Infinity Ultron downgrade

[XXKINGXX69]

Infinity Ultron's speed is

Speed: Massively Hypersonic+ (Should be equal to Vision) | At least Relativistic+, likely far higher (Should be faster than his Sentries, which flew from space and destroyed Ego in seconds. Immensely superior to Captain Marvel). Massively FTL+ attack speed with Energy Manipulation. Massively FTL+ with Size Manipulation

There is no reason for him to be equal to main universe Vision, otherwise we can scale what if feats to their main universe counterparts, and downgrade Thanos to below Mind Stone tier. There's also no reason why he would be faster than his sentries at all, that part is arbitrary. "Immensely superior to Captain Marvel" yeah sure this is me when I am immensely superior to Captain Marvel in speed

MFTL+ attack speed and size is fine, but the rest should just be unknown, he doesn't have speed feats

 

[KLOL506]

By that logic we might as well stop scaling all What If characters to their MCU counterparts because they don't have speed feats for themselves. Let's just stop scaling variant Loki to the movie Loki despite literally being the same exact ******* character from the Avengers escaping the clutches of the Avengers and becoming a Variant.

That is not how this works. They got their powers in the exact same way, the past events remain 1:1 to a certain degree, and did you just seriously say not to scale to Captain Marvel despite having the Sentries flying through space? That's already a big L I am seeing right here.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

By that logic we might as well stop scaling all What If characters to their MCU counterparts because they don't have speed feats for themselves. Let's just stop scaling variant Loki to the movie Loki despite literally being the same exact ******* character from the Avengers escaping the clutches of the Avengers and becoming a Variant.

That is not how this works. They got their powers in the exact same way, the past events remain 1:1 to a certain degree, and did you just seriously say not to scale to Captain Marvel despite having the Sentries flying through space? That's already a big L I am seeing right here.

By that logic we might as well stop scaling all What If characters to their MCU counterparts because they don't have speed feats for themselves.

I'm fine with that

Let's just stop scaling variant Loki to the movie Loki despite literally being the same exact ******* character from the Avengers escaping the clutches of the Avengers and becoming a Variant.

The what-if versions are even more different

That is not how this works. They got their powers in the exact same way, the past events remain 1:1 to a certain degree

I don't remember this, send scans

and did you just seriously say not to scale to Captain Marvel despite having the Sentries flying through space? That's already a big L I am seeing right here.

Did you see the clip I linked where he was blitzed by Captain Marvel? I also refuted this when I said he shouldn't scale to his sentries

 

[KLOL506]

I'm fine with that



The what-if versions are even more different

I'm sorry, what? Are you even listening to yourself?

Carter got amped by the same exact serum that was meant for Steve, she'd scale in full to whatever feats he has in the mainline MCU movies because they're both powered by the same exact Serum, hence, 8-C and MHS+ combat speed and reaction.

Loki is literally Loki from the Avengers but he doesn't get sent back to Asgard. WHERE IS THE GODDAMN DIFFERENCE IN POWER LEVELS HERE? This is the same exact ******* Loki that jobbed Avengers Cap hard and took a blast from Iron Man, only difference is that he got the Tesseract in his hands and then poof, off he went to become a variant.

I don't remember this, send scans

You can't be serious on this.

Literally watch Loki's first episode and What If's episode on Captain Carter.

Did you see the clip I linked where he was blitzed by Captain Marvel? I also refuted this when I said he shouldn't scale to his sentries

THIS THE WORST EXAMPLE TO USE AS A BLITZ. Ultron is literally stronger than her and has plenty of reason to just **** around and find out with her and thus doesn't even put up an attempt to react to her.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

I'm sorry, what? Are you even listening to yourself?

Carter got amped by the same exact serum that was meant for Steve, she'd scale in full to whatever feats he has in the mainline MCU movies because they're both powered by the same exact Serum, hence, 8-C and MHS+ combat speed and reaction.

What-if Carter? That's also a different universe serum iirc

Loki is literally Loki from the Avengers but he doesn't get sent back to Asgard. WHERE IS THE GODDAMN DIFFERENCE HERE?

