Is Omnipresence Downplayed on the Wiki?

[Sniper670]

How exactly do you beat an omnipresent character ???? Any examples??

So there's this character I have in mind who's mentioned to be in everything and nowhere at once. He's in the opponent, in their weapon, their shoe, etc. Wherever, it's in it, wherever, it's not. It's all Metaphysical Mind, think of Brahman-like entity

It's not bounded by space, nor time, nor non space and Non time. And has 0 anti feat against him.

So if he had a fight against a character with 0 feat of affecting such Omnipresent characters(who are you affecting? it's in you as well), how will that work??

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Range. If their Omnipresent on a 2-A Scale then just destroy everything on a 2-A Scale. Whether or not the opponent can manage that to a high enough degree or not is dependent.

 

[Sniper670]

Ive always wondered this..... Why would destroying everything kill an Omnipresent being. And I mean a True Omnipresent being, the Religion Type. I've seen some goofy omnipresent characters on the wiki lol

You'd have to destroy yourself as well, because it's in you, it might as well not exist at all. You can't interact with it so why should destroying the multiverse kill it?

 

[Bobsican]

Ive always wondered this..... Why would destroying everything kill an Omnipresent being. And I mean a True Omnipresent being, the Religion Type. I've seen some goofy omnipresent characters on the wiki lol

You'd have to destroy yourself as well, because it's in you, it might as well not exist at all. You can't interact with it so why should destroying the multiverse kill it?

Well, that's simply a NLF, even a tier 0 isn't truly "omnipresent" on all structures there can be and whatever.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Omnipresence can be a weakness if you are Omnipresent through something. Like if you are Omnipresent across Space and Time then destroying Space and Time may **** you over.

Of course, you also have Omnipresence that works on more straightforward terms. "He is everywhere and nowhere, in everything and nothing at the same time." You can't really do anything about that.

 

[Sniper670]

Omnipresence can be a weakness if you are Omnipresent through something. Like if you are Omnipresent across Space and Time then destroying Space and Time may **** you over.

Ahah, you hammered on a point I wanted to make. Destroying the 2A structure will only work if he's omnipresent accross space and time of such structure

Of course, you also have Omnipresence that works on more straightforward terms. "He is everywhere and nowhere, in everything and nothing at the same time." You can't really do anything about that.

Interesting indeed...... So how does the wiki treat such characters, who aren't bound by space and time, thus, destroying their space and time will do nothing to it?

 

[Sniper670]

Well, that's simply a NLF, even a tier 0 isn't truly "omnipresent" on all structures there can be and whatever.

Well I mean.... So the wiki placed limitations on Omnipresence then?

Because there are some omnipresents who are beyond spatio Temporal features and thus will be unaffected by destroying the space and time of it ie. The structure you're talking about

 

[Bobsican]

Strictly speaking yes, like anything else we don't assume beyond what has been actually displayed.

A case like what you've described would just be "higher" than the "main" structure they may be talking about in context, but not truly "everything" for our purposes.

Like how a character that's reliably stated to have the power to immediately destroy "everything" is defaulted to at least 3-A, 2-C if there's confirmation of multiple universes, 2-A if there's infinite universes, etc.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Interesting indeed...... So how does the wiki treat such characters, who aren't bound by space and time, thus, destroying their space and time will do nothing to it?

Well to interact with Omnipresent beings like that you just need to be able to interact with Abstracts, cause that's what they are.

 

[Bobsican]

Not necessarily, some characters are simply of the size of a universe (or above) and whatever structure a character appears on happens to be inside of it.
Generally you just need enought range/AP.

 

[Sniper670]

Strictly speaking yes, like anything else we don't assume beyond what has been actually displayed.

A case like what you've described would just be "higher" than the "main" structure they may be talking about in context, but not truly "everything" for our purposes.

Like how a character that's stated to have the power to immediately destroy "everything" is defaulted to at least 3-A, 2-C if there's confirmation of multiple universes, 2-A if there's infinite universes, etc.

I see.... So a character of let's says 2A structure that is "Boundless" in an omnipresence sense to said structure will need low 1C Ap to nuke him then?

