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(GRACE) CH fights a bunch of monkes (Composite Human (Real World) vs 4 Chimpanzees)

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Conditions: VBW SBA conditions and standard VBW thread rules otherwise. 4 chimps try to attack CH, but they all start at least 10 m away from CH. Speed is equal and there's no preparation time for both opponents

Best Human: 7 (SatellaTheWoE, MaybeWantsToEdit/G-Toasty, Mariogoods, Undylan, Javenplayz253, Da3ggman, ThePrimalHunter)

Murder Monke Group:

They both become friendly over a bowl of bananas (Incon):

(This match is a part of the tournament for composite human)
Do you miss the chaotic days of composite human? Do you want to go to 2019, the time of composite human's prime? Well, JOIN THE COMPOSITE HUMAN TOURNAMENT! Where you can suggest matches and debate like if composite human wasn't even deleted!!! Experience an enjoyment from the past with a profile that has over 12x more bytes than the original that has the Seal of Approval from the Joke Battles Staff themselves!
 
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Does CH even have their equipment?
No only their martial arts and street fighting experience can help them here. Not to mention that CH does have experience holding their own against groups of people similar in strength to themselves (yes, that's one of their feats).

Though it should be kept in mind the Chimpazee's aggression; look at what they usually do when attacking humans and why they attack people. And there are plenty of instances showing that they can be really vicious.
 
No only their martial arts and street fighting experience can help them here. Not to mention that CH does have experience holding their own against groups of people similar in strength to themselves (yes, that's one of their feats).

Though it should be kept in mind the Chimpazee's aggression; look at what they usually do when attacking humans and why they attack people. And there are plenty of instances showing that they can be really vicious.
The one about the chimpanzee eating brains is especially grueosme
Anyways, CH is going to be massiveky stronger than them whilè also being extremely skilled in fighting off chimapnzees so my vote is still for him
 
Vote is a bit early, though CH is more quality over quantity compared to the Gorilla in the Gorilla v. Chimp match. And that match is why there are 4 chimps here.

The sheer numbers and craziness of the monkeys actually give the chimps a decent wincon. The unpredictablity of fights against humans in IRL can lead to weaker opponents winning against stronger ones, and crazy opponents tend to win against human opponents through sheer unpredictablity and risk-taking. Not to mention that the scan also stated that element of surprise from the Chimps can catch CH before the latter could react, and unpredictability could amplify this factor with CH's essentially lower reaction speed.
 
Vote is a bit early, though CH is more quality over quantity compared to the Gorilla in the Gorilla v. Chimp match. And that match is why there are 4 chimps here.

The sheer numbers and craziness of the monkeys actually give the chimps a decent wincon. The unpredictablity of fights against humans in IRL can lead to weaker opponents winning against stronger ones, and crazy opponents tend to win against human opponents through sheer unpredictablity and risk-taking.
Thats true however there are a lot of humans who have certain conditions which give them perfect stoicism and would keep him perfectly calm and in focus even if they start to get a little whacky, silly and goofy
Not to mention that the scan also stated that element of surprise from the Chimps can catch CH before the latter could react, and unpredictability could amplify this factor with CH's essentially lower reaction speed.
CH would also have training against being caught off guard and would have way way higher reflexes than normal humans to begin with
 
Thats true however there are a lot of humans who have certain conditions which give them perfect stoicism and would keep him perfectly calm and in focus even if they start to get a little whacky, silly and goofy
What do you mean, the monkeys are the ones that's crazy, not the human to a degree
CH would also have training against being caught off guard and would have way way higher reflexes than normal humans to begin with
true, though there's still going to be cooperation and a maybe a quick plan from the monkeys if one of them get a good idea on how to fatally kill or incap CH. CH isn't reacting to a neck/groin bite up-close.
 