Are you talking about the alt timeline Loki from his solo series or what-if?

Literally watch Loki's first episode and What If's episode on Captain Carter.

Send scans

THIS THE WORST EXAMPLE TO USE AS A BLITZ. Ultron is literally stronger than her and has plenty of reason to just **** around and find out with her and thus doesn't even put up an attempt to react to her.

How do you know he could blitz her? And why would he even be immensely superior to her in speed?

 

[KLOL506]

What-if Carter? That's also a different universe serum iirc

Are you being ******* serious right now?

The only thing different about Carter's side is that she is the one who took the serum instead of Steve. Otherwise all the variant timelines hail straight from the Sacred Timeline and shares all its properties. Saying that it's a different universe does not prove that the formula is somehow inherently weaker than the Sacred Timeline because there's no reason to do so nor would it make any sense in the grand scheme of things.

Are you talking about the alt timeline Loki from his solo series or what-if?

Loki from his Solo Series called Loki. He's a Variant too.

Send scans

I LITERALLY SENT YOU THE EPISODE NAMES BRUH.

WHAT IF CAPTAIN CARTER WERE THE FIRST AVENGER

LOKI EPISODE GLORIOUS PURPOSE

How do you know he could blitz her? And why would he even be immensely superior to her in speed?

Watch the part where he one-shots her in the planet's core. Ultron literally just played around with her because he had the stones and could deadass do anything without even having to move. Watch as he says how he can destroy entire galaxies with a thought.

 

[Coolboy6]

KLOL obviously makes sense here, this dude is probably being a troll as usual

 

[KLOL506]

@Qawsedf234 @Dalesean027 @Colonel_Krukov @Propellus @Aguywhodoesthings Here we go again.

 

[KLOL506]

There is no reason for him to be equal to main universe Vision, otherwise we can scale what if feats to their main universe counterparts, and downgrade Thanos to below Mind Stone tier.

No, it means Mind Stone is of a higher tier than Thanos, and Thanos was literally too arrogant to take notice, if Thanos were at full guard expecting the worst, Ultron would be ******* dead in that instant. But he wasn't, so he's the one who died. WOG explicitly confirms this.

There's also no reason why he would be faster than his sentries at all, that part is arbitrary.

Because he's way stronger than his fodder sentries? What makes you think he's just gonna make Sentries faster than him and his powers?

 

[KLOL506]

Oh, oh, Vision was also unable to unlock the true power of the Mind Stone. Ultron doesn't have that weakness.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

KLOL pretty much says everything I have to say

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Yup, I agree with everything that KLOL has said

 

[Dalesean027]

Wait does he not realize Ultros had already killed CM and Thanos mumerous times over in his other universe conquest not just the ones shown on screen where he's chilling...

 

[KLOL506]

Literally the point of What If serves as to universes where only the outcome of certain events were changed. If they were not, they'd literally play out the exact ******* same as the Sacred Timeline, most of these timelines make no changes to how the characters obtained their powers and remain 1:1 to the prior movies up until a wacky point where "X character does not die like he's mandated to in the Sacred Timeline" and something like that. Just ask Classic Loki, everything for him panned out the exact same way up until the start of Infinity War where he used illusions to trick Thanos into believing he had snapped his neck, but Loki used this this fake his death and go into hiding, and he wasn't a variant still. He lived in solitude for decades until he missed his brother Thor so much that he desired to see him one last time, and that's how the TVA got to him.

 

[KLOL506]

Wait does he not realize Ultros had already killed CM and Thanos mumerous times over in his other universe conquest not just the ones shown on screen where he's chilling...

I just said those parts.

 

[AbaddonTheDisappointment]

The only thing here I would even consider is the “being faster than his sentries” bit and that’s only a maybe cuz why would he be any slower?

KLOL pretty much summarized everything else I would’ve said

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Are you being ******* serious right now?

