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Magic the Gathering Revisions
- Thread starter SinsofMan
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You're really accusing a collectable card game of being intentionally overpowered? When it doesen't even have the strongest 2-As on the site (Lady of Pain alone stomped bolas and she's not the strongest 2-A)?
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no im acussing EVERY card game of being intentionally op. lets see: WH40k, D&D, MtG ect. I just dont like intentionally op franchises. But i do not really care THAT much about the card games, they have always been op even if i dont like it. archie comics and digimon is what i dislike the most (they literally have no reason to be op). but still i will not bash on you for your love on those franchises. good luck with the revisions. we should just forget that my message exists.ZacharyGrossman273 said:
Udlmaster
They/Them- 6,879
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>so... let me see. i express my opinion on op franchises and you go on and make fun of me for liking pokemon.
No, not really, like, at all, if I was making fun of you liking Pokemon then I would have gone the 4chan route: "You like Pokemon? Lol, fgt, what are you 6?" but I didn't, what I did do however was make a very obvious correlation between how Arceus is very Haxxed and what you would call "Overpowered", if you need me to spell it out, you're being a hypocrite, you're letting Pokemon get a pass on something you hate just because you like it.
>i did not even say anything to you and you start bashing on me and now i am the one with the attitude?
I didn't realize I needed a library card to comment on something, must have forgotten mine at home.
>no im acussing EVERY card game of being intentionally op. lets see: WH40k, D&D, MtG ect. I just dont like intentionally op franchises.
You mean like how Arceus is OP in the game and the Verse? Like, stomping three of the most powerful beings in the Verse, having the Highest Base stat total in the game for a Creature that doesn't have a Mega-Evolution. What about Arceus having loads of Hax?
Your definition of "OP" just seems like it's anyone who slaps Arceus, you conviently hate 2-A, High 2-As and above, and what tier is Arcues? Oh, right, 2-B.
>But i do not really care THAT much about the card games, they have always been op even if i dont like it.
Okay, how are D&D and MtG OP? MtG's strongest tiers are High 2-A, D&D's highest tiers are 1-A with 1 character. They literally get slapped constantly, even me, Lady of Pain fan-boy even admitted defeat to YHVH vs LoP. Literally, no one on the site is "OP".
How are they OP, it's not like they're Meta-ficition characters like Ajimu Najimi with all abilities and need literally narrative to go against them to lose.
>But i do not really care THAT much about the card games, they have always been op even if i dont like it.
Thanks for pointing out the obvious, Captain Air-Is-Breathable.
>archie comics and digimon is what i dislike the most (they literally have no reason to be op).
Have you even read about the verses you're ******** on? Literally, Digimon has some of the most clear reasonings for being 2-A and above, dude, read a respect thread for the verse before making the Argument from Ignorence.
>but still i will not bash on you for your love on those franchises. good luck with the revisions. we should just forget that my message exists.
Then don't make it.
No, not really, like, at all, if I was making fun of you liking Pokemon then I would have gone the 4chan route: "You like Pokemon? Lol, fgt, what are you 6?" but I didn't, what I did do however was make a very obvious correlation between how Arceus is very Haxxed and what you would call "Overpowered", if you need me to spell it out, you're being a hypocrite, you're letting Pokemon get a pass on something you hate just because you like it.
>i did not even say anything to you and you start bashing on me and now i am the one with the attitude?
I didn't realize I needed a library card to comment on something, must have forgotten mine at home.
>no im acussing EVERY card game of being intentionally op. lets see: WH40k, D&D, MtG ect. I just dont like intentionally op franchises.
You mean like how Arceus is OP in the game and the Verse? Like, stomping three of the most powerful beings in the Verse, having the Highest Base stat total in the game for a Creature that doesn't have a Mega-Evolution. What about Arceus having loads of Hax?
Your definition of "OP" just seems like it's anyone who slaps Arceus, you conviently hate 2-A, High 2-As and above, and what tier is Arcues? Oh, right, 2-B.
>But i do not really care THAT much about the card games, they have always been op even if i dont like it.
Okay, how are D&D and MtG OP? MtG's strongest tiers are High 2-A, D&D's highest tiers are 1-A with 1 character. They literally get slapped constantly, even me, Lady of Pain fan-boy even admitted defeat to YHVH vs LoP. Literally, no one on the site is "OP".
How are they OP, it's not like they're Meta-ficition characters like Ajimu Najimi with all abilities and need literally narrative to go against them to lose.
