiles are as of now the Djinn doesn't fight with everything he's got at the start of fights and gets obliterated

I already explained this, I’m not going over this again just because you can’t read

Fallacy called, they want their limits back

Same as above

What's more consistent, the Djinn instantly winning a fight by doing something he's not shown to do in character or Majin Buu instantly winning the fight by something he does do in character?

All of his “not in character” are contextualized, get over this

Saying he would likely use his abilities better if he feels more threatened directly means he doesn't use his abilities to the best of his capabilities normally

Okay? Irrelevant

you guys are trying to argue a bloodlusted version

No? Never stated that, stop the strawman. I argued him pulling off insta-wish due to distance and the fact that energy balls would not be allowed for this MU due to them upscaling from Nadakhan on blitz level.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

What?

You are claiming that he instant wins by using various abilities, you showcase examples where he doesn't do exactly that and instead chooses to do a variety of other things that don't involve the things you claim.

Wishing people away isn't trying to instant win?

Not when the enemy fired a nuke at that same moment blowing the Djinn up, or if he somehow got teleported away first Buu is literally capable of teleporting back via Kai Kai having that range

Blowing up the rocks where the Ninjas are hiding isn't getting rid of obvious covers????

You call this here rocks blowing up? They are barley even damaged

His current profile was accepted in a CRT....

And his current profile says he doesn't use his abilities to their fullest capability, so he's doesn't use them like that as seen in the grand majority of clips you shown

So Nadakhan wishing someone away is OOC? What are u trying to prove?

That is literally the most useless ability against Buu due to him having the ability to just go back + again it's seemingly not consistent for him to do so instantly without any form of buildup

He only has 1 example of trying to instanly blow up the planet without yapping

That one example is his literal first moment of being awake

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

I'm just going to sleep at this point, other people can look at this nonsense in the meantime.

but one last thing

Tommy Andreasen on Twitter

“@amazinglego123 @sojka_jiri He was very focused on toying with the Ninja… I think he thought himself invincible.”

web.archive.org

why would he suddenly stop feeling invincible, he was already under the SBA rules going against them since he knew they intended to take him down and him losing meant certain doom. SBA rules doesn't turn a character like Nappa into a serious strategic genius who starts off with the strongest moves in his arsenal and doesn't mess around

night

 

[CBslayeR]

Buu FRA

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Snip

He felt invincible specifically against people he knew lol

genius

It’s a little funny, Nadakhan is rated as EG

Anyways going to sleep too, just agree to disagree

 

[Robo432343]

How does this is even matter? They are literally 4 KM away from each other per SBA, his range won’t be enough. And given this range Nadakhan will 100% just say/think about his wish outright instead of energy balls.

no
SBA would make the distance with whoever has the lower range

we dont do the 4km thing anymore