The only thing different about Carter's side is that she is the one who took the serum instead of Steve. Otherwise all the variant timelines hail straight from the Sacred Timeline and shares all its properties. Saying that it's a different universe does not prove that the formula is somehow inherently weaker than the Sacred Timeline because there's no reason to do so nor would it make any sense in the grand scheme of things.


Loki from his Solo Series called Loki. He's a Variant too.


I LITERALLY SENT YOU THE EPISODE NAMES BRUH.

WHAT IF CAPTAIN CARTER WERE THE FIRST AVENGER

LOKI EPISODE GLORIOUS PURPOSE


Watch the part where he one-shots her in the planet's core. Ultron literally just played around with her because he had the stones and could deadass do anything without even having to move. Watch as he says how he can destroy entire galaxies with a thought.

I mean sure but that would apply to Carter, not Ultron

Loki from his Solo Series called Loki. He's a Variant too.

I didn't watch that. Prove it works the same as what-if and the fact that they share the same history except for small differences applies to what-if as well

I LITERALLY SENT YOU THE EPISODE NAMES BRUH.

I'm not gonna rewatch the whole episode, either tell me the timestamp or record the clip

Watch the part where he one-shots her in the planet's core. Ultron literally just played around with her because he had the stones and could deadass do anything without even having to move. Watch as he says how he can destroy entire galaxies with a thought.

He doesn't react to her. Its just an attack speed feat

 

[Dalesean027]

I just said those parts.

Trust me I know I'm just not seeing how he's not making the correction
Anyways I'm obviously in agreeance with KLOL

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Because he's way stronger than his fodder sentries? What makes you think he's just gonna make Sentries faster than him and his powers?

Strength=/= speed. This isn't enough for evidence that he scales to them in speed. His sentries were also tagged and destroyed immediately by Hawkeye's arrows, which aren't boosted in speed or whatever, so I doubt their flight speed even scales to combat

 

[KLOL506]

I mean sure but that would apply to Carter, not Ultron

Why not? Vision's body composition did not change, only thing that changed is that Ultron got to it first, killed the Avengers and unlocked full mastery of the Mind Stone. Deadass that's the only difference. If that didn't happen, it'd pan out exactly as it did in Age of Ultron.

I didn't watch that.

Then why are you claiming otherwise from stuff you didn't watch?

Imagine having this much ******* disregard for the CRTs you make without actually having gone in-depth with your findings.

Prove it works the same as what-if and the fact that they share the same history except for small differences applies to what-if as well

YOU HAVE GOT TO BE ******** ME.

WHAT IF CANNOT EXIST WITHOUT LOKI. Sylvie killing He Who Remains is what triggered the spontaneous formation of all those alternate timelines

I'm not gonna rewatch the whole episode, either tell me the timestamp or record the clip

Literally in the very beginning of both episodes, you don't even have to watch the entire episode.

He doesn't react to her. Its just an attack speed feat

Because he literally doesn't care. He's got all the stones at this point, he could wipe her out of existence with a thought without giving a second care.

 

[KLOL506]

Strength=/= speed. This isn't enough for evidence that he scales to them in speed. His sentries were also tagged and destroyed immediately by Hawkeye's arrows, which aren't boosted in speed or whatever, so I doubt their flight speed even scales to combat

DUDE. HE'S GOT THE INFINITY STONES TO HIM. HE EVEN FORGED A STRONGER BODY THAN HIS SENTRIES.

Also those Sentries aren't even travelling at top speed against Bart or Natasha because their sheer numbers would be enough to overwhelm them, which it actually does when Bart sacrifices himself to save Nat.

At this point I'm deadass convinced you're just trolling in this thread.

Either you have a good grasp of what you're making CRTs about by properly watching the goddamn shows, or don't make them at all.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Yeah, What-ifs being the same except for one event that changes it all is like, the entire plot of the show. I haven't even watched the show and I know this. How the flippity dippity diddle doodle **** do you not get this mate?