>But i do not really care THAT much about the card games, they have always been op even if i dont like it.
Thanks for pointing out the obvious, Captain Air-Is-Breathable.
>archie comics and digimon is what i dislike the most (they literally have no reason to be op).
Have you even read about the verses you're ******** on? Literally, Digimon has some of the most clear reasonings for being 2-A and above, dude, read a respect thread for the verse before making the Argument from Ignorence.
>but still i will not bash on you for your love on those franchises. good luck with the revisions. we should just forget that my message exists.
Then don't make it.
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>Warhammer
>Intentionally OP
What? Most of the series takes place in one galaxy. Sure, the chaos gods, emperor, and ynnead are 1-A, but they're more cosmic forces acting than the main characters.
>Intentionally OP
What? Most of the series takes place in one galaxy. Sure, the chaos gods, emperor, and ynnead are 1-A, but they're more cosmic forces acting than the main characters.
Udlmaster
They/Them- 6,879
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I think I've found why he hates specifically WH40K, when no one mentioned it, because look at this Gem I found on Arceus' profile:
"Khorne (Warhammer Fantasy) Khorne's Profile (Note: This was Warhammer Fantasy/Age of Sigmar Khorne)"
D&D and MtG were just situational verses that were thrown in, but no one spoke off WH40K and it's because Arceus lost to Khorne, or at least that's what it seems like.
"Khorne (Warhammer Fantasy) Khorne's Profile (Note: This was Warhammer Fantasy/Age of Sigmar Khorne)"
D&D and MtG were just situational verses that were thrown in, but no one spoke off WH40K and it's because Arceus lost to Khorne, or at least that's what it seems like.
Wokistan
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Warer usually focuses on lower end dudes, though as of late high ends like Ahriman, Primarchs, Kharn, etc have been getting more focus. This is not the purpose of this thread though. If you want to argue about it, do it on my wall in "Mindhax part 2".
Edit: Link to the thread that you guys should use for this
Edit: Link to the thread that you guys should use for this
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i thought you were a person i could calmly reason with but i guess i was wrong. N1 thing i wanted to point out is the fact that you indirectly call me an arceus fanboy. your reason is that arceus is 2-B and i hate anybody who is stronger. well hear me out, Arceus0X is just a nicname i've been using in multiple places. my favorite character are Mewtwo (5-A) Meta knight (4-A) and Godzilla (4-B). as you can see here i am not bashing on characters who are above 4-A and thus some of your arguments are invalid. I also like annoying dog a bit more than Arceus and he is 2-A. here is another thing, you are now making fun of me which idc about that much but then you call another person a fanboy because he said sth about another franchise that is almost unrelated to our argument, i did not want to drag anybody else into this.Udlmaster said:
reasonings for 2-A and above are a diffeent thing. you think that im talking sbout feats but im actully talking about the fact that digimon could have the same tiers as Pokemon or Mario or any normal franchise and it would be even better, however instead every hairball with a gun in the franchise is 2-A and it would be far better if it was 8-A or any other tier.
lets just look at the most famous anime series usual tiers.
Naruto: 5-B
Bleach: 5-C
DBZ/DBS: 5-A to 2-C (the strongest one out of these)
One piece: 6-C
Toriko: 4-C
HxH: 7-C
MHA: 8-B/A
ect.
all these franchises are incredibly popular and they have reasonable tiers. the other franchises i mentioned are mostly 2-A which kinda makes the power levels boring. it is interesting to put ichigo against naruto because they cncentrate on reasonable ammount of power and abilities while putting one of those 2-A anime girls against someone is boring becasue they are just stupidly op. i am not calling the character stupid btw.
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Just for example, Hitchhiker's guide has a 1-B character but literally no one else is tier 1.
Udlmaster
They/Them- 6,879
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Okay, firstly, don't just press quote and then write something below it, remove the words in the quote first.
>i thought you were a person i could calmly reason with but i guess i was wrong.
An attempt to discredit your detractors isn't a very good way to start an argument, calling someone unreasonable, but going on to be a hipocrite just makes yourself look even worse.
>N1 thing i wanted to point out is the fact that you indirectly call me an arceus fanboy. your reason is that arceus is 2-B and i hate anybody who is stronger.
No, I'm calling you salty at best and a Hipocrite at worse.
>well hear me out, Arceus0X is just a nicname i've been using in multiple places. my favorite character are Mewtwo (5-A) Meta knight (4-A) and Godzilla (4-B). as you can see here i am not bashing on characters who are above 4-A and thus some of your arguments are invalid.
