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Sephiroth acquires all of the knowledge of the Ancients

After being defeated by Cloud in the Nibelheim Reaction, Sephiroth fell into the Lifestream and became its traveler- gaining the knowledge of the Ancients, and claiming that he’s surpassed them in knowledge after obtaining said knowledge. This is the reason why he knows of secret Ancient knowledge such as the existence of the Black Materia, his goal for the whole game.

I should address that while Sephiroth is hecka arrogant, arrogant people typically don’t boast that they have abilities (in this case knowledge) that they actually don’t have, otherwise they have nothing to be arrogant/proud of. So it’s more than likely true that he actually does have all Ancient/Cetran Knowledge

Also, creators typically don't put in statements about characters for the sake of them bluffing, if they put it in on purpose, they more than likely mean it to be true, otherwise they wouldn't spend their time making that clear.

Materia contain fragments of the Ancients' Knowledge

Materia are crystallizations of the Ancients’ Knowledge, or at the very least, they contain the knowledge of the Ancients

This means that the entirety of the Ancients’ Knowledge would be including everything they've known contained in Materia

Therefore, Sephiroth should have all of the powers of the Ancients, and therefore Materia

Just in case, let’s take a look at our Power Inheritance Standards

An acceptable case is of the following:

“The character in question's power is the direct source of all the powers and has demonstrated the power to use the abilities of all other characters to some extent. Being the direct source means to not just be the source of the supernatural energie(s) in the verse, but also of the techniques accomplished by them. E.g. being the source of all mana doesn't imply knowing every spell that was ever invented. So to assume the character knows how to accomplish every spell and has the necessary talent and affinity to do so additional evidence is required.”

  • In our case, the “character’s power” is “Sephiroth’s knowledge” or to more easily digest “the entirety of the Ancients’ Knowledge"- which Sephiroth has acquired.
  • This knowledge is the “direct source of all the powers of all the other characters”, well in this case “all the other characters” is “all the Materia”

The criteria for it also is to demonstrate that he is able to use all of the abilities Materia has to offer to SOME extent, he’s demonstrably already been able to showcase to us that he already has most of the powers Materia grants him- all five types in fact.

Support Materia: His Deen attack targets all opponents, just like All Materia. And various physical attacks he does like with his Wing Attack are laced with other extra effects (Paralysis/Blind) much like the Added Effect Materia.

Summon Materia: If I recall, Supernova draws opponents into a separate space to make the attack happen, which is what Summons from their Summon Materia does.

Command Materia: He has Enemy Skills (Death Sentence and Shadow Flare), which is a Command Materia

Independent Materia: If you kill Jenova-SYNTHESIS with Knights of the Round, Sephiroth in turn gets more HP, which is sort of supporting evidence for a representation of an HP Up Materia, which is an Indepedent Materia

He has demonstrably shown the effects of nearly every Magic Materia in the original FFVII (when no other Materia has been invented yet as the first installment of the series)
The only ones missing would be:
  • Revive (even though the whole plot revolves around him reviving, and also Revive cannot be used on yourself if you’re already defeated): Technically demonstrated by Bizzaro Energy
  • Full Cure: Technically demonstrated by Bizzaro Energy
  • Exit: Technically demonstrated by Supernova
  • Shield: Technically demonstrated by Wall
  • Ultima (which he should have inherited from Jenova tbh, who can use that).
And him having any of these would be absolutely BS to put in a video game. Reviving after losing just makes things hopeless, Exit just permanently banishing a party member for the fight would be stupid game design, Shield would just make him immune to everything, and Full Cure’s main weakness is MP cost when he has unlimited

---

With this, we can complete the sentence for the acceptable case of Power Inheritance from

“The character in question's power is the direct source of all the powers and has demonstrated the power to use the abilities of all other characters to some extent.”

“The Ancients’ knowledge (which Sephiroth acquired in its entirety), is the direct source of all the powers and has demonstrated the power to use the abilities of all Materia to some extent.”

Conclusion: Sephiroth (OG FFVII Onwards) should have access to the powers of every single Materia in the series. (Aside from Black Materia’s Meteor and White Materia’s Holy). Technically this is in his profile already, but there was no evidence backing it up, and TartaChocolate’s Sandbox (which is what we’re going to replace his current profile with) just completely omits it because of that.

I would also argue that he has access to every single ability monsters and robots use as the Enemy Skill Materia essentially copies how they use Mako/Spiritual Energy (the same thing) to attack (so basically any notable attack they may have), however most of these are pretty much useless, even the Weapons. But sitll, he should be able to do these too.



also we should have a Young Sephiroth key for him too lol, probably H6A for being a SOLDIER and apparently they can fight and beat Ifrit(?)
 
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Ik my input usually means nothing in CRTs, but...

Yeah, this all seems reasonable upon a cursory glance.
 
One more, well, honestly, this isn't a very controversal or even a major change, it's just providing evidence for what we already have so I kind of doubt we really need three guys to accept this.

I'll probably implement it into Tarta's sandbox by splitting the VII tab into two sub tabs- splitting between Jenova's stuff and Lifestream Knowledge stuff, kind of like what we have right now for the current profile, except that the tabs are within the VII tab
 
Heyo, just like we talked, so count me in agreeing as well. Doesn't add up anything but still, lol. Didn't expect to see the CRT so soon.

