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Liliana Vess vs Shao Kahn

Wokistan

Wokistan

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Liliana Vess
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Both start Low 6-B, Chain Veil is allowed, Shao has Outworld powers.

Speed equal because no timeframe on mtg

Start 300m out in the Ringed City Streets, yes some enemies are still around.

Liliana Vess: 4 (Schnee One, ThePixelKirby, Dargoo Faust, 19hmun)

Shao Kah:

Inconclusive: 2 (Xtasyamphetamine, Hellbeast1)
 
His strongest key
 
Hmm Kahn has an edge in skill and experience and his soul hax, and emperor's shield could be handy here but the EE could be a problem for Kahn.

Incon for now until someone tells me more about Vess' hax
 
Vess has plenty of experience, I'd bargain, having spent her time with demons and figures such as Nicol Bolas. Just making that clear.

As well, she resists Soul Manipulation and controls it to quite a hefty degree herself with the Chain Veil, although I'm not sure how strong Kahn's is.

Liliana's hax is very strong, and with the Chain Veil, she can amp herself and her abilities to incredible levels- enough to combat powerful demons with control over her own soul, and even stand against Emrakul for a fair amount of time, although she wasn't really close to winning that one. Non-Corp doesn't really help at all agaisnt Lili, but any tricks he comes up with, Liliana wouldn't take long to figure it out and EE. At the very worst, she'd planeswalk away to a different location for a minute or two to collect her bearings and plan what to do before returning.

So yea, non-corp is pretty moot here.

Correct me if I am wrong, Woki.
 
Hard to say. She has quite potent soulhax herself and has dealt with quite powerful demons who also have strong soul hax- it's very likely the soul manip. resistance gets stronger with the Chain Veil.

What's strange is that I really don't see a way for Shao to really survive any of Liliana's attacks, like, at all. Liliana already kills both low-godlies and non-corps, and she can amp herself to a quite absurd degree.
 
The Chain Veil is made up of a very large civilization of Onakke, and all their spirits are inside of it.

As for numbers? Hard to tell, but her with the chain veil might give her a chance.

How I see it is, either Shao Kahn overwhelms Liliana's resistance, or Liliana uses one of her long list of hax and destroys him. However, Liliana doesn't have the weakness of being far more overconfident and cocky, and has power null. I'm leaning in favor of Liliana, since she can amp herself far above Shao, one-shot him with her hax, and has power null to potentially deal with soul manip. if it's too strong.
 
For one, she kills low-godlies and interacts with non-corps quite often. For two, her death hax is very potent and the chain veil amps her to be stupid strong. For three, power null. For four, existence erasure. And there's a few more things but that's what I bargain is most worth mentioning.
 
Shao Kahn being cocky is a misconception, as he is only extremely overconfident during MK tournaments and if he meets someone he despises personally, otherwise he just soulhaxes right away when he has the chance. By SBA he's already in a location in Earthrealm, so the first thing he did when he had access to it (and had no one stopping him) was absorbing a planet's worth of souls.
 
Even if we say Shao Kahn leads with soul hax, and it's strong enough to instantly surpass Liliana even when amped, a few results are possible:

1. Death hax hits or soul hax hits. Incon, who shoots first.

2. Power null deals with Soul Hax, Shao Kahn is ******.

3. The tiniest hesitation due to his cockiness, and he gets hit by Liliana's various hax.

Best Shao Kahn can hope for here is incon, but I'm leaning towards Liliana because of power null and not having that weakness of overconfidence at all.
 
Schnee One said:
Just to be sure can her Death Hax kill Low Godly?
Click to expand...
I believe so, and Wokistan also stated so in the last thread. I could grab him if you need to.
 
I'll have to vote for Lily and her imaginary Raven Friend FRA, high-mid diff.
 
Even if it's the slightest, most miniscule possibility, it's just further tipping the scales in favor of Liliana. But your vote is fair- just saying, power null does make soul manipulation hard to pull off.
 
Liliana does have a soul resistance with the Chain Veil, and that thing does activate without her actively wanting it to. One of her demon Lord's was puppeting her around because he still owned a fourth of her soul, then the CV kicked in and blocked that, letting Liliana destroy him.
 
I remember those demon Lord's having something rather impressive but idk about that. Would need to re read it. It more shows that not having her own soul isn't that big a deal for her when she uses CV.

On other subjects, Bolas was very interested in the CV and she survived an attack from Emrakul when drawing on it.
 
Right. Bolas was both interested in CV's power, but it has also amped her absurdly high, and contains a large amount of souls that also grant her soul resistance, and the demons themselves were quite potent in hax.

And you have power null.
 
The CV didn't give her control over her own soul back. It was still owned by the 4 demons. It just made that irrelevant long enough for her to destroy one of them.
 
Mostly just thought-based deciding to do it. No incantations or utterings needed, she just sorta does it and it happens.
 
Liliana has some thought based spells, which should be inclusive of at least a few death spells, but not everything works off of that. There are a bunch of powerful hollows in the battlefield I'm using she can control with her thoughts btw.

Chain Veil she hates using actively but it will kick in unconsciously to save her. Saved her from the demon Lord, saved her from Jace prying into her mind, and saved her from Emrakul, though in that last case the CV on it's own nearly killed her.
 
Scales to a lightning calc, eventually. It was a generic "Dodge lightning" so I don't think there's a specific calc.
 
Shao Kahn should have thought based abilities actually, his strongest key is actually just him being a being of pure shapeless energy in this form. He wouldn't need to raise his hand to use soulhax or anything.

So Shao Kahn is baseline MHS+ compared to her MHS which we don't know
 
Oh yea true, speed. Fairly sure that should be equalized, Woki.

Albeit, the Chain Veil is unsciously active, so it would probably be able to save/activate even with Shao's speed. Although I'd bargain speed equal is best.
 
Gtg for a while
 
I'll go work on my revisions on the discord while Woki's gone. See you later, robots.
 
This is post-mending Liliana, right? If so, when has she killed a low-godly?

I get soulhax working but not really the deathhax.
 
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