"I like other things, so your argument is invalid" Dude, literally saying "Well, I like other characters, therefore I cannot be salty about a loss from my favourite verse." isn't an argument. And in fact doesn't invalidate my argument, it just shows you didn't understand it.
> I also like annoying dog a bit more than Arceus and he is 2-A.
HEY! It's not your job to prove you're a hipocrite, it's mine.
>here is another thing, you are now making fun of me which idc about that much but then you call another person a fanboy because he said sth about another franchise that is almost unrelated to our argument, i did not want to drag anybody else into this.
Yes, you clearly don't care about it, that's why the raised it again. Also, what? I didn't call anyone a fan-boy, I literally called myself a Fan-boy of the Lady of Pain, can you even read?!
"even me, Lady of Pain fan-boy even admitted defeat to YHVH vs LoP. Literally, no one on the site is "OP"."
>reasonings for 2-A and above are a diffeent thing. you think that im talking sbout feats but im actully talking about the fact that digimon could have the same tiers as Pokemon or Mario or any normal franchise and it would be even better
Why? You never explain why it's better, so, what's your point? Literally dude, you're just hating on something because you want a verse to either be weaker then the Verses you already cited or you want "Hur hur X vs Naruto, because Fights against Haxless beings is TOTALLY fun"
>Naruto: 5-B
Bleach: 5-C
DBZ/DBS: 5-A to 2-C (the strongest one out of these)
One piece: 6-C
Toriko: 4-C
HxH: 7-C
MHA: 8-B/A
So, you bring out a bunch of Shonen Anime, you know, the series that has the most bland, basic 2-D characters and Villians across fiction, with the Main Protag having nothing interesting besides a template found on Deviantart:
The "Mur edgy guy with a Sword." - Bleach, Guts, Beserk, Dragon Ball, etc.
Or the "Happy-Go-Lucky protag" - One Piece, Dragon Ball, Bobobo etc.
Or maybe it will be the rare: "Underdog who gains tranformations"- Oh wait it's not rare at all, in fact EVERY SHOW DOES IT.
Dude, why are you bringing up some of the most Plain and boring shows in fiction? All they do is slash, punch and bite. You cannot get more boring! The Villains are more interesting then the main cast!
>all these franchises are incredibly popular and they have reasonable tiers.
Argument from Popularity. And, what? How are you even defining reasonable? If you want to use the "Muh reason" then no, they're not, a Human destroying a Moon, a Guy with a Sword destroying a Moon? Creating Pocket Realities? A guy moving faster than light and punching a Universe apart? None of these follows Reason or logic, so by your own wording, these examples are "unreasonable".
But I think Digimon is VERY Reasonable;
Because Reasonable means: "having sound judgement; fair and sensible." And it does have reasoning and has been judged soundly.
>the other franchises i mentioned are mostly 2-A which kinda makes the power levels boring.
Why? Because they can't fight the crappy Shonen characters? Dude, the characters you've brought up are so unbelievably boring. And you do know strong 2-As are there because AP right? It's down to Hax, If I got the LoP to have a 5-C form, 2-C form and so on, then she's stomp literally all the verses you just cited because they are bland and have no resistances to decent hax.
>it is interesting to put ichigo against naruto because they cncentrate on reasonable ammount of power and abilities while putting one of those 2-A anime girls against someone is boring becasue they are just stupidly op.
Uh, no, it's not, like at all, I literally don't care for watching "Muh sword" and "muh Ninja" dick measuring contests. Both guys you cited are literally "Muh slash" and "Muh punch" when boiled down to their base parts. They're simply not interesting, I literally get bored reading their profile, heaven forbid their anime, and I love reading through the Profiles on this site.
And why is it boring? Because it would require intellectual thought to not go "Well, X punches harder then Y, so he wins", you have to go through multiple hax and feats in the 2-A ranges, because it's down to pure skill and who goes first, yes, they end soon, but it's all the more reason to see them meet a match, I don't care for a 200 comment thread about a Dick measuring contest between these characters who I could summerize in a sentence.
>i am not calling the character stupid btw.
No, you're just making yourself look stupid.
>i thought you were a person i could calmly reason with but i guess i was wrong.
An attempt to discredit your detractors isn't a very good way to start an argument, calling someone unreasonable, but going on to be a hipocrite just makes yourself look even worse.
