Lightning Feats Attack Potency and Durability

[Randomlamdom]

Bumper

 

[Jasonsith]

Well this is some form of electricity manipulation of transforming into electricity by any means.
Whether we can blindly assign any value to it is another.

Eh, no. Transforming and then going through and out of clouds like this is the textbook definition of transforming into lightning.

I can concede to that cloud-to-ground lightning is textbook example of one average lightning.

Actually there is an attempt to make into a formula
Wonder if we could use THAT formula for any character who can charge up electricity around.

This prolly doesn't take into account electrical resistance (Because again, remember that all that power faces enormous resistance from the air alone, higher the resistance, lower the voltage and lower the energy) that would be faced by said bolt so I don't think we can, unfortunately.

There is one application of punching that generates charged electricity in the air.
Some researcher deem that a electric charge covering a 300 cubic meter of air would yield 151 billion joules of energy. Exact working formula... I am too Busy to find out but there is one.

Well, if they can "just" transform into one electricity source and travel between media, they are still one source of electricity.

Again, going through clouds like this and then charging down into the ground from there is textbook lightning. It doesn't get any more blatant than that.

Textbook lightning... One cloud-to-ground lightning is textbook lightning you mean? I am fine with that.

Glad you do. Because this really affects a lot of characters, including Garuda (Ninja Garden), Wizard (Castlevania) and Flash Gremlin/Electric Gremlin (The Gremlins) and more.

And nobody's denying that.

And to further elaborate, I am selecting these 3 characters for some particular reasons:

• Garuda (Ninja Garden) shoots lightning directly from his wand, but by Game Boy standard looks qualifying enough to be called genuine textbook cloud-to-ground lightning.
• Wizard (Castlevania) can summon a small cloud and then strike lightning from the said cloud onto the ground
• Flash Gremlin/Electric Gremlin (The Gremlins) in Gremlins 2 NES can shoot small-size electricity balls whose projectiles do not quite demonstrate electrical properties, but in the Gremlins 2 movie and the Game boy game version can transform into a bolt of sparking and animate gremlin-shaped electricity and can travel through air
  - the movie version does get primarily attracted to conductive materials, whose "weakness" is manipulated by Billy Peltzer by trapping him into a phone system and then releasing him among other imprisoned and wet gremlins and fatally electrocuting them all, resulting in a big explosion that possibly killed Electric Gremlin himself.

Also, how do we currently distinguish ordinary low tier electricity manipulation user from lightning user? Anyone having a good recap?

 

[KLOL506]

There is one application of punching that generates charged electricity in the air.
Some researcher deem that a electric charge covering a 300 cubic meter of air would yield 151 billion joules of energy. Exact working formula... I am too Busy to find out but there is one.

Does it take into account electrical resistance?

Textbook lightning... One cloud-to-ground lightning is textbook lightning you mean? I am fine with that.

Ya kinda forgot that before the "strike down" thing I literally included "moving through the clouds", right?

And to further elaborate, I am selecting these 3 characters for some particular reasons:

• Garuda (Ninja Garden) shoots lightning directly from his wand, but by Game Boy standard looks qualifying enough to be called genuine textbook cloud-to-ground lightning.

Does the wand shoot down only cloud-to-ground lightning? Or is it able to channel/manipulate the lightning from the clouds as well prior?

• Wizard (Castlevania) can summon a small cloud and then strike lightning from the said cloud onto the ground

Do they have feats of being able to channel the lightning from the cloud? If so, 8-C. If it's just a bolt being summoned down without any channeling shenanigans, 9-A+.

• Flash Gremlin/Electric Gremlin (The Gremlins) in Gremlins 2 NES can shoot small-size electricity balls whose projectiles do not quite demonstrate electrical properties, but in the Gremlins 2 movie and the Game boy game version can transform into a bolt of sparking and animate gremlin-shaped electricity and can travel through air
  - the movie version does get primarily attracted to conductive materials, whose "weakness" is manipulated by Billy Peltzer by trapping him into a phone system and then releasing him among other imprisoned and wet gremlins and fatally electrocuting them all, resulting in a big explosion that possibly killed Electric Gremlin himself.

Travelling through air is a stretch, can it travel through clouds?