 

[Sniper670]

Well to interact with Omnipresent beings like that you just need to be able to interact with Abstracts, cause that's what they are.

So you'd need, specifically Omnipresence AE interaction to interact with said characters?

I don't think simply interacting with Abstracts will help you with this tho

 

[Le'garde273]

I thought this will be a question why omnipresence still can be blitzed

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

So you'd need, specifically Omnipresence AE interaction to interact with said characters?

I don't think simply interacting with Abstracts will help you with this tho

Range handles the size, so interacting with anything like an Omnipresent being on any scale would be enough.

 

[Bobsican]

I see.... So a character of let's says 2A structure that is "Boundless" in an omnipresence sense to said structure will need low 1C Ap to nuke him then?

2-A AP is enought, now if the character would survive their own nuke is up to debate.

 

[Sniper670]

Range handles the size, so interacting with anything like an Omnipresent being on any scale would be enough.

You see. There are two kinds of Omnipresents
1. Some have a sort of body, Abstract body somehow. Madoka is a great example of this

2. They have nothing. They're in everything, and nowhere, not even bound to the 2A structure. They don't have a thing to affect, an abstract may embody something, but this thing does not embody anything. It's just a "Boundless Presence"

 

[Sniper670]

2-A AP is enought, now if the character would survive their own nuke is up to debate.

But.... Why? I don't get it

Why would it be affected by destroying a structure
1. Can't be seen
2. Can't be felt nor does he have anything to destroy because it really.... doesn't have anything to destroy
3. Does not embody a thing
4. Is not bound to the structure

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

You see. There are two kinds of Omnipresents
1. Some have a sort of body, Abstract body somehow. Madoka is a great example of this

Usually, we just see that stuff as avatars.

2. They have nothing. They're in everything, and nowhere, not even bound to the 2A structure. They don't have a thing to affect, an abstract may embody something, but this thing does not embody anything. It's just a "Boundless Presence"

You just described why we have two types of Abstract Existence, one embodies something, and the other is its own abstract, its own localized thing.

 

[Sniper670]

Yeah, but interacting with them means they do have a form, no?

That's a literal anti feat right there. Which I why I mentioned there are some goofy omnipresent entities on the wiki

Madoka, has a form, not avatar, nah.. They literally anti feated her state of being when she hugged Homura or whatever her be was

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Incorporeal (or Non-Corporeal) beings are those who have no true physical form. Though they may have physical avatars or bodies, but their true essence exists non-physically, whether as a soul, as energy, or as an abstract concept.

If you can interact with a formless abstract you can interact with that kind of omnipresence is what I'm saying.

 

[Sniper670]

I see...... I guess we're straying a bit from what I had an issue with. But from what I gathered, an omnipresent not bound to a 2A structure will still be destroyed by Nuking said structure?

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

I see...... I guess we're straying a bit from what I had an issue with. But from what I gathered, an omnipresent not bound to a 2A structure will still be destroyed by Nuking said structure?

It's like if a character has a Large Size, if that Large Size is just based on their raw size without being linked to anything then only attacking them directly would work. Other wise you can target the structure they are basing that large size off of.

 

[Thelastmlg]

Tbh the kind of omnipresence where you are also your opponent probably means said opponent is from their verse, i don't think we assume this stuff applies to other verses in a vs match? Idk

In that case they are probably fighting a in-verse unbeatable entity tbh

 

[Sniper670]

It's like if a character has a Large Size, if that Large Size is just based on their raw size without being linked to anything then only attacking them directly would work. Other wise you can target the structure they are basing that large size off of.

I see.....

So specifically, you'd need specifically Omnipresent interaction to affect such entities removed from said structures then

 

[Sniper670]

Tbh the kind of omnipresence where you are also your opponent probably means said opponent is from their verse, i don't think we assume this stuff applies to other verses in a vs match? Idk

In that case they are probably fighting a in-verse unbeatable entity tbh

Hmmph.... Its I've seen some matches on wiki where an Omnipresent fights another where they have 0 feat of affecting and they still lose. The assumption being to destroy the structure

Seems like a loophole to me tbh

 

[Vietthai96]

Depend on feat and context, some characters with Omnipresent can lose because they have some weakness like can't fight without vessel or something similar, which can be incapped. Again it is depend on what was shown

 

[Delta333]

True omnipresent beings will definitely in the opponents as well...but fiction does not care about logic so unless that being have shown similar feat in verse I think we should not assume like that at all.