>N1 thing i wanted to point out is the fact that you indirectly call me an arceus fanboy. your reason is that arceus is 2-B and i hate anybody who is stronger.
No, I'm calling you salty at best and a Hipocrite at worse.
>well hear me out, Arceus0X is just a nicname i've been using in multiple places. my favorite character are Mewtwo (5-A) Meta knight (4-A) and Godzilla (4-B). as you can see here i am not bashing on characters who are above 4-A and thus some of your arguments are invalid.
"I like other things, so your argument is invalid" Dude, literally saying "Well, I like other characters, therefore I cannot be salty about a loss from my favourite verse." isn't an argument. And in fact doesn't invalidate my argument, it just shows you didn't understand it.
> I also like annoying dog a bit more than Arceus and he is 2-A.
HEY! It's not your job to prove you're a hipocrite, it's mine.
>here is another thing, you are now making fun of me which idc about that much but then you call another person a fanboy because he said sth about another franchise that is almost unrelated to our argument, i did not want to drag anybody else into this.
Yes, you clearly don't care about it, that's why the raised it again. Also, what? I didn't call anyone a fan-boy, I literally called myself a Fan-boy of the Lady of Pain, can you even read?!
"even me, Lady of Pain fan-boy even admitted defeat to YHVH vs LoP. Literally, no one on the site is "OP"."
>reasonings for 2-A and above are a diffeent thing. you think that im talking sbout feats but im actully talking about the fact that digimon could have the same tiers as Pokemon or Mario or any normal franchise and it would be even better
Why? You never explain why it's better, so, what's your point? Literally dude, you're just hating on something because you want a verse to either be weaker then the Verses you already cited or you want "Hur hur X vs Naruto, because Fights against Haxless beings is TOTALLY fun"
>Naruto: 5-B
Bleach: 5-C
DBZ/DBS: 5-A to 2-C (the strongest one out of these)
One piece: 6-C
Toriko: 4-C
HxH: 7-C
MHA: 8-B/A
So, you bring out a bunch of Shonen Anime, you know, the series that has the most bland, basic 2-D characters and Villians across fiction, with the Main Protag having nothing interesting besides a template found on Deviantart:
The "Mur edgy guy with a Sword." - Bleach, Guts, Beserk, Dragon Ball, etc.
Or the "Happy-Go-Lucky protag" - One Piece, Dragon Ball, Bobobo etc.
Or maybe it will be the rare: "Underdog who gains tranformations"- Oh wait it's not rare at all, in fact EVERY SHOW DOES IT.
Dude, why are you bringing up some of the most Plain and boring shows in fiction? All they do is slash, punch and bite. You cannot get more boring! The Villains are more interesting then the main cast!
>all these franchises are incredibly popular and they have reasonable tiers.
Argument from Popularity. And, what? How are you even defining reasonable? If you want to use the "Muh reason" then no, they're not, a Human destroying a Moon, a Guy with a Sword destroying a Moon? Creating Pocket Realities? A guy moving faster than light and punching a Universe apart? None of these follows Reason or logic, so by your own wording, these examples are "unreasonable".
But I think Digimon is VERY Reasonable;
Because Reasonable means: "having sound judgement; fair and sensible." And it does have reasoning and has been judged soundly.
>the other franchises i mentioned are mostly 2-A which kinda makes the power levels boring.
Why? Because they can't fight the crappy Shonen characters? Dude, the characters you've brought up are so unbelievably boring. And you do know strong 2-As are there because AP right? It's down to Hax, If I got the LoP to have a 5-C form, 2-C form and so on, then she's stomp literally all the verses you just cited because they are bland and have no resistances to decent hax.
>it is interesting to put ichigo against naruto because they cncentrate on reasonable ammount of power and abilities while putting one of those 2-A anime girls against someone is boring becasue they are just stupidly op.
Uh, no, it's not, like at all, I literally don't care for watching "Muh sword" and "muh Ninja" dick measuring contests. Both guys you cited are literally "Muh slash" and "Muh punch" when boiled down to their base parts. They're simply not interesting, I literally get bored reading their profile, heaven forbid their anime, and I love reading through the Profiles on this site.
And why is it boring? Because it would require intellectual thought to not go "Well, X punches harder then Y, so he wins", you have to go through multiple hax and feats in the 2-A ranges, because it's down to pure skill and who goes first, yes, they end soon, but it's all the more reason to see them meet a match, I don't care for a 200 comment thread about a Dick measuring contest between these characters who I could summerize in a sentence.