What do you mean, the monkeys are the ones that's crazy, not the human to a degree
Peak human will have peak emotional control as well
true, though there's still going to be cooperation and a maybe a quick plan from the monkeys if one of them get a good idea on how to fatally kill or incap CH. CH isn't reacting to a neck/groin bite up-close.
Monks and several types of martial arts focus on hardening the groing and the neck area as well so they arent as much of a weak spot
Also, he can easily counter them via some neck flings before they have rhe opportunity to bite him
Also what if he just..starts snapping their necks
 
Peak human will have peak emotional control as well
Still see a fair wincon for the monke army in terms of unpredictability.
Monks and several types of martial arts focus on hardening the groing and the neck area as well so they arent as much of a weak spot
Also, he can easily counter them via some neck flings before they have rhe opportunity to bite him
Also what if he just..starts snapping their necks
I've seen videos of monks having groins of iron, and I haven't seen a martial art that hardens the neck. And CH has lower reaction speed, what happens if the Chimps immediately bite the human when the human realizes they've been caught off-guard behind them? CH wouldn't be able to react.
 
Still see a fair wincon for the monke army in terms of unpredictability.
How? CH has gone through the most stressful situations humanely possible and came out on top
I've seen videos of monks having groins of iron, and I haven't seen a martial art that hardens the neck. And CH has lower reaction speed, what happens if the Chimps immediately bite the human when the human realizes they've been caught off-guard behind them? CH wouldn't be able to react.
CH doesn't have lower reacrion speed though? Chimps are peak human while CH is subsonic
Also worth mentioning that peak katana users can react to and cut bullets which puts them at around supersonic reaction speed
 
How? CH has gone through the most stressful situations humanely possible and came out on top
Already told you. "The unpredictablity of fights against humans in IRL can lead to weaker opponents winning against stronger ones, and crazy opponents tend to win against human opponents through sheer unpredictablity and risk-taking."

Not to mention that the savagery is going to make the monkeys act like they have nothing to lose. At the most basic level, if you're fighting a guy that you can't predict their attacks, they're going to be very tough to beat as there will be more surprises and less of a window to react. And most people that encountered Chimps are usually 10-B.

CH's analytical prediction relies on pattern recognition. CH will have a more hard time predicting the Chimps' actions since they're unpredictable animals at their most basic level, especially if the monkeys irratically jump behind CH's head and start to maul CH's vital blood vessels or neck. Or even irratically pull the human to the ground.
CH doesn't have lower reacrion speed though? Chimps are peak human while CH is subsonic
Also worth mentioning that peak katana users can react to and cut bullets which puts them at around supersonic reaction speed
Speed is equalized, meaning this: "The combat speed of that faster character is assumed to be equalized to the combat speed of the slower character. Every other speed the faster character has is reduced by the same multiplier. This includes the speed of any attacks, projectiles, reactions, perception, flight etc."
 
I am going to quote on exactly what they have said
Size and strength are not always the determining factors in a street fight. While size and strength can certainly give someone an advantage, there have been many cases where smaller and weaker people have been able to defeat larger and stronger opponents.The element of surprise is often very important in a street fight. If you can surprise your opponent, you will have a much better chance of winning. This is why it is important to be aware of your surroundings and to be prepared for anything.
This is only and strictly applicable for NON fighters, people with no real combat experience who make stupid mistakes. CH is peak human and will not be having trouble in dealing with low tier fodder fighters who are slightly more abrasive and risk taking.
Crazy usually wins. “Crazy” is more likely to take risks. This can be a big advantage, as it can allow you to land the first punch or take your opponent by surprise. This can make it difficult for an opponent to plan their attack. When things get tough, people with a “crazy” mindset are more likely to keep going. They don’t give up easily, which can be a major factor in winning a fight.Of course, there are also some drawbacks to having a “crazy” mindset. Because “crazy” can be unpredictable and scary, it also means one is more likely to make mistakes. Risks must be managed.
Crazy sinply means you can keep going even if you are hurt, and would usually end up making mistakes in battle that a normal human without combat training wouldn't recognize but a martial artists professional would absolutely use such mistakes against their opponehts and thus it isnt applicable to them.
Or do you want to argue that 3-4 low tier fodder humans can take out a grandmaster in combat? The GMs of MA are super OP and can easily take out people like that
Not to mention that the savagery is going to make the monkeys act like they have nothing to lose. At the most basic level, if you're fighting a guy that you can't predict their attacks, they're going to be very tough to beat as there will be more surprises and less of a window to react. And most people that encountered Chimps are usually 10-B.
Again these aren't combat trained chimps and it would be extremely easy for CH (who btw is the smartest human) to figure out that one shot killing them is the most effective method. There are multiple ways for him to achieve that, via breaking their necks, arms or even attacking their pressure points to numb them.
Also does he have access to any of his weapons?
CH's analytical prediction relies on pattern recognition. CH will have a more hard time predicting the Chimps' actions since they're unpredictable animals at their most basic level, especially if the monkeys irratically jump behind CH's head and start to maul CH's vital blood vessels or neck. Or even irratically pull the human to the ground.
Unfortunately there is no "random" in a chimps behavior. They may seem random at first but due to being a creature literally made out of numerous patterns upon patterns(DNA and how the brain works typically) they are still vulnerable to being predicted.
Plus all CH really needs to do is look for openings that they are inevitably going to make and then strike them with attacks that will instantly shatter their bones, crush their limbs or just straight up snap their neck etc
Yeah i know what speed equal but you mentioned that the chimps were faster so i countered that
 
