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Machamp vs Garou
- Thread starter PaChi2
- Start date
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- Tags
- garou machamp one-punch man pokémon
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I do believe that you're right there. I don't see anything that isn't learned naturally either by LvL Ups, Egg Moves, etc.Drite77 said:
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Stomp = Match where one of the sides has no possibilities to win.
Decisive = Match where one of the sides holds an amount of advantages that edges their opponent and/or counter their fighting style.
If you're defending that Machamp is a lot stronger then don't argue this is a stomp against him. Be coherent with yourself.
Decisive = Match where one of the sides holds an amount of advantages that edges their opponent and/or counter their fighting style.
If you're defending that Machamp is a lot stronger then don't argue this is a stomp against him. Be coherent with yourself.
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Garou FRA
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12 more hours. Kappa changed his vote before and grace was suspended until Cal voted.
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In game, Machamp's bulk up is a 1.5x boost to AP and durability, and is described as a slight boost in Mystery Dungeon. Still, it's respectable. Garou's amps allowed him to go from being practically stomped by Darkshine (i.e. his ribs got broken from a move that Garou partially reflected, Garou couldn't harm him whatsoever) to overpowering Darkshine in both speed and AP. Darkshine can no-sell attacks from Bang who can harm Elder Centipede, who is around 205 megatons.Kappatalism said:
Tutor moves, TM and HM moves are ignored by default as wild Pokemon cannot learn them. Also, seismic toss sending people to orbit has been debunked, though theoretically Machamp is strong enough to send Garou to space, seismic toss or not, so if he does that while Garou's still slow enough to be tagged, that's a solid wincon.
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In game, Machamp's bulk up is a 1.5x boost to AP and durability, and is described as a slight boost in Mystery Dungeon. Still, it's respectable. Garou's amps allowed him to go from being practically stomped by Darkshine (i.e. his ribs got broken from a move that Garou partially reflected, Garou couldn't harm him whatsoever) to overpowering Darkshine in both speed and AP. Darkshine can no-sell attacks from Bang who can harm Elder Centipede, who is around 205 megatons.
Tutor moves, TM and HM moves are ignored by default as wild Pokemon cannot learn them. Also, seismic toss sending people to orbit has been debunked, though theoretically Machamp is strong enough to send Garou to space, seismic toss or not, so if he does that while Garou's still slow enough to be tagged, that's a solid wincon.
Its pokedex entry makes this its go to
Tutor moves, TM and HM moves are ignored by default as wild Pokemon cannot learn them. Also, seismic toss sending people to orbit has been debunked, though theoretically Machamp is strong enough to send Garou to space, seismic toss or not, so if he does that while Garou's still slow enough to be tagged, that's a solid wincon.
Its pokedex entry makes this its go to
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If machamp does not have a wincon its a stomp by your definition.The Calaca said:
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This is pointless. Unfollowing the thread until it's added to both characters.
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Yeah, good thing Machamp could just amp himself until he gets strong enough to one-shot, preventing him to grow strong enough to pose a threat.
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Machamp has enough punching force to toss garou into orbit.Drite77 said:
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Nobody said he hasn't. He said that Garou is better when it comes to CQC than Machamp.
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Why is everyone forgetting that machamp can attack the soul via foresight?
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Because you kept arguing stomp instead, why did you forget?
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Yes, Foresight makes Machamp able to have Non Physical Interaction with any move. He doesn't target embodied souls.
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If machamp has no win con and can't possibly win, how isn't it a stomp? I mean, they're saying garou gets infinitely stronger than machamp.Schnee One said:
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Literally nobody said Garou would get infinitely strongee than Machamp.
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If they refuse to quantify how much stronger, even though machamp can stack his boosts and defense drops on garou, as well as reduce any apeedups garou has, how do they have any votes? Garou loses because machamp would have mastered garou's martial art via sba, correct? Machamp can lower garou's defense/durability 4x with leer and increase his own with bulk up 4x. He so will neg any speed up with scary face. Garou can't deal with seismic toss and being punched across the horizon multiple times. He would also become frozen, paralyzed, or burned. Youre acting like also that no guard won't work and he can't confuse hax with thunderpunch and dynamic punch combo. If none of this works then machamp has no chance. Also, foresight removes evasion bonuses as well. Starts out weaker, in everything, and gains on machamp potentially in AP. But he gets negged. Even if their AP was the same, it would eventually be a 16x difference with bulk up and leer. Thats a one shot.The Calaca said:
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> Garou loses because machamp would have mastered garou's martial art via sba, correct?