Also, how do we currently distinguish ordinary low tier electricity manipulation user from lightning user? Anyone having a good recap?

Simple. They need to show feats to be able to bring down lightning directly from the clouds, first and foremost. Then we can go straight to looking for feats where they can channel the lightning directly from the clouds themselves.

Case in point, Zeus from God of War doing it for you. Channeling lightning into a bolt.

 

[Antvasima]

So what are the staff conclusions here so far?

 

[Jasonsith]

So what are the staff conclusions here so far?

Agreed:
Lightning from two charged clouds shooting at each other (cloud-to-cloud lightning) yields.

All lightning yields.

To request help:

Wanting an exact formula for energy/power of creating an electric field.

There is a feat calculation (with important steps hidden) posted by the Death Battle episode of Johnny Cage vs Captain Falcon that a "300 cubic meter" volume of electric field will yield 151 billion joules of energy.
But important steps are skipped.
Nor is it clearly stated on the effect from the factors of air resistance.
Glad if someone can find that out - this can be critical in measuring feats where a character releases electric aura or electric fields.

Still debating:

Textbook lightning... One cloud-to-ground lightning is textbook lightning you mean? I am fine with that.

Ya kinda forgot that before the "strike down" thing I literally included "moving through the clouds", right

Well, two charged clouds shooting lightning at each other is cloud to cloud lightning. Two source of lightning strike. 1.6 gigajoule.
One cloud shooting one bolt of electricity into the ground is one source of lightning strike and is 800 megajoules.
Simple as that.

Garuda (Ninja Garden) shoots lightning directly from his wand, but by Game Boy standard looks qualifying enough to be called genuine textbook cloud-to-ground lightning.

Does the wand shoot down only cloud-to-ground lightning? Or is it able to channel/manipulate the lightning from the clouds as well prior?

He shoots lightning primarily from his wand during his fight with Ryu Hayabusa in his first form. (He summons an armor and shoots fire balls instead in his second phase.)
(There is a scene where Garuda took over New York in a storm. But it is unknown whether Garuda creates such storm.)

Wizard (Castlevania) can summon a small cloud and then strike lightning from the said cloud onto the ground

Do they have feats of being able to channel the lightning from the cloud? If so, 8-C. If it's just a bolt being summoned down without any channeling shenanigans, 9-A+.

Wiz does pose with his wand to signal the cloud to cast a cloud-to-ground lightning.
But regardless the attack is still cloud-to-ground lightning. So IMO this should be still 9-A+. This said without calculating the creation of the exact lightning cloud.
Why do we even consider cloud-to-ground lightning strike 9-A+ at first?

Flash Gremlin/Electric Gremlin (The Gremlins) in Gremlins 2 NES can shoot small-size electricity balls whose projectiles do not quite demonstrate electrical properties, but in the Gremlins 2 movie and the Game boy game version can transform into a bolt of sparking and animate gremlin-shaped electricity and can travel through air
- the movie version does get primarily attracted to conductive materials, whose "weakness" is manipulated by Billy Peltzer by trapping him into a phone system and then releasing him among other imprisoned and wet gremlins and fatally electrocuting them all, resulting in a big explosion that possibly killed Electric Gremlin himself.

Travelling through air is a stretch, can it travel through clouds?

If Electric Gremlin can travel through thin air which is "ordinarily neutral in elecric charge", why should it be an issue for travelling through clouds? Charged air (including charged clouds) should be a better medium of conducting electricity than neutral air right?
(To supplement, only Electric Gremlin (Game Boy) can travel as electricity forms and move almost freely mid air.
Electric Gremlin (movie) travel uncontrollably and is attracted / dragged towards conductors first.
Electric Gremlin (NES) just walks and throws electrically charged fictional energy balls.)

Also, how do we currently distinguish ordinary low tier electricity manipulation user from lightning user? Anyone having a good recap?

Simple. They need to show feats to be able to bring down lightning directly from the clouds, first and foremost. Then we can go straight to looking for feats where they can channel the lightning directly from the clouds themselves.

Case in point, Zeus from God of War doing it for you. Channeling lightning into a bolt.

Looks fair enough. Specific guidelines should be pointed out in the drafting part.