Yeah i know what speed equal but you mentioned that the chimps were faster so i countered that
That was the point I was trying to make for reaction speed of the chimps.
Unfortunately there is no "random" in a chimps behavior. They may seem random at first but due to being a creature literally made out of numerous patterns upon patterns(DNA and how the brain works typically) they are still vulnerable to being predicted.
Plus all CH really needs to do is look for openings that they are inevitably going to make and then strike them with attacks that will instantly shatter their bones, crush their limbs or just straight up snap their neck etc
The randomness in animals is common sense considering that they don't give people a heads up first before attacking. If you're reasoning is that valid, then gain an intuition and high knowledge of an animal and try to predict its actions in combat or in the wild. Not to mention that we would need to explain how animals can do this: "Animals that ignore you, look calm, or apprear friendly may suddenly and without warning charge or strike out" and still be predictable. And I predict trying to predict an animals' actions (especially the superhumanly dangerous ones) in the wild is going to get deadly the hard way.

DNA is the blueprint of living beings, just because they're made up of patterns doesn't mean their blueprint has to make them very predictable.
This is only and strictly applicable for NON fighters, people with no real combat experience who make stupid mistakes. CH is peak human and will not be having trouble in dealing with low tier fodder fighters who are slightly more abrasive and risk taking.
I'm going to have to remind everyone here (even though you didn't say this) that just because some "X" thing has a major weakness like making mistakes, it doesn't mean that the advantages of unpredictablity and risk taking automatically don't exist for the chimps.

And while my scan is explaining normal people's fighting skills and the risks of street-fighting, average people have shown the capablity or skill fight with other people on the streets. You can ask any of your peers or family members if they've been in a street fight (hand-to-hand fighting in a public place) or search the internet for any people in a hand-to-hand quick street fight.

And even without skill, men have shown the capablity to fight evenly or hold their own against predators of the same tier or a tier close as them.

Surprises effect everyone due to the shock and unexpectedness of such events. CH is still going to be effected by something unexpected from the Chimps, relevent or not.
Again these aren't combat trained chimps and it would be extremely easy for CH (who btw is the smartest human) to figure out that one shot killing them is the most effective method. There are multiple ways for him to achieve that, via breaking their necks, arms or even attacking their pressure points to numb them.
Also does he have access to any of his weapons?
I agree with this point that CH is far stronger and would likely win here 7/10 times. Though I would like to clarify that IRL pressure points are mostly into vital points of human bodies and treatment through them, albeit with CH having some anatomy knowledge on Chimps. They're not entirely true pressure points.

This is a hand-to-hand monke street fight, so no prior weapons besides what both sides can get from their surroundings.
 
That was the point I was trying to make for reaction speed of the chimps.
Reaxtion speed would be the multiplier between their fastest possible movement vs their normal combat speed right?
Then CH should scale to the katana cutting bullet feat of top swordsman, although you can argue for it to be anal precog, the speed to swing in tangent with a bullet would still place him in the transonic to supersonic range
The randomness in animals is common sense considering that they don't give people a heads up first before attacking. If you're reasoning is that valid, then gain an intuition and high knowledge of an animal and try to predict its actions in combat or in the wild. Not to mention that we would need to explain how animals can do this: "Animals that ignore you, look calm, or apprear friendly may suddenly and without warning charge or strike out" and still be predictable. And I predict trying to predict an animals' actions (especially the superhumanly dangerous ones) in the wild is going to get deadly the hard way.