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Plus, Ultron already scales to Strange Supreme as well, who scales above main strange, who also scales to Rel+. So he's easily Rel+ without Captain Marvel

 

[KLOL506]

Plus, Ultron already scales to Strange as well, who scales above main strange, who also scales to Rel+. So he's easily Rel+ without Captain Marvel

Ah yeah. Strange Supreme. Who literally watched Palmer die but otherwise had the same exact past and backstory up until Endgame.

 

[Valiant_Abyss]

Boy, if I had a dollar for every time someone tried to ignorantly change Vultron’s extensively debated statistics…

 

[RoTt35]

I disagree with the op FRA

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Boy, if I had a dollar for every time someone tried to ignorantly change Vultron’s extensively debated statistics…

Millionaire right here fr

 

[Chariot190]

I didn't watch that.

Then why are you even arguing.

 

[Dalesean027]

Just saying as well all scaling aside

The literal intro to what if literally says a single decision branches out into infinite realities so we're literally being told only 1 thing being changed is all it takes to affect things so since you obviously didn't watch either show and wanted scans here you go and as KLOL said

Carter got amped by the same exact serum that was meant for Steve, she'd scale in full to whatever feats he has in the mainline MCU movies because they're both powered by the same exact Serum, hence, 8-C and MHS+ combat speed and reaction.

Loki is literally Loki from the Avengers but he doesn't get sent back to Asgard. WHERE IS THE GODDAMN DIFFERENCE IN POWER LEVELS HERE? This is the same exact ******* Loki that jobbed Avengers Cap hard and took a blast from Iron Man, only difference is that he got the Tesseract in his hands and then poof, off he went to become a variant.

There's literally no way that doesn't clear up that part for you if anything said by literally anyone especially KLOL numerous times didn't clear it up for ya already

 

[KLOL506]

Then why are you even arguing.

My ******* thoughts exactly.

 

[Dalesean027]

My thing is as well on top of not watching the shows you just made claims that you didn't even remotely try to prove literally just sending out of context clips without even knowing the context yourself, the fact that KLOL even entertained you this long when the burden of proof fell on you is honestly crazy enough imo so you could've at least just watched 2 like 30-40 minute episodes and came back here for all that's worth

 

[Qawsedf234]

There is no reason for him to be equal to main universe Vision, otherwise we can scale what if feats to their main universe counterparts, and downgrade

To explain the current policy: The scaling is one way, not two.

A What If character can scale to their main universe version, the reverse however isn't currently allowed. So Infinity Ultron or IU Captain Marvel scaling to their main counterparts is allowed, we just can't backscale those versions.

But as a note the watcher clip is wrong. There's other changes in the Infiniry Ultron universe besides just Ultron winning. Thanos had five of the Infinity stones in 2014 as an example and he got the Soul Stone without killing Gamora.

 

[Dalesean027]

But as a note the watcher clip is wrong. There's other changes in the Infiniry Ultron universe besides just Ultron winning. Thanos had five of the Infinity stones in 2014 as an example and he got the Soul Stone without killing Gamora.

Nah that doesn't make it wrong because it's not saying that exclusively one thing and only one there can be more changes just one is enough

 

[CharlesZaGreat]

But as a note the watcher clip is wrong. There's other changes in the Infiniry Ultron universe besides just Ultron winning. Thanos had five of the Infinity stones in 2014 as an example and he got the Soul Stone without killing Gamora.

Age of Ultron takes place in 2015, which is still three years prior to Infinity War. Ego is alive in the episode, despite him dying in October of 2014. There's also the fact that, in order to get the power stone, Thanos would've had to ransack Xander before Ultron even got there

 

[Colonel_Krukov]

 

[Propellus]

I share the same thoughts as KLOL here, yeah no

 

[Lonkitt]

I can be a stickler now and then when it comes to alternate universe scaling, but...Infinity Ultron's speed has completely valid scaling here. KLOL pretty much covered everything

 

[Propellus]

Since this thread is heavily disagreed on and rejected, should this thread be closed?

 

[KLOL506]

Since this thread is heavily disagreed on and rejected, should this thread be closed?

If that's what you wish, sure.

 

[Bernkastelll]

nah let it open, it is funny