Also, I will be very busy IRL for the coming weeks of work (in fact I am really squeezing time for a proper response instead of chit chats which uses far less brain power). So sorry for foreseeable late response.

 

[KLOL506]

He shoots lightning primarily from his wand during his fight with Ryu Hayabusa in his first form. (He summons an armor and shoots fire balls instead in his second phase.)
(There is a scene where Garuda took over New York in a storm. But it is unknown whether Garuda creates such storm.)

A possible 8-C rating might be in for the works then.

Wiz does pose with his wand to signal the cloud to cast a cloud-to-ground lightning.
But regardless the attack is still cloud-to-ground lightning. So IMO this should be still 9-A+. This said without calculating the creation of the exact lightning cloud.
Why do we even consider cloud-to-ground lightning strike 9-A+ at first?

Because CtG Lightning is half that of intra-cloud lightning in terms of potency?

If Electric Gremlin can travel through thin air which is "ordinarily neutral in elecric charge", why should it be an issue for travelling through clouds? Charged air (including charged clouds) should be a better medium of conducting electricity than neutral air right?
(To supplement, only Electric Gremlin (Game Boy) can travel as electricity forms and move almost freely mid air.
Electric Gremlin (movie) travel uncontrollably and is attracted / dragged towards conductors first.
Electric Gremlin (NES) just walks and throws electrically charged fictional energy balls.)

Generally speaking lightning is usually produced in clouds, hence the proposal.

 

[Jasonsith]

He shoots lightning primarily from his wand during his fight with Ryu Hayabusa in his first form. (He summons an armor and shoots fire balls instead in his second phase.)
(There is a scene where Garuda took over New York in a storm. But it is unknown whether Garuda creates such storm.)

A possible 8-C rating might be in for the works then.

How come? He shoots the lightning from a wand that resembles more a cloud-to-ground lightning.
To be honest, the idea of cloud-to-cloud lightning having double the yield of cloud-to-ground lightning is because there are two charged clouds shooting lightning at each other. Two sources of attack.
To be honest I see very very little application for cloud-to-cloud lightning yields for most fictional characters shooting lightning even if the lightning is legit lightning.

If you want higher yields for stronger electricity users, I would suggest extracting the formula for creating electric fields with electric sparks in RTP air such that stronger characters having a wider radius of electric fields generated will have a higher attack potency.

Wiz does pose with his wand to signal the cloud to cast a cloud-to-ground lightning.
But regardless the attack is still cloud-to-ground lightning. So IMO this should be still 9-A+. This said without calculating the creation of the exact lightning cloud.
Why do we even consider cloud-to-ground lightning strike 9-A+ at first?

Because CtG Lightning is half that of intra-cloud lightning in terms of potency?

So lightning attacks from Wiz is still cloud to ground lightning am I right.

If Electric Gremlin can travel through thin air which is "ordinarily neutral in elecric charge", why should it be an issue for travelling through clouds? Charged air (including charged clouds) should be a better medium of conducting electricity than neutral air right?
(To supplement, only Electric Gremlin (Game Boy) can travel as electricity forms and move almost freely mid air.
Electric Gremlin (movie) travel uncontrollably and is attracted / dragged towards conductors first.
Electric Gremlin (NES) just walks and throws electrically charged fictional energy balls.)

Generally speaking lightning is usually produced in clouds, hence the proposal.

So transforming into a bolt of electricity and moving mid-air is still cloud to ground lightning I would see.

 

[KLOL506]

How come? He shoots the lightning from a wand that resembles more a cloud-to-ground lightning.
To be honest, the idea of cloud-to-cloud lightning having double the yield of cloud-to-ground lightning is because there are two charged clouds shooting lightning at each other. Two sources of attack.

The idea is that the manipulation of the clouds would also grant the wielder control over all of its other aspects as well as the ability to channel lightning from it directly.

If you want higher yields for stronger electricity users, I would suggest extracting the formula for creating electric fields with electric sparks in RTP air such that stronger characters having a wider radius of electric fields generated will have a higher attack potency.

Again, one needs to account for resistance first.

Though, by electric fields, do you you mean an example like this?

So lightning attacks from Wiz is still cloud to ground lightning am I right.