DNA is the blueprint of living beings, just because they're made up of patterns doesn't mean their blueprint has to make them very predictable.
Right but CH already knows that this will be a fight and due to his massive knolwdge(basically almost the entire google library of knowledge) on chimps he would know all of their observed behaviour patterns and would easily be able to distinguish their nature from just that alone.
Heck, he could even potentially passify them via using some form of communication
I'm going to have to remind everyone here (even though you didn't say this) that just because some "X" thing has a major weakness like making mistakes, it doesn't mean that the advantages of unpredictablity and risk taking automatically don't exist for the chimps.

And while my scan is explaining normal people's fighting skills and the risks of street-fighting, average people have shown the capablity or skill fight with other people on the streets. You can ask any of your peers or family members if they've been in a street fight (hand-to-hand fighting in a public place) or search the internet for any people in a hand-to-hand quick street fight.

And even without skill, men have shown the capablity to fight evenly or hold their own against predators of the same tier or a tier close as them.
Those are average people and i shouldn't have to explain to you how absurd the existence of CH is, a single top marfial artist can casually defeat 5-10 street fighter without breaking a sweat and CH is like that in EVERY way possible. When he is fighting somebody he wont just see a single or double but multiple different lines of absolutely different fighting styles to instantly incap or kill his opponents. Each movement of his would be polished to a degree unfathomable to a normal human because they have been trained hundreds of thousands to literal millions of times. How many times do you think a normal human punches in his lifetime? Even if you take a lowball and say 100, considering that there have been over 108 billion people to have ever lived 8n this planet. assuming that only half of those ever punched rhat much, the number of punches CH would have thrown would still be atleast 5.4 trillion.
That kind of experience would lead to an unfathomable perfected movement
That is the level of polished movements we are talking about here, CH wont be making minor mistakes that avg humans or even peak humans would do
Surprises effect everyone due to the shock and unexpectedness of such events. CH is still going to be effected by something unexpected from the Chimps, relevent or not.
He wont because he would also have experience of all the chimp attacks on humans, every single piece of knowledge on chimps and plus his perfected emotonal control from having experience in every type of disaster there ever was. He would have the best self control in the history and there are people like that US president (JFK?) Who can get straight up shot and still continue giving their speech
I agree with this point that CH is far stronger and would likely win here 7/10 times. Though I would like to clarify that IRL pressure points are mostly into vital points of human bodies and treatment through them, albeit with CH having some anatomy knowledge on Chimps. They're not entirely true pressure points.
Its not "some" its all the knowledge on chimps from the greatest researchers and scientists combined along with his own superhuman intelligence
This is a hand-to-hand monke street fight, so no prior weapons besides what both sides can get from their surroundings
Where is the fight taking place?
 
This fight is in central park as per SBA.

The best feats humans have against fighting multiple people have shown people holding their own against people unarmed and having an even better chance with melee weapons, not effortlessly beating them. However, the most likely melee weapons in CH's surroundings would be hazardous trash like glass bottles and clubs like huge sticks. If necessary, CH could just use their surroundings to their advantage, they're one of the best street fighters of course.

CH's hand-to-hand combat isn't as badass as movie martial arts casually defeating groups of people (and saying this to remind everyone here regardless if they actually intended to say/think this. Also, cinema isn't the most credible source of information since it's fiction). There is strength in numbers and movies usually either downplay that or make the hero canonically more superhumanly skilled.

CH should have the best skills of any fighter at most (not the combined skills of any fighter), can we have a scan at least of someone beating a group of boys with a club weapon?

This is pretty paradoxical for CH to have the best skills in chimps and not have prior knowledge on the chimps as per SBA conditions, for now, CH doesn't have any prior knowledge on the Chimps. If we want, we could always ask in the questions and answers section of VSBW if characters should retain their skills and abilities. Even if the character paradoxically doesn't have prior knowledge there.
 