Summons are included as well, correct?

Yeah, a First SOLDIER key for Sephiroth would be great, but I haven't even touched Ever Crisis...
 
Summons are indeed included yeah, though in terms of AP only KotR really compete, but the hax of the others could be applied when combined with Elemental Support Materia abilities that Sephiroth would also have


I should also point out that since there are multiple copies of the same Materia, Sephiroth can theoretically (though unquantifiably) stack a lot of Materia abilities onto himself such as say, Speed Up Materia, much like how Cloud and Co. can stack multiple Independent Materia than enhance their stats. This would be a huge stat amp, but idk how far we could take that kind of claim since it’s pretty easy to wank and say “yeah he can fight 3-A people by stacking 129482 Strength Up Materia on himself”
 
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I think Ever Crisis is a different canon. The story has some differences

I'm not sure if that's enough to prove Sephiroth has literally every spell and Materia though, surpassing them in knowledge and gaining their knowledge likely doesn't mean he has every bit of information they have
 
Summons are indeed included yeah, though in terms of AP only KotR really compete, but the hax of the others could be applied when combined with Elemental Support Materia abilities that Sephiroth would also have


I should also point out that since there are multiple copies of the same Materia, Sephiroth can theoretically (though unquantifiably) stack a lot of Materia abilities onto himself such as say, Speed Up Materia, much like how Cloud and Co. can stack multiple Independent Materia than enhance their stats. This would be a huge stat amp, but idk how far we could take that kind of claim since it’s pretty easy to wank and say “yeah he can fight 3-A people by stacking 129482 Strength Up Materia on himself”
Status boost Materia caps at x2, though.
 
I'm not sure if that's enough to prove Sephiroth has literally every spell and Materia though, surpassing them in knowledge and gaining their knowledge likely doesn't mean he has every bit of information they have
I see where you’re stance is coming from, if he really did get all of the Ancients’ knowledge he wouldn’t need a Black Materia which contains knowledge (though Rebirth has some counters to that) to summon Meteor- but I still stand by my claim- looking at the line

Sephiroth: I'm far superior to the Ancients. I became a traveler of the Lifestream and gained the knowledge and wisdom of the Ancients. I also gained the knowledge and wisdom of those after the extinction of the Ancients. And soon, I will create the future.

A couple notes- he’s “far superior” to them, meaning that he thinks their knowledge is relatively small to what he knows. And secondly, his logic that he’s superior to them is based on the fact that he both their knowledge and the knowledge of those after them. When someone makes this kind of claim that they’re superior to another, it’s framed in a fashion of “I’m you but better” or a “you + more”.

If you don’t know what another person knows, how could you claim to know more than them? If he claims to know more than the Ancients he should know just how much and what they know. If he doesn’t know what they know, and he finds out- he’d then automatically know what they know by finding out what they don’t know- and the process would repeat until the claim is just true.

Even if you say he does know that they know stuff he doesn’t- Sephiroth’s plan is like… 90% based on Ancient knowledge I swear. He needed to know their knowledge to enact his plans (and he "travelled" the lifestream for that reason)- if there’s something he doesn’t know he would seek it out to make sure his plan goes smoothly, he was pretty much locked in when it came to planning during the game- so when he claims he knows more than the Ancients, he’s not doing so out of ignorance- he would have made complete sure that it’s true before he boasts about it (since you can’t be proud about something that isn’t true- ex. Saying you’re the best sprinter in the world while getting a Silver Medal at the Olympics)

There’s also the fact that Sephiroth has been working with Materia for a really long time now, most Materia is artificially made by Shinra so Sephiroth would likely seen and played with all kinds of them for like 10+ years. If he’s saying that he is superior to all of that, then the knowledge of Materia as a whole that he’s seen would look insignificant to him

Also, the claim I’m making is backed up by the fact that Sephiroth demonstrates that he knows (basically) every Magic Materia spell ever on screen- or at the very least has moves that replicate said effects of Magic Materia, and even some Support, Command, and Summon Materia

I don’t really mind having a “likely all abilities granted by Materia” on the profile- though for me personally it’s pretty clear cut this is what the creators intended, otherwise they wouldn’t demonstrate Sephiroth using a bunch of spells that are identical to that of Materia, and they wouldn’t have had Sephiroth say this line at all. It’s one of those things where you know it’s true but it’s really hard to prove
 
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Safer Sephiroth knows high end magic like Flare and Shadowflare and even before the timeskip he mastered Materia like Revive, Fire, Ice etc. I also remember him being knowledgeable about Materia when they were travelling to the reactor. It's not unbelievable that with Lifestream access or just pure experience he would know stuff like Ultima etc. especially so when the party gets access to those Materia before fighting him in Disc 3.
 
Gonna bump this one. I'll probably make it a weekly thing- (not that I think we really need more staff votes as it's not a big thing)
 
Okay, it’s been a week and the minimum amount of staff (even if it’s FF it’s just one facet of one single character) has been in favor of this- and there is little to no opposition currently it seems- so I’m going to deem this as just, accepted- and will just add it to the current page and Tarta’s box sometime tonight
 
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