If it is in the nature of a cloud-to-ground lightning bolt and not channeled from the clouds first, yes.

So transforming into a bolt of electricity and moving mid-air is still cloud to ground lightning I would see.

Maybe, but once that goes into the clouds, it'd be a different story.

 

[Jasonsith]

@jasonsith says Garuda is likely shooting cloud-to-ground lightning
@KLOL506 is arguing a case Garuda may actually scale from a cloud-to-cloud lightning
How come? He shoots the lightning from a wand that resembles more a cloud-to-ground lightning.
To be honest, the idea of cloud-to-cloud lightning having double the yield of cloud-to-ground lightning is because there are two charged clouds shooting lightning at each other. Two sources of attack.

The idea is that the manipulation of the clouds would also grant the wielder control over all of its other aspects as well as the ability to channel lightning from it directly.

Back to the Garuda case. The case where he took over New York during a storm has little to no evidence where he actually created the storms.
In the fight, he does shoot something resembling cloud-to-ground lightning.

If one can control two or more clouds and use said sources to initiate a lightning strike, should we start to count how many sources of attack can an attacker initiate at once?

Again, one needs to account for resistance first.

Sure.
This I may need help from you to find the exact formula on how much energy is required to fill a volume of medium (vacuum, normal air, particular gas, water, sand, etc) with (a) electric fields and (b) electric sparks and strands.

Though, by electric fields, do you you mean an example like this?

One application sure.
The other being the final Falcon Punch by Captain Falcon on Black Shadow.

So lightning attacks from Wiz is still cloud to ground lightning am I right.

If it is in the nature of a cloud-to-ground lightning bolt and not channeled from the clouds first, yes.

Well that lightning strike is literally one lightning strike from the cloud to the ground.

I still do not get why you want to argue that as two sources of lightning striking at each other.

So transforming into a bolt of electricity and moving mid-air is still cloud to ground lightning I would see.

Maybe, but once that goes into the clouds, it'd be a different story.

That is still one source of attack or one source of electricity.




Sorry I am really REALLY busy IRL during these months I am replying you late. (In fact I may have already missed some other requests I need to pick up later)

 

[KLOL506]

Back to the Garuda case. The case where he took over New York during a storm has little to no evidence where he actually created the storms.
In the fight, he does shoot something resembling cloud-to-ground lightning.

If one can control two or more clouds and use said sources to initiate a lightning strike, should we start to count how many sources of attack can an attacker initiate at once?

Ye. But chances are, they'll involve more than one. Not sure what happens to CtG lightning then.

Sure.
This I may need help from you to find the exact formula on how much energy is required to fill a volume of medium (vacuum, normal air, particular gas, water, sand, etc) with (a) electric fields and (b) electric sparks and strands.

Hmmmmm. Perhaps DT will be able to help out here.

One application sure.
The other being the final Falcon Punch by Captain Falcon on Black Shadow.

Well that lightning strike is literally one lightning strike from the cloud to the ground.

I still do not get why you want to argue that as two sources of lightning striking at each other.

Cloud Manipulation and stuff.

Though I am not sure what happens if a CtG lightning comes down from two clouds being manipulated and stuff.

That is still one source of attack or one source of electricity.

Until it goes into the clouds and ends up making two by contact.

Sorry I am really REALLY busy IRL during these months I am replying you late. (In fact I may have already missed some other requests I need to pick up later)

No worries.

 

[Antvasima]

DontTalk seems to be busy with schoolwork at the moment. He isn't responding to my PM requests either.

 

[KLOL506]

@DontTalkDT Your help is still needed to conclude this.

 

[Antvasima]

I will remind him.

 

[KLOL506]

@DontTalkDT

This I may need help from you to find the exact formula on how much energy is required to fill a volume of medium (vacuum, normal air, particular gas, water, sand, etc) with (a) electric fields and (b) electric sparks and strands.

I think this is all that's left to handle and then we can conclude this thread.

 

[GarrixianXD]

@DontTalkDT

I think this is all that's left to handle and then we can conclude this thread.

Couldn’t you just derive a formula for this?

 

[KLOL506]

Couldn’t you just derive a formula for this?

Not that simple, need all the variables.

 

[Antvasima]

I have asked DontTalk for help.