Come on...
Come on...
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Because Garou would keep progressing, growing stronger and faster.
We don't take the in-game multipliers AFAIK. Otherwise the profiles would be a mess since some of them would scale to higher tiers just with the amps.
Garou can run back from the horizon. Isn't like BFRing him to the next state would stop him since both are playing at Relativistic speeds. Not like Machamp would resort to that or would land the hit that many times as you suggest. Has Seismic Toss ever BFRd someone to space at all?
Dunno how we treat No-Guard, but it sounds a little NLFish.
Burning or paralyzing Garou is either unlikely or useless considering he has resistances to those things. Frozing him would only incap seeing as there's no proof that Ice Punch frostbites.
We don't take the in-game multipliers AFAIK. Otherwise the profiles would be a mess since some of them would scale to higher tiers just with the amps.
Garou can run back from the horizon. Isn't like BFRing him to the next state would stop him since both are playing at Relativistic speeds. Not like Machamp would resort to that or would land the hit that many times as you suggest. Has Seismic Toss ever BFRd someone to space at all?
Dunno how we treat No-Guard, but it sounds a little NLFish.
Burning or paralyzing Garou is either unlikely or useless considering he has resistances to those things. Frozing him would only incap seeing as there's no proof that Ice Punch frostbites.
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Game animations show Seismic Toss throwing the opponent to space and back, and Machamp is certainly strong enough to do so. Though this has also been semi-debunked as no other depiction of seismic toss comes close to this.
By in-game multipliers, moves like bulk up can be stacked up to ten times in Mystery Dungeon, which is 6x. But either way, bulk up is a residual amp that has to be actively used by Machamp instead of attacking, in comparison to Garou's adaptation amp which is passive and going by feats is superior to bulk up. Leer is even worse since it leaves Machamp completely defenceless while it is being used. Foresight removing 'evasion bonuses' doesn't help much when it comes to tagging a faster opponent, though if we take the japanese name of the move literally then using it to read Garou's mind could help. Garou can also break out of being frozen solid, possibly even stronger than before. And out of all the moves you have listed, only bulk up and dynamic punch fit Machamp's character much.
On the other hand, Dynamic Punch is actually a very dangerous move that I had forgotten about until now. Garou has no resistance to the confusion status effect, and against an equally or more skilled opponent such as Machamp, even the slightest hesitation could spell doom for him, let alone a status effect which disorients an opponent so much that Pokemon who are otherwise experienced and hardwired for battle can end up hitting themselves. Not to mention the move itself is one of Machamp's strongest, so if Machamp lands a dynamic punch before Garou is able to equalize the initial AP advantage, it'll not only deal serious damage but he could win simply by capitalising on the damaged, disoriented Garou and star platinum him.
By in-game multipliers, moves like bulk up can be stacked up to ten times in Mystery Dungeon, which is 6x. But either way, bulk up is a residual amp that has to be actively used by Machamp instead of attacking, in comparison to Garou's adaptation amp which is passive and going by feats is superior to bulk up. Leer is even worse since it leaves Machamp completely defenceless while it is being used. Foresight removing 'evasion bonuses' doesn't help much when it comes to tagging a faster opponent, though if we take the japanese name of the move literally then using it to read Garou's mind could help. Garou can also break out of being frozen solid, possibly even stronger than before. And out of all the moves you have listed, only bulk up and dynamic punch fit Machamp's character much.
On the other hand, Dynamic Punch is actually a very dangerous move that I had forgotten about until now. Garou has no resistance to the confusion status effect, and against an equally or more skilled opponent such as Machamp, even the slightest hesitation could spell doom for him, let alone a status effect which disorients an opponent so much that Pokemon who are otherwise experienced and hardwired for battle can end up hitting themselves. Not to mention the move itself is one of Machamp's strongest, so if Machamp lands a dynamic punch before Garou is able to equalize the initial AP advantage, it'll not only deal serious damage but he could win simply by capitalising on the damaged, disoriented Garou and star platinum him.
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If machamp has no win con and can't possibly win, how isn't it a stomp? I mean, they're saying garou gets infinitely stronger than machamp.