 

[Sniper670]

So how do you deal with something like this btw?

"The Original One is in all things. The Original One is nowhere at all. From all creations, over all creations, does the Original One watch over all."

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

"The Original One is in all things. The Original One is nowhere at all. From all creations, over all creations, does the Original One watch over all."

Think of a humanoid that has a given size of an average human. This humanoid is also stated to not exist, it is not even there.

That quote is basically similar, only this entity has a given size of the entire cosmology, yet does not exist; can't be found on any plane of existence.

NEP (Type 2) interaction + Range + Appropriate tier should be able to deal with it.

 

[Bobsican]

But.... Why? I don't get it

Why would it be affected by destroying a structure
1. Can't be seen
2. Can't be felt nor does he have anything to destroy because it really.... doesn't have anything to destroy
3. Does not embody a thing
4. Is not bound to the structure

It's still bound to some level of reality to begin with, just nuke that level and that should be enought if there's nothing to claim otherwise beyond mere size, as much as we don't assume any resistance whatsoever to work against a smurf ability if the resistance isn't displayed to be on a smurf level as well.

 

[Sniper670]

Think of a humanoid that has a given size of an average human. This humanoid is also stated to not exist, it is not even there.

That quote is basically similar, only this entity has a given size of the entire cosmology, yet does not exist; can't be found on any plane of existence.

NEP (Type 2) interaction + Range + Appropriate tier should be able to deal with it.

I see.... Does being everywhere and nowhere imply nonexistence?

 

[Sniper670]

It's still bound to some level of reality to begin with,

just nuke that level and that should be enought if there's nothing to claim otherwise beyond mere size, as much as we don't assume any resistance whatsoever to work against a smurf ability if the resistance isn't displayed to be on a smurf level as well.

So what if the thing you want to nuke, is, everywhere and nowhere at all. What are you Nuking exactly?? He's not there.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

I see.... Does being everywhere and nowhere imply nonexistence?

Yes, since it is paradoxically there and yet isn't.

 

[ImmortalDread]

I think the answer is range. Someone is omnipresent only in that said earth, destroy the earth.

 

[Bobsican]

So what if the thing you want to nuke, is, everywhere and nowhere at all. What are you Nuking exactly?? He's not there.

You're nuking the structure as a whole to begin with, rather than merely the stuff within its space, this is like asking the difference between High 3-A and Low 2-C

 

[Sniper670]

I think the answer is range. Someone is omnipresent only in that said earth, destroy the earth.

Well here's the thing, some Omnipresents are not bound to any structure, like the guy I pointed out earlier. So destroying a structure won't do anything to it.

For example, the entity i mentioned earlier, is a primordial "Presence" that extends beyond time and space, which is a 2A structure. So will destroying the 2A structure kill him? That wouldn't work would it?

 

[ImmortalDread]

Well, that's simply a NLF, even a tier 0 isn't truly "omnipresent" on all structures there can be and whatever.

ngl tier 0 is a such joke. I heard some arguments that tier 9 could beat tier 0 alone with the statement (the boundless character can be beaten and interacted with)

 

[Sniper670]

Yes, since it is paradoxically there and yet isn't.

Do you know of some entities like that on the wiki. I'm interested

 

[ImmortalDread]

Well here's the thing, some Omnipresents are not bound to any structure, like the guy I pointed out earlier. So destroying a structure won't do anything to it.

For example, the entity i mentioned earlier, is a primordial "Presence" that extends beyond time and space, which is a 2A structure. So will destroying the 2A structure kill him? That wouldn't work would it?

I would not say killing him. Who said that? You would only remove his omnipresence.

 

[Sniper670]

You're nuking the structure as a whole to begin with, rather than merely the stuff within its space, this is like asking the difference between High 3-A and Low 2-C

So you need a range beyond just 2A then?