Those are average people and i shouldn't have to explain to you how absurd the existence of CH is, a single top marfial artist can casually defeat 5-10 street fighter without breaking a sweat and CH is like that in EVERY way possible. When he is fighting somebody he wont just see a single or double but multiple different lines of absolutely different fighting styles to instantly incap or kill his opponents. Each movement of his would be polished to a degree unfathomable to a normal human because they have been trained hundreds of thousands to literal millions of times. How many times do you think a normal human punches in his lifetime? Even if you take a lowball and say 100, considering that there have been over 108 billion people to have ever lived 8n this planet. assuming that only half of those ever punched rhat much, the number of punches CH would have thrown would still be atleast 5.4 trillion.
That kind of experience would lead to an unfathomable perfected movement
That is the level of polished movements we are talking about here, CH wont be making minor mistakes that avg humans or even peak humans would do
I don't need to be reminded about how skill CH is, considering that I already implied I know their extreme skill. And no, composites like CH don't multiply stats from every human that existed, it combines the peaks of the best human traits. The punch experience argument isn't that valid due to that, though it's only valid for the most skilled fighters.

Just because the scan I provided mostly focuses on normal people, doesn't mean it can't apply to trained martial artists. Show one fighter in IRL that can resist the effects of a surprise attack or crazy person if your argument if valid. And no, crazy isn't only making mistakes and willpower. That's misinterpretation of the point of crazy in my scan. Crazy is by common sense, wild and uncontroled.
 
Just because the scan I provided mostly focuses on normal people, doesn't mean it can't apply to trained martial artists. Show one fighter in IRL that can resist the effects of a surprise attack or crazy person if your argument if valid.
Combat trained cops(who are far below the avg MMA fighter) defusing, taking down, and countering random attacks. MMA fighters literally trained to be unpredictable during a fight and other top MMA fighters countering that during combat, trained street fighters having experience in countering random attacks etc.
And no, crazy isn't only making mistakes and willpower. That's misinterpretation of the point of crazy in my scan. Crazy is by common sense, wild and uncontroled.
Your arguement is literally that untrained random attacks>combat trained, well performed counters
CH has experience of the top strreet fighters, top MMA fighters, Top unpredictable fighters and the top cops combine this with his massive knowledge of Chimps, top animal trainers and psychology ànd i think he will be completely fine in such a scenario
 
Combat trained cops(who are far below the avg MMA fighter) defusing, taking down, and countering random attacks. MMA fighters literally trained to be unpredictable during a fight and other top MMA fighters countering that during combat, trained street fighters having experience in countering random attacks etc.
When you're showing proof, give a link to a credible source. Listing stuff like this isn't always enough.
Your arguement is literally that untrained random attacks>combat trained, well performed counters
Misinterpretation of argument. Where did I say or imply this when that's not what I'm intending to say. Saying this arguement is like being a guy strawmanning themselves to oblivion.

I'm saying that the craziness of the chimps can give them a fair wincon against CH.
 
I'm thinking CH. Chimps are kind of unpredictable? But if it's coming to get you it's just moving at you. CH can kinda clobber them with their stronger striking strength. I mean couldn't CH just kick them all. Or just grab them and toss them away
 
I'm thinking CH. Chimps are kind of unpredictable? But if it's coming to get you it's just moving at you. CH can kinda clobber them with their stronger striking strength. I mean couldn't CH just kick them all. Or just grab them and toss them away
They can momentarily overwhelm CH optionally and by chance, exploit an opening to bite through CH's vital blood vessels like the ones in the neck or arteries. This isn't just a real life match, SBA gives them a motive to kill via something like a neck bite before CH can react.

The Chimps still have their reaction speed advantage too, and CH can have a harder time using their strength and skill advantage via the surprise and swifter reactions of the monkeys.

CH is stacked, but I don't think I should give the monkeys more advantage since the monkeys have a 1-2/10 chance of winning, and that chance is probable.

Will count your vote.
 
