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Hellsing: Schrodinger revision
- Thread starter LordGinSama
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- #202
Alucard already has normal NPI, this would be adding more layers on top of that.
I've literally seen people get NEP and such for existing as only an illusion. Zorin's illusions aren't real and do not exist physically, Subjective Reality has nothing to do with NPI. Alucard also effected himself after being erased from existence.
Bobsican
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I wouldn't say "layers" as it doesn't mean he can now affect someone with NEP above baseline (as far I can see with what's provided anyways), instead just that he can affect more kinds of intangible beings.
...That's part of my point, Subjective Reality has nothing to do with NPI, so I'm unsure how that'd support it. If you mean that interacting with something coming from SR that is "not real", then I'd prefer if ther was more proof on this qualifying for NPI, like that not being usually interactuable by the average character. The so-called EE is also already quite on dispute out of the whole deal with the blood, so I wouldn't rely too much on that.
...That's part of my point, Subjective Reality has nothing to do with NPI, so I'm unsure how that'd support it. If you mean that interacting with something coming from SR that is "not real", then I'd prefer if ther was more proof on this qualifying for NPI, like that not being usually interactuable by the average character. The so-called EE is also already quite on dispute out of the whole deal with the blood, so I wouldn't rely too much on that.
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- #204
The EE is not on dispute, this is both shown and stated, same thing with the blood. Both me and Random have told you this countless times, Alucard was indeed erased and the blood does in fact carry the soul and mind.
Stop bringing up old shit that we've already gone over.
Schrodinger Subjective Reality has nothing to do with his NPI Bob, your confusing yourself for literally no reason.
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- #206
That's fine, you can disagree all you want but that doesn't make your opinion right. This thread has been held up long enough, so if you want to create a thread about Alucard's already accepted feat of Regeneration from Erasure then you can go ahead and make a seperate CRT if you disagree.
I already provided two reasons why he needs advanced NPI, up-scaling from Alucard's Base NPI, physically effecting Zorin's illusions and effecting himself after being erased from existence.
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I agree, I was thinking I'd discuss the AP and speed stuff but in a later thread. I'd like to go over that with you, actually. I've got a possible speed and AP upgrade in mind as you know.
I have a few thoughts about Schrodinger as well but I think I might discuss that with Bobsican so we can come to some sort of arrangement. That way any Schrodinger discussion won't be a shambles.
Does it really upscale? I suppose he couldn't kill Schrodinger before.
I do have an issue with this; the fact that Schrodinger acted like he was climbing but didn't actually demonstrate any ability to move the illusionary objects around.
We can certainly agree he was without any physical form, which goes beyond intangibility. Is that a different type of NPI or just a note that he can kill something that doesn't have any physical form to attack?
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- #208
Bobsican isn't knowledgeable regarding the verse so he most likely wouldn't be of very much help tbh.
Yeah absolutely, remember Schrodinger can affect himself despite being made of his own thoughts. Up-scaling from his base NPI should acceptable.
I mean that doesn't really debunk anything he never tried to move any of the illusionary objects around. He can just exist there physically and grab the space / boarders with his hands as if it were a solid.
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Really? It seemed he was.
Well, Alucard already possessed NPI, as did Seras, and yet neither of them seemed to be able to kill Schrodinger, although admittedly neither of them tried to destroy his soul. And yet later on Alucard evidently can kill souls that have the same nature as Schrodinger's own, so that does suggest some kind of improvement, maybe due to Alucard's own soul and NPI also having that nature.
My concern isn't so much about it debunking the ability to move things around in the illusion, it's more that it means Schrodinger didn't provably demonstrate the ability to physically affect the objects in Zorin's illusion. If the fact that he acts like he is touching them is enough to make the small stretch that he can physically affect them, that's fine, it's just that he didn't actually affect them for us to see.
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No NEP as it is not sufficient.
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Going to say that I don't think Alucard killing his own souls qualifies as Advanced NPI or NPI that would be able to harm characters with NEP.
Schrödingers power doesn't just make you not exist. It more makes you "maybe exist" (as in quantum mechanical superpositions are at play).
Like, fundamentally Schrödinger's power is based on Schrödinger's Cat, that's in a state of "maybe alive". That cat could eat a treat someone left in the box like normal. Just that it would only have "maybe happened" until someone definitely observes it.
Similarly, Alucard within his catbox can probably kill his own lives as normal, while from the outside he remains caught in his paradoxical state.
It's kinda debatable whether he can do what he did to the lives inside himself to others anyway.
Schrödingers power doesn't just make you not exist. It more makes you "maybe exist" (as in quantum mechanical superpositions are at play).
Like, fundamentally Schrödinger's power is based on Schrödinger's Cat, that's in a state of "maybe alive". That cat could eat a treat someone left in the box like normal. Just that it would only have "maybe happened" until someone definitely observes it.
Similarly, Alucard within his catbox can probably kill his own lives as normal, while from the outside he remains caught in his paradoxical state.
It's kinda debatable whether he can do what he did to the lives inside himself to others anyway.
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I would assume the "equivocal" bit refers to the existence being in a superposition.
But yeah, I can generally agree that Schrödinger's ability has to primarily be seen through the lense of quantum mechanics. It appears to be, in its entirety, a play on quantum effects.
But yeah, I can generally agree that Schrödinger's ability has to primarily be seen through the lense of quantum mechanics. It appears to be, in its entirety, a play on quantum effects.
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My large concern with NEP is that Alucard doesn't have any ability to choose not to exist, so at very best it wasn't combat applicable, but indeed, Schrodinger always seemed more like a maybe than anything else. I would however figure he could interact with souls he couldn't before, since he couldn't kill Schrodinger earlier.
My issue with the Mid-Godly regeneration was always that we weren't sure Alucard's soul was physical like his blood was, and I also have some misgivings about it when some of his blood still physically remained on the ground afterwards, deliberately arranged into his pattern as if it was still connected to him or something. That's why it became possibly.
My issue with the Mid-Godly regeneration was always that we weren't sure Alucard's soul was physical like his blood was, and I also have some misgivings about it when some of his blood still physically remained on the ground afterwards, deliberately arranged into his pattern as if it was still connected to him or something. That's why it became possibly.
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- #217
Why are we sitting here still talking about NEP whenever I dropped that a hot minute ago?
That wouldn't be the cause of his advanced NPI, it comes from Alucard still being able to somehow effect himself and take some action after he was erased from existence.
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- #219
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- #222
Bump, NEP was dropped awhile ago so I'm not sure why that's still even being mentioned. I think DontTalk might have gotten confused with the current discussion.
Rejected would be NEP
Currently being discussed is the NPI.
The accepted ones are Possible Mid-Godly regeneration, Type 1 AE, Subjective Reality & Unconventional resistance to absorption.
Rejected would be NEP
Currently being discussed is the NPI.
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The OP looks good to me.
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Okay. The accepted parts are probably fine to apply then.
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- #225
Okay so I'll go ahead and apply the accepted changes, this can be closed now.
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- #227
Yeah I'll save the NPI stuff for a separate thread. The rest is gucci to add since they've been accepted already.
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