Because you kept arguing for Machamp winning
<Machamp Wins
<Stomp
<Why do people forget that he can attack the soul
<Stomp
You are less consistent then Sailor Moon arcs
Because you kept arguing for Machamp winning
<Machamp Wins
<Stomp
<Why do people forget that he can attack the soul
<Stomp
You are less consistent then Sailor Moon arcs
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There you go with the limitless scaling garou. You are saying he just gets stronger based on some unquantifable feat. There is nothing stopping machamp from continiously punching him across the horizon. You are equalizing all of the resistances that he has like they scale to him, when garou just blatenly out powers them. Machamp outscales garou in all assets, and since you can't quantify his boosts, it is disingenuous to say that he just wins by outscaling. It would be a NLF to say he scales above everyone. You also need to show his analytical skills overcoming something like no guard. You realize that the durability and AP difference is massive, as machamp scales to dugtrio who creates enormous earthquakes and can tank them at the same time.The Calaca said:
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Earthquake_Power_Chart Earthquake has a similar base power to 8.5 magnitude.
Machamp oneshots due to the enormous difference in AP and Durability. Garous does not have the time to get increasings to his stats. All it takes is 1 bulk up and Dynamic punch/ close combat. They outscale earthquake while being stab, adding 50% more power.
| Magnitude 8.5 | 6.934258e+21 | 1.65732743786 teratons | Small Country level |
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No, if I say that Garou would adapt to a 6-C punch then I'd be limitlessly scaling Garou. But guess what, he can take attacks from someone on his tier that it's around 2.5x stronger and won't get one-shoted.
Yes, there is a thing that'd stop him. Garou's adaptability which will make him not only able to just dodge or redirect the attack but to tank the force required to send someone across the horizon.
Funny. Garou took the fire from a 7-A, likely High 6-C while being 7-B. Dunno about the other cases, but his resistance isn't him overpowering the opponent's fire.
In-game multipliers aren't valids outside of, of course, the games. Show me those multipliers existing in any other PKMN media and then I'll concede. But considering Machamp can't turn High 7-A not even with a 2x Bulk Up then it's a moot point. So yes, you can't quantify their boosts either.
When Garou starts weaker yet somehow you imply that I argue Garou to be stronger. He isn't, but he will.
Good thing we don't use Magnitude nor Earthquake to scale the characters. Want to change that? Content Revision Board is your place. Pretty sure we had that discussion before.
Also, the 1.6 Teratons comes from shaking the whole world, IIRC.
Yes, there is a thing that'd stop him. Garou's adaptability which will make him not only able to just dodge or redirect the attack but to tank the force required to send someone across the horizon.
Funny. Garou took the fire from a 7-A, likely High 6-C while being 7-B. Dunno about the other cases, but his resistance isn't him overpowering the opponent's fire.
In-game multipliers aren't valids outside of, of course, the games. Show me those multipliers existing in any other PKMN media and then I'll concede. But considering Machamp can't turn High 7-A not even with a 2x Bulk Up then it's a moot point. So yes, you can't quantify their boosts either.
When Garou starts weaker yet somehow you imply that I argue Garou to be stronger. He isn't, but he will.
Good thing we don't use Magnitude nor Earthquake to scale the characters. Want to change that? Content Revision Board is your place. Pretty sure we had that discussion before.
Also, the 1.6 Teratons comes from shaking the whole world, IIRC.
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Luckily it is, that is where I got it from. Machamp scales to dugtrio in AP. Try again. Scales to other Pokémon on its level such as Dugtrio). The AP gap is way too high. Machamp wins. There is a reason machamp is Mountain level+ and not Likely Mountain level. There is a big gap between them in AP and durability. Machamp also can use earthquake as a TM move, so it can generate this force. Dynamic punch with its 50% bonus from being stab and being the same power as earthquake makes it well into 6B, and it can use dynamic punch with each of its 4 arms.The Calaca said:
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Do a CRT then. Because that is what it says. I was told to do a CRT to change what I brought to the table.Drite77 said:
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Machamp has similar power moves to earthquake, like its Dynamic punch, which was the reference. But it can use earthquake, and its within its capabilities, even if the TM move does not exist on the useable pokemon for VS battles. Its power scales to dugtrio based on its page, and dugtrio is still scaled based on its earthquakes. Do a CRTDrite77 said:
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then do a CRT. It is still on the profilesDrite77 said:
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then it is as it is
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