They can momentarily overwhelm CH optionally and by chance, exploit an opening to bite through CH's vital blood vessels like the ones in the neck or arteries. This isn't just a real life match, SBA gives them a motive to kill via something like a neck bite before CH can react.
Is that even a thing chimpanzees would go for? I don't think I've seen really most animals attempt to use pressure points lol. That doesn't seem very likely, especially when CH is much taller than them. (A bite to the privates won't necessarily be lethal and CH just won't feel the pain)
The Chimps still have their reaction speed advantage too, and CH can have a harder time using their strength and skill advantage via the surprise and swifter reactions of the monkeys.
CH however, would know the pressure points on the chimpanzees, and looking at the chimpanzee's profile, CH just blatantly has the reaction and combat speed advantage here. CH's kicks and even punches are fast enough for the chimps to not be able to react to (if we assume dodging punches is something they'd do in the first place).

Plenty of martial artists have done kicks that also would work very well against a crowd of monkeys im rather sure too, they're incredibly quick.

also has their standard equipment here given the conditions, so they have their shoes which are already basically the equivalent of brass knuckles for their feet, keys to use as makeshift stabby weapons, and a smartphone, which they might use the "Flash" feature on to blind the monkeys
 
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Is that even a thing chimpanzees would go for? I don't think I've seen really most animals attempt to use pressure points lol. That doesn't seem very likely, especially when CH is much taller than them. (A bite to the privates won't necessarily be lethal and CH just won't feel the pain)
Chimps have aimed for the neck before as stated on it's profile with the Leopard. They would have the basic instinct and fighting knowledge that severely damaging the neck of an animal would severely cripple or kill an animal. And CH doesn't have a high resistance to piercing damage.
CH however, would know the pressure points on the chimpanzees, and looking at the chimpanzee's profile, CH just blatantly has the reaction and combat speed advantage here. CH's kicks and even punches are fast enough for the chimps to not be able to react to (if we assume dodging punches is something they'd do in the first place).

Plenty of martial artists have done kicks that also would work very well against a crowd of monkeys im rather sure too, they're incredibly quick.

also has their standard equipment here given the conditions, so they have their shoes which are already basically the equivalent of brass knuckles for their feet, keys to use as makeshift stabby weapons, and a smartphone, which they might use the "Flash" feature on to blind the monkeys
1: And I should really note here that the primary justification for the pressure points is from human martial arts and treatment/healing pressure point. Are there chimp martial arts that relate to targeting chimp pressure points? I think I'll need to clarify this later on the profile at the end of the debate.

2: The OP says speed is equalized, and CH's peak reaction speed is lower than their peak combat speed by the mechanics of speed equalized. That would make the Chimps faster in terms of reaction speed.

3: We're using the base key for composite human, so CH at best has only their teeth whilst being naked.
 
Oh, equal speed just kind of means CH just gets completely clobbered lol nvm
Ch can still easily one-shot overpower many of the chimps by overpowering one in one hand easily throwing the chimp onto the ground. CH can also send them a couple of meters away with a kick or strike in a short distance. CH stlll has quite the strength and durability advantage ike the gorilla in the gorilla vs 4 chimps match.
 
Ch can still easily one-shot overpower many of the chimps by overpowering one in one hand easily throwing the chimp onto the ground. CH can also send them a couple of meters away with a kick or strike in a short distance. CH stlll has quite the strength and durability advantage ike the gorilla in the gorilla vs 4 chimps match.
If both have generally the same speed including combat speed, if CH does that with one of them, the other three would already be beating CH up once they do that. I'm sure even given a distance, they're all moving to CH at once and not one at a time
 
If both have generally the same speed including combat speed, if CH does that with one of them, the other three would already be beating CH up once they do that. I'm sure even given a distance, they're all moving to CH at once and not one at a time
In real life, it's possible for martial artists to hold their own against multiple fighters by "controlling the crowd" so the assailants are more attacking the defender one-by-one (if my memory recalls correctly according to the feats of people holding their own against multiple fighters of the same tier in CH's profile). Also, the distance is sufficient enough to where CH has a chance of aim-dodging some of the monkeys.

Also, durability and lifting strength advantage from CH can help them get out from getting beat up by multiple monkeys.
 
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