Ippo Makonouchi vs Joe Yabuki REMATCH

[Sorvoe551]

I know this match was already voted on and decided a while ago, but after reading the entirety of the Ashita no Joe manga, I believe that this fight is more in Ippo's favor than previously thought, so I thought it would be worth debating once again.

Same rules as the previous discussion: Both Featherweight, no prior knowledge, physical peak for both, unlimited rounds, win by KO.

Joe Yabuki, The Grim Reaper

Ippo Makonouchi, The Wind God

 

[Sorvoe551]

I will go into more detail for each point if necessary, but to start my argument, I will mention points from the three biggest fights in Ashita no Joe: Carlos Rivera, Kim Yong-Bi, and Jose Mendoza.

Carlos Rivera: Both of them were about equal in skill, but by the end, Joe couldn't KO Carlos and vice versa. The fight ultimately ended with the two of them passing out simultaneously after it had devolved into a brawl and all the rules were thrown out the window.

Kim Yong-Bi: Joe couldn't land a single hit on Kim in this fight and the only reason Joe knocked him out as quickly as he did was because Joe's bleeding face casued Kim's PTSD from the Korean War to resurface and he freaked out, not even attempting to run away or block after Joe regained his composure

Jose Mendoza: There are multiple points for this fight, so I will bulletpoint them.

-The only reason Joe landed a hit early in the fight was because his blind right eye caused his fist to subconsciously slip to the right a little bit, enough to counter Jose's minimum-effort dodging technique. If Joe wasn't partially blind during the fight, he wouldn't have landed a hit until much later due to Jose's fatigue or getting in his head.

-Jose lost composure after his dodging started to fail and he became scared after Joe kept getting back up. Again, if Joe wasn't blinded, this wouldn't have happened until much later in the fight and the outcome could have been much different

-Due to the manga cutting away to Youko driving away in a taxi, we miss most of Round 7 and come back at the start of Round 12. We only know for certain, due to blurbs from the commentary on the radio, that both Jose and Joe went down once in that timespan. We can't be certain as to how much abuse either fighter received during that period.

-The reason Joe started to "improve" and make things more one-sided during Rounds 12-15 was because by then, he was practically dead. He no longer felt the pain and fatigue, so he just started swinging as hard as he could, even throwing in a cross counter. Also, Jose was terrified of Joe's lifeless eyes and unrelenting stamina, to the point where he threw Joe to the ground and started sucker-punching him.

I can go into more detail and provide points for Ippo, but for now, I will leave it here to start the discussion.

 

[Sorvoe551]

Bump

 

[GimmyJibbsJr]

Firstly, Ippo should have the speed advantage since the OP doesn't specifically state that speed equalized. Reason for Ippo having the speed edge is that he is flat out Subsonic with Transonic reactions/combat speed as opposed to Joe who is Peak Human with Subsonic Reactions/combat speed.

I do feel like Ippo and Joe are comparable in durability, as Ippo was able to withstand the punch of someone whos fist was stated to hold the power of a speeding truck and Joe could take hits from someone who could knock cows out with barehanded punches.

That being said, I'd wager that they Joe is the smarter fighter, even if Ippo has fought more opponents then Joe. While, yes, Ippo has been getting better with tactical thinking due to becoming a Second, Joe has apparently shown to be more strategic from day one, so he is probably smarter then Ippo even if he technically has less experience.

That being said, Ippo has more variety in his techniques then Joe. Joe is highly adaptive, but Ippo is incredible at putting pressure onto outboxers like Joe as seen in the sparring match between Ippo and Itagaki, where Ippo was able to force Itagaki into a corner and then pummel him.

Heck, thanks to Ippo's superior speed, he'll likely FINALLY be able to make the most out of his headslips and peekaboo style, which is something he practices and uses in most every match he is in. With that said, Ippo should also have an easy time pinning Joe down thanks to his speed advantage, keeping him form getting any time to do anything. Plus, if Ippo manages to land a Heart Break Shot on Joe, that will leave Joe stunned long enough for Ippo to land one of his more notable punches, like the Liver Blow or Dempsey Roll.

Plus, clinching would be a terrible idea for Joe because then he would put himself right in Ippo's range, and Ippo has shown that he doesn't lose any power in his punches even if he can't get a proper windup on them.

Again, only thing Joe truly has going for him is that he is smarter.

However, I am voting for Ippo to win with High Difficulty because of his greater speed, good evasive capabilities and technique versatility.

 

[Sorvoe551]

Another point I forgot to mention, throughout Ashita no Joe, Joe went down several times in all but one of his fights that we saw. In contrast, there is a long stretch of fights for Ippo where he doesn't go down at all. Oh sure, there were moments where he nearly went down, but he always saved himself and kept fighting. It wasn't until he fought Alfredo Gonzales that he finally fell again. Sure, Joe technically only truly lost twice, the other three instances were him throwing up, but it says a lot about Ippo that he went through several fights without falling once.

 

[Mirai-Koichi]

Sorry if necro-bump but this result definetly needs to be overturned. Joe shouldn't be able to hang with Ippo in the long haul and Ippo has a much wider array of techniques and experience fighting far more skilled Boxers.


Also not that it should matter much but apparantley an IRL simulation was made to showcase who of the two boxers woul win in a match, and the event was screened to the Authors of both manga with Ippo coming out as the victor (Supposedly in a Round 5 KO via body blow)

Fight Page

 

[Sorvoe551]

It's not a necro, it was less than a month, but yeah, low traffic for this match.

 

[Sorvoe551]

Bump