>i am not calling the character stupid btw.
No, you're just making yourself look stupid.
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now i fianlly see that you are a digimon fanboy and a shonen jump hater and you also curse out ppl who you do not agree with. im not gonna continue this and answer with another wall of text. if you think all those multi hyper ultra versal beings have better fights than shonen jump characters then i can't change your opinion, but those fights end up in one character insta errasing another while the "plain 2-D characters" at least put up a good fight. im not going to cotinue an argument about a thing that does not exist and thus im leaving. i hope to never see you again.Udlmaster said:
Udlmaster
They/Them- 6,879
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>now i fianlly see that you are a digimon fanboy
What? Dude, I've literally never watched a single episode of Digimon, in fact, I've only ever commented on a few threads about Digimon and that was the Lady of Pain vs a Digimon character, if anything I was closer to an opponent than a Supporter.
And look who's calling someone a Fan-boy. Maybe practice what you preach?
>and a shonen jump hater
"You're just a hater" Way to not adress anything I said in the comment at all, Well played there. And no, I'm not, I'm just realistic.
>and you also curse out ppl who you do not agree with
Oh yiss, look at all those cuss words I called you. All 0 of them.
> im not gonna continue this and answer with another wall of text.
You mean like how you said you don't care?
> if you think all those multi hyper ultra versal beings have better fights than shonen jump characters then i can't change your opinion
Nah, it's vertually fact, Shonen characters are lazy, paper-thin, 2-D characters with the most trash stories.
> those fights end up in one character insta errasing another while the "plain 2-D characters" at least put up a good fight.
You mean like the fights from Dies Irae? Ya know, a Verse made up of 1-As but has Shonen-like fights? :Thinking:
>im not going to cotinue an argument about a thing that does not exist and thus im leaving. i hope to never see you again.
Eat me, don't forget to write.
What? Dude, I've literally never watched a single episode of Digimon, in fact, I've only ever commented on a few threads about Digimon and that was the Lady of Pain vs a Digimon character, if anything I was closer to an opponent than a Supporter.
And look who's calling someone a Fan-boy. Maybe practice what you preach?
>and a shonen jump hater
"You're just a hater" Way to not adress anything I said in the comment at all, Well played there. And no, I'm not, I'm just realistic.
>and you also curse out ppl who you do not agree with
Oh yiss, look at all those cuss words I called you. All 0 of them.
> im not gonna continue this and answer with another wall of text.
You mean like how you said you don't care?
> if you think all those multi hyper ultra versal beings have better fights than shonen jump characters then i can't change your opinion
Nah, it's vertually fact, Shonen characters are lazy, paper-thin, 2-D characters with the most trash stories.
> those fights end up in one character insta errasing another while the "plain 2-D characters" at least put up a good fight.
You mean like the fights from Dies Irae? Ya know, a Verse made up of 1-As but has Shonen-like fights? :Thinking:
>im not going to cotinue an argument about a thing that does not exist and thus im leaving. i hope to never see you again.
Eat me, don't forget to write.
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Udlmaster said:
I've read through what both of you have said, and I'm not amused. It's bad enough you two had to derail the thread for (what amounts to) a bunch of nonsense, but the name-calling and generally toxic attitudes from both of you are not something I'm about to ignore.Arceus0x said:
Grow up. And don't let this happen again.
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You know I am glad King is the mature one and next to Dargoo, I am immensely satisfied they are the ones that are staff. Since most people agree, should I implement the changes? Which tldr is: Immortality Types 7,8,9 are to be added Non-Corporeal And anyone who is still 3-A pre mending is now Low 2-C (think at best there is only like two)
Wokistan
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I'm still unsure on Ob Nixilis and Liliana Vess as oldwalkers tbh.
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At least you told me this now--Wokistan said:
Now Liliana is a little sketch, but Ob Nixilis is still an old walker. He should scale to the weaker ones like Freyalise, Jaya, Serra etc.
Liliana is supposedly an oldwalker, (and I call myself a magic fanboy...)
So she is fine.
As stated above, if you have any issues with the supporting feats to back this up, then that is fine.
Immortality and Non-Corporeal are the big ones I am pushing for anyway.
Wokistan
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Liliana never really did much as an oldwalker did she? The abilities on her page are more for her low 6-B to 4-A, she definitely can't do the chain veil stuff for example as an oldwalker because she didn't have it. We should probably fix that, I added the 3-A key more as an afterthought when I remembered she was an oldwalker.
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